Convicted Of Cussing; Brit Offender Burrowes To Get Free Tcket Home

[thai1]

Jingthing here is one for you.

2 guys at work in London. 1 black 1 white. Workmates. they go into work and find a bunch of bananas on the scaffold they are working on. In the toilets there are messages to F&^k off back home and when they go into the canteen to eat monkey noises are made. You and your ilk will immediately see it as racist attacks on the poor black guy! YES ??????????

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WRONG

its against me the white guy!

Simply because I am from the North East of England and so to the cockneys, ie residents of London I am just a Northern Monkey that should go back up North!

I got this everywhere I went working around London.

Did it bother me ?

Not in the slightest!!!!!!!!!

1 I'm a man and just got on with my job. You know stick and stones etc!

2 I like free bananas!

The big difference being I just got on with my job not made a big fuss over nothing and demanded compensation of thousands of pounds.

Things aren't always as the first appear.

Bully for you. You neglected to mention in your honorable coping. How many days in a Thai nick did you do with all the ruling bodies condemning you

[thai1]

Happy to know he can go back home.

The Passport was genuine?It seems it was!

The photo was accepted by the competent(British,I think)authority?It seems it was!

Was the Passport accepted by the Thai Immigration on entering Thailand?It seems it was!

Why the f*** would he have then to lose his flight and go to prison?For swearing?In English?(normally a tourist doesn't swear in Thai to a Thai Officer)

The British FCO is to blame?For sure.

The Thai Immigration is to blame?Not on TV.

The Politically Correct people are acting like fools?YES.(Sorry Jingthing,MHO only).

It could happen to me,not sure if I would only politely smile.Third world my a**.

not sure? you swear in a thread about someone else's experience of immigration so i would not back you not to

its not about being politically correct its about judging his behaviour (as reported) both at the airport and subsequently as idiotic

Burrowes behaviour was fine for an hour until laughed at after plane had left and questions not answered while stranded. But if you want to read all the editorial (as reported of course ) as idiotic, that's your selective choice. Does this mean that you have a mind of your own

[thai1]

Burrowes, on the other hand. was totally innocent but was pulled, accused and held in prison for far longer than was necessary because he was black.

Didn't his highly suspect passport photo have something to do with his being pulled aside and questioned?

Possibly, but only if you are so intellectually challenged or institutionally hidebound by a racial prejudice that you actually conclude that an apparent state of undress depicted in the photograph is sufficient evidence of forgery and that as a consequence it was not original to the document in which it was contained.

Had it been presented by any one of the thousands of white tourists passing through immigration at Phuket airport it would be a racing certainty the outcome would have been altogether different.

So a highly unusual passport photo of a shirtless man taken from an unusual angle and doesn't match the normal standard of the thousands of passport photos that pass in front of immigration every day wouldn't arouse suspicion as to its authenticity..

except if it's a black man involved???

I find that impossible to believe.

Arouse suspicion ? You neglected to mention, scrutinise for an hour in this era of high technology in one of britain's most popular holiday destinations , concluding his guilt.

[thai1]

....

The problem arose that despite the fact the passport bore no evidence of tampering the immigration officers at Phuket could not believe that a photograph depicting an apparently shirtless man could possibly be genuine and original to the document presented to them. They then contacted the British consular official in Bangkok to confirm its authenticity which , as we know, he was not able to do at the time.

Certainly, the photograph evidently aroused suspicion but on closer scrutiny any examination should have confirmed that it was original to the document and quite clearly that of the bearer.

Frankly, I don't understand your reluctance to accept that it is only because Mr Burrowes was black and therefore linked in the mindset of many Thai to all the other black Africans ' drug smugglers ' that caused his grief. The immigration officer who saw him upon his arrival obviously was aware that he came from the UK and therefore no suspicion was aroused because African impersonators travelling on alleged stolen forged British documents are not noted for their migration from Britain to Thailand because of its siren call of their welfare state and the free thinking, pluralist society likely to embrace them.

...

Surely the key is that the British consular did not confirm the authenticity?

"that it is only because Mr Burrowes was black"

That could have been a factor in why his passport was scrutinized more than normal, but how does that have any baring on the British consular not verifying the authenticity of the passport?

It seems like it's the British consular who dropped the ball big time, and not the Thai immigration...? What should they have done with a person holding a suspicious passport, which even his home country won't verify?

Just accept the facts. It won't hurt. There were cock-ups all around. Police, immigration and embassy. Yes it is possible

[thai1]

Two words sum up the latest Immigration action - vindictive and spiteful.

It will surely do wonders to Thailand's attempt to rebuild Tourism.

I wait for S. John's explanation as to why this latest setback is actually all Simon's fault, did he not grovel deep enough at Phuket this time round?

I'm sorry for your apparent reading impediment, but I never said it was all his fault in the first place nor is it now.

As for the latest... and to his credit, he seems to have at least learned from his last experience and conducted himself accordingly this time.

This time, it seems, he kept his cool.

“It's not that much of a surprise, really,” he told the Gazette, explaining that after all he had been through, he was fully prepared for a hitch.

“It’s nothing. It really is nothing,” he said, sounding resigned.

Conducted himself accordingly ? You mean he didn't speak out against incompetence and being again incarcerated without commiting a crime. Do you think this is behaviour he should be proud of, or would be upset about ?

[thai1]

Good riddance to his sort...thats one of the main reasons I left the U.K. because of w&nkers like him....still think they should have locked him away for a few years...total a&&hole...

Burrowes stands up to being humiliated after being humble for an hour and that mAKES HIM axwxker and axhol. And you live as a second class citizen who can't vote or own property and daren't raise your voice; voluntarily . You obviously think grovelling is a virtue because reacting warrants a few years in a Thai prison. You aren't even a prixk. You are just a waste of space. Shame you never fell through the toilet of the plane on the way over here

[thai1]

Conclusion:

As traversing the globe entails any number of potential pitfalls, not everyone is cut out to be a world traveler.

What a pompous statement!

Seems the board is populated with elitists , too.

So, you are actually arguing Mr. Burrowes skin colour had NOTHING to do with his ordeal and it was his fault that his legally issued passport wasn't up to Thai standards ( or at least one Thai's standard..)?

Factual, not pompous.

Realist, not elitist.

I'm not arguing anything, but simply pointing out that given his presentation with a suspect passport followed by aggressive action, the subsequent events that befell him could occur to a person of any color.

Part of being a world traveler is having responsibility for educating oneself and in many areas, this was sorely lacking. Yes, others were involved in his predicament, but I don't absolve him of his own role in it.

COULD...... again, cowardly not commital. As for your selective rendition of events, Suspect passport followes by an hour of deception , followed by non accountability, nay giggling after executing a crucial decision. Of course, how irresponsible of him not to have read up on this. How arrogant and pompus you are

[thai1]

I can see quite plainly how some loudmouth, ignorant posters might find Burrowes' actions acceptable.

Shameful.

How do you conclude that I'm a racist, Gunga Dim? Because the rude, angry Brit is a black man?

Brilliant! Lovely!

maybe because you formulate your case like an ignorant , pointless narrow moronic member of a lynch mob

[sriracha john]

....

The problem arose that despite the fact the passport bore no evidence of tampering the immigration officers at Phuket could not believe that a photograph depicting an apparently shirtless man could possibly be genuine and original to the document presented to them. They then contacted the British consular official in Bangkok to confirm its authenticity which , as we know, he was not able to do at the time.

Certainly, the photograph evidently aroused suspicion but on closer scrutiny any examination should have confirmed that it was original to the document and quite clearly that of the bearer.

Frankly, I don't understand your reluctance to accept that it is only because Mr Burrowes was black and therefore linked in the mindset of many Thai to all the other black Africans ' drug smugglers ' that caused his grief. The immigration officer who saw him upon his arrival obviously was aware that he came from the UK and therefore no suspicion was aroused because African impersonators travelling on alleged stolen forged British documents are not noted for their migration from Britain to Thailand because of its siren call of their welfare state and the free thinking, pluralist society likely to embrace them.

...

Surely the key is that the British consular did not confirm the authenticity?

"that it is only because Mr Burrowes was black"

That could have been a factor in why his passport was scrutinized more than normal, but how does that have any baring on the British consular not verifying the authenticity of the passport?

It seems like it's the British consular who dropped the ball big time, and not the Thai immigration...? What should they have done with a person holding a suspicious passport, which even his home country won't verify?

Just accept the facts. It won't hurt. There were cock-ups all around. Police, immigration and embassy. Yes it is possible

Please be sure add Mr. Burrowes to your list and then you could change "possible" to "probable" for all those on the list.

Edited May 29, 2009 by sriracha john

[philw]

I can see quite plainly how some loudmouth, ignorant posters might find Burrowes' actions acceptable.

Shameful.

How do you conclude that I'm a racist, Gunga Dim? Because the rude, angry Brit is a black man?

Brilliant! Lovely!

maybe because you formulate your case like an ignorant , pointless narrow moronic member of a lynch mob

Great stuff Thai1 and you are spot on !!!!

phil

[sriracha john]

Two words sum up the latest Immigration action - vindictive and spiteful.

It will surely do wonders to Thailand's attempt to rebuild Tourism.

I wait for S. John's explanation as to why this latest setback is actually all Simon's fault, did he not grovel deep enough at Phuket this time round?

I'm sorry for your apparent reading impediment, but I never said it was all his fault in the first place nor is it now.

As for the latest... and to his credit, he seems to have at least learned from his last experience and conducted himself accordingly this time.

This time, it seems, he kept his cool.

“It's not that much of a surprise, really,” he told the Gazette, explaining that after all he had been through, he was fully prepared for a hitch.

“It’s nothing. It really is nothing,” he said, sounding resigned.

Conducted himself accordingly ? You mean he didn't speak out against incompetence and being again incarcerated without commiting a crime. Do you think this is behaviour he should be proud of, or would be upset about ?

This time he didn't hurl expletives at immigration officials and this time he acknowledged in other parts of the story that as a visitor he should be more respectful to the country he is visiting. He also kept in mind as per the above quote, that, as a world traveler, sometimes things don't always go the way one expects and to simply roll with the punches (using a boxing analogy for him). These were the different angles, I was referring to has having him, at least, learned something from his ordeal. It was the first indication he has any sense of developing insight into what occurred and his role in it.

[sriracha john]

Conclusion:

As traversing the globe entails any number of potential pitfalls, not everyone is cut out to be a world traveler.

What a pompous statement!

Seems the board is populated with elitists , too.

So, you are actually arguing Mr. Burrowes skin colour had NOTHING to do with his ordeal and it was his fault that his legally issued passport wasn't up to Thai standards ( or at least one Thai's standard..)?

Factual, not pompous.

Realist, not elitist.

I'm not arguing anything, but simply pointing out that given his presentation with a suspect passport followed by aggressive action, the subsequent events that befell him could occur to a person of any color.

Part of being a world traveler is having responsibility for educating oneself and in many areas, this was sorely lacking. Yes, others were involved in his predicament, but I don't absolve him of his own role in it.

COULD...... again, cowardly not commital. As for your selective rendition of events, Suspect passport followes by an hour of deception , followed by non accountability, nay giggling after executing a crucial decision. Of course, how irresponsible of him not to have read up on this. How arrogant and pompus you are

I like how you've queue'd all the different posters up for a line up of flames in your replies.... sorta like Simon's behavior.

Anyway, what's this about giggling? We know that the Thais were likely smiling or even gently laughing in their cultural method of dealing with loud, aggressive action. Simon, as many an uninformed newbie visitor does, isn't aware of this difference and makes misinterpretive steps afterwards.

Until one learns that its always best to be at least rudimentary informed of such basic and well-documented aspects prior to traveling the world, people can frequently make fundamental mistakes.

I somehow suspect even Simon has learned that basic premise himself now.

Edited May 29, 2009 by sriracha john

[GungaDin]

I like how you've queue'd all the different posters up for a line up of flames in your replies.... sorta like Simon's behavior.

Anyway, what's this about giggling? We know that the Thais were likely smiling or even gently laughing in their cultural method of dealing with loud, aggressive action. Simon, as many an uninformed newbie visitor does, isn't aware of this difference and makes misinterpretive steps afterwards.

Until one learns that its always best to be at least rudimentary informed of such basic and well-documented aspects prior to traveling the world, people can frequently make fundamental mistakes.

I somehow suspect even Simon has learned that basic premise himself now.

You've lost the plot (yet again)

Nothing new in that, going by your previous ludicrous posts in this topic.

Do you share a room with patinbkk or texpat? (or both)

[sriracha john]

I like how you've queue'd all the different posters up for a line up of flames in your replies.... sorta like Simon's behavior.

Anyway, what's this about giggling? We know that the Thais were likely smiling or even gently laughing in their cultural method of dealing with loud, aggressive action. Simon, as many an uninformed newbie visitor does, isn't aware of this difference and makes misinterpretive steps afterwards.

Until one learns that its always best to be at least rudimentary informed of such basic and well-documented aspects prior to traveling the world, people can frequently make fundamental mistakes.

I somehow suspect even Simon has learned that basic premise himself now.

You've lost the plot (yet again)

Nothing new in that, going by your previous ludicrous posts in this topic.

Do you share a room with patinbkk or texpat? (or both)

Yet another Simon-esque flamer...

One place I've not shared a room... is Immigration detention. How about yourself?

[TheLaughingMan]

I like how you've queue'd all the different posters up for a line up of flames in your replies.... sorta like Simon's behavior.

Anyway, what's this about giggling? We know that the Thais were likely smiling or even gently laughing in their cultural method of dealing with loud, aggressive action. Simon, as many an uninformed newbie visitor does, isn't aware of this difference and makes misinterpretive steps afterwards.

Until one learns that its always best to be at least rudimentary informed of such basic and well-documented aspects prior to traveling the world, people can frequently make fundamental mistakes.

I somehow suspect even Simon has learned that basic premise himself now.

You've lost the plot (yet again)

Nothing new in that, going by your previous ludicrous posts in this topic.

Do you share a room with patinbkk or texpat? (or both)

Yet another Simon-esque flamer...

One place I've not shared a room... is Immigration detention. How about yourself?

SJ, there is absolutely no reason to disbelieve Simon when he says they were giggling at him. You claim it was a cultural thing that he misunderstood, sorry but I live here and an official or authority should be acting professionally, not like an Isaan farmer who laughs when someone falls and breaks their leg which is only common of the more ignorant and badly educated Thais. If you are going to expect so much from travellers to Thailand you need to expect as much from the Thai officials and professionals that are supposed to be trained properly and react in a professional manner. Simon was not loud and abusive to make them giggle, it was the giggling that made him suddenly raise his voice, you have it out of order.

[sriracha john]

I like how you've queue'd all the different posters up for a line up of flames in your replies.... sorta like Simon's behavior.

Anyway, what's this about giggling? We know that the Thais were likely smiling or even gently laughing in their cultural method of dealing with loud, aggressive action. Simon, as many an uninformed newbie visitor does, isn't aware of this difference and makes misinterpretive steps afterwards.

Until one learns that its always best to be at least rudimentary informed of such basic and well-documented aspects prior to traveling the world, people can frequently make fundamental mistakes.

I somehow suspect even Simon has learned that basic premise himself now.

You've lost the plot (yet again)

Nothing new in that, going by your previous ludicrous posts in this topic.

Do you share a room with patinbkk or texpat? (or both)

Yet another Simon-esque flamer...

One place I've not shared a room... is Immigration detention. How about yourself?

SJ, there is absolutely no reason to disbelieve Simon when he says they were giggling at him. You claim it was a cultural thing that he misunderstood, sorry but I live here and an official or authority should be acting professionally, not like an Isaan farmer who laughs when someone falls and breaks their leg which is only common of the more ignorant and badly educated Thais. If you are going to expect so much from travellers to Thailand you need to expect as much from the Thai officials and professionals that are supposed to be trained properly and react in a professional manner. Simon was not loud and abusive to make them giggle, it was the giggling that made him suddenly raise his voice, you have it out of order.

You give up self-determination when you say someone's non-physical actions "made him" do something and that's something I have great difficulty in buying into. It's what self-control, if one has it, comes in to play.

Most immigration officials I've encountered don't strike me as highly educated nor worldly experienced (same as most other immigration officials) and I would imagine that, given their background, they would fall under the "norm" of other Thais in this cultural aspect. It (inappropriate laughing/smiling by Western situational standards) is a cultural phenomenon that I've seen cross socio-economic boundaries anyway.

It is also incumbent upon the visitor to know the customs of the place he is visiting and to a lesser degree the vice versa of the situation.

Lastly and just to reiterate, despite the flamers' insinuations, I have never blamed this entire incident on Mr. Burrowes.

Edited May 29, 2009 by sriracha john

[TheLaughingMan]

You said they responded to his loud abusive behaviour by giggling, this was incorrect. It was the other way around.

[spysee]

Not that Burrowes deserved this, but I hope this will help let other know not to just yell and get pissed off at Thai people for such little reasons. Some farang tourists are just plain disrespectful to Thai's. Its amazing that most Thai's still smile at farangs anymore

[kennkate]

Amazing Thailand. I cannot belive this is still going on.

Simon Burrowes, The Big Bad Black man From England. I know this is fantasy Land and you like to play

Now Please Play with your Leggo nicely if not you will go to Bed. and not go to the Pictures.

Fact Simon Burrowes Came to Thailand with The Same Passport and Recived Entry Stamp ( Passport OK )

He would then have is Photo Taken and the passport details entered on the Imigration Computer. ?

I take it the Passport No is recorded.

So you come to leave Thailand Imigration Enter the Same No. Guess what! You see his Entry Photo and Passport No

These Computers are wonderfull. They do not make mistakes operators make mistakes Rubbish IN Rubbish OUT

Unless it's all there to LOOK Efficient. That is a Possible It is Thailand and everything is not always what it appears to be.

Now Children Please Play nicely.