bodypaul Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 As I write, CBC are still saying 200 DEAD:http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/200...land050117.html <{POST_SNAPBACK}> RDN ... have you been drinking?? That links says 200 injured or it did when I read it!!
RDN Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 As I write, CBC are still saying 200 DEAD:http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/200...land050117.html <{POST_SNAPBACK}> RDN ... have you been drinking?? That links says 200 injured or it did when I read it!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> No - check my previous post - they've just updated it.
bodypaul Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 As I write, CBC are still saying 200 DEAD:http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/200...land050117.html <{POST_SNAPBACK}> RDN ... have you been drinking?? That links says 200 injured or it did when I read it!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> No - check my previous post - they've just updated it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> OK ... It doesn't suprise me .... the POWER of editing on computers!!!
sriracha john Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 Killed or injured, it's all bad press for Thailand at the moment it seems......
cdnvic Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 (edited) So how long did it take them to get it right? Long enough for a few thousand more hits on their sensationalised story. Yeah they messed up good this time, but in fairness to the CBC, they're not ones to sensationalise things. I hardly think they're dying for a few extra hits on the website. (although it did get me to read your sensationalised post ) cv Edited January 17, 2005 by cdnvic
mouse Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 CBC is reporting that there are 200 injured but the Google news on which the CBC is runningthe headlines has the 200 listed as dead. See http://news.google.com/
meemiathai Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 hi'this train out of maintenance should never be on tracks during working hours!! how does it work in western countries? maintenance is made at night, after working hours when tracks are empty Thais have still to learn a lot ... francois Where is the logic? They do not do maintenance work on running tracks, do they? So why does it have to at night?ps: checking the ability of drivers is not a bad idea ...does anyone remember some experience of students who could have a part time job driving trains with a minimum of learning time before? it seems to me to remember such a thing on Thai tv last year ..? I may be wrong My guess is a 3-year old kid would be able to be the driver if things were switched to "AUTO", with today's techno...
Crushdepth Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 PM Thaksin - interviewed on Channel 3 - confirmed that thecause was a Driver not acting safely ... $1.8 billion transport system and they hire a monkey to drive it. If it fell off the tracks I could probably cope with that...but sliding (?!?) down the track *backwards* into another train ??? I can understand the exit problem in this case, but no emergency lights ? No warning system like, hey man there's a ###### TRAIN coming down the track the WRONG ###### WAY ??? Top work.
RDN Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 CBC is reporting that there are 200 injured but the Google news on which the CBC is running the headlines has the 200 listed as dead.See http://news.google.com/ <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The Google news is based on what CTV and CBC are reporting and WXXA and ABC. Seems like they give preference to the most sensational: CTV 200 dead in Bangkok subway crashCBC News - 4 hours ago BANGKOK - At least 200 people were killed Monday when a subway train slammed into another one stopped at a station in Bangkok. Bleeding victims were carried onto the street following the crash, which occurred ... Official says human error caused subway crash WXXA Nearly 140 Hurt in Thai Capital Subway Crash ABC News It just shows that Google is slow to get updated, even slower than CBC, and that most of all you cannot believe anything you read these days, whether it's in newspapers or on the net. Including what I just wrote.
qualtrough Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 35 years ago as a teenager I had the privilege of riding on the footplate of an old steam locomotive between Verdun and Bar Le Duc ( I think) in France. The loco was a North British Loco built in 1916. Didn't even have electric lights, used gas. However, it did have a system that required the driver to tap a lever everytime a block signal was passed. A whistle would sound and you had a certain time period to shut it off. If not, loco was shut down. Judging by the equipment it looked to me as if it had been installed when the loco was new, it was certainly very old. Now if a loco could have that more than 80 years ago, how in the #### could a presumably state-of-the-art subway system not have similar systems in place to prevent one train from running into another?? On surface systems there are also things call derails to prevent cars from sidings fouling the main line unintentionally. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable could tell us if those are also in place on subway systems? Or should be?
RDN Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 Killed or injured, it's all bad press for Thailand at the moment it seems...... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It is staggering - the troubles in the south, the tsunami in the west and now a crash in the capital's new underground train system. And don't forget, we're all waiting to see the outcome of Khun Visetsingha's trial.
Bangkok Barry Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 From Tuesday's Bangkok Post: Bangkok Governor Apirak Kosayodhin said the BTS system was completely computer-controlled and operated under a three-tier safety system which limited the speed of trains, prevented the trains from changing directions and stopped them when they came within 200 metres of each other. That's okay, then. No train can hit another. Must have imagined it. And it's completely computer-controlled, so there are no drivers. This double-door system is obviously unsafe. If the doors of the train and the platform are not aligned then the doors can't open, and presumably that's what happened when one train hit the other and shifted it backwards along the platform. If the driver is the only one that can And why did the lights not work? It is clear that if there was a fire or smoke, then the death toll would have been immense. But according to our lame-duck 'Please do not smoke in the park' Governor, all is fine.
Bangkok Barry Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Sorry - editing error... If the driver is the only one who can open the doors and he is dead or injured, then what happens?
DaveYo Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 I cannot figure out why they don't have a barrier stop in the Maintenance facility to prevent wayward trains from going to the main tracks!!!!!!!! Secondly if the train was being repaired, what in the heck is the person doing inside the controls, unless he accidently released it's brakes. Third under such conditions, that train should have had its wheels locked down to prevent any movement in case such strange behavior does take place. By having that barrier across the tracks, that itself would have prevented it from going any further. So if anyone should be laying the blame, the Subway administration safety board should be getting the blame and also the Maintenance facility for not putting up the darn safety barriers in the first place. They have such barriers in USA, and by the way, for such to pass from maintenance to main track they have to put codes into the computers to get clearance similar to Airport procedures. Not to mention that the track switches itself (should it pass that barrier), should be pointing into a different direction which is a dead end wall to stop it completely should such breach occur. In my opinion all this could have been avoided had somebody used their coo-coo brains if they have any and set the system up correctly and thought safety first and then money and not the other way around to appease Toxin and others. Daveyo
taxexile Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 140 injured in Bangkok subway crashThai authorities have blamed yesterday's train crash on the Bangkok subway on human error. About 140 people were hurt when an empty train ran out of control and smashed into another one loaded with passengers. It has been revealed that rail controllers had asked the driver of the empty train to release its brakes while waiting for a tow to a depot. Thailand's Transport Minister Suriya Jungrungreangkit says officials simply failed to follow the proper operating procedure stated in instruction manuals. - Reuters human error , it seems to be endemic in thailand. will the mrt accept responsibility and pay hospital bills and compensate those injured? and will the safety aspect of those outer platform doors (the hong kong subway uses a similar system) be questioned now. if the train doors and the platform doors dont line up when a train stops then exiting the train is impossible ?
maerim Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 I cannot figure out why they don't have a barrier stop in the Maintenance facility to prevent wayward trains from going to the main tracks!!!!!!!!Secondly if the train was being repaired, what in the heck is the person doing inside the controls, unless he accidently released it's brakes. Third under such conditions, that train should have had its wheels locked down to prevent any movement in case such strange behavior does take place. By having that barrier across the tracks, that itself would have prevented it from going any further. So if anyone should be laying the blame, the Subway administration safety board should be getting the blame and also the Maintenance facility for not putting up the darn safety barriers in the first place. They have such barriers in USA, and by the way, for such to pass from maintenance to main track they have to put codes into the computers to get clearance similar to Airport procedures. Not to mention that the track switches itself (should it pass that barrier), should be pointing into a different direction which is a dead end wall to stop it completely should such breach occur. In my opinion all this could have been avoided had somebody used their coo-coo brains if they have any and set the system up correctly and thought safety first and then money and not the other way around to appease Toxin and others. Daveyo Ah at last, the voice of reason in a world gone mad. Dave please keep the words of wisdom coming.
kreon Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 i still honestly believe that there was sabotage involved
taxexile Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 i still honestly believe that there was sabotage involved then you are totally mad !
cdnvic Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Considering the way people drive on the road here, including the buses, is it any surprise that a train can be driven carelessly? cv
Golf Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Totally man-made error the Thai way. We're living in the world of assuming. The control center said, "unlock the brake. The train operator assumed it was ALL air brakes!?! Why didn't he ask the control center back what brake they are talking about. He assumed and went on unlock all 6 of them. In fact, he must ask them back, "Unlock the brake? Are you crazy?" But that never happened. Based on my experience, I suspected something like this would happen since the day the government announced that they will build the sybway. I keep wondering if Thais ready for this? We can be as hitech as we want, but ultimately the people who is controling the systems are the ones making decisions. We're lack of working skills, commonsenses, good judgements and many more. We can buy the best subway system in the world, but still have accidents. We need to step back and think, "What are we doing?", "Are we ready for this rapid changes in our society?", "How can we control it?", "Are we using all available resources to prevent accidents?", "Are our employees ready and have good judgements?",..., on and on.
cdnvic Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Golf, why don't people who think like you get elected? The country would be alot better off with such an honest way of looking at things. Asking questions rather than boasting. cv
Golf Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 (edited) There always the logical ways in explaining everything. Sadly most Thais don't like hearing facts. And as many as 10 millions Thais are very poor, what they need is food, the very basic human need. They are ready to sell their votes in order to have meals. They don't see long-term problems. Thai society is also based on class system, ranking, and money. We give away our souls just to be accepted in this society as rich and powerful. So we are wiling to do everything, good and bad, to get to that point. People at the top are making their way this way. When they're there, they will do everything they can to stay in power. Power and money make them blind. They cannot see things as they are. Many people like me are powerless. As the whole society is gearing toward them more and more. I only will have to pray that nothing worse than this happen. Wish only the best for Thailand, my country, my sole purpose of being on this planet. Edited January 18, 2005 by Golf
taxexile Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 its not only in thailand. there have been three or four bad train crashes in recent years in the uk , many killed , that have been a result of poor maintenace , not following correct working practice and that old chestnut, human error. even the most foolproof system will eventually be fooled into malfunctioning.
carlthailand Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 And now the systems shut for a week. Thats great. Not too sure how it works o/seas but to close for an entire week. Thank god it has only added an xtra 20mintues to my day. Feel sorry for peeps going say from Bang Sue to Silom etc. Thank god no one was hurt too badly. Nomad
stumonster Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 In fact, he must ask them back, "Unlock the brake? Are you crazy?" its been stated before - REAL education that emphasises understanding not rote learning.
steadirob Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 and will the safety aspect of those outer platform doors (the hong kong subway uses a similar system) be questioned now. if the train doors and the platform doors dont line up when a train stops then exiting the train is impossible ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes, in so many countries and cities there are no doors at all: Paris, Amsterdam, Stockholm and more . all high tech, no doors And the people in those countries are not as well-behaving in public as in Thailand! Seems to me like a security measure that surpassed the real safety issues and becomes dangerous in itself.
Sphere Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Thickskin has said it was because of just one "lousy" driver. I feel safe now. Why, I may even take the bus to work tomorrow.
sriracha john Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 i still honestly believe that there was sabotage involved <{POST_SNAPBACK}> wellllll.... the government did want to buy it and merge it with BTS and the owner didn't want to sell..... so stranger things have happened here.
sriracha john Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Golf, why don't people who think like you get elected? The country would be alot better off with such an honest way of looking at things. Asking questions rather than boasting.cv <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree. Golf for Parliment....!!!
bodypaul Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Thickskin has said it was because of just one "lousy" driver. I feel safe now. Why, I may even take the bus to work tomorrow. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And you feel safe on a bus????
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