A Friend Of A Friend Needs Advice.

[yeesipha]

Hi there,

i am asking a question for a friend of a friend who is married to a thai lady and they are currenly living together in england.They have now been in

england for approx 6 months now,and she has a spouse visa,no ILR yet,they also have a baby daughter now (1 month old).They have been living

at his mother and fathers house since reterning from thailand,also he has just recently lost his job,and is finding it very difficult to find work,due

to the current situation in england,things are getting very crowded at his parents house,and is now being asked to leave,he would go out and rent

but the prices for rent are way to much,and he dosnt have the money anyway.what he wants to no is can he go to the local council to get help

with houseing him,his wife and baby daughter by makeing the claim in his name or does it have to be in joint names?

Yes he has looked on the UKBA website and looked at the maintainance and accomondation,but this info dosnt help people whose situation has

changed dramaticly.Also IF the local council was to help,would this affect her ILR when she comes to apply for this,and if they refused ILR could

they (the UKBA)kick her out of the uk,even when married to a uk citizen and has a UK born child.

thanks for any SOUND advice.

[7by7]

As you can see from this leaflet housing benefit, council tax benefit and an allocation of housing from a local authority are all on the list of proscribed public funds.

Also, from the leaflet

Two types of housing assistance count as public

funds:

• An allocation of housing, or grant of a licence

or tenancy, by a local housing authority – for

example, through the ‘housing waiting list’.

• Housing assistance under homelessness

legislation.

However, there are other types of housing

assistance that do not count as public funds:

• Housing provided directly by housing

associations. These are independent

organisations and are separate from local

housing authorities.

• Housing provided by Key Worker Housing

schemes.

• Housing provided by your employer – for

example, if you are a nurse and you are

living in housing provided by the local NHS

Trust.

If you receive any of these types of support, it

will not count as recourse to public funds.

(My emphasis)

So, apart from the exceptions listed above, she cannot claim housing assistance and her husband cannot claim on her behalf. But her husband, of course, can claim any public funds to which he is entitled. He cannot claim any extra due to his marriage to her, but he can claim for himself and his daughter. This would, in my opinion, mean that if he obtained two bedroomed council accommodation for himself and his daughter, and housing benefit to pay the rent, that his wife lived there as well would not affect her status in the UK nor her ILR application.

As I said, that is my opinion. I am not a lawyer, so you may want to obtain a second opinion, and even a third one.

[orchidofsiam]

I totally agree withy 7by7, very sound advice. Your friend should go and talk with Citizens Advice who will freely advise him of his full entitlements and how to apply.

[yeesipha]

Thanks 7by7 for your thoughts on this one,

Orchid of siam, yes i think best to seek more advice ,will let him no in due course.

Please dont get me wrong,this guy is not a freeloader,he has just been dealt a couple of shitty hands in the last few months,(apart from his

beautiful baby daughter being born) .

In your opinion 7by7,OOS,

Could they (the UKBA) if they revoked her visa or did not grant ILR,could they split /seperate the mother from the baby,I.E send her back to thai

and leave the baby in england with the father?even though the baby was born in england,will have british PP and birth cert or could they ask them

both to leave, or even worse deport them?,if she was in breach of her visa conditions.

Edited September 19, 2009 by yeesipha

[7by7]

The child is British, so cannot be deported/removed from the UK. However, worst case scenario is that the mother could be if she were in breach of her leave to enter/remain or was refused an extension of same. The UKBA could argue that as the child is also Thai there is no legal reason why the child could not go to Thailand with the mother.

If this happened then she could submit an appeal against under Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights; which may well be successful. I have a recollection of a specific, often referred to case on this; but can't put my finger on it!

However, all of this is hypothetical as, based upon what you have told us, she is not in any way in breach of her leave to enter/remain nor is she likely to be, and there is no reason why her husband and child claiming and recieving housing assistance, or any other public funds they are entitled to, should effect her ILR application adversly.

Edited September 19, 2009 by 7by7

[snuggzzz]

Thanks 7by7 for your thoughts on this one,

Orchid of siam, yes i think best to seek more advice ,will let him no in due course.

Please dont get me wrong,this guy is not a freeloader,he has just been dealt a couple of shitty hands in the last few months,(apart from his

beautiful baby daughter being born) .

In your opinion 7by7,OOS,

Could they (the UKBA) if they revoked her visa or did not grant ILR,could they split /seperate the mother from the baby,I.E send her back to thai

and leave the baby in england with the father?even though the baby was born in england,will have british PP and birth cert or could they ask them

both to leave, or even worse deport them?,if she was in breach of her visa conditions.

The UKBA cannot revoke her Visa. The advice given by 7by7 is sound, it is the best way to go. There is no way that his wife would be sent back under the circumstances you describe. Tell them to go to the CAB for options, but I'd stick with the advice given already...!!

[sumrit]

As you can see from this leaflet housing benefit, council tax benefit and an allocation of housing from a local authority are all on the list of proscribed public funds.

Also, from the leaflet

Two types of housing assistance count as public

funds:

• An allocation of housing, or grant of a licence

or tenancy, by a local housing authority – for

example, through the ‘housing waiting list’.

• Housing assistance under homelessness

legislation.

However, there are other types of housing

assistance that do not count as public funds:

• Housing provided directly by housing

associations. These are independent

organisations and are separate from local

housing authorities.

• Housing provided by Key Worker Housing

schemes.

• Housing provided by your employer – for

example, if you are a nurse and you are

living in housing provided by the local NHS

Trust.

If you receive any of these types of support, it

will not count as recourse to public funds.

(My emphasis)

So, apart from the exceptions listed above, she cannot claim housing assistance and her husband cannot claim on her behalf. But her husband, of course, can claim any public funds to which he is entitled. He cannot claim any extra due to his marriage to her, but he can claim for himself and his daughter. This would, in my opinion, mean that if he obtained two bedroomed council accommodation for himself and his daughter, and housing benefit to pay the rent, that his wife lived there as well would not affect her status in the UK nor her ILR application.

As I said, that is my opinion. I am not a lawyer, so you may want to obtain a second opinion, and even a third one.

The no recourse to public funds rule can't be used to prevent a British Citizen from claiming what he/she would normally be entitled to claim.

So if he rents a house he can claim housing benefit, if he's entitled to it of course. He must also put both his wife and daughters names on the application forms as living at the same address. By law both he and his wife will have to sign the claim form, but as it's the husband that is making the claim she will not be breaking the 'no recourse to public funds' rule. They will also find that they will get the same benefit as any other couple with one dependant. They won't lose and get a reduced amount because of her visa status.

As 7by7 says they would be entitled to housing benefit on a two bedroomed property, If they were to rent a (more expensive) three or four bedroomed property they might find they wouldn't get all the rent paid, they might have to pay 'the difference' themselves. There's normally a maximum amount given, based on they size and needs of the family.