Software Police Target Thai Businesses

[newtronbom]

Sorry if this is off post, but I have to rebut all those diehards who continue to put MS O/Ss down. Get real. Look at the % of MS Windows O/Ss installed out there, compared to Mac, Linux etc. I have tried them all. If ya got 1,000,000 XP users and 1,000 Mac users, of course the "hackers" are going to target the "big market" - I mean it stands to reason. Good(or in this case bad) business ethics dictate you go where the customers are. I now use MS Win 7 Ultimate and while I agree "Vista" was a disaster unmodded, this new O/S is everything that Vista could have been - yeah, yeah MS were lazy I have to agree, but they have made up for it in this edition. See the attached .jpg of my own desktop. Pure eye candy! Everthing runs faster and better. Yet to find a mainstream prog that won't run on it. Please wake up you guys and stop the bashing. It is your right to have a "niche product" but it is not your right to put down other peoples preferences.

It's not eye candy - it's user interface design and user experience that Apple cares about. User interface design is the top layer of software; it's with what you interact with everyday. Apple will build the user interface first and then code the software and manufacture the hardware to make it work. Microsoft codes first and then throws a design on top of it. It's two completely different approach to making a product - it's not about eye candy.

you are quite right and that's why they made Win 7 the right way first this time. Also their customer support is very good - both auto and for emailed probs. There are also so many outside the box support forums too. I have tried Ubuntu, Linux and Mac - which by the way I really like, it's just that more progs run on MS Win O/Ss. Personal choice:)

[falkenbach]

not a good news, imho Gates is rich enough anyway and all this troubles will hurt business more or less

open source can be alternative:

MS Office == Open Office, AbiWord or Lotus Symphony

Photoshop == GIMP

Flash == Flex

etc...

and what about portable software? if you run it from flash sticker how police suppose to detect is it licensed or not?

[Samuian]

not a good news, imho Gates is rich enough anyway and all this troubles will hurt business more or less

open source can be alternative:

MS Office == Open Office, AbiWord or Lotus Symphony

Photoshop == GIMP

Flash == Flex

etc...

and what about portable software? if you run it from flash sticker how police suppose to detect is it licensed or not?

Agreed if the Open Source community cold only be convinced to give the progs' functions names which make more sense!

Open Office isa good start, but GIMP and all these funny shortcut names...

but so far good work - for FREE!

[tmark]

What a laugh ! .. They can start off easy and raid their own Police Stations for starters. I was in a Police Station last year in Korat and noticed the familiar little "Black Star" in the System Tray on a monitor there.

After that .. they can branch out and go to any Government school. ALL 3 of the ones I've worked for so far had pirated copies of Windows, Office etc etc.

I think someone already mentioned they won't raid Government places because they won't get any money out of them .. well how pathetic is that?

I love this country .. but quite often the "powers that be" are real tossers .. aren't they? Does any other countries Government use pirated software? Maybe I should drop an email to Mr Gates. Yeah ,Yeah .. he probably already knows.

[Ga-gai]

I've seen local government office computers and local public schools using pirated versions of Windows and the Office suite. Why don't they start cleaning up in their own backyard first?

[monty]

Biggest laugh was the big LED screen Pattaya city installed at the sukhumvit entrance of Central Pattaya Road.

They had the "black star" on their windows desktop after the software controlling the screen crashed...

[tmark]

Biggest laugh was the big LED screen Pattaya city installed at the sukhumvit entrance of Central Pattaya Road.

They had the "black star" on their windows desktop after the software controlling the screen crashed...

... and another thing .. I just remembered watching on TV some Monk giving a presentation to a bunch of school kids. He was using a laptop hooked up to a projector .. and that's right! .. you guessed it .. the "Little Black Star" was down in the sys tray blazing away in all it's glory.

So .. they can add Monks and Wats to the "Raid List". Singling out private business's in their pathetic attention getting, face saving "crackdown" is just plain dishonorable .. as the Japanese would say. Welcome to "corruption central"  They're lucky Buddhism has no hel_l... but surely their "Karma points" should be slipping rapidly into the red.

[ChiangMaiThai]

I've seen local government office computers and local public schools using pirated versions of Windows and the Office suite. Why don't they start cleaning up in their own backyard first?

Couldn't agree more. And the fines that they are forcing upon people are absolutely disgusting. F$CK OFF MICROSOFT AND YOUR HYPOCRITICAL PARTNERS IN THAILAND.

[stingray]

And how do we know if the software is real or no? Can we sue the computershop if our computer get seized? I guess in Pattaya there is no real software for sale.

[ChiangMaiThai]

This whole thing is just ridiculous. Kind of like sentencing the guy doing a line of coke to 10 years in jail, while the guy selling kilos a day goes out for drinks with the MIB at the local pub.

[tmark]

And how do we know if the software is real or no? Can we sue the computershop if our computer get seized? I guess in Pattaya there is no real software for sale.

Of course there is genuine software for sale in Pattaya .. and everywhere for that matter. It was only a few weeks ago I bought a genuine XP SP3 for 5000 Baht at TukCom. They actually doubled checked with me if that was what I wanted instead of an "Unattended Pirate Copy" for a 150 Baht. I don't think B.Gates will be giving them jobs as salesmen any time soon.

As for knowing if the software is genuine or not .. just take note of the price tag .. if it's under 200 Baht .. it's a fake. Or ... just ask them! .. they have no morals .. they'll give you an honest answer.

[jjmax]

I have been using Ubuntu for 3 years now and can definitely say that there is nothing that I need windows for. One of the main problems that some companies I deal with encounter when they try to run Linux is certain Thai programs won't run on it, i.e. Express accounting, Thai software dictionary. I think if these companies could provide support for Linux then these companies would make the switch. There is also one accounting program that I used to like to use for my business, but I just installed virtualbox and had a very fast windows xp at the click of a button, all from inside my Ubuntu machine.

Not sure if this would work with the software you mention, but a lot of windows software will run on Linux using Wine or Crossover Linux

Worth a try, I use Photoshop a lot, and can run Photoshop 7 (almost)perfectly with Wine in OpenSUSE.

[tmark]

Let's face it. If the Police were really serious about this they wouldn't publicly announce this "crackdown" .. yawn .. or any other crackdown for that matter.

The whole purpose of "announcing" it is to more or less say "Hey! .. look at us ! .. aren't we great ! .. look at us .. look at us .. we are doing a wonderful job .. look at the sun shining out of our collective butt holes! It's all about "Face"

If they had ANY brains in their heads .. they would keep their mouths shut .. do their raids unannounced and not tip all the transgressors off!

Can you imagine an army general acting the same way? ... "Hey .. enemy ! .. tomorrow .. at 7.30 am we're going to attack!"

Morons.

[Tywais]

I've seen local government office computers and local public schools using pirated versions of Windows and the Office suite. Why don't they start cleaning up in their own backyard first?

Actually they are to some degree in Chiang Mai. A local, large, government school was hit and fined 1.5 Million Baht just recently. Now, since it is a government school does the government have to pay the fine?

[tmark]

I've seen local government office computers and local public schools using pirated versions of Windows and the Office suite. Why don't they start cleaning up in their own backyard first?

Actually they are to some degree in Chiang Mai. A local, large, government school was hit and fined 1.5 Million Baht just recently. Now, since it is a government school does the government have to pay the fine?

Of course they do! .. They'll hand it over with their left hand and receive it with their right hand! .. ludicrous! Forget the "fine" That'll just go back into their own pockets .. just force them to set a good example and cough up for the genuine stuff. It'll never happen though. Flying pigs and all that !

[livinthailandos]

1. The government is not going to look into itself to see if it is using pirated software, do you realize how ironic it would be to go and arrest themselves, although I would get a good laugh from it though.

2. Even though some of you go for linux I can honestly say linux is still not ready, why:

a. Seriously you need people who have enough IT background in a lot of areas in linux to come to your office or on site to help you in person when things go wrong.

b. Don't expect things to go smoothly with linux, even though I use some areas on linux using the terminal I still have problems which I have no idea how to solve and please don't tell people to search. Majority of time when you search finding the answering to your problem can take days because the search paraimeter is done extremely poorly. When you do sometimes have a problem if you don't have help or knowledge it can take minutes, hours, days, months to solve a simple problem.

c. Seriously be prepared to fix something in linux a lot of time

d. So far using ubuntu from 8.04, 8.10, 9.04, when i've done at some point an update, that i've downloaded it wound up breaking my network connection / eth0 seriously how messed up can linux be that 3 different versions break my network connection.

e. If your gonna advise people to use linux, you need to be there to show them in person about this OS.

f. Realize linux is made by geeks for geeks. Majority of people are not geeks. They just want a OS that works out of the box period. This includes businesses.

Some of you may wonder why i put this its because if your going to try to give linux to business you at least now understand why. Some of you are seriously not going to be happy with this statement but here goes. For business use and customer use microsoft really is the only alternative. MAC is a luxury item & on top I dislike mac for the simple fact mac is nothing but really parts of BSD and unix. yes mac works really well I admit that but its not seriously ever going to be wide spread in customer use or business. Price is a big factor for a lot of people including businesses. you can say about microsoft what you like but for businesses microsoft does offer licensing for small business as long as you have 5 computers they'll help you out on pricing. Second windows 7 RC i've been using its works really well, like other said before vista was a pain but they did it right with windows 7 although seriously i think windows 7 is about as equal as when tiger os x came out 4 years ago.

1 last thing before i'm bashed as someone who does not like linux watch this video and tell me that his points are not valid http://lunduke.com/?p=429

[12DrinkMore]

when they raid you, and i have seen a few, they simply run a utility on each computer to check your registry and see what is installed and when it was installed.

Can you post a copy???

:D

[andyww]

A few years ago they had regular raids on Panthip Plaza. I arrived there once just after a raid and it was a strange and eerie place with all software stalls closed and covered with sheeting.

In those days, all the raised were instigated by the USA. Usually they were around the time of some international trade summit. The US would pressurize Thailand into doing something and they sent people into the police stations to "liase" with the local police on what to do.

I would guess these latest crackdowns are similarly instigated by US pressure. They seem to be far more serious this time around, targetting businesses rather than vendors in Panthip.

[slipperx]

It strikes me it is the responsibility of the software developers to control the use of their software and to take legal action against people who use their software illegally. Can it be that difficult to check the legality of software installed on a regular basis and disabling it if it is illegal - basically that is what Microsoft is doing with Windows 7. What other business can get the police running around doing their investigation for them? It looks to me like it is just an excuse to persecute foreign owned business in the same fashion the VAT and tax departments do. Having previously been involved with a business where we were hounded by all and sundry it was very eye opening to see all the harassment completely disappear as soon as I was no longer apparently involved. This is just another example of that harrassment coupled with a way for the police to make a bit of cash on the side. It stinks.

As for software - I don;t much like Microsoft but running a pirated OS just isn't worth the hassle in my opinion and you can convert your windows to a licenced updatable version online. As for other software well like I said it should be up to them not the police to monitor and control the use of their software - useful to ask oneself why the police ARE involved unless there is a financial incentive. Next up will be police knocking on your door at home and asking to inspect your computer and maybe check for pirated DVD's and check to see if you have any other un-thai materials such as porno mags or sex toys. Its a fine line

[tmark]

It strikes me it is the responsibility of the software developers to control the use of their software and to take legal action against people who use their software illegally.

"It strikes me it is the responsibility of parents to stop people kidnapping their kids" (no police involvement necessary)

"It strikes me it is the responsibility of banks to apprehend people who rob them"  (no police involvement necessary)

Not really logical is it?

Can it be that difficult to check the legality of software installed on a regular basis and disabling it if it is illegal - basically that is what Microsoft is doing with Windows 7.

"Phone Home" components of programs can be removed .... and .. Win 7 does not do that. I know someone who bought a pirate copy last week ... no problems .. no "Black Stars"

What other business can get the police running around doing their investigation for them?

Banks, Insurance companies, small shops that have been burgled .. the list goes on ... that's the Police's job after all.

It looks to me like it is just an excuse to persecute foreign owned business in the same fashion the VAT and tax departments do.

That's just plain silly .. most of the business's are probably Thai owned.

[Thanh-BKK]

Sorry if this is off post, but I have to rebut all those diehards who continue to put MS O/Ss down. Get real. Look at the % of MS Windows O/Ss installed out there, compared to Mac, Linux etc. I have tried them all. If ya got 1,000,000 XP users and 1,000 Mac users, of course the "hackers" are going to target the "big market" - I mean it stands to reason. Good(or in this case bad) business ethics dictate you go where the customers are. I now use MS Win 7 Ultimate and while I agree "Vista" was a disaster unmodded, this new O/S is everything that Vista could have been - yeah, yeah MS were lazy I have to agree, but they have made up for it in this edition. See the attached .jpg of my own desktop. Pure eye candy! Everthing runs faster and better. Yet to find a mainstream prog that won't run on it. Please wake up you guys and stop the bashing. It is your right to have a "niche product" but it is not your right to put down other peoples preferences.

Hi

Sorry to rain on youir parade, my friend - what you are showing there is a regular wallpaper that can be downloaded from anywhere and the Stardock ObjectDock which can also be downloaded for free (and legal, it is Freeware). Sorry, the icons on it are a giveaway - i am using the same on my office machine (Windows XP).

On my Linux (Ubuntu) machine i have a similar dock, named Advanced Window Navigator or simply AWN. As opposed to ObjectDock i can chose what icon to use for a launcher in that dock (as i can with launchers on the desktop or in the menu! Try that with Windows!) and that opens the door for endless customization. My Windows, for instance, disappear in the background by rolling down in stripes and they close by burning up from the top. When i move a small sized window around it is kind of "gummy" or "wobbly", and even a full size Window i can stretch somewhat to have a peek what is behind it. And those are just a very few of a TON of such effects that come built-in with Ubuntu, no hacking or weird command-line coding to do

And i bet my balls that on any given machine Ubuntu will outperform Windows 7 by miles - if not on the first day so certainly after six months as Windows, all versions, tend to become slower by the day. While my Ubuntu still boots in 34 seconds from power button to end of HDD activity and shuts down in eight seconds flat, regardless how many and what applications i was running before. This Ubuntu-version has been installed since April.

And i am not bashing Windows at all - i am still using it (and, to be honest, am suffering from it's slowness) daily at the office and for the rare times that i need to do something that requires Windows at home i have one XP Home and one Win 95 (yes!) at a couple of clicks - VMware virtual machines, a "computer in the computer".

Oh, and they are both genuine and do not have one single pirated application on them

But for eye-candy there is nothing better than the "niche product" that is Linux.

Kind regards......

Thanh

[andyww]

Sorry if this is off post, but I have to rebut all those diehards who continue to put MS O/Ss down. Get real. Look at the % of MS Windows O/Ss installed out there, compared to Mac, Linux etc. I have tried them all. If ya got 1,000,000 XP users and 1,000 Mac users, of course the "hackers" are going to target the "big market" - I mean it stands to reason. Good(or in this case bad) business ethics dictate you go where the customers are. I now use MS Win 7 Ultimate and while I agree "Vista" was a disaster unmodded, this new O/S is everything that Vista could have been - yeah, yeah MS were lazy I have to agree, but they have made up for it in this edition. See the attached .jpg of my own desktop. Pure eye candy! Everthing runs faster and better. Yet to find a mainstream prog that won't run on it. Please wake up you guys and stop the bashing. It is your right to have a "niche product" but it is not your right to put down other peoples preferences.

Hi

Sorry to rain on youir parade, my friend - what you are showing there is a regular wallpaper that can be downloaded from anywhere and the Stardock ObjectDock which can also be downloaded for free (and legal, it is Freeware). Sorry, the icons on it are a giveaway - i am using the same on my office machine (Windows XP).

On my Linux (Ubuntu) machine i have a similar dock, named Advanced Window Navigator or simply AWN. As opposed to ObjectDock i can chose what icon to use for a launcher in that dock (as i can with launchers on the desktop or in the menu! Try that with Windows!) and that opens the door for endless customization. My Windows, for instance, disappear in the background by rolling down in stripes and they close by burning up from the top. When i move a small sized window around it is kind of "gummy" or "wobbly", and even a full size Window i can stretch somewhat to have a peek what is behind it. And those are just a very few of a TON of such effects that come built-in with Ubuntu, no hacking or weird command-line coding to do

And i bet my balls that on any given machine Ubuntu will outperform Windows 7 by miles - if not on the first day so certainly after six months as Windows, all versions, tend to become slower by the day. While my Ubuntu still boots in 34 seconds from power button to end of HDD activity and shuts down in eight seconds flat, regardless how many and what applications i was running before. This Ubuntu-version has been installed since April.

And i am not bashing Windows at all - i am still using it (and, to be honest, am suffering from it's slowness) daily at the office and for the rare times that i need to do something that requires Windows at home i have one XP Home and one Win 95 (yes!) at a couple of clicks - VMware virtual machines, a "computer in the computer".

Oh, and they are both genuine and do not have one single pirated application on them

But for eye-candy there is nothing better than the "niche product" that is Linux.

Kind regards......

Thanh

Please please lets not turn this thread into yet another Windows vs Linux vs Mac argument. Probably the most done to death subject of every message board in existence. Mods...

[Screws]

Perchance would any of the 'legal' MS software have the code they were found guilty of stealing from Ric Richardson by a - Unanimous Jury Verdict -?? (on MS's home turf!!)

If so then BSA should be picking up the so called 'legal' copies as well and throwing them under a steam roller.

[Eureka]

I'd have to agree. Buy a PC in pantip etc etc, you'll get it pre-installed with windows, office, photoshop etc.

Why have a go at the guys who don't know the details like this - A PC is supposed to come with Windows XP right? They all do?

......

Stop the duplication plants, give amnesty's with a good window - not a quick earner.

./P

You often buy new computers with preloaded software. So if a customer buys a computer, how are they supposed to know that it was illegally installed and not an OEM licensed agreement to preload the software? What do you tell the police if they challenge it and it came preloaded on your computer?

If you buy a television, washing machine or DVD player it comes with documentation so does the LEGAL software including OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) versions. As with all warranties resonable notice must be given as to the terms and conditions. If a consumer fails to RTFM (read the f***ing manual) it is by their own choice.

Although I disagree with the high price of most software I do not take the view that all people are so stupid that they do not realize that a computer selling for 10,000TBT would also include an additional 60,000TBT of software

I bought my daughter a PC at Tesco - that would be Tesco Lotus, the international company. The tag on the display model said "Windows installed". Got it home and a couple of days later the "you are a victim of counterfeit software" pops up. So its not just little shops in Panthip selling the fake stuff. And when I went back I was told by a shocked staff that it was an extra 4500 baht for the genuine windows.

Although it does not state the Licence for Windows is included you have every right to explain to the Manager at Tesco Lotus to please bow down so you can insert their sly choice of words (& computer) where the sun does not shine.

In a country with consumer rights they would be subjected to legal action.

Unfortunately the Licence for the Use Of (you do not actually own any Microshaft software. Read the licence thoroughly.) is a separate issue according to the BIB.

Has anyone price Legal versions of Windows 7 in the US, Thailand & Aust as a direct price comparison, using Microsoft's online pricing.

USofA 3 Licences for Windows7 Home Premium 4,975 TBT

Thailand 1 Licences for Windows7 Home Premium 4,900 TBT

Australia 1 Licence for Windows7 Home Premium 5,875 TBT

Why should Win7 be 33% of the Thai price?

[RigPig]

Sorry if this is off post, but I have to rebut all those diehards who continue to put MS O/Ss down. Get real. Look at the % of MS Windows O/Ss installed out there, compared to Mac, Linux etc. I have tried them all. If ya got 1,000,000 XP users (750,000 PIRATED BECAUSE IT IS TOO EXPENSIVE TO BUY) and 1,000 Mac users, of course the "hackers" are going to target the "big market" - I mean it stands to reason ESPECIALLY IF IT HAS HOLES IN IT BIG ENOUGH TO DRIVE A MAC TRUCK THROUGH. Good(or in this case bad) business ethics dictate you go where the customers are. I now use MS Win 7 Ultimate and while I agree "Vista" was a disaster unmodded CURIOUS AS TO HOW MUCH THIS DISASTER COST YOU INCLUDING THE UPGRADE, this new O/S is everything that Vista could have been - yeah, yeah MS were lazy AGAIN BUT YOU STILL KEEP PAYING FOR THEIR MISTAKES!!! I have to agree, but they have made up for it in this edition. See the attached .jpg of my own desktop. Pure eye candy! I ACTUALLY WANT SOMETHING THAT WORKS NOT LOOKS GOOD... Everthing runs faster and better BUT STILL DEFIES MOORE'S LAW. Yet to find a mainstream (READ EXPENSIVE IF YOU ACTUALLY PAID FOR THE SOFTWARE) prog that won't run on it. Please wake up you guys and stop the bashing. It is your right to have a "niche product" but it is not your right to put down other peoples preferences. Hmmm...YES IT IS!

Well I just bought a new Toshiba laptop which I am using to reply to your post. It did not come with an operating system which surprised me but it is probably due to the crack down I have just installed Ubuntu and guess what...it cost me nothing and it installed flawlessly the only hassle was deciding which free software not to install !!!

It seems laughable that Microsoft's anti piracy policy is driving people to open source software in greater droves. To join the "lets fleece you for all you've got" club...Sony, Microsoft etc and be content with it and pay through the nose willingly when unnecessary seems bazaar to me. The price companies like Sony and Microsoft could sell these products for and still make a decent profit considering how much they pay to prevent piracy and how much they supposedly loose because of it would be far less than it costs to pirate the goods! People only pirate things because they are too expensive in the first place. Have a look at blu ray and Hd Dvd's, companies have to build in hardware devices to prevent you pirating them in order for you to be able to use them so they can sell their product in the hope you want the new technology. Look at the exorbitant prices demanded for what, extra storage space to improve the quality for which the technology has been there for years. They spend the R&D in making sure you have to pay their high prices not in providing the quality of movie you are entitled to, for buying the hardware to produce it. Even printer cartridges are "chipped" so you can not buy them in a different country or refill them because the $100 printer you just bought won't make them masses of money long term, but it still only cost them $10 to make it, why should you reap the benefits of technology, "slave labour" and mass production. Good business or daylight robbery? But go your hardest it's your choice.......

Open source businesses seem to be surviving and are making money so why not support them?(it costs nothing) The more people that kick the habit the better off we will all be! Just read how many posts are advocating it, we can't all be just rebels or wrong. Step outside your box increase your security and be prepared to try something different (but not that much). Don't be afraid to give something that costs nothing a go. But hey if you have paid $100 for your operating system, $400 for your office suite, $500 for your photo editor etc, as I am sure you have, I can understand your reluctance to try something free. Keep on paying for the upgrades I'll just get mine delivered in the background for nothing. Shame you can't do much more with your system (legally anyhow).

Who is knocking what ???

Seriously how much would it cost to do basic things on a PC if you paid for all of the software? Far more than the computer !!!

And no I am not a lefty I just think it is time we all got a fair shake!

[mysterybkk]

1. The government is not going to look into itself to see if it is using pirated software, do you realize how ironic it would be to go and arrest themselves, although I would get a good laugh from it though.

2. Even though some of you go for linux I can honestly say linux is still not ready, why:

a. Seriously you need people who have enough IT background in a lot of areas in linux to come to your office or on site to help you in person when things go wrong.

b. Don't expect things to go smoothly with linux, even though I use some areas on linux using the terminal I still have problems which I have no idea how to solve and please don't tell people to search. Majority of time when you search finding the answering to your problem can take days because the search paraimeter is done extremely poorly. When you do sometimes have a problem if you don't have help or knowledge it can take minutes, hours, days, months to solve a simple problem.

c. Seriously be prepared to fix something in linux a lot of time

d. So far using ubuntu from 8.04, 8.10, 9.04, when i've done at some point an update, that i've downloaded it wound up breaking my network connection / eth0 seriously how messed up can linux be that 3 different versions break my network connection.

e. If your gonna advise people to use linux, you need to be there to show them in person about this OS.

f. Realize linux is made by geeks for geeks. Majority of people are not geeks. They just want a OS that works out of the box period. This includes businesses.

Some of you may wonder why i put this its because if your going to try to give linux to business you at least now understand why. Some of you are seriously not going to be happy with this statement but here goes. For business use and customer use microsoft really is the only alternative. MAC is a luxury item & on top I dislike mac for the simple fact mac is nothing but really parts of BSD and unix. yes mac works really well I admit that but its not seriously ever going to be wide spread in customer use or business. Price is a big factor for a lot of people including businesses. you can say about microsoft what you like but for businesses microsoft does offer licensing for small business as long as you have 5 computers they'll help you out on pricing. Second windows 7 RC i've been using its works really well, like other said before vista was a pain but they did it right with windows 7 although seriously i think windows 7 is about as equal as when tiger os x came out 4 years ago.

1 last thing before i'm bashed as someone who does not like linux watch this video and tell me that his points are not valid http://lunduke.com/?p=429

i think the people that are advocating open source are the ones that dont understand how to use windows properly. you have to admit, it is fairly simple to use, and it is enough for certain purposes. but for other applications it cant be compared. i use photoshop on a daily basis. i have tried GIMP before, and it cant be compared. i need to do actual work with photoshop, not just cropping an image, things that GIMP cant do.

i agree with you that linux is not very good, but you have to add "for professional purposes'. but i'm sure if you are at the level where you can use Adobe and Autodesk etc. you can afford to run the original version to avoid a hassle.

[hansbak]

open source ERP, but not free I suppose or how else does your company survives ? by asking hugues amount for support ?

Please check the site: htp://ofbiz.apache.org

If you know ERP, know general business practices and know how to use the system you do not need us.

However we are here to help you and yes we charge a fee for that.

Because we are operating from Thailand, our fees compared to the western world are very competitive however with the western quality.

regards,

Hans Bakker

[jjmax]

I don't want to get into a linux vs the world debate, as I don't consider myself qualified, or fanatical, enough to be a linux advocate.

But I will say I'm not a geek, but I have worked in IT support and engineering for over 10 years. Working mainly with the Windows platform.

My only advice to anyone considering, or curious about, Linux is to go to ubuntu.com or en.opensuse.org, download the Live CD and give it a go.

You can run Linux from CD without messing with your PC setup. Then you can make an educated desicion on your own as to whether or not Linux is for you.

Edited November 7, 2009 by jjmax

[newtronbom]

Sorry if this is off post, but I have to rebut all those diehards who continue to put MS O/Ss down. Get real. Look at the % of MS Windows O/Ss installed out there, compared to Mac, Linux etc. I have tried them all. If ya got 1,000,000 XP users (750,000 PIRATED BECAUSE IT IS TOO EXPENSIVE TO BUY) and 1,000 Mac users, of course the "hackers" are going to target the "big market" - I mean it stands to reason ESPECIALLY IF IT HAS HOLES IN IT BIG ENOUGH TO DRIVE A MAC TRUCK THROUGH. Good(or in this case bad) business ethics dictate you go where the customers are. I now use MS Win 7 Ultimate and while I agree "Vista" was a disaster unmodded CURIOUS AS TO HOW MUCH THIS DISASTER COST YOU INCLUDING THE UPGRADE, this new O/S is everything that Vista could have been - yeah, yeah MS were lazy AGAIN BUT YOU STILL KEEP PAYING FOR THEIR MISTAKES!!! I have to agree, but they have made up for it in this edition. See the attached .jpg of my own desktop. Pure eye candy! I ACTUALLY WANT SOMETHING THAT WORKS NOT LOOKS GOOD... Everthing runs faster and better BUT STILL DEFIES MOORE'S LAW. Yet to find a mainstream (READ EXPENSIVE IF YOU ACTUALLY PAID FOR THE SOFTWARE) prog that won't run on it. Please wake up you guys and stop the bashing. It is your right to have a "niche product" but it is not your right to put down other peoples preferences. Hmmm...YES IT IS!

Well I just bought a new Toshiba laptop which I am using to reply to your post. It did not come with an operating system which surprised me but it is probably due to the crack down I have just installed Ubuntu and guess what...it cost me nothing and it installed flawlessly the only hassle was deciding which free software not to install !!!

It seems laughable that Microsoft's anti piracy policy is driving people to open source software in greater droves. To join the "lets fleece you for all you've got" club...Sony, Microsoft etc and be content with it and pay through the nose willingly when unnecessary seems bazaar to me. The price companies like Sony and Microsoft could sell these products for and still make a decent profit considering how much they pay to prevent piracy and how much they supposedly loose because of it would be far less than it costs to pirate the goods! People only pirate things because they are too expensive in the first place. Have a look at blu ray and Hd Dvd's, companies have to build in hardware devices to prevent you pirating them in order for you to be able to use them so they can sell their product in the hope you want the new technology. Look at the exorbitant prices demanded for what, extra storage space to improve the quality for which the technology has been there for years. They spend the R&D in making sure you have to pay their high prices not in providing the quality of movie you are entitled to, for buying the hardware to produce it. Even printer cartridges are "chipped" so you can not buy them in a different country or refill them because the $100 printer you just bought won't make them masses of money long term, but it still only cost them $10 to make it, why should you reap the benefits of technology, "slave labour" and mass production. Good business or daylight robbery? But go your hardest it's your choice.......

Open source businesses seem to be surviving and are making money so why not support them?(it costs nothing) The more people that kick the habit the better off we will all be! Just read how many posts are advocating it, we can't all be just rebels or wrong. Step outside your box increase your security and be prepared to try something different (but not that much). Don't be afraid to give something that costs nothing a go. But hey if you have paid $100 for your operating system, $400 for your office suite, $500 for your photo editor etc, as I am sure you have, I can understand your reluctance to try something free. Keep on paying for the upgrades I'll just get mine delivered in the background for nothing. Shame you can't do much more with your system (legally anyhow).

Who is knocking what ???

Seriously how much would it cost to do basic things on a PC if you paid for all of the software? Far more than the computer !!!

And no I am not a lefty I just think it is time we all got a fair shake!

Good reply and fair comment. It's just that I'm lazy for a start and the software I am running to do game levels and graphics/3D animation, is designed for windows. I have 1000 GBs internal SATA2s 2x (over 700 GB used - not slowed down yet!) and and 300+ GB external SATA2 for the auto backup. The other poster said try to change the icons on "object dock" in win 7 don't know <deleted> - I have over a hundred icons to play with and as I am still reinstalling s-ware after my win 7 install, when I get the time I will be designing my own icons. I have used ubuntu and did like it - same for mac- but for a lazy old fart like me, win is brainless and if you have the right progs setup the right way it takes care of it self - all in how you set it up. I fully agree with you that none of us can afford the cost of 100% legit s-ware - just under US$5000.00 for 3D Max's latest edition, it's no wonder people buy the hacked stuff. My main 3D modeling and rendering s-ware (the same guys who started Rhino 3D)was programed and put together in Brazil and sells at a fraction of the likes of 3D max. Unlike max and especially Maya, it is nearly drag and drop and has lots of special FX addins for free too. As to the punter who was harping on about mac truck holes for viruses to get in, if he ever comes down from wherever he is and reads my post instead of pulling it apart, he will see that 24/7 for many years I have had very few probs - he probably has the FREE VERSION antivirous - get what ya pay for. Pirating of video/movies does have to come down. If we all get so anally retentive that nobody buys the legit stuff, the film industry will crash - as it nearly has in LOS cause of pirating. Thats why my sons group "7DDT" are only doing down-loadable MTVs and ring tones - over 200,000 bht a day for a good studio session and thats only audio! The prices of legal DVDs has got to come down, as does a lot of the software. But companies etc. no excuse as unlike most of you, they make money from it. Still as most posters say, this will blow over here and they are not targeting the main abusers anyway. PS: MSs free antivirous program works better than most too - and on Win 7 if you CAN'T afford the good stuff. Just google it - beware! You will need a legit O/S or it won't install!

[newtronbom]

I don't want to get into a linux vs the world debate, as I don't consider myself qualified, or fanatical, enough to be a linux advocate.

But I will say I'm not a geek, but I have worked in IT support and engineering for over 10 years. Working mainly with the Windows platform.

My only advice to anyone considering, or curious about, Linux is to go to ubuntu.com or en.opensuse.org, download the Live CD and give it a go.

You can run Linux from CD without messing with your PC setup. Then you can make an educated desicion on your own as to whether or not Linux is for you.

Good comment. Especially with Sunmicros virtual box (free an all).