คิดถึง And นึกถึง

[thongdee]

I friend off mine when we are on the phone I always say คิดถึง ,she go's like ...no we just friends , you have to say นึกถึง ... whats your oppinion about that ?

what's the difirent ?

[DavidHouston]

I friend off mine when we are on the phone I always say คิดถึง ,she go's like ...no we just friends , you have to say นึกถึง ... whats your oppinion about that ?

what's the difirent ?

From "คลัวคำ" ดร. นววรรณ พันธุเมธา, Amarin Publishing, third edition, 2549 (2006), 600 baht, page 42:

คิดถึง คิดเกี่ยวกับ เช่น คิดถึงความผิด; นึกถึงด้วยใจผูกพัน เช่น คิดถึงลูก

คิดถึง – to think about, to reflect on, e.g., 'to reflect on one's mistake'; to miss, to yearn for someone with whom one has emotional ties, e.g., 'to miss one's child'.

นึกถึง นึกเกี่ยวกับ เช่น ใครจะเป็นอย่างไรไม่เคยนึกถึง

นึกถึง - to think about; to consider, e.g., 'I didn't really stop to consider how everyone was doing'.

Thongdee,

From what I hear, "คิดถึง" tends to be more intimate or to involve emotional content ("to reflect on one's mistakes"). On the other hand "นึกถึง" has less emotional content and more reflects to "be in mind" or "is conscious of". I suspect it is difference in emotional content which is causing your friend to emphasize the difference between he two terms.

BTW, I would like to ask if other readers of this post could critique my understanding of "ใครจะเป็นอย่างไรไม่เคยนึกถึง". Thanks.

Edited November 1, 2009 by DavidHouston

[DavidHouston]

As to the last question, here is something from the Internet with a similar usage:

"มีใครเคยนึกถึงความรู้สึกสุดท้ายก่อนสิ้นใจตายบ้าง ว่าเป็นอย่างไร เจ็บปวดทรมานหรือไม่"

Has anyone ever considered how someone felt just before they passed away? Were they in pain; were they suffering?

Note also, that in this context, the writer used the word "นึกถึง", rather than "คิดถึง".

[thongdee]

I friend off mine when we are on the phone I always say คิดถึง ,she go's like ...no we just friends , you have to say นึกถึง ... whats your oppinion about that ?

what's the difirent ?

From "คลัวคำ" ดร. นววรรณ พันธุเมธา, Amarin Publishing, third edition, 2549 (2006), 600 baht, page 42:

คิดถึง คิดเกี่ยวกับ เช่น คิดถึงความผิด; นึกถึงด้วยใจผูกพัน เช่น คิดถึงลูก

คิดถึง – to think about, to reflect on, e.g., 'to reflect on one's mistake'; to miss, to yearn for someone with whom one has emotional ties, e.g., 'to miss one's child'.

นึกถึง นึกเกี่ยวกับ เช่น ใครจะเป็นอย่างไรไม่เคยนึกถึง

นึกถึง - to think about; to consider, e.g., 'I didn't really stop to consider how everyone was doing'.

Thongdee,

From what I hear, "คิดถึง" tends to be more intimate or to involve emotional content ("to reflect on one's mistakes"). On the other hand "นึกถึง" has less emotional content and more reflects to "be in mind" or "is conscious of". I suspect it is difference in emotional content which is causing your friend to emphasize the difference between he two terms.

BTW, I would like to ask if other readers of this post could critique my understanding of "ใครจะเป็นอย่างไรไม่เคยนึกถึง". Thanks.

Thank you very much for helping me out on this one David , ขอบคุณครับ

[Rionoir]

That's interesting, but I must say ALL my friends say คิดถึง with me exclusively. Take that for whatever u want... maybe there's a level of formality involved? My friends and I aren't very formal with each other.

[tgeezer]

That's interesting, but I must say ALL my friends say คิดถึง with me exclusively. Take that for whatever u want... maybe there's a level of formality involved? My friends and I aren't very formal with each other.

Same here. I have just written a reply which explains why I would just say that they both mean think and nothing much changes which ever one you use. It does sound strange to use คิดถึง in any other context than 'missing you' but only because that is probably the first context in which we met it.

On a translation point, I replied to David but a feature of my connection is that when you post it drops off-line and a whole body of 'wonderful prose' is lost.

David, ความรู้สึกสุดท้าย...บ้าง 'some of the last feeling/emotions'? or if not where will we put 'บ้าง' ?

[DavidHouston]

That's interesting, but I must say ALL my friends say คิดถึง with me exclusively. Take that for whatever u want... maybe there's a level of formality involved? My friends and I aren't very formal with each other.

Same here. I have just written a reply which explains why I would just say that they both mean think and nothing much changes which ever one you use. It does sound strange to use คิดถึง in any other context than 'missing you' but only because that is probably the first context in which we met it.

On a translation point, I replied to David but a feature of my connection is that when you post it drops off-line and a whole body of 'wonderful prose' is lost.

David, ความรู้สึกสุดท้าย...บ้าง 'some of the last feeling/emotions'? or if not where will we put 'บ้าง' ?

"มีใครเคยนึกถึง . . . บ้าง"

Seems to me that the บ้าง is an appendage to มีใครเคยนึกถึง, not to the noun phrase "ความรู้สึกสุดท้ายก่อนสิ้นใจตาย". The meaning would be ". . . had some thoughts regarding . . .".

What do you think?

[tgeezer]

That's interesting, but I must say ALL my friends say คิดถึง with me exclusively. Take that for whatever u want... maybe there's a level of formality involved? My friends and I aren't very formal with each other.

Same here. I have just written a reply which explains why I would just say that they both mean think and nothing much changes which ever one you use. It does sound strange to use คิดถึง in any other context than 'missing you' but only because that is probably the first context in which we met it.

On a translation point, I replied to David but a feature of my connection is that when you post it drops off-line and a whole body of 'wonderful prose' is lost.

David, ความรู้สึกสุดท้าย...บ้าง 'some of the last feeling/emotions'? or if not where will we put 'บ้าง' ?

"มีใครเคยนึกถึง . . . บ้าง"

Seems to me that the บ้าง is an appendage to มีใครเคยนึกถึง, not to the noun phrase "ความรู้สึกสุดท้ายก่อนสิ้นใจตาย". The meaning would be ". . . had some thoughts regarding . . .".

What do you think?

Just lost another wonderful reply to ไม่เคยนึกถึงใครจะเปํนอย่างใร so to summarize what you haven't seen I think it says I didn't consider anybody will be how. Differs from yours in being Singular and future. Putting it into English entails adding but here goes; I didn't consider how anybody would be affected.

Could well be. บ้าง ว. บางส่วนของสิ่งที่กล่าวถึงโดยเฉพาะ some parts if the main thing being referred to. It means some of something. Can it be some of everything which went before?

I think that บ้าง indicates some of a whole ใคร is already one out of everyone. คิดถึง is a verb, either you do or you don't and the adverb would be มาก หน่อย or somesuch, so we are only left with the ความรู้สึก with its คำขยาย สุดท้าย ก่อนสิ้นใจตาย which only describes the noun so you can take it out.

I am now off-line, but on to it..... โดยความหวัง

[aanon]

Interesting conundrum...

To me, บ้าง here might be intended as either มีใครบ้าง or เคยนึกถึงบ้าง. Roughly, the latter would mean "has done at least some thinking about...". I'm not sure that the former can be rendered properly in English, especially in this rhetorical situation. Perhaps "who amongst us" is the best we can do, since either a partial or complete answer is acceptable.

(In a non-rhetorical question มีใครบ้าง is like ไปที่ไหนบ้าง or พบใครบ้าง or คิดอย่างไรบ้าง in that it asks for some, but not necessarily all, of a set [of the places you went, of the people you met, of your opinions].)

[tgeezer]

Interesting conundrum...

To me, บ้าง here might be intended as either มีใครบ้าง or เคยนึกถึงบ้าง. Roughly, the latter would mean "has done at least some thinking about...". I'm not sure that the former can be rendered properly in English, especially in this rhetorical situation. Perhaps "who amongst us" is the best we can do, since either a partial or complete answer is acceptable.

(In a non-rhetorical question มีใครบ้าง is like ไปที่ไหนบ้าง or พบใครบ้าง or คิดอย่างไรบ้าง in that it asks for some, but not necessarily all, of a set [of the places you went, of the people you met, of your opinions].)

I think that both you and David are correct. I tried it on a Thai and he just translated it as 'has anyone ever thought what it would feel like to die'. I didn't have the เป็นอย่างไง etc which modifies it a little but I asked whether บ้าง shouldn't follow ใคร and he agreed that it could, I didn't push my luck and go into whether it could be applied to ความนึกถึงสุดท้าย. I forgot to suggest that it could be left out but suspect that it perhaps could.

I think that we all have the gist of it.