Calling Time On My Linux Experience.

[Richb2004v2]

After about 8 months of using Linux on my netbook I am sadly going to switch back to Windows XP. With a little help from various forums including this one I have just about managed to make Linux do everything I need. But now I have a need to use some windows only software for work and study and also have one or two unresolved issues that would be easily solved if I were using windows. If I were in an environment with a couple of other Linux users I'm sure I could get around all my problems but on my own it just becomes a headache that seems to have one simple solution. I guess it's easy enough to come back to Linux when the time comes that I no longer need to use the Microsoft only applications, and I might play around with a few other Linux OS's over the next few days before reverting back. I know there are Windows simulators that I could use but I think I will be adding to my confusion with this route.

Thanks for those that have tried, and in some cases succeeded to help me out with many of my problems.

[jhs]

Unless you are in the technology industry or are some kind of entrepreneur, or unless you are very young or very enthusiastic, I don't see much reason to force yourself to use Linux. Linux is a huge investment because there is day-to-day pain but you can become adept at something that is strongly involved with the future of the technology industry.

I would suggest virtualization. Windows can be run from Linux (which is what I do), or vice versa (which you might want to look into). I also am not a big user of emulation tools but with virtualization, you have a traditional Windows (or Linux) system by all rights. I suggest looking into VirtualBox which is free and well-regarded. If you have been able to run Linux for a while, then you should have few problems getting it running on either Linux or Windows (it can run on both, and Macs for that matter).

(Also, you can sign up to download the Windows 7 release candidate, which is a free download from Microsoft and will run until late 2010. It runs from within VirtualBox quite well; or if you go the other route it is said to run on netbooks much better than Vista.)

[jackdanielsesq]

There is no need to quit anything - simply multiboot.

I have been doing this for a coon's age and relish in learning new stuff every time I boot.

Admittedly I have my favorites - lets not start a roasting session - and love the freedom and learning curves

Unfortunately - as I remarked previously - your first choice is - in my humble opinion - not the easiest.

Once you have setup XP and suitably bored, give on of the smaller, simpler distros a whirl.

If ya follow approx my scenario, a fresh, new install is only 10 minutes away.

See ya out on the Prairie.

BR>Jack

[Richb2004v2]

There is no need to quit anything - simply multiboot.

I have been doing this for a coon's age and relish in learning new stuff every time I boot.

Admittedly I have my favorites - lets not start a roasting session - and love the freedom and learning curves

Unfortunately - as I remarked previously - your first choice is - in my humble opinion - not the easiest.

Once you have setup XP and suitably bored, give on of the smaller, simpler distros a whirl.

If ya follow approx my scenario, a fresh, new install is only 10 minutes away.

See ya out on the Prairie.

BR>Jack

I think your right. I found a decent guide online so I will install XP and then install a dual boot. I will try to put the Linux OS on a SD card.

[niller74]

I have followed your venture to the world of Linux and think you have done just fine. It is as other people point out very hard to do on your own. I don't know which software is 'forcing' you to move away from Linux again, but there are several alternatives.

- If you are just looking for functionality try checking out http://www.linuxalt.com/

- If you are required to run a specific program, may an emulator can help you http://www.winhq.com

- A better way to run Windows applications on Linux is through visualization. Check http://www.virtualbox.org

- Finally there is dual-boot which is a guaranteed success. Plenty of documentation on getting that up and running.

Good luck

[yankineire]

Don't quit yet! You missed ONE important -and wonderful feature of Linux!

Before retiring in Thailand, I worked half a lifetime (since 71) in UNIX. First in the US Army, later contracted for IBM and Apple's Speech Recognition technology, in my own work on AI, hearing/responding (speaking) talking robots, a software writer/contributor to open source (Linux, UNIX, BSD etc) and throughout all the latter, in the 90s/through present, my favorite job was replacing entire small business MS PCs and networks -with Linux.

So I would like to point out some good news that has note been mentioned in this worthy discussion.

First, regarding the reason "Richb2004v2", gives for "switching back" to Windoze:

There has long been a program included with all distributions (we call them "distros" or "flavors") called "Wine". This was originally called "WhineDoze", since its sole purpose was to run any Windows program -on Linux. Bill Gates was offended by the name, so he (as he has done to me, 5 times, when I offended him) sued the creators of WhineDoze, and a US court paid off by MS enforced his wishes (now the judge has a new ranch that was bought by MS, but that's another story). The suit could not STOP Whinedoze, it merely had to change the name. This program is available in ALL the current UNIX, Linux, BSD versions. But because of a few required Win32 files, Wine must be downloaded via your APT or Synaptics "free software" search/install module. Check Wine when search results come up, and then you simply click "apply". This downloads all the required Wine files and plug-ins (about 11-20mb, depending on your Linux/UNIX version). And then it is done.

What does "Wine" do? YOU WILL LOVE THIS PART: Wine will automatically run ANY known MS application, even 64-bit apps (which you cannot do on Windows if you only have a 32-bit processor). Everything!

Not only does it RUN the programs, but it does it BETTER. How is it better?

FASTER, and SAFER!

To explain "faster" I need to use a detailed example. Although all Linux comes with "Gimp", a free program that covers everything Photoshop, Corel and Illustrator does, I personally prefer Photoshop 4.0, because it is the last version of Photoshop that utilizes BOTH bitmap and RGB drawing/painting in direct core plugins, rather than using "translators/converters" for one or the other. This is important to me, because I literally "draw" on the PC, more than I (used to) use pen and ink for my cartoon sidelines. The mouse can keep up with me in PS 4.0, whereas it cannot do so in any other drawing program made since (I get staircase or erratic lines instead of smooth ones). With PS 4.0, the mouse/screen redraw speed keeps up with my hand movements perfectly.

So in all my Linux partitions, PS 4.0 is invoked automatically for any work on artwork. Now, that Photoshop program is NOT installed on Linux, it is in my WinXP partition, under Program Files. Yet, when I open PS in XP, it takes 8 seconds longer than it does in Linux, just to LOAD up! And when I test performance benchmarks, the XP installation fails even more miserably. I use a 20mb JPG, and "re-size the image" to a 12mb image size as a test task. This requires massive amounts of CPU power and processing, because this is a very heavy (mostly mathematical) task when "re-sample image" is selected. XP PS 4.0 takes 28 seconds to accomplish the task, while Linux/Wine PS 4 takes only 9 seconds.

How is that possible? It is the old "MS Malware Factor" at work. MS and Adobe are OBSESSED with piracy, and devote massive amounts of software code to checking file versions/dates and registration codes of every application (including the Windows OS) to checking your configuration for "pirated versions". These paranoid processes run every time you start Windows, and consume vast amounts of processor resources (and thus boot time) checking everything. And likewise, every time you start Adobe apps, they do the same thing. Worse, both of these will ALSO "call home" over and over again, whenever an internet connection is discovered. They carry on this communication WITHOUT your consent, by the way, and regardless, this also adds TIME to any task. My time is VERY valuable and I do not like having a "fifth column" working in my PC, trying to prove I am a criminal -when I never "steal" software (why should I, when I can make my own?). This insults me, and worse, it affects performance dramatically, makes my computer unresponsive to my needs.

Linux Wine does NOT allow this crap to run. It recognizes, by default, all the "verification" code in most MS applications, and just essentially says "tut, tut, yes, that is OK, now, lets run the next VITAL code"... in other words, it SKIPS the BS and gets on with business. And here is the kicker: by default, wine also recognizes (and ignores) any malicious code contained in the application (like viruses or HTTPS referrers/home page hijackers, etc.) So you are SAFER with PS4 in Linux than you are in PS4 (and especially, all the newer Photoshop versions) in Windows.

So not only do you get better performance in Linux, you get safer tools.

As a last note, I will also add my recommendation for Linux "flavors" for any "newbie". Try PCLOS (PCLinuxOS), I am a contributor to that project. PCLOS is designed to let you "test run" on any PC to see if it is compatible with your desktop/laptop hardware. Just download the 700mb CD ISO, burn it to a CD, stick it in the PC, and start up. You may need to hit F2 or whatever BIOS screen suggests, to make sure the PC boots from a CD Rom drive first (this should be the default on any PC, but many games/malware/viruses change it, to prevent you from booting on any alternate device for cleaning out malware/viruses). The CD will not change ANYTHNG on your computer, so this is a safe way to try Linux. Any OS running on a CD is slower, but everything works and you get to try Linux without any fear of changing a thing. If the screen ends up nice, open FireFox (sorry, no hazardous IE on Linux, unless you run it with Wine). If you like what you have, you can install it right there, from the desktop. It is completely goof-proof, and installs much faster than any Windows (except W98). If you want to install it as a SECOND boot option on your PC, that takes a bit more savvy, but I can talk you through that. I have several "How-TOs" that I have written. But you can also find all that on the net (Google "How to dual-boot Linux" with the quotes, or go visit the PCLOS website/forums). PCLOS has a Thai repository, too (this means software is available in a free server here). Download speeds locally for software/updates are 400+ kbps normative! POSITIVES: Linux is virtually immune to destructive viruses. DRAWBACKS: I am a yank, and PCLOS is a Yankee Linux. The best, in my opinion (I multi-boot the top 10, and 4 Windoze), but PCLOS has some drawbacks. It is USA-English only. It does ask what keyboard to use when booting, and you can choose any common one (UK, German, etc.) but the OS remains in US English. No "Centre", only "Center", because we do NOT use FRENCH in America, like they do in UK. Once installed, you can add any other language prefs and in one click (flag icons, on bottom menu bar) have Thai, Belgian, Sanskrit, or whatever else you prefer (up to 20 keyboard layouts).

regards to all

DanaSaur

Write me here and I will send direct thai (local 400mbps) PCLOS download/Read-Me links!

My motto: "Life is a State of Mind" (Jerzy Kosinski) -and MS is definitely the WRONG state!

[yankineire]

There is no need to quit anything - simply multiboot.

I have been doing this for a coon's age and relish in learning new stuff every time I boot.

Admittedly I have my favorites - lets not start a roasting session - and love the freedom and learning curves

Unfortunately - as I remarked previously - your first choice is - in my humble opinion - not the easiest.

Once you have setup XP and suitably bored, give on of the smaller, simpler distros a whirl.

If ya follow approx my scenario, a fresh, new install is only 10 minutes away.

See ya out on the Prairie.

BR>Jack

I think your right. I found a decent guide online so I will install XP and then install a dual boot. I will try to put the Linux OS on a SD card.

Bad idea, if I may saay so. SD Flash is MUCH slower than a hard drive, and significantly slower than regular USB flash devices. Next point, Linux needs "SWAP" to run properly. A second partition for VM, whenever more RAM is needed, or when ACPI needs to put things to bed (sleep, suspend, etc). Flash devices cannot easily hold more than one partition (proof, the goofy U3 types from 2006, that were a complete failure because viruses loved to live inside the fake CD partition, and also, most PCs have trouble recognizing them/mounting either partition). Last, SD flash is a "limited write" technology. Most only have 100,000 writes possible before they fail. Be4st for you, to compare apples to apples (and get the benefits of performance) is to install the Linux on a separate partition, which can be made on the existing HD, without upsetting Windows at all. You only need 3.5 to 4GB for a basic PCLOS partition (plus a SWAP partition equal to the amount of RAM you have). Or for a full boat, everything you ever dreamed of from classic arcade games (like Tron, Missile Command, Space Invaders, and professional Flight Simmulators all free), barcode readers, WAP/WEPwifi-crackers, TV tuners, DVD decrypters/burners, music/moog//kevboard apps, every printer/scanner/USB device known to man... etc etc etc -all free, you still only need 10gb! And unlike Windows, Linux is happy anywhere on the HD (doesn't have to hijack sector zero, like all Windows). If you are going to load it, give it a chance to perform, so you can fall in love with its freedom from tyranny, privacy violations -and licensing fees.

[jackdanielsesq]

Aha - we have traction here - good man.

If ya follow my lead - always secure ya data on a F32 partition first, the world is ya oyster.

3 or 5 different, wonderful O/S. Remember, the moment we stop learning, we die.

Use HDD, thats its function, for everything - dont complicate ya life with flash. It will let ya down.

BR>Jack

PS Move data to flash, use any Linux live distro and zap the entire HDD - there is a copy of GParted on most.

Have fun - thats critical-mass.

[Richb2004v2]

I have followed your venture to the world of Linux and think you have done just fine. It is as other people point out very hard to do on your own. I don't know which software is 'forcing' you to move away from Linux again, but there are several alternatives.

- If you are just looking for functionality try checking out http://www.linuxalt.com/

- If you are required to run a specific program, may an emulator can help you http://www.winhq.com

- A better way to run Windows applications on Linux is through visualization. Check http://www.virtualbox.org

- Finally there is dual-boot which is a guaranteed success. Plenty of documentation on getting that up and running.

Good luck

I have just installed Virtualbox. Once the install was complete I can not find reference to it anywhere on the machine! I've put a MS software disk in the machine and tried 'open with' thinking I could use Virtualbox but again no sign of it. Looking on the Virtualbox web site I find lots of reference to hosting XP but nothing as simple as an explanation of how to run Xp software. Any tips?

[niller74]

If you are running Ubuntu it Virtual Box should appear in your menu under ether System Tools or Accessories.

Once Virtual Box is launched you simply make a virtual partition and install XP on to it.

[tariq786]

Hello

Pls have a look at http://www.virtualbox.org/manual/UserManual.html

I am not sure which distro u r using but if it is Ubuntu then there is add remove option and lots of software to play with including virtualbox and its GUIs

If u have a netbook, pls have a look at http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/download-netbook

I have installed Ubuntu 9.04 on my DELL Core 2 Duo 2 Gig Ram and Windows XP as Guest OS. It works like charm.

I hope u stay with Linux and above info may help u.

Tariq

[jackdanielsesq]

I have never had virtual sex or whiskey - do it right.

BR>Jack

[Richb2004v2]

You could have something there Jack. I've installed VirtualBox and will put XP on it tomorrow. I wonder just how well it runs. Could I run games in it for example? It was quite easy to set up. If it proves not to up to the task I will do a real XP install.

[OxfordWill]

Was WINE not able to let you use your windows only software from within linux?

[joncl]

You could have something there Jack. I've installed VirtualBox and will put XP on it tomorrow. I wonder just how well it runs. Could I run games in it for example? It was quite easy to set up. If it proves not to up to the task I will do a real XP install.

I use vmware on mine and it works fine running win7 and OSX 10.4 with games and other application like SlingPlayer & HavaPlayer that wine will not run.

[Richb2004v2]

I installed XP and had a tech add all the extras to it. Contrary to my expectations it is not without problems. The screen does not even fit on my little netbook so I have to constantly scroll the screen up and down and Skype will not even download let alone function. Plus it seems that I have partitioned the drive so as just to fit all the program files in. I guess I will now look into adding a dual boot Linux distro on an SD card.

[livinthailandos]

To: Richb2004v2

I also have a netbook right now although I am using it running windows 7 RC candiate, but my netbook has a regular hard drive not a SSD Drive and I have 2 GB Ram. I have also put ubuntu netbook remix on there and that has worked fine to. I would remind you if you look at windows xp its about 8 years old and even though you had help putting it back on you still are going to have problems. Windows 7 has worked fine and I have skype on there to. Most of windows 7 has a lot of vista with it to. Most programs I put on there have worked as long as they were compatible with windows vista. I do realize somebody won't like that I putting windows on this issue but I understand where your coming from about needing software that only seems to work with windows. My options to you as follows

If you have virtualbox I suggest you download windows 7 ( only if you have a really fast internet connection its about 4 GB big took me 4 hours to get it. You could put windows 7 on a dvd, if you have a external dvd drive you could easily install windows 7 I did. Installination is very easy. Hardware and finding everything was easy to. Only downside is you can only use windows 7 RC till march but at least you have some idea and could play with it.

[Richb2004v2]

To: Richb2004v2

I also have a netbook right now although I am using it running windows 7 RC candiate, but my netbook has a regular hard drive not a SSD Drive and I have 2 GB Ram. I have also put ubuntu netbook remix on there and that has worked fine to. I would remind you if you look at windows xp its about 8 years old and even though you had help putting it back on you still are going to have problems. Windows 7 has worked fine and I have skype on there to. Most of windows 7 has a lot of vista with it to. Most programs I put on there have worked as long as they were compatible with windows vista. I do realize somebody won't like that I putting windows on this issue but I understand where your coming from about needing software that only seems to work with windows. My options to you as follows

If you have virtualbox I suggest you download windows 7 ( only if you have a really fast internet connection its about 4 GB big took me 4 hours to get it. You could put windows 7 on a dvd, if you have a external dvd drive you could easily install windows 7 I did. Installination is very easy. Hardware and finding everything was easy to. Only downside is you can only use windows 7 RC till march but at least you have some idea and could play with it.

I considered Windows 7 but figured my 901 might not be up to it. If I can not improve my installation of XP I will be changing regardless of compatible programs. At the minute the screen does not even fit!

[Tywais]

I considered Windows 7 but figured my 901 might not be up to it. If I can not improve my installation of XP I will be changing regardless of compatible programs. At the minute the screen does not even fit!

That is probably related to your other topic on XP drivers. You do need the video driver for the netbook in order to properly support the ASUS screen size. It will also give you an option in the tray to select between scrollable and fixed screen.

//edit - regarding Windows 7, I'm running it on my MSI Wind netbook with no problems.

[Richb2004v2]

I considered Windows 7 but figured my 901 might not be up to it. If I can not improve my installation of XP I will be changing regardless of compatible programs. At the minute the screen does not even fit!

That is probably related to your other topic on XP drivers. You do need the video driver for the netbook in order to properly support the ASUS screen size. It will also give you an option in the tray to select between scrollable and fixed screen.

//edit - regarding Windows 7, I'm running it on my MSI Wind netbook with no problems.

Yes the two topics are linked.

I am not happy with either the installation of XP or it's location on the small partition. If I find the disk tomorrow with the drivers on I might attempt a fresh install myself. My only problem is that I go away to work on Sunday and if I screw it up I won't have time to take it somewhere to get fixed. Decisions, decisions. Maybe I will wait until I return in four weeks and get a copy of Windows 7 and try that.

In the mean time I might not do any harm trying to install another Linux on either the other partition or an SD card.

[hkt83100]

I considered Windows 7 but figured my 901 might not be up to it.

The 901 will be, for sure. W7 needs a lot less power than Vista, and it runs nicely on the 901. By the way, on my 901 I use a Class 6 SD-Card for Kubuntu 9.04, I simply installed it from an external CD to the SD-Card and had it write the bootloader to the card. On bootup I just hit [Esc] for the Bootmenu of the 901 and choose the Cardreader to boot from. It works perfectly well and the speed is quite ok. The 9.04 supports all the hardware in the 901, including the camera, WLAN, and bluetooth.

[Plus]

There's no point in installing Windows drivers in VirtualBox - Windows inside the box doesn't have direct access to any of your hardware, it uses drivers provided by your host system (Ubuntu, I suppose).

What you need is to install Guest Additions from VirtualBox menu. I just did it a week or so ago, but I use Sun's proprietary version of VB instead of OSE (open source edition from in Ubuntu official repositories).

Prior to Guest Additions I still could run VB in full screen but it was convoluted, there was a special key to switch mouse between VB and Ubuntu, and there were key combinations to run in full screen (also available from VB menu).

With Guest Additions it all went away - now it works just like any other application witout any hassle. Also I got VirtualBox Shared folders so I have access to files from both Linux and Windows.

What might not work in VB is Windows programs relying on Direct3D - two online games I installed for kids. They didn't work before Guest Additions, now the support is promised but I don't have passwords to login and test myself.

>>>

Windows 7 runs on small or old machines like a breeze, I have it on dual boot, and you can use "Readyboost" feature that isn't available in XP - it's using flash drives for pagefile that is normally placed on a hard disk, next best thing to more RAM.

My next project is to install Win7 in Virtualbox, too, now that VB works on my Ubuntu.

[Plus]

Another thing about VirtualBox - you have to allocate it some RAM but prefereably not more than half of what you have (VB will give you warnings). I gave it 256MB to XP and it runs ok, but if you plan on doing some heavy memory/CPU intensive stuff - it won't have access to ALL your computer resourses like a dual boot would.

Also - things that won't work are the ones Linux doesn't have drivers for. Sun VB gives Windows direct access to USB devices but not much else. Direct3d doesn't work because no one has wrote translation from it to similar features in OpenGl used by Linux, so Windows gives errors.

Dual boot will solve all those problems but it's a waste of time for simple tasks - virtualBox suits a lot better for that.

Currently I use it for searching and generating NZB files with a program that runs only on Windows. Once I got them, I shutdown VB and download stuff using Windows prgrams that run in Wine mentioned earlier.

[Richb2004v2]

I don't have a drivers disk after all, only the Linux rescue disks, but I have managed to find the drivers on the ASUS site.

I tried Linux Mint from a Live CD again last night. It seemed to work so well and felt so comfortable that I decided to try to install it on my 4 gig SD memory card. I wasn't even sure if 4 gig was big enough but I thought I'd try it. The install seemed fairly straight forward as I selected the SD card and didn't seem to effect the XP partition. However when I rebooted the machine with the SD card in I got the Mint screen with a selection for start up including several Mint options and the XP option. When I select the XP option it does indeed start up XP just fine. But when I try to start up with one of the Mint options it trys but fails and gives me some info and ultimately stops. If I remove the SD card and boot up I get similar results. Something has gone wrong somewhere but I don't know where.

So I am now considering if I should try to reinstall Mint on one of the other bigger SSD partitions, or if I should attempt to re-install XP in one of the bigger SSD partitions as now I have the drivers in theory it should not be a headache. I have a flight late tonight and really need to sort it by then.

[jackr]

No "Centre", only "Center", because we do NOT use FRENCH in America, like they do in UK.

I almost opined that you knew your stuff until you embarrassed yourself with this little gem.

[NUMBNUTTS]

Your problem does not appear to be going anywhere

Could you tell us exactly how ya have SSD/HDD divvied up, so that we might solve it.

Your problem is easy to solve, ya might have to start over, is all, and partition the drive/s correctly

Always enjoyed the French Cuisine in NO, LA

[Richb2004v2]

After my annoying experience of trying to get a good install of XP and then immediately suffering from various virus problems I have now installed 'Linux Mint'. It installed easily, works brilliantly, has so many great features including Open Office and other applications on install, and does everything I need right now. More people need to get exposure to Linux.

Thanks for the help and advice everyone.

[NUMBNUTTS]

Yes - much better - Ubuntu was always a poor choice

[Richb2004v2]

Yes - much better - Ubuntu was always a poor choice

I will be sticking with Mint, but I just wonder why you say that regarding Ubuntu.