Forever Outvoted In Condo Board Of Director's Meeting

[Robbiechiang]

Hi. Any advice appreciated. I stay in a condo and was voted in as a director. Been serving as a director for last 1 year plus. We have 4 directors altogether. Two of the directors are related. Brother and sister. The brother was appointed Chairman. They are Thais. They run the condo like they run their Kingdom. If they are absent, they will appoint their wife or husband and friends and even one instance their father to attend the meeting. Sometimes, the meetings becomes totally nonsense. I would like to know whether it is Against the Condo Law to Proxy another Person to attend the meeting if you as a director is unable to attend. I know in the Company Law, there is such a thing as an Alternate director. I have asked my friends to check the Condo Act and they told me that the only time you can proxy a person to attend on your behalf, it is only for the co-owner at the Annual General Meeting. My friends have checked with their lawyer friends and they say although the Condo Act is silent on this, it is illegal and any votes taken is also illegal for the proxy.

They are insistent that a Proxy can be allowed. They are very lazy to attend the monthly condo meetings and very empty of ideas. I wonder ? Maybe next meeting, I will proxy my son to attend the meeting. As I am a co-owner and he is my son, then he should be entitled to attend the Board Meeting. As a director I know we have to submit all our particulars to be registered at the Ministery of Interior. So it is a very formal thing. So imagine, if a MP is sick and then he proxy his wife or the driver or the Minister is sick, he can proxy his wife to attend all the important Defence Matters. The person who attends must be accountable for his actions.

I think the law is silent on this. It is stupid to challenge the law. There are many things that the laws are silent on. I have told them that it is illegal to proxy his friends to attend the Board Meeting but they insist that they are not breaking the laws. Any comments ?

[samtam]

Section 37 of the Condominium Act covers the Committee of a condominium. You are right that there are no proxies, and if there are insufficient numbers of committee members, (you are not "directors"), then the committee cannot meet.

If you are dissatisfied with their behaviour, you should get together 1/3 of your co-owners and call for an EGM, and have them removed. 50% of the vote of all co-owners is required to achieve that:

มาตรา ๓๗. ให้มีคณะกรรมการนิติบุคคลอาคารชุดประกอบด้วยกรรมการไม่น้อย

กว่าสามคนแต่ไม่เกินเก้าคน ซึ่งแต่งตั้งโดยที่ประชุมใหญ่เจ้าของร่วม

กรรมการมีวาระการดำรงตำแหน่งคราวละสองปี ในกรณีกรรมการพ้นจากตำแหน่งก่อน

วาระหรือมีการแต่งตั้งกรรมการเพิ่มขึ้นในระหว่างที่กรรมการซึ่งแต่งตั้งไว้แล้วยังมีวาระ

อยู่ในตำแหน่งให้ผู้ซึ่งได้รับแต่งตั้งดำรงตำแหน่งแทนหรือเป็นกรรมการเพิ่มขึ้นอยู่ใน

ตำแหน่งเท่ากับวาระที่เหลืออยู่ของกรรมการซึ่งได้รับแต่งตั้งไว้แล้ว

เมื่อครบกำหนดวาระตามวรรคสอง หากยังมิได้มีการแต่งตั้งกรรมการขึ้นใหม่ให้

กรรมการซึ่งพ้นจากตำแหน่งตามวาระนั้นปฏิบัติหน้าที่ต่อไปจนกว่ากรรมการซึ่งได้รับ

แต่งตั้งใหม่เข้ารับหน้าที่

กรรมการซึ่งพ้นจากตำแหน่งอาจได้รับแต่งตั้งอีกได้ แต่จะดำรงตำแหน่งเกินสองวาระ

ติดต่อกันไม่ได้ เว้นแต่ไม่อาจหาบุคคลอื่นมาดำรงตำแหน่งได้

การแต่งตั้งกรรมการ ให้ผู้จัดการนำไปจดทะเบียนต่อพนักงานเจ้าหน้าที่ภายในสามสิบ

วันนับแต่วันที่ที่ประชุมใหญ่เจ้าของร่วมมีมติ

Section 37.40 There shall be established a condominium building

juristic person committee comprising not less than three but not more

than nine committee members who are appointed by a joint owners

general meeting.

Each committee member shall hold office two years each term. In the

case where a committee member vacates office before completing

his/her term, or there be appointed an additional committee member

during the period the appointed committee members are still holding

office, the replacement or additional committee member shall hold

office only for the remaining period of the committee members who

have already been appointed.

Upon the lapse of the period under paragraph two, if there have not yet

been appointed new committee members, the committee members who

have vacated office shall continue performing their duties until the

newly appointed committee members will have assumed their duties.

Retired committee members may be reappointed, however, they may not

hold office for more than two consecutive terms, except where no other

persons can be solicited to take their place.

The manager shall effect the registration of appointment of committee

members with the competent officer within thirty days from the date of

passing the resolution by the joint owner general meeting.

มาตรา ๓๗/๑. บุคคลดังต่อไปนี้มีสิทธิได้รับแต่งตั้งเป็นกรรมการ

(๑) เจ้าของร่วมหรือคู่สมรสของเจ้าของร่วม

(๒) ผู้แทนโดยชอบธรรม ผู้อนุบาล หรือผู้พิทักษ์ในกรณีที่เจ้าของร่วมเป็นผู้เยาว์

คนไร้ความสามารถ หรือคนเสมือนไร้ความสามารถ แล้วแต่กรณี

(๓) ตัวแทนของนิติบุคคลจำนวนหนึ่งคน ในกรณีที่นิติบุคคลเป็นเจ้าของร่วม

ในกรณีที่ห้องชุดใดมีผู้ถือกรรมสิทธิ์เป็นเจ้าของร่วมหลายคน ให้มีสิทธิได้รับแต่งตั้งเป็น

กรรมการจำนวนหนึ่งคน

Section 37/1.41 The following persons may be appointed as a

committee member:

(1) A joint owner or his/her spouse.

(2) The legitimate representative, the guardian, or the caretaker in

the case the joint owner is a juvenile, an incompetent or quasiincompetent

person, as the case may be.

(3) A representative of the juristic person, in the case the juristic

person is a joint owner.

In the case any condominium room has several holders of ownership as

joint owners, only one person may be appointed as a committee

member.

[Robbiechiang]

Section 37 of the Condominium Act covers the Committee of a condominium. You are right that there are no proxies, and if there are insufficient numbers of committee members, (you are not "directors"), then the committee cannot meet.

If you are dissatisfied with their behaviour, you should get together 1/3 of your co-owners and call for an EGM, and have them removed. 50% of the vote of all co-owners is required to achieve that:

มาตรา ๓๗. ให้มีคณะกรรมการนิติบุคคลอาคารชุดประกอบด้วยกรรมการไม่น้อย

กว่าสามคนแต่ไม่เกินเก้าคน ซึ่งแต่งตั้งโดยที่ประชุมใหญ่เจ้าของร่วม

กรรมการมีวาระการดำรงตำแหน่งคราวละสองปี ในกรณีกรรมการพ้นจากตำแหน่งก่อน

วาระหรือมีการแต่งตั้งกรรมการเพิ่มขึ้นในระหว่างที่กรรมการซึ่งแต่งตั้งไว้แล้วยังมีวาระ

อยู่ในตำแหน่งให้ผู้ซึ่งได้รับแต่งตั้งดำรงตำแหน่งแทนหรือเป็นกรรมการเพิ่มขึ้นอยู่ใน

ตำแหน่งเท่ากับวาระที่เหลืออยู่ของกรรมการซึ่งได้รับแต่งตั้งไว้แล้ว

เมื่อครบกำหนดวาระตามวรรคสอง หากยังมิได้มีการแต่งตั้งกรรมการขึ้นใหม่ให้

กรรมการซึ่งพ้นจากตำแหน่งตามวาระนั้นปฏิบัติหน้าที่ต่อไปจนกว่ากรรมการซึ่งได้รับ

แต่งตั้งใหม่เข้ารับหน้าที่

กรรมการซึ่งพ้นจากตำแหน่งอาจได้รับแต่งตั้งอีกได้ แต่จะดำรงตำแหน่งเกินสองวาระ

ติดต่อกันไม่ได้ เว้นแต่ไม่อาจหาบุคคลอื่นมาดำรงตำแหน่งได้

การแต่งตั้งกรรมการ ให้ผู้จัดการนำไปจดทะเบียนต่อพนักงานเจ้าหน้าที่ภายในสามสิบ

วันนับแต่วันที่ที่ประชุมใหญ่เจ้าของร่วมมีมติ

Section 37.40 There shall be established a condominium building

juristic person committee comprising not less than three but not more

than nine committee members who are appointed by a joint owners

general meeting.

Each committee member shall hold office two years each term. In the

case where a committee member vacates office before completing

his/her term, or there be appointed an additional committee member

during the period the appointed committee members are still holding

office, the replacement or additional committee member shall hold

office only for the remaining period of the committee members who

have already been appointed.

Upon the lapse of the period under paragraph two, if there have not yet

been appointed new committee members, the committee members who

have vacated office shall continue performing their duties until the

newly appointed committee members will have assumed their duties.

Retired committee members may be reappointed, however, they may not

hold office for more than two consecutive terms, except where no other

persons can be solicited to take their place.

The manager shall effect the registration of appointment of committee

members with the competent officer within thirty days from the date of

passing the resolution by the joint owner general meeting.

มาตรา ๓๗/๑. บุคคลดังต่อไปนี้มีสิทธิได้รับแต่งตั้งเป็นกรรมการ

(๑) เจ้าของร่วมหรือคู่สมรสของเจ้าของร่วม

(๒) ผู้แทนโดยชอบธรรม ผู้อนุบาล หรือผู้พิทักษ์ในกรณีที่เจ้าของร่วมเป็นผู้เยาว์

คนไร้ความสามารถ หรือคนเสมือนไร้ความสามารถ แล้วแต่กรณี

(๓) ตัวแทนของนิติบุคคลจำนวนหนึ่งคน ในกรณีที่นิติบุคคลเป็นเจ้าของร่วม

ในกรณีที่ห้องชุดใดมีผู้ถือกรรมสิทธิ์เป็นเจ้าของร่วมหลายคน ให้มีสิทธิได้รับแต่งตั้งเป็น

กรรมการจำนวนหนึ่งคน

Section 37/1.41 The following persons may be appointed as a

committee member:

(1) A joint owner or his/her spouse.

(2) The legitimate representative, the guardian, or the caretaker in

the case the joint owner is a juvenile, an incompetent or quasiincompetent

person, as the case may be.

(3) A representative of the juristic person, in the case the juristic

person is a joint owner.

In the case any condominium room has several holders of ownership as

joint owners, only one person may be appointed as a committee

member.

Thanks Samtam for the detailed reply. I dont read Thai but appreciate your thoughtfulness for both English and Thai translation. Can I concur that it is implicit in that section of the Act that if there are Not enough directors, then there is no quorum ? And implies that A Proxy is not allowed for Directors who are absent. In my case, the brother proxied his friend and his friend became the Chairman and his friend also have the Casting Votes in some of the meetings. Can I deduce that all those Board of Director's meetings where we lost in the Votes count when an Agenda was brought up to vote during the meeting is Ultra Vires ? The brother and his sister caused the Condo a lot of grief with their mispendings. Can we get the co-owners then to sue these directors , or a few of us get together and get a lawyer to sue them , and get back the moneys that came out from the Sinking Fund. Or should we sue the Juristic Person at the Condo. ? How can we prevent the Brother from bringing up the Proxy Word again as he insist again and again that he is within the Laws? Must we go and complain to the Land Department and ask them to take action and fine them? And what if he refuses and wants to conduct the meeting his way. Is there a recourse ? Thai laws are funny. They are seldom enforced. Is there a punishment available for the Brother and Sister Team for all the grief they caused by their own interpretation of the Condo Act and their insistence that it is correct? They seem well connected in the high places. We try to help in maintaining the condo as a co-owner and participate as much as possible as the common property is in everybody's interest but it is such a waste of our time to meet with such characters.

I think these questions are too much of a burden to a reader. But thanks for listening anyway and any comments much appreciated.

[elkangorito]

The way I see it, all you need is a copy of the complete Condominium Act, in Thai & English. I've tried searching the web but was not successful.

[trajan]

I recently bought a booklet at Bookazine (at Siam Complex) of the entire Condo Act (in English and Thai) updated to the latest amendments....it was their last one in stock, but they said they would re-stock soon.....they might have it at other branches also....

if you buy a condo, you should read-up on it.......

[samtam]

If you PM me, I will forward you a copy. I have in in pdf, but can't seem to be able to copy and paste.

As far as your other questions, your best bet is to get a lawyer*. By the sound of it they are in breach of their powers and duties. But as with all of these things, you need to get support from your other co-owners, and if the majority do not want to upset the important family, because of Thai culture and "kreng jai" there is not a lot you can do, despite being in the right as far as the law is concerned, and despite your fellow Thai co-owners agreeing that you are right and they are wrong.

*Do you have a management company, such as Jones Lang etc, as they should be used to implement the law, and inform the errant committee members that they are abusing their power, and breaking the law.

[jasreeve17]

With all due respect Robbie: don't put yourself through the grief.

These condos are run by little Thai familly groups for their own benefit. It happens all over. They quite like a foreigner on the board to do the dog'sbody work, and they believe it makes them look good too, but what do you get? Stress, stress and more stress. If it is something you enjoy doing then fine, but don't expect to have a say or be able to change anything. These family groups have nothing to do in their lives but abuse their little pond... They love the power, and scheme all day every day about more ways to use the power for personal benefit. Get out of that loop and avoid the @#&%&@!

[mark5335]

I recently bought a booklet at Bookazine (at Siam Complex) of the entire Condo Act (in English and Thai) updated to the latest amendments....it was their last one in stock, but they said they would re-stock soon.....they might have it at other branches also....

if you buy a condo, you should read-up on it.......

This book is also available from Asia Books. I bought a copy this week from the All Seasons Place branch.

[Robbiechiang]

If you PM me, I will forward you a copy. I have in in pdf, but can't seem to be able to copy and paste.

As far as your other questions, your best bet is to get a lawyer*. By the sound of it they are in breach of their powers and duties. But as with all of these things, you need to get support from your other co-owners, and if the majority do not want to upset the important family, because of Thai culture and "kreng jai" there is not a lot you can do, despite being in the right as far as the law is concerned, and despite your fellow Thai co-owners agreeing that you are right and they are wrong.

*Do you have a management company, such as Jones Lang etc, as they should be used to implement the law, and inform the errant committee members that they are abusing their power, and breaking the law.

Thanks for your offer. I managed to get a copy of the Condo Act in Thai and my friend helped translated it especially the Section in question. I will go and head out to look for the English Version. The problems with co-owners are they are apathetic and today they will support you when there is a matter affecting his pockets. But once he gets it rectified, they will not really care. Not so many of the Thais are conversant with Condo and apartment living. We know that they are in breach of their powers and duties. But we know, as time goes by, civilisation comes around. It will become harder and harder for them to do what they had been traditionally doing. But this is Thailand. If you have difficulty removing a Police Chief when you are the Head of the Goverment, where do we stand in his " Little Pond ". But I think the power of information, getting people informed will reign in the end. We do not use a Management Company but outsource the various functions. However , I will press for Hiring a Management Company in the next meeting.

[Robbiechiang]

With all due respect Robbie: don't put yourself through the grief.

These condos are run by little Thai familly groups for their own benefit. It happens all over. They quite like a foreigner on the board to do the dog'sbody work, and they believe it makes them look good too, but what do you get? Stress, stress and more stress. If it is something you enjoy doing then fine, but don't expect to have a say or be able to change anything. These family groups have nothing to do in their lives but abuse their little pond... They love the power, and scheme all day every day about more ways to use the power for personal benefit. Get out of that loop and avoid the @#&%&@!

Yeah. I agree with you. They have their own Little Pond to play. They really love the power. The spy versus spy games. They will get the security guards to even monitor when I and the other director go out in the morning and come back in the evening. I just do not understand. There are so many things to do in life instead of trying to monitor even the movement of every pubic hair. I leave that to your imagination. Yes, like in politics, they love to scheme. Scheme and Scheme. They will invite the security guards out for lunch or dinner ?, get the maids to run errands for them and pay them a stipend, get the office staff to do their personal things, bribed the office staff to make them feel indebted even though the office staff are highly incompetent, parked even more cars than they are allocated, Block the driveway at the Condo Lobby drop off and pick up point or even park in the driveway when it rains so that other cars cannot drop their passengers, get the condo to allocate funds to make the garden into their own botanical backyard. It is quite stressful for me. Many times I want to quit, similar with the other director, but we think that if we do not give them some hindrance, they will get out of hand. I suspect that they must be suffering from some psychologica problems. Thanks for lending an ear.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

it might pay to get a reliable lawyer involved in the changes. Do it right and you will win.

[JohnC]

Condo_Act.pdf

Attached copy.

[samtam]

I asked this on another thread, but as you are referring to an expat club, you might know with more certainty - is it possible for a non-Thai, without a work permit to be a member of a condo committee?

[Robbiechiang]

Condo_Act.pdf

Attached copy.

Thanks Very Much for the File. Fantastic.

[AsiaCheese]

With all due respect Robbie: don't put yourself through the grief.

These condos are run by little Thai familly groups for their own benefit. It happens all over. They quite like a foreigner on the board to do the dog'sbody work, and they believe it makes them look good too, but what do you get? Stress, stress and more stress. If it is something you enjoy doing then fine, but don't expect to have a say or be able to change anything. These family groups have nothing to do in their lives but abuse their little pond... They love the power, and scheme all day every day about more ways to use the power for personal benefit. Get out of that loop and avoid the @#&%&@!

Add to that the fact that quite a few condo buildings (especially in the current financial climate) aren't sold-out, i.e. the builders/owners hold a considerable number of votes for unsold condos, and can out-vote anyone and anything. The place where I have my condo in Jomtien is one of those; the ownership issue will presumably change over time, but by then, most co-owners will be sick & tired of going to farce meetings where "big madame's" wishes automatically come true...

[jasreeve17]

Good luck Robbie.

Remember: if the stress builds up too much then it's no disgrace to move out and move on; get away from these muppets and instantly improve your quality of life.

[TGIR]

We're in a similar situation in our condo. All we are trying to do is get some financial records put together so we can calculate the common area and maintenance fees. I've spent several months just trying to get the "secretary" to give us basic receipts and expenditures.....no luck yet.

TIT never fits better than it does to a condo board........I hope you have more falangs than we have as we just don't have the numbers to do anything about it.

Good luck, but my advice would be not to waste money with an attorney. My wife and I paid for a piece of property; the owner changed her mind and wouldn't give us the Chanote. This happened over two years ago. She also wouldn't give back our money. Seems like a pretty simple case doesn't it? We're still waiting for our day in court which is supposed to come next year.........I'm not holding my breath.

[Robbiechiang]

I asked this on another thread, but as you are referring to an expat club, you might know with more certainty - is it possible for a non-Thai, without a work permit to be a member of a condo committee?

Hi. Myself have a Thai Work Permit. I think that without a work permit , those who do not quite like or appreciate you can create problems. I think the Thai Law is rather vague on this. But first come, first serve. The local Thai resident may have a friend at the police station and when you are having an AGM or EGM, they may suddenly visit you and proclaim that you are under arrest. Well, What a great start to an AGM or EGM until it is sorted out. It is then difficult to hold another EGM again because they can still proceed without you as the quorum already met. I heard about a very fierce condo clash at an EGM at a condo near the airport. It seems that the local thai co-owner got together quite several policemen both in uniform and undercover uniform to turn up at the meeting including female policewomen. But this is Thailand.

[Robbiechiang]

We're in a similar situation in our condo. All we are trying to do is get some financial records put together so we can calculate the common area and maintenance fees. I've spent several months just trying to get the "secretary" to give us basic receipts and expenditures.....no luck yet.

I am not so sure. But I think you can go to the Land Department or perhaps you have the list of all the condo owners and the condo probably have a copy of the title deeds and you can calculate the total area of the condo owned by the co-owners. I think it will form a good basis to calculate the maintenance fees. In the condo that we have, the "secretary" conveniently threw away all the photostated title deeds. So I sympathise with you. In my situation, all the current staff , the clerks, the security guards , the maids had been " bought " over. I also suspect that those contractors are also paying money to somebody in the management in order to ensure that they can sell the services.

TIT never fits better than it does to a condo board........I hope you have more falangs than we have as we just don't have the numbers to do anything about it.

In my condo, they never maintain the register of the foreign quota or the Thai quota. I suspect the local Thais when they want to sell their condo to a Farang, they bribe the Juristic Manager and get the necessary documents to the Land Department even when the Foreign Quota is exceeded. The Land Department does not make a check unless there is a serious complaint from the top with Influential Politicians or bureaucrats asking for action.

Good luck, but my advice would be not to waste money with an attorney. My wife and I paid for a piece of property; the owner changed her mind and wouldn't give us the Chanote. This happened over two years ago. She also wouldn't give back our money. Seems like a pretty simple case doesn't it? We're still waiting for our day in court which is supposed to come next year.........I'm not holding my breath. I am trying to make a difference. You heard about the story of the beached starfish. One person came across the hundreds of thousands of beached starfish and started to throw as many as humanly possible back into the water. Some bystanders came around and told him.... Hey... give up. There are millions of them lying there. The person replied" Thanks, but for that particular starfish that I threw back into the water, it makes a difference. "

Anyway, I will try my best in my instance as one of our fellow sympathisers said, if it is too tough, it is not a shame to give up. I will try first.

I like Thailand alot. It is many of the people who needs a re-education. But there are worst places too, I tell myself regularly !

[MJo]

Feel for you OP.

Everyone participating the never ending debate of buying condo or house should read this. Shows that there is really no sure bet in Thailand what it comes to property ownership. Condo or house.

One has to choose very carefully and still there is no guarantees of trouble free ownership.

What ever you do don't give up. Also don't loose your sleep or sanity over this but keep the pressure there and inform people. Thais or not people will act in some point if faced with facts and more so when they realize they are funding these siglings from their own pockets.

[Robbiechiang]

Feel for you OP.

Everyone participating the never ending debate of buying condo or house should read this. Shows that there is really no sure bet in Thailand what it comes to property ownership. Condo or house.

One has to choose very carefully and still there is no guarantees of trouble free ownership.

What ever you do don't give up. Also don't loose your sleep or sanity over this but keep the pressure there and inform people. Thais or not people will act in some point if faced with facts and more so when they realize they are funding these siglings from their own pockets.

Buying a condo or a house has so many problems. The final countdown of course will be the neighbours. The problem is that the culture is such that those staying here tends to interpret the laws according to their own advantage. We are also guilty of that. I won't loose my sleep and will do my best when I am staying here in Thailand.

[ripley]

Must say you've gotten excellent feedback on your question. Am also heartened to know that books on Thai Condo Law are selling like hotcakes. Indicates that people are finally realizing the repercussions of apathy and ignorance of their rights.

If you do decide to take on the reformation of your condo I advise you not to try to do it on your own. It's like sticking your hand into a hornet's nest. Rather get a group of 10 - 15 people to stand up with you, form a strategy and disseminate information. Then, when you know what support you have amongst the co-owners, and what you're up against, call for an Annual General Meeting to be held on the premises. If nobody will stand with you, walk away from this fight.

Remember, you're dealing with Thai Condo Law which is just like any law - ultimately enforceable by the police and the courts.

Good luck.

[trogers]

Time to sell and move on.

[scorecard]

Section 37 of the Condominium Act covers the Committee of a condominium. You are right that there are no proxies, and if there are insufficient numbers of committee members, (you are not "directors"), then the committee cannot meet.

If you are dissatisfied with their behaviour, you should get together 1/3 of your co-owners and call for an EGM, and have them removed. 50% of the vote of all co-owners is required to achieve that:

มาตรา ๓๗. ให้มีคณะกรรมการนิติบุคคลอาคารชุดประกอบด้วยกรรมการไม่น้อย

กว่าสามคนแต่ไม่เกินเก้าคน ซึ่งแต่งตั้งโดยที่ประชุมใหญ่เจ้าของร่วม

กรรมการมีวาระการดำรงตำแหน่งคราวละสองปี ในกรณีกรรมการพ้นจากตำแหน่งก่อน

วาระหรือมีการแต่งตั้งกรรมการเพิ่มขึ้นในระหว่างที่กรรมการซึ่งแต่งตั้งไว้แล้วยังมีวาระ

อยู่ในตำแหน่งให้ผู้ซึ่งได้รับแต่งตั้งดำรงตำแหน่งแทนหรือเป็นกรรมการเพิ่มขึ้นอยู่ใน

ตำแหน่งเท่ากับวาระที่เหลืออยู่ของกรรมการซึ่งได้รับแต่งตั้งไว้แล้ว

เมื่อครบกำหนดวาระตามวรรคสอง หากยังมิได้มีการแต่งตั้งกรรมการขึ้นใหม่ให้

กรรมการซึ่งพ้นจากตำแหน่งตามวาระนั้นปฏิบัติหน้าที่ต่อไปจนกว่ากรรมการซึ่งได้รับ

แต่งตั้งใหม่เข้ารับหน้าที่

กรรมการซึ่งพ้นจากตำแหน่งอาจได้รับแต่งตั้งอีกได้ แต่จะดำรงตำแหน่งเกินสองวาระ

ติดต่อกันไม่ได้ เว้นแต่ไม่อาจหาบุคคลอื่นมาดำรงตำแหน่งได้

การแต่งตั้งกรรมการ ให้ผู้จัดการนำไปจดทะเบียนต่อพนักงานเจ้าหน้าที่ภายในสามสิบ

วันนับแต่วันที่ที่ประชุมใหญ่เจ้าของร่วมมีมติ

Section 37.40 There shall be established a condominium building

juristic person committee comprising not less than three but not more

than nine committee members who are appointed by a joint owners

general meeting.

Each committee member shall hold office two years each term. In the

case where a committee member vacates office before completing

his/her term, or there be appointed an additional committee member

during the period the appointed committee members are still holding

office, the replacement or additional committee member shall hold

office only for the remaining period of the committee members who

have already been appointed.

Upon the lapse of the period under paragraph two, if there have not yet

been appointed new committee members, the committee members who

have vacated office shall continue performing their duties until the

newly appointed committee members will have assumed their duties.

Retired committee members may be reappointed, however, they may not

hold office for more than two consecutive terms, except where no other

persons can be solicited to take their place.

The manager shall effect the registration of appointment of committee

members with the competent officer within thirty days from the date of

passing the resolution by the joint owner general meeting.

มาตรา ๓๗/๑. บุคคลดังต่อไปนี้มีสิทธิได้รับแต่งตั้งเป็นกรรมการ

(๑) เจ้าของร่วมหรือคู่สมรสของเจ้าของร่วม

(๒) ผู้แทนโดยชอบธรรม ผู้อนุบาล หรือผู้พิทักษ์ในกรณีที่เจ้าของร่วมเป็นผู้เยาว์

คนไร้ความสามารถ หรือคนเสมือนไร้ความสามารถ แล้วแต่กรณี

(๓) ตัวแทนของนิติบุคคลจำนวนหนึ่งคน ในกรณีที่นิติบุคคลเป็นเจ้าของร่วม

ในกรณีที่ห้องชุดใดมีผู้ถือกรรมสิทธิ์เป็นเจ้าของร่วมหลายคน ให้มีสิทธิได้รับแต่งตั้งเป็น

กรรมการจำนวนหนึ่งคน

Section 37/1.41 The following persons may be appointed as a

committee member:

(1) A joint owner or his/her spouse.

(2) The legitimate representative, the guardian, or the caretaker in

the case the joint owner is a juvenile, an incompetent or quasiincompetent

person, as the case may be.

(3) A representative of the juristic person, in the case the juristic

person is a joint owner.

In the case any condominium room has several holders of ownership as

joint owners, only one person may be appointed as a committee

member.

Thanks Samtam for the detailed reply. I dont read Thai but appreciate your thoughtfulness for both English and Thai translation. Can I concur that it is implicit in that section of the Act that if there are Not enough directors, then there is no quorum ? And implies that A Proxy is not allowed for Directors who are absent. In my case, the brother proxied his friend and his friend became the Chairman and his friend also have the Casting Votes in some of the meetings. Can I deduce that all those Board of Director's meetings where we lost in the Votes count when an Agenda was brought up to vote during the meeting is Ultra Vires ? The brother and his sister caused the Condo a lot of grief with their mispendings. Can we get the co-owners then to sue these directors , or a few of us get together and get a lawyer to sue them , and get back the moneys that came out from the Sinking Fund. Or should we sue the Juristic Person at the Condo. ? How can we prevent the Brother from bringing up the Proxy Word again as he insist again and again that he is within the Laws? Must we go and complain to the Land Department and ask them to take action and fine them? And what if he refuses and wants to conduct the meeting his way. Is there a recourse ? Thai laws are funny. They are seldom enforced. Is there a punishment available for the Brother and Sister Team for all the grief they caused by their own interpretation of the Condo Act and their insistence that it is correct? They seem well connected in the high places. We try to help in maintaining the condo as a co-owner and participate as much as possible as the common property is in everybody's interest but it is such a waste of our time to meet with such characters.

I think these questions are too much of a burden to a reader. But thanks for listening anyway and any comments much appreciated.

There is a book easily available with a good English translation of the appropriate laws, I've read it but don't have a copy, but I understand It'' not difficult to find at SE-ED books, Asia Books and more, and not expensive.

In fact the laws and the subsequent regulations and documentation is very detailed and for good reason. By the regulations the committee must ensure every item is documented and signed by all committee members. Also, in many circumstances where a vote is required, the chairman cannot vote (that's the law).

My understanding is that committe members can only be the person who is mentioned on the chanut as the owner, therefore passing 'proxies' to non owners (incl. other family members) is not legal.

There is a government agency which does random checks of condo documents. They have 'audited' our building /documenation a couple of times and have been very picky about following the laws/regulations/process, and we've been scolded for even slight errors on various documents.

The law also requires that there be a 'juristic person' which again must be an owner and this person is liable at law for any transgression of the regulations etc., and owners can quite easily sue this person.

I would suggest you also think about whether you are being exposed to risk, as you are part of the elected committee.

[powderpuff]

Rams home the message: "Never buy property in Thailand"

Any questions? See rule 1.

[trogers]

Rams home the message: "Never buy property in Thailand"

Any questions? See rule 1.

Correction - Never buy into a project where either the developer, or a group of relations, has a large voting power in the running of the project.

The former is common in projects that have poor sales.

The latter is common in projects with too few units.

[scorecard]

Must say you've gotten excellent feedback on your question. Am also heartened to know that books on Thai Condo Law are selling like hotcakes. Indicates that people are finally realizing the repercussions of apathy and ignorance of their rights.

If you do decide to take on the reformation of your condo I advise you not to try to do it on your own. It's like sticking your hand into a hornet's nest. Rather get a group of 10 - 15 people to stand up with you, form a strategy and disseminate information. Then, when you know what support you have amongst the co-owners, and what you're up against, call for an Annual General Meeting to be held on the premises. If nobody will stand with you, walk away from this fight.

Remember, you're dealing with Thai Condo Law which is just like any law - ultimately enforceable by the police and the courts.

Good luck.

Agree with this. Our annual general meeting elected two farang onto the committee (all totally legal, majority of owners happy and very supportive of farang on committee).

Then farang tried to carefully convinve all owners to get serious about several serious problems, then another Thai committee member spread false rumours that the farang were out to steal the building funds.

At next meeting majority of owners now very negative about farang and made it obvious that farang no longer welcome.

[ripley]

Slander and rumour mongering are the primary weapons of those who wish to avoid a clean-up. These, together with misinformation regarding condo business and the law, and the danger of thwarting them are lethal and effective enough to keep most owners quiet. These tools are used by farangs as well as Thais and it can be a dirty business. Thais and farangs have problems trusting each other and I agree with the man who said "East is East and West is West and the twain shall never meet." We just see the world differently and play by different rules to achieve different ends. (But never underestimate the ability of the Westerners to play power politics and promote in-fighting.) In fact, the whole scene is so fraught I wouldn't touch it unless the value of my investment were being threatened.

This is why I suggest getting a group of not less than 10 to 15 to stand with you and disseminate information, then assess what support you have in the building. Without support you can do little.

What I didn't mention is that the first thing to do when you achieve a voice in the committee or even in the AGM is to protect the money. Insist the building finances be consistent with the Thai Condo Law, that checks be signed by more than 2 people and are verified by accompanying receipts/documents; that contracts require at least three competitive bids. Also that a monthly financial balance sheet in Thai and English be posted prominently each month; an audit performed by an independent company every year and presented to the AGM. Few can argue the sense of this without revealing they have something to gain by being evasive and obscure. "We don't want to show an independent audit"...."Why?"

Anyway, if you succeed in protecting the money you will have impeded corruption and protected an important asset of your building. IN the case of condo business being sewed up by a clique, perhaps you can compel them to accept a "sunshine" law, or even an oversight committee voted in by owners. As i said, this all depends on getting a good core group and support from co-owners.

I wouldn't wish the job on anyone, but sometimes there just isn't a good choice.

[beano2274]

Recently went to my Condos meeting to vote for the Juristic persons, the condo is 8 floors so 8 were chosen, 1 from each floor.

Hard luck for those who turned up from some floors only to find they were the only ones from that floor there and were immediately voted as Juristic persons.

I do not understand Thai, my wife helped me understand, also a nice older gentleman in the condo speaks excellent English (works for Thai Airways) and he explained things to me. I voted and am happy with the choice from my floor. I did not want to be in charge of my floor.

The condo act is there to protect us all, you should read it, understand it and then inform the other occupants about what is wrong and how you would like to go forward and get things sorted out, but be careful you are Farang and they are Thai, they stick together through thick and thin.

[aussiebebe]

Rams home the message: "Never buy property in Thailand"

Any questions? See rule 1.

Here, here. I've been living in Bangkok for only three years, I live with my Thai wife in her home and I'm just reading with amusement this senario with condos. I really had no clue about the BS involved in owning a condo as I never have and never plan to. The OP says he's been voted 'Director' ??? is this a special case or does every condo have these meetings?. It sounds crazy to have to attend meetings. So nothing worthwhile is being discussed? what should be discussed? who fixes the roof and who pays etc?

Fascinating reading.