Tourism plunges 22 per cent

[JR Texas]

It's just no fun any more.

So why waste your time even coming onto a Thailand dedicated forum? I m not having a go, just seems counter productive way to spend your time. Personally, I have fun in Thailand. Having fun and a good experience is down to the individual whereever you are. The great blessing than humans have been gifted is that we possess an intellect to guide. One can go wherever they want to go. If you are not having fun, then vote with your feet so to speak, the world is a big place. Just seems pointless coming on to a Thai website and reinforcing your on negativity on yourself.

Just as beach resorts come and go, so too people keep moving to places they prefer. However, it's a finite world, though not to say a place that was 'fun' 120 years ago cannot once again be 'fun' at a later epoch. Much of enjoyment stems from an individual's inner characteristics - rather than seeking it from 'outside'. You can enter the pinball machine, and get knocked around/pinged by others and have 'fun' or you can become your own spiritual pinball machine - precluding the need to have outside influences to zap your world.

IMO, The Philippines is not close to Thailand in anyway shape or form... The food is very poor, the poverty is more extreme and in general not many people look that happy compared to Thailand. Not many smiling faces unfortunately.

I've only been to the Philippines once, for 3 weeks 20 years ago. I went to see some ladies I'd been corresponding with as part of a Lonely Hearts Club. Every one of the 5 or 6 islands I went, up and down the archapeligo, the dynamic was essentially: the women had this prudent Catholic idea of how ideal men should be, and the men were incessantly getting drunk and chasing girls, so it was a continual unresolved carousel of tension which led to fighting and misery. One side effect is the Pope-sanctioned popping out of endless numbers of little Catholics, nearly all without fathers. The other is, obviously; deep-set poverty.

Just to make the discussion a bit more balanced, here are some data on corruption, violent crime, GDP growth rates, and peace.

Thailand does score better than the Philippines in terms of perception of corruption.

http://www.transparency.org/news_room/in_f.../cpi_2008_table

But that certainly does not make Thailand "not corrupt." Corruption seems to be a way of life in Southeast Asia (perhaps Malaysia and Singapore are the two least corrupt countries in the region).

In terms of annual GDP growth rate, the Philippines is doing much better than Thailand. So our most of the other nations in Southeast Asia.......data are dated, but there are more current data (no time to search for it now). http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/eco_gdp_...p-growth-annual

In terms of violent crime, Thailand's is high.......14th in the world and almost the same as Zimbabwe (again, that should make people sleep better). http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_...ders-per-capita

Data for violent crime in the Philippines is missing from the NationMaster.com list, but it has been shown on other threads and violent crime is actually higher in Thailand than it is in the Philippines.

Continuing to state that the Philippines is more violent is simply an abuse of reality......both countries suffer from rather high rates of crime.

I would also venture to guess that places like Pattaya-Jomtien have some of the highest crime rates in the world.

In terms of overall peace, both Cambodia and the Philippines score better than Thailand:

http://www.visionofhumanity.org/gpi/results/rankings.php

Thailand has many problems........and so do most of the countries in Southeast Asia. Thailand is certainly not that much better than the Philippines (there are places to live in the Philippines that are beautiful and fairly peaceful......you have to be selective).

[Thai at Heart]

"The Phillipines is unfortunately a corrupt dirty dingehole even if the people are nice."

Sounds like a perfect description of Thailand!

Have visited the Philippines regularly for business in the last few years and it really cannot even hold a candle to Thailand in terms of safety or food.

Corruption is probably the same or worse, but much like corruption anywhere, keep your head down and you might avoid it. Having been up country a few times, the roads are absolutely shocking and the poverty is far more in your face than Thailand. Expats in Bangkok can live perfectly well without ever seeing obvious poverty. In Manila it is under every underpass.

And as for the food, well where shall we start. Adobo is the national dish. I suggest people look it up. It is quite exquisite in it's blandness and fat content. Then add on top that on every other corner is an American fast food outlet. Safety wise, I was privy to visit a gun show in Manila. Whilst Americans are far more au fait with the concept of every tom, dick and dirty harry having a gun, it definitely wasn't my cup of tea and I found the overt amount of guns available in society quite disturbing.

Nice people nonetheless and much larger percentage of good English speakers than Thailand.

[animatic]

"The Phillipines is unfortunately a corrupt dirty dingehole even if the people are nice."

Sounds like a perfect description of Thailand!

For what it's worth, I went to the Philippines way back in the late 80's, only a few times, Thailand vs. Phillipines on a personal comparison test. The national cuisine didn't impress me at all. Go to a beach side resort and the restaurant only has 1 item of seafood on the menu?!?!?!?!? IMHO, when the US Military pulled out the degradation turned into a landslide. I think to this day that Thailand is the better option.

Food quality, safety, living standards, and even cost of living is all inferior to Thailand in my opinion. This hasn't changed although they do offer more than 1 seafood on the menu these days. Filipino food is still terrible. As far as the people goes it's a toss up like anywhere else. Filipinos are much more "westernized" which can be good or bad depending on your point of view. I don't think it's a positive thing to be honest.

We have a filipina friend and she agrees with this.

She prefers Thailand to her home land and couldn't wait to bring her daughter over here.

Many of the better, yet lowest paid musicians on the island are fillipino(a) and even at the

rotten pay they get, it is mana from heaven compared to back home.

She is westernized in several respects, but still asian to the core.

[animatic]

IMO,.....

essentially: the women had this prudent Catholic idea of how ideal men should be,

and the men were incessantly getting drunk and chasing girls,

so it was a continual unresolved carousel of tension which led to fighting and misery.

One side effect is the Pope-sanctioned popping out of endless numbers of little Catholics,

nearly all without fathers. The other is, obviously; deep-set poverty.

And those two elements go hand in glove.

Sure lots more bodies for the greater church, and some 'moral battles' won Quixotically,

but then those new catholics are subjected to penury and abuse just for existing.

Oh, but hey, condoms are a moral abomination, birth control a travesty of 'god's will'

etc etc. With all the good the catholic church does do, it really drops the ball on

these fundamental functions of creating a better world for it's membership.

[CHIEFOFFICER]

Agree with this. It all depends how the Govt really wants to perceive itself; a tourist economy or start to be focused on their manufacturing.

I trust you realize that even in the "boom" years that tourism has never accounted for more than 6-7% of Thai GDP. Feel free to google it.

I love Thailand without all the tourists- the "low season" deals this year are amazing!

I too love thailand,been here for 20years,have a nice fam.(wife,2 sons,2 girls) and I never have

had any problems. I'm not blind or deaf, nothing is perfect, but life is good in thailand, when

you live like a thai and don't try to change things to be like in 'YOUR OLD COUNTRY'

best regards

chiefofficer

[mommysboy]

Of course things have changed.

The world is always in change.

The Golden era is over in many ways for visiting Thailand.

Too many tourists helped to wreck it. The Thai people responded as expected/

Prices have risen on everything.

A beer 10 years ago was 60 baht or so in a watering hole.

It now will cost you closer to 140 baht or more.

Short-time friendship HAA HAA

Oh yeah the price of that has more than doubled.

Hotels--doubled

Taxi rates--doubled

In the UK ten years ago, a pint was under £2, now it is nearly £4, is this unique to Thailand?

Taxi prices have doubled here also...

House prices went up nearly 200%, and in some areas nearly 400%!!

So we have had price increases all over the world. I m not disagreeing with you. I expect the baht to be quite strong in the coming years, but relative to what? Well, I m diversifying into real assets, silver, gold, agricultural commodities, some yen in the short term. I m not positive on many currencies, including the baht, but I think the situation with pound sterling is precarious, so having the same purchasing power as few years ago in baht ( and hopefully more) is of paramount importance, and I see being properly positioned is the key to staying up with prices all over the world, including Thailand.

So what's your point? Are you saying life is easy in Thailand? Because the next bloke has a broken arm too that the pain ofyour broken arm doesn't count ?. That it's not hot in the Sahara because the Gobi has a heat wave.

You don't talk about quality either. Prices have gone up markedly, quality down IMHO.

It really isn't that much fun anymore.

I'm not surprised tourism is plummeting.

Thailand was all about cheap and cheerful, that isn't true anymore.

[Oberkommando]

It's just no fun any more.

So why waste your time even coming onto a Thailand dedicated forum? I m not having a go, just seems counter productive way to spend your time. Personally, I have fun in Thailand. Having fun and a good experience is down to the individual whereever you are. The great blessing than humans have been gifted is that we possess an intellect to guide. One can go whereever they want to go. If you are not having fun, then vote with your feet so to speak, the world is a big place. Just seems pointless coming on to a Thai website and reinforcing your on negativity on yourself.

Eh? I have lived in Thailand for 25 years and have several businesses here. I visit this forum to keep up to date with current affairs primarily.

It must be nice to have no commitments and be able to up and leave countries at a moments notice.

Unfortunately some of us have responsibilities.

[vedantafx]

It's just no fun any more.

So why waste your time even coming onto a Thailand dedicated forum? I m not having a go, just seems counter productive way to spend your time. Personally, I have fun in Thailand. Having fun and a good experience is down to the individual whereever you are. The great blessing than humans have been gifted is that we possess an intellect to guide. One can go whereever they want to go. If you are not having fun, then vote with your feet so to speak, the world is a big place. Just seems pointless coming on to a Thai website and reinforcing your on negativity on yourself.

Eh? I have lived in Thailand for 25 years and have several businesses here. I visit this forum to keep up to date with current affairs primarily.

It must be nice to have no commitments and be able to up and leave countries at a moments notice.

Unfortunately some of us have responsibilities.

Like I said Okerkommando, I m not having a go. I m just pointing out that humans have the priviledge to choose. Of course we all have responsibilities...however, it is worth remembering that all responsibilities are self-created.

Also, like I said fun is a subjective experience and down to the inner temperament of the individual. I have fun in Thailand, Bangkok, and friends people who I hang out with some of who have been here more than two decades still have alot of fun and seem happy.

[vedantafx]

Of course things have changed.

The world is always in change.

The Golden era is over in many ways for visiting Thailand.

Too many tourists helped to wreck it. The Thai people responded as expected/

Prices have risen on everything.

A beer 10 years ago was 60 baht or so in a watering hole.

It now will cost you closer to 140 baht or more.

Short-time friendship HAA HAA

Oh yeah the price of that has more than doubled.

Hotels--doubled

Taxi rates--doubled

In the UK ten years ago, a pint was under £2, now it is nearly £4, is this unique to Thailand?

Taxi prices have doubled here also...

House prices went up nearly 200%, and in some areas nearly 400%!!

So we have had price increases all over the world. I m not disagreeing with you. I expect the baht to be quite strong in the coming years, but relative to what? Well, I m diversifying into real assets, silver, gold, agricultural commodities, some yen in the short term. I m not positive on many currencies, including the baht, but I think the situation with pound sterling is precarious, so having the same purchasing power as few years ago in baht ( and hopefully more) is of paramount importance, and I see being properly positioned is the key to staying up with prices all over the world, including Thailand.

So what's your point? Are you saying life is easy in Thailand? Because the next bloke has a broken arm too that the pain ofyour broken arm doesn't count ?. That it's not hot in the Sahara because the Gobi has a heat wave.

You don't talk about quality either. Prices have gone up markedly, quality down IMHO.

It really isn't that much fun anymore.

I'm not surprised tourism is plummeting.

Thailand was all about cheap and cheerful, that isn't true anymore.

My point is that this is not anything unique to Thailand, and it cannot be said it is down to greed of the Thais, since inflation has been a wrold wide event, due to an increase in the supply of money and credit. A boom if you like. Life is what you make it anywhere. It totally depends on how you decide to live it. Yes, life is easy in Thailand in my experience. But I don't have a Thai business, so perhaps it is not as easy if you are trying to run a business here, and I appreciate that. I only need a laptop and an internet connection, so having this flexibility and to really enjoy what I'm doing I guess makes life easy, which I don't feel guilty about.

Again the comment about being not surprised that tourism is plummeting seems a little out of context. I wrote this earlier in this thread...

Every country tourist numbers are down

Just do a search for any region. Tourism is being struck hard everywhere. I m not surprised tourism is plummeting, but not for the reasons many others are postulating with. There is a world wide credit contraction.

I m not being pedantic, ok maybe I am. I m not sure what you mean bu quality? IN what area? As the ipod I bought in the UK comes from the same place the Ipod in Thailand comes from. The TV is made in China, the laptop I m writing on is made in Asia, the clothes we wear come from Asia to a large degree...Is it the quality of the beer, the food? I still find the beer and food to be very good. The Uk doesn't produce anything anymore, so it is hard to assess the quality here.

Edited July 27, 2009 by vedantafx

[JR Texas]

Of course things have changed.

The world is always in change.

The Golden era is over in many ways for visiting Thailand.

Too many tourists helped to wreck it. The Thai people responded as expected/

Prices have risen on everything.

A beer 10 years ago was 60 baht or so in a watering hole.

It now will cost you closer to 140 baht or more.

Short-time friendship HAA HAA

Oh yeah the price of that has more than doubled.

Hotels--doubled

Taxi rates--doubled

In the UK ten years ago, a pint was under £2, now it is nearly £4, is this unique to Thailand?

Taxi prices have doubled here also...

House prices went up nearly 200%, and in some areas nearly 400%!!

So we have had price increases all over the world. I m not disagreeing with you. I expect the baht to be quite strong in the coming years, but relative to what? Well, I m diversifying into real assets, silver, gold, agricultural commodities, some yen in the short term. I m not positive on many currencies, including the baht, but I think the situation with pound sterling is precarious, so having the same purchasing power as few years ago in baht ( and hopefully more) is of paramount importance, and I see being properly positioned is the key to staying up with prices all over the world, including Thailand.

So what's your point? Are you saying life is easy in Thailand? Because the next bloke has a broken arm too that the pain ofyour broken arm doesn't count ?. That it's not hot in the Sahara because the Gobi has a heat wave.

You don't talk about quality either. Prices have gone up markedly, quality down IMHO.

It really isn't that much fun anymore.

I'm not surprised tourism is plummeting.

Thailand was all about cheap and cheerful, that isn't true anymore.

My point is that this is not anything unique to Thailand, and it cannot be said it is down to greed of the Thais, since inflation has been a wrold wide event, due to an increase in the supply of money and credit. A boom if you like. Life is what you make it anywhere. It totally depends on how you decide to live it. Yes, life is easy in Thailand in my experience. But I don't have a Thai business, so perhaps it is not as easy if you are trying to run a business here, and I appreciate that. I only need a laptop and an internet connection, so having this flexibility and to really enjoy what I'm doing I guess makes life easy, which I don't feel guilty about.

Again the comment about being not surprised that tourism is plummeting seems a little out of context. I wrote this earlier in this thread...

Every country tourist numbers are down

Just do a search for any region. Tourism is being struck hard everywhere. I m not surprised tourism is plummeting, but not for the reasons many others are postulating with. There is a world wide credit contraction.

I m not being pedantic, ok maybe I am. I m not sure what you mean bu quality? IN what area? As the ipod I bought in the UK comes from the same place the Ipod in Thailand comes from. The TV is made in China, the laptop I m writing on is made in Asia, the clothes we wear come from Asia to a large degree...Is it the quality of the beer, the food? I still find the beer and food to be very good. The Uk doesn't produce anything anymore, so it is hard to assess the quality here.

Some countries are actually doing fine in terms of tourism numbers (e.g., Malaysia). The UN just posted a study on it.

There is a thread running in the Pattaya section that gives the data (I know because I posted it).

Yes, in general, most tourism destinations are hurting..........but some are doing OK.

Very interesting to me that Malaysia is doing fine when it is experiencing the same global eonomic problems and Swine Flu problem as Thailand.

One person reported (again on the Pattaya thread) that there are loads of tourists there now.

Bali is also OK.........so is, surprisingly, many northern African countries and some destinations in S. America.

So, not everyone is hurting...........some people are still traveling.......the difference is that many more than usual are decided to avoid Thailand.

[vedantafx]

Some countries are actually doing fine in terms of tourism numbers (e.g., Malaysia). The UN just posted a study on it.

There is a thread running in the Pattaya section that gives the data (I know because I posted it).

Yes, in general, most tourism destinations are hurting..........but some are doing OK.

Very interesting to me that Malaysia is doing fine when it is experiencing the same global eonomic problems and Swine Flu problem as Thailand.

One person reported (again on the Pattaya thread) that there are loads of tourists there now.

Bali is also OK.........so is, surprisingly, many northern African countries and some destinations in S. America.

So, not everyone is hurting...........some people are still traveling.......the difference is that many more than usual are decided to avoid Thailand.

Good points, and fair points also. I agree that more people are deciding to go to other countries other than Thailand. These other countries are certainly making large efforts to promote tourism in their countries, so I think it is natural there will be growth in these nations, as they have more room for growth, especially in North Africa. However, if you take Thailand as a country with a mature tourism sector and compare it with countries that have large tourism sectors then the trend is similar in these countries with developed tourism sectors., Australia, Spain, UK, Europe etc etc. I have also noticed large advertising campaigns for Malaysia and the African countries to promote tourism, so people will go to try out these new places as the promotion efforts imbed these countries in the consciouness off people who probably could have not have found them on a map a few years ago.

The countries that have less well developed tourism sectors are doing better. It is the same with a country's economy. More under developed countries will show higher growth than developed countries as the room for capacity growth, industrial production is there.

There is a finite number of tourists. As more options are open, it is only natural that these countries will start to gain some market share from other destinations and hence growth will come. I could compare it to a company. If we only have 2-3 companies providing a service in a sector, they will have dominant market share. If however more new competitors ( countries such as Malaysia, African nations, Eastern European nations) enter into the arena where there are an finite number of buyers (tourists) then some of the market share willl be taken away from the other companies (countries) I don't see this as a negative, and I think it will be good for the region in the longer run. So perhaps it is fair to say that Thailand is not being a well run company at this time in some aspects

I agree that Thailand is not doing all it could do to fight to keep these tourists, and individuals will make these choices by themselves as consumers.

• My bone is only that people say Thailand is not fun anymore when that is a subjective element, and cannot be quantified for everyone.
  
• And that Thailand is isolated in being to blame for a decrease in tourist numbers, using visa rules, prices, people not being cheerful ect etc as excuses when it is not as clear cut as that for the reasons you and I have already mentioned.
  

Edited July 27, 2009 by vedantafx

[Koo82]

"If the government can solve its political problems and is able to host the Asean meetings successfully, tourism should be revived by the end of this year or the beginning of 2010," Mr Kongkit predicted.

If they still want to arrest Khun Thaksin, no way they can do it. They're just wasting time and causing political problems by running after him.

Call a new election and see what the Prime Minister who is elected by majority of people can do.

[catmac]

However, if you take Thailand as a country with a mature tourism sector and compare it with countries that have large tourism sectors then the trend is similar in these countries with developed tourism sectors., Australia, Spain, UK, Europe etc etc. Ithat for the reasons you and I have already mentioned.

Just not true. Bali has been an established tourist spot for years and they are showing an 8% increase this year! Australia, Spain, etc. have no relevence in the SE Asia tourist market, and are just red herrings. If Indonesia and Malaysia can manage to increase their tourist arrivals in spite of all the global problems, yet Thailand is reporting simply disastrous figures, then perhaps the problems are within Thailand itself.

[mrtoad]

"If the government can solve its political problems and is able to host the Asean meetings successfully, tourism should be revived by the end of this year or the beginning of 2010," Mr Kongkit predicted.

If they still want to arrest Khun Thaksin, no way they can do it. They're just wasting time and causing political problems by running after him.

Call a new election and see what the Prime Minister who is elected by majority of people can do.

Yes, those idiotic red shirts didn't harm tourism at all did they? They were no better than the idiots in the yellow who blocked off the airport.

The only people who are losing out on this power struggle between two sides are the majority of the Thai population.

[dude007]

These things are happening in every country in the world, likely no more or less than here. I find Thailand a safer country than most I have visited. When have you, or any of the posters here experienced such violence? The only violence I have experienced was drunken farang.

The only violence I have experienced was drunken Thai.

Apologists nonsense

...but unfortunately true. You ever met a drunken Thai? Open your eyes my friend and stop believing that Thailand is a "safe country". I've seen beating up a farang a few days ago by 17 tuk-tuk drivers in Phuket because he had walked against his mirror (wrongly parked tuk-tuk) and the tuk-tuk driver wanted him to pay 2,000 THB (there was no damage at all). They followed him in a bar where he tried to escape from the arrogance and with 17, they beated him up... The bar-tender got his deal as well, trying to limit the damage. It took 45 minutes before police came... just to drive slowly by and then disappear. The tuk-tuk drivers watched from the other side of the street in even greater numbers.

And that is just one story, the latest one.

Just be patient and stay a bit longer and after 20 years we talk again.

[livinthailandos]

I had to put this is let it be noted that the MAJORITY OF YOU ARE NOT TOURISTS. You are either retired here, working here. period

1. Thailand is a developing country but its tourism market I believe has gone as high as it might go and its overly matured as far as tourism

2. I to have seen advertising for tourism to visit malaysia, india, vietnam, laos.

3. As far as I remember 100 hotels are for sale in thailand majority are 4 -5 star

4. To many people only interested in the high end to luxury market. Only interested in the quickest way to making money

5. Like i mention and have heard before the back packer today is the future middle class tourist

6. Smart, people who have a business plan, prepare, try to make value for guests and provide hospitaly and aren't breed for overly high pricing do well. ( don't laugh there are people here doing fine still )

7. Tourism is down everywhere. Add H1N1 and nobody really knows whats going to happen with this virus for all we know it could mutate. If that happens it really won't matter for any industry then and it won't matter where you are

8. Thailand has had 19 military coups, how many prime ministers now. Face it government process doesn't happen period. Business progress happens though

Truly the future is always unknown. unpredictable, and in life there is no such thing as control. Just live your life one day at a time and enjoy what you have because things can always be worse.

[zzaa09]

I had to put this is let it be noted that the MAJORITY OF YOU ARE NOT TOURISTS. You are either retired here, working here. period

1. Thailand is a developing country but its tourism market I believe has gone as high as it might go and its overly matured as far as tourism

2. I to have seen advertising for tourism to visit malaysia, india, vietnam, laos.

3. As far as I remember 100 hotels are for sale in thailand majority are 4 -5 star

4. To many people only interested in the high end to luxury market. Only interested in the quickest way to making money

5. Like i mention and have heard before the back packer today is the future middle class tourist

6. Smart, people who have a business plan, prepare, try to make value for guests and provide hospitaly and aren't breed for overly high pricing do well. ( don't laugh there are people here doing fine still )

7. Tourism is down everywhere. Add H1N1 and nobody really knows whats going to happen with this virus for all we know it could mutate. If that happens it really won't matter for any industry then and it won't matter where you are

8. Thailand has had 19 military coups, how many prime ministers now. Face it government process doesn't happen period. Business progress happens though

Truly the future is always unknown. unpredictable, and in life there is no such thing as control. Just live your life one day at a time and enjoy what you have because things can always be worse.

.....we still have our rice bowls full.

[JR Texas]

I had to put this is let it be noted that the MAJORITY OF YOU ARE NOT TOURISTS. You are either retired here, working here. period

1. Thailand is a developing country but its tourism market I believe has gone as high as it might go and its overly matured as far as tourism

2. I to have seen advertising for tourism to visit malaysia, india, vietnam, laos.

3. As far as I remember 100 hotels are for sale in thailand majority are 4 -5 star

4. To many people only interested in the high end to luxury market. Only interested in the quickest way to making money

5. Like i mention and have heard before the back packer today is the future middle class tourist

6. Smart, people who have a business plan, prepare, try to make value for guests and provide hospitaly and aren't breed for overly high pricing do well. ( don't laugh there are people here doing fine still )

7. Tourism is down everywhere. Add H1N1 and nobody really knows whats going to happen with this virus for all we know it could mutate. If that happens it really won't matter for any industry then and it won't matter where you are

8. Thailand has had 19 military coups, how many prime ministers now. Face it government process doesn't happen period. Business progress happens though

Truly the future is always unknown. unpredictable, and in life there is no such thing as control. Just live your life one day at a time and enjoy what you have because things can always be worse.

This page is a wake up call to any person who thinks all countries in Southeast Asia rank the same on variables like "crime".....in fact, as the data show, Thailand is behind virtually all other countries in the region on many variables:

http://www.business-in-asia.com/asia/asia_peace_ranking.html

And, by the way, the word "tourists" is just a word. It does not change the person.

In Thailand, if you don't have a long-term-secure visa option (and unless you have some 10 year option like in Malaysia you do not) you are nothing but a temporary tourist--short-term temporary tourist or long term temporary tourist.

Some other countries in the region do not make criminals out of long-stay tourists.........they simply smile and take their money and leave them alone (e.g., the Philippines and Cambodia).

[brahmburgers]

These things are happening in every country in the world, likely no more or less than here. I find Thailand a safer country than most I have visited. When have you, or any of the posters here experienced such violence? The only violence I have experienced was drunken farang.

The only violence I have experienced was drunken Thai.

Apologists nonsense

...but unfortunately true. You ever met a drunken Thai? Open your eyes my friend and stop believing that Thailand is a "safe country". I've seen beating up a farang a few days ago by 17 tuk-tuk drivers in Phuket because he had walked against his mirror (wrongly parked tuk-tuk) and the tuk-tuk driver wanted him to pay 2,000 THB (there was no damage at all). They followed him in a bar where he tried to escape from the arrogance and with 17, they beated him up... The bar-tender got his deal as well, trying to limit the damage. It took 45 minutes before police came... just to drive slowly by and then disappear. The tuk-tuk drivers watched from the other side of the street in even greater numbers.

And that is just one story, the latest one.

wow, a reminder to avoid Phuket. That will never change: when one vendor gets angry at a farang, every vendor within earshot will join in the harangue or beating. It matters not one eyelash whether the others know what the original problem was. All that matters is; one of their fellows felt shorted, so the ignorant follow-the-crowd cowardly instincts kick in. Chimps sometimes do a similar type ganging up, though they usually have a good reason. Baboons more often settle their problems one on one - though neither of those other primates drink fermented sugar drinks to heighten their beserkedness.

Rhetorical question: When will Thai men ever gain an appreciation for the righteousness of fighting a duel, one on one? - with the loser acknowledging defeat and leaving it at that. Answer: never.

I'm one of those people who have too much roots developed in Thailand to just pull up tent stakes and leave. Sometimes I wish it were that simple, because other destinations look more appealing - somewhat like that old saying, 'the grass is always greener on the other side of the hill.'

[JR Texas]

wow, a reminder to avoid Phuket. That will never change: when one vendor gets angry at a farang, every vendor within earshot will join in the harangue or beating. It matters not one eyelash whether the others know what the original problem was. All that matters is; one of their fellows felt shorted, so the ignorant follow-the-crowd cowardly instincts kick in. Chimps sometimes do a similar type ganging up, though they usually have a good reason. Baboons more often settle their problems one on one - though neither of those other primates drink fermented sugar drinks to heighten their beserkedness.

Rhetorical question: When will Thai men ever gain an appreciation for the righteousness of fighting a duel, one on one? - with the loser acknowledging defeat and leaving it at that. Answer: never.

I'm one of those people who have too much roots developed in Thailand to just pull up tent stakes and leave. Sometimes I wish it were that simple, because other destinations look more appealing - somewhat like that old saying, 'the grass is always greener on the other side of the hill.'

Phuket is supposed to be the jewel of Thailand........lots of negative comments about the place and area recently......not to mention the now 8 unsolved deaths of foreigners in the Krabi area.

I have always thought that Phuket would be the last place in Thailand to see a downturn in tourism.......if it is happening there, Thailand is in real trouble...its tourism industry, that is.

[zzaa09]

These things are happening in every country in the world, likely no more or less than here. I find Thailand a safer country than most I have visited. When have you, or any of the posters here experienced such violence? The only violence I have experienced was drunken farang.

The only violence I have experienced was drunken Thai.

Apologists nonsense

...but unfortunately true. You ever met a drunken Thai? Open your eyes my friend and stop believing that Thailand is a "safe country". I've seen beating up a farang a few days ago by 17 tuk-tuk drivers in Phuket because he had walked against his mirror (wrongly parked tuk-tuk) and the tuk-tuk driver wanted him to pay 2,000 THB (there was no damage at all). They followed him in a bar where he tried to escape from the arrogance and with 17, they beated him up... The bar-tender got his deal as well, trying to limit the damage. It took 45 minutes before police came... just to drive slowly by and then disappear. The tuk-tuk drivers watched from the other side of the street in even greater numbers.

And that is just one story, the latest one.

Just be patient and stay a bit longer and after 20 years we talk again.

Well, I've oberseved Thailand for some 50 years. Please, don't give me this typically arrogant I've been here longer than you s**t. Since it is popular and even expected to use comparatives in all such conversations. How about Cleveland or Melbourne or Birmingham or Toronto or Hamburg? Safe? Corrupt? Criminal element? Compared to our fair and lively land?

[animatic]

Never had major problems in :

Boston, New York City, San Fran, Paris, Amsterdam, Copenhagen, London, Bangkok, KL,

And many smaller cities.

In smaller towns I have had problems from narrow minded, parochialisms,

of a mixed bag of flavors. The same fools who beat fans of the next-town-over's football team,

carry that idiocy for much of their lives into their home town pub and make things tough for strangers.

[reallyok]

Hmmm... Let's see... Elected government removed by the military, Yellow Shirt airport closures, Red Shirt riots, SCAMs including false imprisonment & blackmail by an airport shop in collusion with the Tourist Police, anti-foreigner rhetoric by senior immigration officials, visa regulation making it more difficult to come and/or live in Thailand... Duh...

Seeing as I'm an X radio operator including Morse Cod maybe you will "get" this acronym...

<deleted> K

elaborate please

(for those who are trying to solve your acronym)

I too am an ex radio operator with morse code ( 26 wpm) but still don't understand your acronym ?????

Please explain !

[zzaa09]

Phuket is supposed to be the jewel of Thailand........lots of negative comments about the place and area recently......not to mention the now 8 unsolved deaths of foreigners in the Krabi area.

I have always thought that Phuket would be the last place in Thailand to see a downturn in tourism.......if it is happening there, Thailand is in real trouble...its tourism industry, that is.

I can imagine what Phuket was like some 60 or 70 years ago. Peaceful, unspoiled, civilised. Lives were lived, things got done......the coming of tourism and it's artificial gold has been the downfall for this rich region. And all the nasties that might be associated with it.

[zzaa09]

This page is a wake up call to any person who thinks all countries in Southeast Asia rank the same on variables like "crime".....in fact, as the data show, Thailand is behind virtually all other countries in the region on many variables:

http://www.business-in-asia.com/asia/asia_peace_ranking.html

Easy to browse lifeless stattistics and studies, instead of really observing what really is....

[JR Texas]

Easy to browse lifeless stattistics and studies, instead of really observing what really is....

It is much harder to observe human behavior and turn it into statistics.

There are many eyewitness reports from several people confirming the statistics.

One was from a person who was just in Malaysia.......loads of tourists there, just like the UN report suggested.

[Serpico]

More shame heaped upon the country.

".. I watched a programme on the Australian ABC station about an Australian government warning for tourists travelling to Thailand. The strong warning concerned the airport scams and that "if in trouble", no assistance would be available from the Thai police.

FULL STORY.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/worl...on-the-country