Fat Men, Small Thai Women.

[F1fanatic]

Good grief, what a load of twaddle! You start off by saying that you don't care about prostitution or drugs as they're not illegal, and even if they were, its no business of yours. You go on to say that people picking their nose, farting or belching in public or wearing inappropriate clothes will be seen as ignorant (presumably unlike those who are into prostitution or drugs).

You then go onto say that people who disapprove of old men with bar girls should stay away from that scene. Please explain to me, precisely how? The easy answer is 'don't go to bars' - but why should normal people with feelings of revulsion (the normal feeling from their own cultural background) be excluded from the equivalent to a pub here? Let's not forget that its not 'a difference in culture' as its always an old farang male with a younger Thai woman - never an older Thai male with a etc. etc.!

And where on earth did you get the idea of "the morally righteous who went to well known nud_e beaches and then acted like it was somebody elses fault that there were all these nud_e people walking around and enjoying themselves". Its certainly not something I've ever seen!!

Maybe you misunderstood me. What other people do doesn't concern me at all if it doesn't affect me. I've seen so much strange behaviour that I just ignore it. However, I can tell pretty quickly if I might find someone interesting or not. I don't care for loutish behaviour wherever it occurs and I'll just ignore people who don't act in ways that appeal to me. I don't drink to excess, so I normally stay away from people who do. What they choose to do is entirely up to themselves if it doesn't affect me. The bars with the gals for hire are not places for the self righteous to visit unless they INTENTIONALLY want to be affronted. There are plenty of other places to drink. Why go to the Pattaya strip bars and get annoyed with what is going on?

And, I don't have any knowledge about some fat old guy sitting with a lovely young gal. She could be his daughter or niece for all I know, so I hardly give it any thought. I keep repeating myself when I say that any deal worked out between two adults should be nobody's business but the two participants. People (and that includes the government) should keep their noses out of other people's private lives.

And, I'm telling the truth about the nudists beaches and the self righteous who take objection. I don't know of any public nudist beach in Thailand because I believe it is illegal, but there are a few places where a few tourists go topless. But, we do have many public nud_e beaches in Canada, and Australia. And, yes, I've seen all sorts of frumpy people object. They never even knew the places existed until it was publicised, but then they came came down to protest when they found out. I've got all sorts of funny tales to tell about my experiences there. I've even got a few photos that I can't obviously post.

I doubt if I misunderstood you at all. You made your preferences and 'ideals?' quite clear. No problem with that, if you'd been a bit more honest and less mealy mouthed about it!!

Are you seriously trying to tell us that there are bars where the 'b/g's' aren't out ot attract farangs?

Yes, the frightening part is that on v rare occasion it could be someone out with his neice or daughter - but without his wife? Unlikely.

It would, as you say, be far nicer if we could keep our nose out of other people's business, but we are all a product of our upbringing - so some of us see drug pushers and women who sell themselves for money as 'unpleasant' and 'not our type of people'.

I'm ignoring your comments about nudist beaches 'cos they're so patently ludicrous.

Its only when people try to pretend otherwise, we point out the inconvenient facts.

Edited September 17, 2009 by F1fanatic

[robblok]

OK, can I ask a question here - a lot has been said about 'why Thai girls like fat blokes' ya da da da - and many of you are saying it must be the money - and yet the fitter ones are convinced its because of their looks that the girls like them. Apart from that being more than a tad vain, the question is 'How do you know its you she likes (or your body if you must) and not YOUR potential wallet?'

...and don't say because she told you so, because that's also what she told the fat guy too. Point is, you have no more idea if its true affection or gold digging than the next fellow, however fat - its just your vanity tells you your 'sacrifice' makes all the difference.

I know because the girls i dated always payed half of the costs. My wife pays half of everything too mortgage, electricity ect . So i know its not about money. I would not date a girl and always pay everything. I do this to make sure its not about the money.

So, if you did happen to go out with a girl that couldn't afford to pay half, then she's a gold digger? - and if the fat guy's date also paid half that means she isn't? Still not entirely convinced here, and I don't want to seem like I attacking you (which I'm not), but it still seems like either vanity or body snobbery that is prejudicing (non fat / non old / non ugly / whatever) people's views of other people's relationships. Its rather shallow and slightly bigoted in my view.

I believe we can all attract the wrong sort and the right sort and I truly think that, whilst people tend to be initially attracted by physical appearance, it is often the funny, confident, interesting guy that ends up with the girl long term regardless of whether he can do the ironing on his abs or not. Grabbing a hooker for a one night stand is a completely different kettle of fish, but when people get to know each other (especially in groups - at work, on courses, even on holidays), its often not the one you expect that gets the best looking girl in the end (if if she did work her way through the GI Joe's first).

I think you look at my awnser in a black and white way, there is a lot of grey too. Im sure you know it but just ignore it. The fact is by letting them pay too you will weed out the gold diggers and after a while you can see who is one and who is not. But of course taking a poor girl to a expensive restaurant and expecting her to pay is not the way to do it. You just have to be creative about it, my wife pays less then me now just based on income.

As Bonobo has said people like beauty but we all think different about what is beauty. But in general fat is not seen as beautiful. I have stated a few times that i rather have a smart average girl then a super sexy with no brains and a bad temper but even better would be if the super sexy girl would be smart too.

Just look at it like this if all things are the same but body weight is different the fat guy usually looses out. If the in shape guy is an total asshol_e he will loose out but so would a fat guy that is a total asshol_e. What im trying to say how you look does influence things but other things can offset the balance. If you pay for the girl then money helps (not that i would do that).. if your funny and a real gentleman then that helps too.

The whole time in this thread you see people compare the fit guy who is an asshol_e the fat guy who is funny and a gentle man. Why dont compare only the fat par... because then they know the awnser and have to admit that in GENERAL fat guys loose out then.

I hope i have shown nuance in my post and that peple understand it.

[britmaveric]

^I disagree I think personality rules out -looks are not important at the end of the day. I think most women will agree with this.

[bkkjames]

OK, can I ask a question here - a lot has been said about 'why Thai girls like fat blokes' ya da da da - and many of you are saying it must be the money - and yet the fitter ones are convinced its because of their looks that the girls like them. Apart from that being more than a tad vain, the question is 'How do you know its you she likes (or your body if you must) and not YOUR potential wallet?'

...and don't say because she told you so, because that's also what she told the fat guy too. Point is, you have no more idea if its true affection or gold digging than the next fellow, however fat - its just your vanity tells you your 'sacrifice' makes all the difference.

I know because the girls i dated always payed half of the costs. My wife pays half of everything too mortgage, electricity ect . So i know its not about money. I would not date a girl and always pay everything. I do this to make sure its not about the money.

So, if you did happen to go out with a girl that couldn't afford to pay half, then she's a gold digger? - and if the fat guy's date also paid half that means she isn't? Still not entirely convinced here, and I don't want to seem like I attacking you (which I'm not), but it still seems like either vanity or body snobbery that is prejudicing (non fat / non old / non ugly / whatever) people's views of other people's relationships. Its rather shallow and slightly bigoted in my view.

I believe we can all attract the wrong sort and the right sort and I truly think that, whilst people tend to be initially attracted by physical appearance, it is often the funny, confident, interesting guy that ends up with the girl long term regardless of whether he can do the ironing on his abs or not. Grabbing a hooker for a one night stand is a completely different kettle of fish, but when people get to know each other (especially in groups - at work, on courses, even on holidays), its often not the one you expect that gets the best looking girl in the end (if if she did work her way through the GI Joe's first).

I think you look at my awnser in a black and white way, there is a lot of grey too. Im sure you know it but just ignore it. The fact is by letting them pay too you will weed out the gold diggers and after a while you can see who is one and who is not. But of course taking a poor girl to a expensive restaurant and expecting her to pay is not the way to do it. You just have to be creative about it, my wife pays less then me now just based on income.

As Bonobo has said people like beauty but we all think different about what is beauty. But in general fat is not seen as beautiful. I have stated a few times that i rather have a smart average girl then a super sexy with no brains and a bad temper but even better would be if the super sexy girl would be smart too.

Just look at it like this if all things are the same but body weight is different the fat guy usually looses out. If the in shape guy is an total asshol_e he will loose out but so would a fat guy that is a total asshol_e. What im trying to say how you look does influence things but other things can offset the balance. If you pay for the girl then money helps (not that i would do that).. if your funny and a real gentleman then that helps too.

The whole time in this thread you see people compare the fit guy who is an asshol_e the fat guy who is funny and a gentle man. Why dont compare only the fat par... because then they know the awnser and have to admit that in GENERAL fat guys loose out then.

I hope i have shown nuance in my post and that peple understand it.

Rob if we only compared Fat people, then I guess we need to start a thread to bash the fit ones?

[wolf5370]

I think you look at my awnser in a black and white way, there is a lot of grey too. Im sure you know it but just ignore it. The fact is by letting them pay too you will weed out the gold diggers and after a while you can see who is one and who is not. But of course taking a poor girl to a expensive restaurant and expecting her to pay is not the way to do it. You just have to be creative about it, my wife pays less then me now just based on income.

As Bonobo has said people like beauty but we all think different about what is beauty. But in general fat is not seen as beautiful. I have stated a few times that i rather have a smart average girl then a super sexy with no brains and a bad temper but even better would be if the super sexy girl would be smart too.

Just look at it like this if all things are the same but body weight is different the fat guy usually looses out. If the in shape guy is an total asshol_e he will loose out but so would a fat guy that is a total asshol_e. What im trying to say how you look does influence things but other things can offset the balance. If you pay for the girl then money helps (not that i would do that).. if your funny and a real gentleman then that helps too.

The whole time in this thread you see people compare the fit guy who is an asshol_e the fat guy who is funny and a gentle man. Why dont compare only the fat par... because then they know the awnser and have to admit that in GENERAL fat guys loose out then.

I hope i have shown nuance in my post and that peple understand it.

Yes I intentionally looked at your answer in black and white - it could easily have been construed that way though given a single unqualified sentence - as I said, I am playing Devil's Advocate.

You missed the same point as Bonobo did - and Brit didn't - that while beauty made well be in the eye of the beholder, it is still only the initial temporary draw. While you are perhaps right that all things being equal the stud will get the girl, all things generally aren't equal (while we are generalising). Those non Adonis-like of us have learned to play on our own strengths - which is humour, listening, not talking about ourselves and our training regime 24 hrs a day, making the girl feel special for herself rather than for lucking out and end up with us, etc. As I said I am generalising as we all are here - and there will be fit guys that do all the above too, but I must admit every gym-jockey I have every met loves to talk about themselves and have a false superiority complex (not necessarily you of course). Guys that just like to work out, and are not obsessed, I do not call gym-jockeys by the way - but body-beautiful guys, well....of course being in Thailand, it may less of an issue if they can't understand the self engrandisment, but again that is short lived in a long term relationship.

If the girl is a gym-jockey too, then all bet are off.

I don't thinmk anyone will argue that given a 'nice' girl, and a 'nice' fattyman and a 'nice' Adonis, then Adonis is going to get it on with 'nice' girl (assuming he doesn't have an eye for fattyman ).

What I'm trying to say is that if a fit man relies on his selling point (his body) and a fat man relies on his (his personality) then short term fit man will have more dates, but fatman will end up with girl long term. People get used to looks, personalities grind continually. And do we really want to be with a girl that is that shallow all our lives. Yes, I know I am being black and white again and there are bastard fatties and saint Adonises, but that would be the very few all lucked out (or the opposite of course) in all departments - maybe you are one, and if so, all power to you.

I am you inverted, I guess. I used to be a gym-jockey. I used to have muscles on muscles - I played club level Rugby and I trained with iron 6 days a week once or twice a day. I had lots of dates (on my non gym days - usually after a game on Saturday). I married a cutie very young and divorced very quickly. As I went up the ladder so to speak, at work, I had less time for the gym and more lunches and drinks. I bought a restaurant as a side line (Thai) and this was the end of it - Mr inversion. I can honestly say I have had more meaningful and enjoyable relationships since. Now I don't rely on the initial attraction, I smile, make eye contact - I am confident and I make people laugh.

Maybe it is because the girls I met before were just interested in my body or a night or two of steaming sex they imagined a well honed body could achieve - and the girls later were actually looking for a relationship - I don't know, but I do miss being fit and toned (though I would say I'm just as strong now as then) but because I liked the way I looked and the way I could exert myself easily (running for instance!), but not because it attracted girls.

I'm still in my 30's so there is time for me if I do decide to pick up iron again - and if I'm truthful I have the time now - but it would be for me, not for the girls, as I believe the best girls are the ones that hang around to find out who you are rather than how many times you can manage in a night. I am not saying that you, or any other guy like you, is specifically doing it for the girls either, I meant that the draw to being fit again would not even include the girl magnet thing.

[bonobo]

You missed the same point as Bonobo did - and Brit didn't - that while beauty made well be in the eye of the beholder, it is still only the initial temporary draw. 

And you rather missed my point, too.  I very specifically wrote that appearances are an initial criterion from which we form an opinion about someone, but other attributes tend to take over. Personality usually trumps appearances.

And I do disagree that the draw of appearances is only temporary. It may be significantly diminished in importance when compared to other factors, but it attraction to a person's appearance is still there or not there.  My ex is a beautiful, tall, slim redhead, and even when we were having problems, I could still appreciate her stunning beauty. It is just that her beauty was far less important than other characteristics/actions which eventually sunk our relationship as husband and wife.

[robblok]

Yes I intentionally looked at your answer in black and white - it could easily have been construed that way though given a single unqualified sentence - as I said, I am playing Devil's Advocate.

You missed the same point as Bonobo did - and Brit didn't - that while beauty made well be in the eye of the beholder, it is still only the initial temporary draw. While you are perhaps right that all things being equal the stud will get the girl, all things generally aren't equal (while we are generalising). Those non Adonis-like of us have learned to play on our own strengths - which is humour, listening, not talking about ourselves and our training regime 24 hrs a day, making the girl feel special for herself rather than for lucking out and end up with us, etc. As I said I am generalising as we all are here - and there will be fit guys that do all the above too, but I must admit every gym-jockey I have every met loves to talk about themselves and have a false superiority complex (not necessarily you of course). Guys that just like to work out, and are not obsessed, I do not call gym-jockeys by the way - but body-beautiful guys, well....of course being in Thailand, it may less of an issue if they can't understand the self engrandisment, but again that is short lived in a long term relationship.

If the girl is a gym-jockey too, then all bet are off.

I don't thinmk anyone will argue that given a 'nice' girl, and a 'nice' fattyman and a 'nice' Adonis, then Adonis is going to get it on with 'nice' girl (assuming he doesn't have an eye for fattyman ).

What I'm trying to say is that if a fit man relies on his selling point (his body) and a fat man relies on his (his personality) then short term fit man will have more dates, but fatman will end up with girl long term. People get used to looks, personalities grind continually. And do we really want to be with a girl that is that shallow all our lives. Yes, I know I am being black and white again and there are bastard fatties and saint Adonises, but that would be the very few all lucked out (or the opposite of course) in all departments - maybe you are one, and if so, all power to you.

I am you inverted, I guess. I used to be a gym-jockey. I used to have muscles on muscles - I played club level Rugby and I trained with iron 6 days a week once or twice a day. I had lots of dates (on my non gym days - usually after a game on Saturday). I married a cutie very young and divorced very quickly. As I went up the ladder so to speak, at work, I had less time for the gym and more lunches and drinks. I bought a restaurant as a side line (Thai) and this was the end of it - Mr inversion. I can honestly say I have had more meaningful and enjoyable relationships since. Now I don't rely on the initial attraction, I smile, make eye contact - I am confident and I make people laugh.

Maybe it is because the girls I met before were just interested in my body or a night or two of steaming sex they imagined a well honed body could achieve - and the girls later were actually looking for a relationship - I don't know, but I do miss being fit and toned (though I would say I'm just as strong now as then) but because I liked the way I looked and the way I could exert myself easily (running for instance!), but not because it attracted girls.

I'm still in my 30's so there is time for me if I do decide to pick up iron again - and if I'm truthful I have the time now - but it would be for me, not for the girls, as I believe the best girls are the ones that hang around to find out who you are rather than how many times you can manage in a night. I am not saying that you, or any other guy like you, is specifically doing it for the girls either, I meant that the draw to being fit again would not even include the girl magnet thing.

You might be me inverted, im a gymrat, but have not always been one. I always developed my other skills im quite a strange person, gymrat, computer lover (easily spend days behind it with some games), studied a lot too, never a group kind of guy. So im not the typical gymrat. But i am not so sure if there is a typical gym rat to be honest people like to paint a totally wrong picture of them and sure a few will conform to the general stereotype but a large portion wont.

To be honest i do talk a lot about training.. but not with girls only with other gym rats. The times of training so much as you said are well over now its recommended to train up to 40-60 min max so that gives me plenty of time to do other things.

I don't rely on my muscles to be a selling point they are part of a package, that is what im trying to tell all the time but you guys seem to ignore. If all things are the same money.. humor ect but one is fat and the other is not it will make a difference. Different things make a difference to different girls. When im talking about fat guys im talking about the real fat guys.. the ones with bellies that seem to pop. Not talking about someone with a pot belly. You got fat and fat.

I think this will be a never ending discussion and i think we should agree that we disagree.

[robblok]

Rob if we only compared Fat people, then I guess we need to start a thread to bash the fit ones?

Think the fit ones already get bashed enough by the stereotypes.

But if you like we could bash each other with some french bread that is a few days old Saturday at high noon showdown in soi nana. Bring your french bread and be ready to be bashed

[bkkjames]

Rob if we only compared Fat people, then I guess we need to start a thread to bash the fit ones?

Think the fit ones already get bashed enough by the stereotypes.

But if you like we could bash each other with some french bread that is a few days old Saturday at high noon showdown in soi nana. Bring your french bread and be ready to be bashed

Sorry Rob, your not my type. Don't you remember, I am fat, therefore only like small thai women.

[bonobo]

 

I'm still in my 30's so there is time for me if I do decide to pick up iron again - and if I'm truthful I have the time now - but it would be for me, not for the girls, as I believe the best girls are the ones that hang around to find out who you are rather than how many times you can manage in a night. I am not saying that you, or any other guy like you, is specifically doing it for the girls either, I meant that the draw to being fit again would not even include the girl magnet thing.

This is not a criticism on your point, but in the interest of full disclosure, I hit the gym for two reasons. The first one is for myself.  I want a healthier, fitter life.  But the other reason is for how I am perceived by women.  I am 51, and in no way a Brad Pitt or whomever.  I don't want women to be with me and think, "well, he is a nice guy, so I guess I can put up with his appearances."  I would rather have my looks not be an issue at all.  And since I can't do much about my face, receding hairline, skin getting older, and the like, I focus on what I can do, mainly being fit and living a healthy lifestyle, and treating women with respect and consideration.

[robblok]

This is not a criticism on your point, but in the interest of full disclosure, I hit the gym for two reasons. The first one is for myself.  I want a healthier, fitter life.  But the other reason is for how I am perceived by women.  I am 51, and in no way a Brad Pitt or whomever.  I don't want women to be with me and think, "well, he is a nice guy, so I guess I can put up with his appearances."  I would rather have my looks not be an issue at all.  And since I can't do much about my face, receding hairline, skin getting older, and the like, I focus on what I can do, mainly being fit and living a healthy lifestyle, and treating women with respect and consideration.

That is why i am training.. sure i do like muscle.. but i train to stay in shape and be healthy. You should always be training for yourself.

[bonobo]

This is not a criticism on your point, but in the interest of full disclosure, I hit the gym for two reasons. The first one is for myself.  I want a healthier, fitter life.  But the other reason is for how I am perceived by women.  I am 51, and in no way a Brad Pitt or whomever.  I don't want women to be with me and think, "well, he is a nice guy, so I guess I can put up with his appearances."  I would rather have my looks not be an issue at all.  And since I can't do much about my face, receding hairline, skin getting older, and the like, I focus on what I can do, mainly being fit and living a healthy lifestyle, and treating women with respect and consideration.

That is why i am training.. sure i do like muscle.. but i train to stay in shape and be healthy. You should always be training for yourself.

 Not to be argumentative, but why?  Sure, I train for myself.  But I also train for others, or at least for my perception of what others would prefer.  I know women and men who have lost weight specifically for their spouses, and if they felt better about themselves as well, all the better.  The impetus to get fit is not as important, in my opinion, as being fit.  

[robblok]

This is not a criticism on your point, but in the interest of full disclosure, I hit the gym for two reasons. The first one is for myself.  I want a healthier, fitter life.  But the other reason is for how I am perceived by women.  I am 51, and in no way a Brad Pitt or whomever.  I don't want women to be with me and think, "well, he is a nice guy, so I guess I can put up with his appearances."  I would rather have my looks not be an issue at all.  And since I can't do much about my face, receding hairline, skin getting older, and the like, I focus on what I can do, mainly being fit and living a healthy lifestyle, and treating women with respect and consideration.

That is why i am training.. sure i do like muscle.. but i train to stay in shape and be healthy. You should always be training for yourself.

 Not to be argumentative, but why?  Sure, I train for myself.  But I also train for others, or at least for my perception of what others would prefer.  I know women and men who have lost weight specifically for their spouses, and if they felt better about themselves as well, all the better.  The impetus to get fit is not as important, in my opinion, as being fit.  

I look at it different.. if i think im overweight id train to loose it .. i wont do it because someone else tells me. If they like how i become that is a nice added bonus.

I mean to say its better to be motivated by yourself then by what others think of it.. because if those others leave.. your motivation is gone.

Just my reasoning.

[wolf5370]

You missed the same point as Bonobo did - and Brit didn't - that while beauty made well be in the eye of the beholder, it is still only the initial temporary draw. 

And you rather missed my point, too.  I very specifically wrote that appearances are an initial criterion from which we form an opinion about someone, but other attributes tend to take over. Personality usually trumps appearances.

And I do disagree that the draw of appearances is only temporary. It may be significantly diminished in importance when compared to other factors, but it attraction to a person's appearance is still there or not there.  My ex is a beautiful, tall, slim redhead, and even when we were having problems, I could still appreciate her stunning beauty. It is just that her beauty was far less important than other characteristics/actions which eventually sunk our relationship as husband and wife.

Para 1: Yes, I specifically wrote that before you in an earlier post too - so on that we are agreed

Para 2: Yes, of course you are right that it does not disappear, but like you said it lessens in importance - and if she was less attractive (your red head) but you had liked her for other reasons earlier on, then her plain looks would not have been an issue either because you would have got used to them. We all love our mums for other reasons, and we all (at least when we were young) thought they were beautiful in an innocent sort of way - its simply because we attached our feelings to them as well as their looks.

[Geekfreaklover]

Lets face it. Working out and training in a gym is something that we do because we enjoy the release of endorphines into the blood stream. It is a pleasurable thing to do. If you are working out with the sole intention of attracting female mates then you are probably in the wrong city. It's so hot here, and there is a pletohra of young attractive women. Six pack or barrel.

[wolf5370]

You might be me inverted, im a gymrat, but have not always been one. I always developed my other skills im quite a strange person, gymrat, computer lover (easily spend days behind it with some games), studied a lot too, never a group kind of guy. So im not the typical gymrat. But i am not so sure if there is a typical gym rat to be honest people like to paint a totally wrong picture of them and sure a few will conform to the general stereotype but a large portion wont.

To be honest i do talk a lot about training.. but not with girls only with other gym rats. The times of training so much as you said are well over now its recommended to train up to 40-60 min max so that gives me plenty of time to do other things.

I don't rely on my muscles to be a selling point they are part of a package, that is what im trying to tell all the time but you guys seem to ignore. If all things are the same money.. humor ect but one is fat and the other is not it will make a difference. Different things make a difference to different girls. When im talking about fat guys im talking about the real fat guys.. the ones with bellies that seem to pop. Not talking about someone with a pot belly. You got fat and fat.

I think this will be a never ending discussion and i think we should agree that we disagree.

Oh actually I don't particularly disagree - you actually hit the nail on the head in their IMO. Its a package. The first thing that gets noticed is the looks (the pretty wrapper) - if the rest is good too then peachy.

For those that don't have the looks, then often they have other part to their package that will make up for it. I think genrally speaking the world evens out (package wise ) and some are an all round catch of course, but most a good point and bad points. If the good point is your look and the bad point is your personality, then you will probably luck out on more short term relationships; if on the other hand its the reverse, you will probably not luck out so often (or possibly even very often at all), but once they stop vomiting (OK that was a joke) and discover the rest of the package, it is longer lasting.

Rather like the package may have nice wrapping and we all go for the biggest and best wrapped, but what's really important is what's inside the box, eh?

I also think that drawing on our experience with out past women and their attractiveness is somewhat floored as it is generally well known that women tend to value other traits more highly than looks when looking for a mate (of course its still in there); where us dogs see titties, hips. bums, legs, bonnet and boat-race as number 1 through 6 (in various orders) (OK maybe not quite true, but we do value looks much more highly and for longer in the relationship than women)

[bonobo]

Lets face it. Working out and training in a gym is something that we do because we enjoy the release of endorphines into the blood stream. It is a pleasurable thing to do. If you are working out with the sole intention of attracting female mates then you are probably in the wrong city. It's so hot here, and there is a pletohra of young attractive women. Six pack or barrel.

Actually, the only exercise I like is sports.  I detest running and cycling on a machine, and I really don't like to lift.  But I dislike being unfit a lot more than that.

And if you are referring to my post, I don't work out in order to attract women here.  I realize that most men, despite age or appearances, can find female friends in Thailand.  I just don't want a woman to be with me in spite of my looks. I would rather have her opinion of my appearances being at least neutral and she is with me for other reasons.  Call it a fragile ego or whatever.  But I am not satisfied in being the only one to be getting enjoyment out of a relationship.

[Geekfreaklover]

Lets face it. Working out and training in a gym is something that we do because we enjoy the release of endorphines into the blood stream. It is a pleasurable thing to do. If you are working out with the sole intention of attracting female mates then you are probably in the wrong city. It's so hot here, and there is a pletohra of young attractive women. Six pack or barrel.

Actually, the only exercise I like is sports. I detest running and cycling on a machine, and I really don't like to lift. But I dislike being unfit a lot more than that.

And if you are referring to my post, I don't work out in order to attract women here. I realize that most men, despite age or appearances, can find female friends in Thailand. I just don't want a woman to be with me in spite of my looks. I would rather have her opinion of my appearances being at least neutral and she is with me for other reasons. Call it a fragile ego or whatever. But I am not satisfied in being the only one to be getting enjoyment out of a relationship.

Bonobo. I apologize if you found my post directed at you. It wasn't. I was simply stating that working out in a gym should be something you do for yourself, not for others. A point that you agree with.

Personally I like to skateboard. Theres a great little handrail outside Tesco in on nut. A lot of Thai and farang skaters can be found grinding the rail. Nice way to spend an afternoon. I'm not obbessed by it. Just a cool thing to do every week.

[IanForbes]

This is not a criticism on your point, but in the interest of full disclosure, I hit the gym for two reasons. The first one is for myself. I want a healthier, fitter life. But the other reason is for how I am perceived by women. I am 51, and in no way a Brad Pitt or whomever. I don't want women to be with me and think, "well, he is a nice guy, so I guess I can put up with his appearances." I would rather have my looks not be an issue at all. And since I can't do much about my face, receding hairline, skin getting older, and the like, I focus on what I can do, mainly being fit and living a healthy lifestyle, and treating women with respect and consideration.

I pretty much agree with everything you've said, bonobo... even though I'm almost 20 years older than you. I'm reasonably fit for my age and don't have trouble with any of the physical interests I enjoy: fishing, hiking, biking, hunting, skiing, diving etc. I just can't keep up with the long distance runners and serious fanatics. I've had many young ladies who don't believe I'm as old as I am. That's because most of their 30 to 50 year old "clents" don't have any muscle tone and are not as fit as me. I don't stay fit because of the ladies. I do so to enjoy my other interests. But, there IS the side benefit of more interest from the ladies. That does a lot for my self esteem and gives me more confidence. Most women are more attracted to confident men than they are to the meek and mild guys. It is self perpetuating.

I've known meek guys from Canada and the USA who could never get a date back home. But, after a month in Pattaya they went home with a whole new outlook on life and confidence in themselves. After that they had no trouble with women anywhere.

[Alwaysright]

This is not a criticism on your point, but in the interest of full disclosure, I hit the gym for two reasons. The first one is for myself. I want a healthier, fitter life. But the other reason is for how I am perceived by women. I am 51, and in no way a Brad Pitt or whomever. I don't want women to be with me and think, "well, he is a nice guy, so I guess I can put up with his appearances." I would rather have my looks not be an issue at all. And since I can't do much about my face, receding hairline, skin getting older, and the like, I focus on what I can do, mainly being fit and living a healthy lifestyle, and treating women with respect and consideration.

I pretty much agree with everything you've said, bonobo... even though I'm almost 20 years older than you. I'm reasonably fit for my age and don't have trouble with any of the physical interests I enjoy: fishing, hiking, biking, hunting, skiing, diving etc. I just can't keep up with the long distance runners and serious fanatics. I've had many young ladies who don't believe I'm as old as I am. That's because most of their 30 to 50 year old "clents" don't have any muscle tone and are not as fit as me. I don't stay fit because of the ladies. I do so to enjoy my other interests. But, there IS the side benefit of more interest from the ladies. That does a lot for my self esteem and gives me more confidence. Most women are more attracted to confident men than they are to the meek and mild guys. It is self perpetuating.

I've known meek guys from Canada and the USA who could never get a date back home. But, after a month in Pattaya they went home with a whole new outlook on life and confidence in themselves. After that they had no trouble with women anywhere.

I see a lot of skinny Farang men walking around with fat Farang women.I ask myself "why don't they dump the fatties".

[bonobo]

That does a lot for my self esteem and gives me more confidence. Most women are more attracted to confident men than they are to the meek and mild guys. It is self perpetuating. 

Very, very true statement!

[Lopburi99]

That is why i am training.. sure i do like muscle.. but i train to stay in shape and be healthy...

Lots of interesting posts lately. I'm curious Rob, why do you like muscle? Think before answering please, I am serious. Do you like the way muscles look? Many women do not. Do you like the extra strength? During ageing muscles can become somewhat unattractive, especially as weight is gained. My once impressive pecs now look too boob-like, which I know sometimes draws chuckles from the ladies .

Men and women alike prefer trim to muscular, I believe.

Returning closer to topic, my wife is constantly remarking seeing so many farang men with fat/heavy Thai wives/gfs, which perplexes and amazes her. Actually it surprises me too. She asks me if the wife/gf probably was slim before or was heavy all along, and I say who knows because some men of any race prefer women who are not thin.

Edited September 18, 2009 by Lopburi99

[bonobo]

 

Returning closer to topic, my wife is constantly remarking seeing so many farang men with fat/heavy Thai wives/gfs, which perplexes and amazes her. Actually it surprises me too. We wonder if the wife/gf was slim before or was heavy all along.

I think western men who are attracted to slimmer women tend to come to places like Thailand vice Nigeria, for example.  And so a higher percentage of western men who are here might like slimmer women.  But where a lighter skin and slimmer bodies are the most common expression of beauty amongst Thais, many western cultures emphasize breasts and butts.  And, quite frankly, many young women with prominent breasts and butts tend to put on weight as they get older.  So a western man who is attracted to a shapely young Thai woman, falls in love with her, and marries her, well, he is still going to be in love and with her after she has a few kids, get older, and puts on a little weight. 

Edited:  Sorry, I read your post incorrectly.  It is small men western men with large western women, not large Thai women.

But the point about an emphasis on breasts and butts over slimness still holds true, I think.

And according to whatever study you want to read, somewhere around 10% of western men are "chubby chaser."  They are attracted to Gaea figures.

[rixalex]

Returning closer to topic, my wife is constantly remarking seeing so many farang men with fat/heavy Thai wives/gfs, which perplexes and amazes her. Actually it surprises me too.

I imagine these guys were snared the day they arrived.

Only fools rush in.

[robblok]

That is why i am training.. sure i do like muscle.. but i train to stay in shape and be healthy...

Lots of interesting posts lately. I'm curious Rob, why do you like muscle? Think before answering please, I am serious. Do you like the way muscles look? Many women do not. Do you like the extra strength? During ageing muscles can become somewhat unattractive, especially as weight is gained. My once impressive pecs now look too boob-like, which I know sometimes draws chuckles from the ladies.

Men and women alike prefer trim to muscular, I believe.

Returning closer to topic, my wife is constantly remarking seeing so many farang men with fat/heavy Thai wives/gfs, which perplexes and amazes her. Actually it surprises me too. We wonder if the wife/gf was slim before or was heavy all along.

About your pecs.. its not the problem of the muscle but the problem of keeping the same diet you had when you were training. Its a common mistake people who quit training dont adjust their food intake and get fat. Then they think that their muscles turn into fat and its impossible.

I like the way how it looks and i like the extra strength but to be honest you dont notice it that much i think in day to day things either that or im used to it. I think its all a question of semantics what is trim and what is muscular, that is different for everyone. I dont like the pro bodybuilders of today but i did like Arnold. My goals are just a muscular body that is real lean. What is too big and so on i will see when i think i'm done.

[IanForbes]

I see a lot of skinny Farang men walking around with fat Farang women.I ask myself "why don't they dump the fatties".

That is true. But it probably didn't start out that way. The skinny guys don't dump their fat wives for a variety of reasons.

1. They can't afford to do so, or at least they THINK they can't afford to do so.

2. They have grown in love with their wives, just as the wife might have over looked many of the man's failings and are still in love with him. Women who truly love their husbands are very attractive to their man. And, the reverse is true.

3. The wives might be sex machines and the guys are too tired to stray.

4. The guy might be planning an escape and just hasn't made up his mind when.

5. The guy is so hen pecked that he's afraid to do anything and has no confidence in making any decisions.

[Lopburi99]

I see a lot of skinny Farang men walking around with fat Farang women.I ask myself "why don't they dump the fatties".

That is true. But it probably didn't start out that way. The skinny guys don't dump their fat wives for a variety of reasons.

1. They can't afford to do so, or at least they THINK they can't afford to do so.

2. They have grown in love with their wives, just as the wife might have over looked many of the man's failings and are still in love with him. Women who truly love their husbands are very attractive to their man. And, the reverse is true.

3. The wives might be sex machines and the guys are too tired to stray.

4. The guy might be planning an escape and just hasn't made up his mind when.

5. The guy is so hen pecked that he's afraid to do anything and has no confidence in making any decisions.

I think a major reason in a western country the man stays with a wife is because he doesn't want to live alone and isn't confident in finding a new woman. Many men hate the thought of living alone, especially older men. I read somewhere men living alone in the 60+ age group have a higher suicide rate (in the U.S). So many men live a somewhat unhappy life rather than rock the boat and end up alone, not to mention giving up half of everything, disrupting the family, etc.

Hey guys, ever consider visiting Thailand?

Edited September 18, 2009 by Lopburi99

[IanForbes]

I agree, Lopburi99. That was one point I left out. It's the same reason that many people get married in the first place... they don't want to be alone and will marry anyone who will have them. Many men just want to marry their mother and be looked after. They often pick a woman who reminds them of their mother. Many wives grow up to resemble their own mothers. It's a funny world.

[rixalex]

They often pick a woman who reminds them of their mother. Many wives grow up to resemble their own mothers. It's a funny world.

A funny world full of mother fockers you seem to be telling us...

[Lopburi99]

I agree, Lopburi99. That was one point I left out. It's the same reason that many people get married in the first place... they don't want to be alone and will marry anyone who will have them. Many men just want to marry their mother and be looked after. They often pick a woman who reminds them of their mother. Many wives grow up to resemble their own mothers. It's a funny world.

Yes, and I think many men regret marrying a woman like their mother, per the "Madonna/Whore" syndrome. This can lead to major sexual frustration.

The men are attracted by mother-type mates, but don't have their fantasy desires met because they can't imagine doing some sex acts they have a need to do. You men know exactly what I am talking about, maybe wanting to watch porn of have oral sex but can't imagine doing it with a woman who resembles your mother! This sometimes leads to infidelity or often divorce. It can be a tragic can't win situation for a man. Loves the mother type, but craves the whore type.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madonna-whore_complex

Another advantage of having a Thai wife - less likely to resemble our western mother.

Edited September 18, 2009 by Lopburi99