Marriage, Sinsod, In-laws And 1.5m Baht

[travellife]

Need help

I would like some feedback on the following situation. It has to do with marriage, sinsod and in-laws.

I was recently married and provided 900,000 baht in jewelry to my bride and 600,000 baht in sinsod to the parents. It sounds like a lot (which I agree), but my wife insisted that it was the right thing to do.

She has a very good status job with the government, masters degree from overseas, 30 something, never married, no boyfriends, and she claims that this amount was needed, as determined by her parents. I reluctantly agreed, being from a western culture where equality is more common (sharing of the wedding costs).

I provided the money because I love my wife, and also in part to see how her parents would react. It wasn’t clear if they were really traditional or maybe saw me as a rich foreigner with money to burn (which I burned on the marriage). My wife’s father always talks about money. He probably dreams about it also. I had a concern prior to being married about this obsession and my wife just said that it is part of the culture and he will stop after we get married. Well, he still calls about four times a week, asking about what we did and how much we spent. I informed her that this will cause undue stress in our relationship if he consistently tries to control any financial decisions we make. He tries to monitor everything. He mentioned that I should invest in a business, like a gas station, with his son.

My wife said the sinsod is just part of the tradition and her parents would return it. Prior to the marriage she said that her father has enough money and will help us live a nice life. Well, it’s been several month and we currently live in an older rented studio condo and the parents haven’t said anything. It’s not the most convenient way to live as a married couple. It is more common in my home country to use a good portion of the money as a down-payment on a house. I come from an Asian background, so I have some understanding of face. I satisfied my father-in-laws face by providing a lot of my savings for the marriage. But he has done nothing in return to salvage mine.

I read about the Thai ‘ego’ and the need to satisfy it. Her father lives in a nice house (probably worth 12 million baht or more). But her sister lives in a very old townhome which was bought for a few hundred thousand baht some years ago. It’s strange to see the contrast in living. Her sister has children and from a western standpoint, the living standard would be considered near poverty.

Am I trying to analyze her family’s intention too much, or should I just accept it as Thai culture?

[samuibeachcomber]

well sunshine this is all a bit heavy for me on a saturday morning and will pass up on this extraordinary oppotunity to flame your post,maybe others will be in the mood.

[britmaveric]

Well seems like you have been duped..... unfortunately too late now. Always a bad sign when dosh is the soul motivation and its coming from the parents. Also the sinsot is typically given back straight away - so at this point I'd say you might as well forget about the 600K.

[HankChinasky]

Great! Another troll trying to get a 20 pages topic.

Good luck to you young troll and may the force be with you.

[scottyd]

Is your wife worth it?

If the answer is yes, you got a bargain.

If the answeris no, you got ripped-off.

Think nothing more of it.

Edited February 21, 2009 by scottyd

[Pakeha]

I'm just giving some traditional food and bits and pieces for the sinsod (maybe 500 baht). Call me cheap but my Mrs wouldn't let me give sinsod even if I wanted to as the money WE have WE have earned together in the 6 years leading up to the marriage.

I'd tell your wife to hit your father in law up about giving you guys some cash for a better house. No need to ask for the sinsod back just point out it would be nice if they could help you with a deposit to the tune of 600,000 baht.

Good luck Mate. Sounds like you're in for an interesting ride. I hope you have a good job

[chiangmaibruce]

Some posters are going to focus on the size of your contribution and talk about what the 'standard' amount is. Well I don't think there is a standard amount, and I don't think the size of contribution is the key thing either. Regardless of the amount, if the money is only flowing one way and you are not being accorded proper respect, then you HAVE been poorly treated.

Do younger members of her family wai you? Are you given attention and a good seat at family get-togethers or are you ignored in the corner? Does her family regularly bring food or gifts when they come to visit you? Can you lend money from them? ie. for a better place. If no, to any or all of these then you need to speak seriously with your wife now. The sooner you (she) has it out with her folks the better.

[slapout]

Depending on how recently you bought the gold for your wife and the price you paid, this may be a good time to sell and recoup some of the 600,000 baht you gave to Mr big bucks (FIN). Hope everything works out for you but remember the nuts fall close to the tree.

[luisparis]

Everytime my wife gets pissed off, she barks for me to return her parents' money, than regulary when we're getting along better, they transfer some more. Lol. One should avoid marrying into a poorer family.

Edited February 21, 2009 by luisparis

[Pakeha]

Everytime my wife gets pissed off, she barks for me to return her parents' money, than regulary when we're getting along better, they transfer some more. Lol. One should avoid marrying into a poorer family.

Congratulations on your hand outs luisparis. But seriously - choosing marriage based on your partners / partners families wealth puts you in the same category as a BG (no disrespect to BG's). Call me crazy but I think a better basis for marriage is love.

Did you meet your wife by standing out the front of a bar screaming 'you so sexy lady' at the passers by?

[mdechgan]

Sinsod believe it or not is Thai and Chinese tradition. At first I was like what the....! Why can't just two people fall in love and live together and get married. Like the marriage ceremony isn't enough.

Here are two opinions. Chinese tradition (my wife is chinese and is the sole daughter, only brothers no sisters):

1. Sinsod is about face. A good amount of sinsod and a big ceremony gives the parents face that their daughter is marrying up.

2. Sinsod is for the expenses of raising up the girl. Becaue after marriage (in Chinese custom) the girl is to live with the husband and is part of the husband's family now. No longer part of her own family. The sinsod is a one time payment because the girl will no longer have to support her parents. She is supposed to belong to the husband now.

3. Every family wants to have their daughter married up and financially secure. It is suggested the husband has his own home, a business and is finacially stable to support their daughter after marriage. No one wants to have their daugher married into a difficult position. A sinsod is guarantee or insurance money that the husband can support the lady well onto the future and her children.

Thai custom:

1. In Thai custom sinsod is payment for the lady same as Chinese with a few differences.

2. In Thai customs, this dates back long time ago. A husband is to be married into the girl's family not other way around. A husband is to support the lady's family and usually moves into her parents house. This has to do with the Thai agriculture family in the past. If the Thai family has a girl, extra help and labor is needed to help on the farm. Can't just take a girl from her family and leave the parents to support themselves.

My brother in law and neighbor have been through Thai marriages. Lets just say it was difficult because of the differences of cultures. My brotehr in law who is Chinese wanted the girl to live with him and be a part of his family but the girl's family expected him to support her family. Let's just say that they are now divorced.

My neigher has a house. But he is now forced to sell his house and live with his wife at her parents house. She wanted the money from the sale to fix up her parents house so that she can be close to her parents.

Only daughter:

In another case my friend after getting married was supposed to be married into her wife's company. The girl was an only daughter and the father did not have any sons. So my friend had to be the father in law's successor in her father's company.

I also want to mention that in both cases sinsod usually is returned to the bride. The parents do not keep the money and give it to their daughter as an investment for her future and as a wedding gift from her parents. Well atleast return half and offer a wedding gift like a house or car, etc.

Lets just sum it up into two customs. In one custom if a family has a girl it is a lost on investment. In another custom if one has a girl it is a good return on investement.

The amount of sinsod depends on her age, occupation, education and especially her parents status. Usually a couple hundred thousand is more than enough if the parents are not too greedy. Just seeing their daughter financially secure and a loving husband is more than enough. If your wife is highly respected with a good occupation and a master's degree overseas the amount is about right. A bachelor's degree is about half the price.

It also depends on how in demand she was. If she is really pretty, etc. Anyone remember Tata Youngs 100M baht sinsod?

The best scenario is that both of you cleared the air and had ground rules before getting married. Separate finances, who controls the finances, where to live, which family to support, etc.

Oh I have to be honest some families if their girl marries a rich foreigner it is considered to be free money falling from the trees. Well translated from Thai actually.

Edited February 21, 2009 by mdechgan

[luisparis]

Everytime my wife gets pissed off, she barks for me to return her parents' money, than regulary when we're getting along better, they transfer some more. Lol. One should avoid marrying into a poorer family.

Congratulations on your hand outs luisparis. But seriously - choosing marriage based on your partners / partners families wealth puts you in the same category as a BG (no disrespect to BG's). Call me crazy but I think a better basis for marriage is love.

Did you meet your wife by standing out the front of a bar screaming 'you so sexy lady' at the passers by?

Well, ever noticed how indian arranged marriages worked well ? You think it's because the couples love each other or have terrific sex while hardly talking to each other before wedding?? Nah... it's because they match eachother. Not that we match particulary well, but when you're working over a long term relationship, you should think over the practical details rather deeply... taking a girl that has to support her family and see you like a jackpot ain't gona help you much through tough times( Besides I had a good socioprofessionnal situation when we married, Missus is also a practical kind of girl)

[mdechgan]

Well, ever noticed how indian arranged marriages worked well ? You think it's because the couples love each other or have terrific sex while hardly talking to each other before wedding?? Nah... it's because they match eachother. Not that we match particulary well, but when you're working over a long term relationship, you should think over the practical details rather deeply... taking a girl that has to support her family and see you like a jackpot ain't gona help you much through tough times( Besides I had a good socioprofessionnal situation when we married, Missus is also a practical kind of girl)

You know there is a saying that arranged marriages actually have a lower divorce rate than people that actually fall in love and dated?

Many elders say marriages should be arranged due to their birth date, horoscopes, status of both families, blood types, etc. Also that if two people live together long enough and start a family they will love each other in the end. I crack up everytime I see those big marriage ceremonies like Tao and Nat or Fluke and Beau with big sinod, even Tata Young and in the end they divorce each other after a year.

Edited February 21, 2009 by mdechgan

[luisparis]

You know there is a saying that arranged marriages actually have a lower divorce rate than people that actually fall in love and dated?

Many elders say marriages should be arranged due to their birth date, horoscopes, status of both families, blood types, etc. Also that if two people live together long enough and start a family they will love each other in the end.

I doubt it's only a saying, I deal with quite a few indian and nepali and their divorce rate is ridiculously low compared to my western friends. I'm not so sure about the relevance of the horoscope but heard that's one of the first thing indian family check when working over a marriage. The rest makes a lot of sense.

[Pakeha]

You know there is a saying that arranged marriages actually have a lower divorce rate than people that actually fall in love and dated?

Many elders say marriages should be arranged due to their birth date, horoscopes, status of both families, blood types, etc. Also that if two people live together long enough and start a family they will love each other in the end.

Don't forget the option of reading tea leaves...

Historical statistics on divorce rates may agree with your post however arranged marriages are decreasing in popularity in general so they can't be that wonderful / desirable.

As I said before I think love is the best reason to marry. Whether the marriages lasts or fails it is the adventure that makes it enjoyable. As the saying goes, 'it's the journey, not the destination that's important'.

[mdechgan]

You know there is a saying that arranged marriages actually have a lower divorce rate than people that actually fall in love and dated?

Many elders say marriages should be arranged due to their birth date, horoscopes, status of both families, blood types, etc. Also that if two people live together long enough and start a family they will love each other in the end.

Don't forget the option of reading tea leaves...

Historical statistics on divorce rates may agree with your post however arranged marriages are decreasing in popularity in general so they can't be that wonderful / desirable.

As I said before I think love is the best reason to marry. Whether the marriages lasts or fails it is the adventure that makes it enjoyable. As the saying goes, 'it's the journey, not the destination that's important'.

I've been with many friends that have went through bad marriages and divorces. It was not pretty. The best is to make an agreement with each other before the marriage. Actually try and live together first and don't rush into a marriage like only after a couple of months of courtship. Get to know the family etc. Love is not the only reason for marriage and should not be. Because love is subjective. Also you know how love get stale after awhile because it wasn't really love but just infatuation.

[Pakeha]

I've been with many friends that have went through bad marriages and divorces. It was not pretty. The best is to make an agreement with each other before the marriage. Actually try and live together first and don't rush into a marriage like only after a couple of months of courtship. Get to know the family etc. Love is not the only reason for marriage and should not be. Because love is subjective. Also you know how love get stale after awhile because it wasn't really love but just infatuation.

Well said. Excellent points and I believe you should be with someone for years (not months) before considering marriage.

But if love isn't the primary basis best to stay single I reckon

[capco1]

Bottom line is....If this is true and not a troll post (which I have my doubts).....You're nothing more than an ATM machine and you let yourself get screwed! everything revolves around money in this country......Wanna play?....Better pay!

Edited February 21, 2009 by capco1

[scottyd]

Why do the foreigners always seem to follow the thai rules and traditions, but not their own? Spooky I know. Seems to be a take-take relationship from the beginning.

[patklang]

Well, ever noticed how indian arranged marriages worked well ? You think it's because the couples love each other or have terrific sex while hardly talking to each other before wedding?? Nah... it's because they match eachother. Not that we match particulary well, but when you're working over a long term relationship, you should think over the practical details rather deeply... taking a girl that has to support her family and see you like a jackpot ain't gona help you much through tough times( Besides I had a good socioprofessionnal situation when we married, Missus is also a practical kind of girl)

You know there is a saying that arranged marriages actually have a lower divorce rate than people that actually fall in love and dated?

Many elders say marriages should be arranged due to their birth date, horoscopes, status of both families, blood types, etc. Also that if two people live together long enough and start a family they will love each other in the end. I crack up everytime I see those big marriage ceremonies like Tao and Nat or Fluke and Beau with big sinod, even Tata Young and in the end they divorce each other after a year.

Total bull,if you are right what you say its because the woman is scared shitless of leaving due to the many murders in that type of community.

the women are not wives,they are slaves.let get this right

[Tagaa]

At todays exchange rates, you've paid $42,205 or 29,738 GBP. I don't care where your from, absolutely no woman is worth that much dosh. (Just ask Paul McCartney) I've heard all the Hu Ha about the brides family returning it, but I have yet to see it happen.

From the other things you've mentioned, it sounds like they took you for one hel_l of a ride.

The bright side is that the price of gold is high at the moment. Sell it while you can recoup at least some of your money. If the wife B I itches to much, get rid of her too ASAP before you earn some real money & she takes half of that as well.

That's our opinion, we welcome yours.

[Asbestos]

well sunshine this is all a bit heavy for me on a saturday morning and will pass up on this extraordinary oppotunity to flame your post,maybe others will be in the mood.

Same old same old. Flame away.

[lazygourmet]

When I asked the in-laws about sinsod, they answered to me: her weight in gold.

Since then, she never stops eating...

So, we will never get married!

[a2396]

Great! Another troll trying to get a 20 pages topic.

Good luck to you young troll and may the force be with you.

Looks that way to me too. I can't believe so much stupidy with regard to this issue. Zero sin sot. It's an ancient relic & a present day rip-off.

[a2396]

Sinsod believe it or not is Thai and Chinese tradition. At first I was like what the....! Why can't just two people fall in love and live together and get married. Like the marriage ceremony isn't enough.

Here are two opinions. Chinese tradition (my wife is chinese and is the sole daughter, only brothers no sisters):

1. Sinsod is about face. A good amount of sinsod and a big ceremony gives the parents face that their daughter is marrying up.

2. Sinsod is for the expenses of raising up the girl. Becaue after marriage (in Chinese custom) the girl is to live with the husband and is part of the husband's family now. No longer part of her own family. The sinsod is a one time payment because the girl will no longer have to support her parents. She is supposed to belong to the husband now.

3. Every family wants to have their daughter married up and financially secure. It is suggested the husband has his own home, a business and is finacially stable to support their daughter after marriage. No one wants to have their daugher married into a difficult position. A sinsod is guarantee or insurance money that the husband can support the lady well onto the future and her children.

Thai custom:

1. In Thai custom sinsod is payment for the lady same as Chinese with a few differences.

2. In Thai customs, this dates back long time ago. A husband is to be married into the girl's family not other way around. A husband is to support the lady's family and usually moves into her parents house. This has to do with the Thai agriculture family in the past. If the Thai family has a girl, extra help and labor is needed to help on the farm. Can't just take a girl from her family and leave the parents to support themselves.

My brother in law and neighbor have been through Thai marriages. Lets just say it was difficult because of the differences of cultures. My brotehr in law who is Chinese wanted the girl to live with him and be a part of his family but the girl's family expected him to support her family. Let's just say that they are now divorced.

My neigher has a house. But he is now forced to sell his house and live with his wife at her parents house. She wanted the money from the sale to fix up her parents house so that she can be close to her parents.

Only daughter:

In another case my friend after getting married was supposed to be married into her wife's company. The girl was an only daughter and the father did not have any sons. So my friend had to be the father in law's successor in her father's company.

I also want to mention that in both cases sinsod usually is returned to the bride. The parents do not keep the money and give it to their daughter as an investment for her future and as a wedding gift from her parents. Well atleast return half and offer a wedding gift like a house or car, etc.

Lets just sum it up into two customs. In one custom if a family has a girl it is a lost on investment. In another custom if one has a girl it is a good return on investement.

The amount of sinsod depends on her age, occupation, education and especially her parents status. Usually a couple hundred thousand is more than enough if the parents are not too greedy. Just seeing their daughter financially secure and a loving husband is more than enough. If your wife is highly respected with a good occupation and a master's degree overseas the amount is about right. A bachelor's degree is about half the price.

It also depends on how in demand she was. If she is really pretty, etc. Anyone remember Tata Youngs 100M baht sinsod?

The best scenario is that both of you cleared the air and had ground rules before getting married. Separate finances, who controls the finances, where to live, which family to support, etc.

Oh I have to be honest some families if their girl marries a rich foreigner it is considered to be free money falling from the trees. Well translated from Thai actually.

To his credit, I believe Chaiman Mao made this "cultural tradition" illegal in China, although it is still practiced. I think they viewed it as demeaning to women to be sold off as chattel.

[dave111223]

900,000 THB in Jewelry?? Government job and masters degree certainly doesn't qualify for that much jewelry! Especially if you can only afford to live in a rented studio.

However seeing as the 600K has not come back to you as stipulated by your wife i'm sure she would not have any problem selling at least 600K worth of the jewelry?

I think it's not uncommon for Thai fathers to frequently talk about money.

My father in-law always asks how much we earn, and how much we spend.

Fortunately my wife has the nous to tell him some extremely meager figures each time.

[khundon]

Any parent that sells their child, is not fit to be a parent. End of.

[Brigante7]

Sinsod believe it or not is Thai and Chinese tradition. At first I was like what the....! Why can't just two people fall in love and live together and get married. Like the marriage ceremony isn't enough.

Here are two opinions. Chinese tradition (my wife is chinese and is the sole daughter, only brothers no sisters):

1. Sinsod is about face. A good amount of sinsod and a big ceremony gives the parents face that their daughter is marrying up.

2. Sinsod is for the expenses of raising up the girl. Becaue after marriage (in Chinese custom) the girl is to live with the husband and is part of the husband's family now. No longer part of her own family. The sinsod is a one time payment because the girl will no longer have to support her parents. She is supposed to belong to the husband now.

3. Every family wants to have their daughter married up and financially secure. It is suggested the husband has his own home, a business and is finacially stable to support their daughter after marriage. No one wants to have their daugher married into a difficult position. A sinsod is guarantee or insurance money that the husband can support the lady well onto the future and her children.

Thai custom:

1. In Thai custom sinsod is payment for the lady same as Chinese with a few differences.

2. In Thai customs, this dates back long time ago. A husband is to be married into the girl's family not other way around. A husband is to support the lady's family and usually moves into her parents house. This has to do with the Thai agriculture family in the past. If the Thai family has a girl, extra help and labor is needed to help on the farm. Can't just take a girl from her family and leave the parents to support themselves.

My brother in law and neighbor have been through Thai marriages. Lets just say it was difficult because of the differences of cultures. My brotehr in law who is Chinese wanted the girl to live with him and be a part of his family but the girl's family expected him to support her family. Let's just say that they are now divorced.

My neigher has a house. But he is now forced to sell his house and live with his wife at her parents house. She wanted the money from the sale to fix up her parents house so that she can be close to her parents.

Only daughter:

In another case my friend after getting married was supposed to be married into her wife's company. The girl was an only daughter and the father did not have any sons. So my friend had to be the father in law's successor in her father's company.

I also want to mention that in both cases sinsod usually is returned to the bride. The parents do not keep the money and give it to their daughter as an investment for her future and as a wedding gift from her parents. Well atleast return half and offer a wedding gift like a house or car, etc.

Lets just sum it up into two customs. In one custom if a family has a girl it is a lost on investment. In another custom if one has a girl it is a good return on investement.

The amount of sinsod depends on her age, occupation, education and especially her parents status. Usually a couple hundred thousand is more than enough if the parents are not too greedy. Just seeing their daughter financially secure and a loving husband is more than enough. If your wife is highly respected with a good occupation and a master's degree overseas the amount is about right. A bachelor's degree is about half the price.

It also depends on how in demand she was. If she is really pretty, etc. Anyone remember Tata Youngs 100M baht sinsod?

The best scenario is that both of you cleared the air and had ground rules before getting married. Separate finances, who controls the finances, where to live, which family to support, etc.

Oh I have to be honest some families if their girl marries a rich foreigner it is considered to be free money falling from the trees. Well translated from Thai actually.

I paid no sinsod but instead brought my wifes mum & dad to the UK for our wedding. When I asked my wife about her dad losing face because I didn't pay a sinsod she said and I quote "Your joking? The fact that their daughters husband flew them to the UK for the wedding and a holiday and paid for everything meant more them than a cash sinsod and people would respect her family more because their daughter has a good farang who will look after their daughter" So it seems that while it may be about face, it's not always about money.

[BygonKeaw]

I come from an Asian background, .

wot an asian getting ripped off???

Y waste your time typing this crap???

Edited February 21, 2009 by BygonKeaw

[HankChinasky]

Y waste your time typing this crap???

Because he's trying to get as many answers as he can... That's the point of trolling, and it seems to work very well on TV.

I might create a new account and start playing that little sport myself, looks like a lot of fun.