A Question To Those Who Work Here Or Run A Business Here

[livinthailandos]

My question to those who work here or run a business:

a. Being that it seems to me thailand every year has some political event / something disruptive that causes concern about stability issues, would it be fair to say to always be prepared and not think to far ahead?

b. Do you feel thailand is still a good place to work or do business here?

c. Regarding your business or place you work did you manage to get through last year ok or did your business or place you work lose money?

d. How do you feel about this year prospects, same as last year, good, better, worse?

e. What challenges have you been facing so far

I ask these questions as I work here and run a business and am just curious to hear about your personal experiences so far.

[Ulysses G.]

Anything successful is copied by both Thais and other foreigners to the point that noone can do more than survive at best.

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist. It makes it difficult for more successful businesses to ever get improve their sales as in a normal country.

[TheJoker12]

I think you can be successful but you have to be more creative. Every person wants to open a bar or restaurant because they know how to eat. They don't know anything about building furniture or rug making, so they stick to what they know and get in line with the other thousand farang thinking the same way they do.

Thais are poor so to make money in business here I think its best to focus on the export market. You want to take advantage of cheap Thai labor.

I never leave my house during rush hour. I really think I would hate to work in Thailand.

[manarak]

Or you could try something that:

- sells to the poor: lotteries, tobacco, alcohol, etc.

- sells to the poor & easy believing: unneeded mobile telephony services, surcharged numbers, horoscopes, amulets, magical crystals

- sells/buys to the unsuccessful: rent or sell bar/restaurant furniture, massage parlor equipment, etc.

In my experience, Thais are not good at marketing their products or services (except the bargirls), so with good service and prices it should be possible to get a hold if your business idea is a little better than a bar or restaurant and actually has a market.

But the best way to make money is if you can make webpages - then you can work on western markets and spend the money on thai prices.

After a year, that's easily 2000 USD a month.

Not even a work permit is required, you just play a lot on the computer...

Edited January 5, 2010 by manarak

[angiud]

I agree with Ulysses. When you run a good business many copycat will come soon. Both thai and farangs.

About the forecast for 2010, I can see a substantial improvement in the last 2 months. If nothing bad happen in Thailand this year and the world economy follow to grow, this year will be good (more exactly, better than 2009)

[Tatsujin]

I think manarak will have a visit soon for making so much money so easily whilst working without a work permit <grins> . . . I must try making webpages if it's so easy!

[DegenFarang]

I don't work or do business here but think I have a pretty solid grasp on the environment - all I can say is that if I were to go into business in Thailand I would avoid the tourism industry or anything servicing Farang like the plague. It is becoming more and more clear that the Thai's are not too concerned about tourism and expats are not wanted.

That said, the country and especially the region and Asia in general, have a bright future, much better than America or Europe - and the economy and market focused on serving the Thai's will only get stronger and stronger. The problem with cashing in on this is you have to have a keen understanding of what Thai's want and more important, what they will want in the future.

I don't know of many examples of Foreigners mastering marketing to Thai's or providing services to Thai's - but that is where you want to be.

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

Edited January 6, 2010 by DegenFarang

[Dakhar]

Without knowing much,

It seems to me the trick is to harness cheap labor, in a fashion that takes a high degree of experience, equipment etc in order to raise the protection bar from being coppied.

To sound niave, I like to whatch the episodes of "How things are made" and get some ideas from that. I saw one with a focus on wooden golf clubs. It seemed to me there was enough labor needed to make building wooden golf clubs in Thailand a fair option. Not only that, there are plenty of rard woods to be found in this region of the world. (along with some very exotic woods too)

Their is a co. in CM that ties "Flies" for flie fishing etc, and I heard that Fenwick (a fishing pole co.) has their poles made in Thailand.

As others have noted, the trick is to harness the labor in areas that take some expertise, ie furniture etc.

I am actually working on a project now that is much like as I discribed: high degree of knowledge needed, high amount of tedious labor time, special equipment, fairly high start up costs... 30K+ USD) and due to this a high degree of protection from being coppied.

[sgunn65]

If you can find a gap in the market there are usually one of two reasons for this. One is that no-one has thought of it the other is that it is not needed. So find the former and avoid the latter.

Last year I saw 70% growth in a business that is directed solely to farangs. I expect this year to be similar.

The biggest challenge in any business is staff. Finding good staff and keeping them. There is little loyalty here. I employ 24 people 75% of whom are THai. If you can retain staff then you can succeed.

The biggest problem I see with farang who come here is that they want to be on holiday in THailand. Living here is completely different to coming here on holiday. Work hard (harder than you would work at home) and you can make a success of most things.

You can do well here, I am proof of that but it is not easy. However the benefits of living in Thailand outweigh the difficulties. Check the weather in the UK today!!!!

[sallymae]

I think manarak will have a visit soon for making so much money so easily whilst working without a work permit <grins> . . . I must try making webpages if it's so easy!

me tooooooooooooooo .

people give such bad business advise here its down right ludicrious.

concentrate on the export market, what kind of advise is that

[Ulysses G.]

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

Lots of wealthy Thais keep failing businesses going for years so their family have something to do. Some farangs on pensions seem to follow the same logic.

They tend to copy other businesses run by farangs.

[sallymae]

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

Lots of wealthy Thais keep failing businesses going for years so their family have something to do. Some farangs on pensions seem to follow the same logic.

They tend to copy other businesses run by farangs.

this may explain why i see so many business with no customers.

eyeglass shops as one example, i always think they fronts for something shady..........

open air beer bars in patpong...........must be farang owned.............. . farangs have mastered the art of running business with no income..............just how do they do it.................

[emsfeld]

I don't work or do business here but think I have a pretty solid grasp on the environment - all I can say is that if I were to go into business in Thailand I would avoid the tourism industry or anything servicing Farang like the plague. It is becoming more and more clear that the Thai's are not too concerned about tourism and expats are not wanted.

That said, the country and especially the region and Asia in general, have a bright future, much better than America or Europe - and the economy and market focused on serving the Thai's will only get stronger and stronger. The problem with cashing in on this is you have to have a keen understanding of what Thai's want and more important, what they will want in the future.

I don't know of many examples of Foreigners mastering marketing to Thai's or providing services to Thai's - but that is where you want to be.

Can't agree more with your statement. I have pretty much the very same opinion about Asia in general and your comment on where to position your business.

The last thing you want to do is operate a business whose main income source derives from tourism directly or indirectly. I had this opinion long before tourist arrival stats hit rock bottom. A small number of farangs may do well in this industry, but generally I would advise against it. There are simply too many risk factors over which you have no control over - apart from these services often being easily duplicatable.

[NADTATIDA1]

I don't work or do business here but think I have a pretty solid grasp on the environment - all I can say is that if I were to go into business in Thailand I would avoid the tourism industry or anything servicing Farang like the plague. It is becoming more and more clear that the Thai's are not too concerned about tourism and expats are not wanted.

That said, the country and especially the region and Asia in general, have a bright future, much better than America or Europe - and the economy and market focused on serving the Thai's will only get stronger and stronger. The problem with cashing in on this is you have to have a keen understanding of what Thai's want and more important, what they will want in the future.

I don't know of many examples of Foreigners mastering marketing to Thai's or providing services to Thai's - but that is where you want to be.

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

good post and very true....in 10 years time the thais will not need western tourists(as much!)and especially expats...unfortunately china has taken over the marketing stratagies in Thailand and hence this is why they control marketing forces all over the country.And due to the high ratio of Thai/Chinese/japanese businesses this is where the future for the east and industries in general is.....low costs,high turnover!

westerners beware!!

[h90]

I think you can be successful but you have to be more creative. Every person wants to open a bar or restaurant because they know how to eat. They don't know anything about building furniture or rug making, so they stick to what they know and get in line with the other thousand farang thinking the same way they do.

Thais are poor so to make money in business here I think its best to focus on the export market. You want to take advantage of cheap Thai labor.

I never leave my house during rush hour. I really think I would hate to work in Thailand.

beer bar

english teacher

that are the things which are already done by 1 zillion farangs. New ideas are needed.

[sallymae]

I don't work or do business here but think I have a pretty solid grasp on the environment - all I can say is that if I were to go into business in Thailand I would avoid the tourism industry or anything servicing Farang like the plague. It is becoming more and more clear that the Thai's are not too concerned about tourism and expats are not wanted.

That said, the country and especially the region and Asia in general, have a bright future, much better than America or Europe - and the economy and market focused on serving the Thai's will only get stronger and stronger. The problem with cashing in on this is you have to have a keen understanding of what Thai's want and more important, what they will want in the future.

I don't know of many examples of Foreigners mastering marketing to Thai's or providing services to Thai's - but that is where you want to be.

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

good post and very true....in 10 years time the thais will not need western tourists(as much!)and especially expats...unfortunately china has taken over the marketing stratagies in Thailand and hence this is why they control marketing forces all over the country.And due to the high ratio of Thai/Chinese/japanese businesses this is where the future for the east and industries in general is.....low costs,high turnover!

westerners beware!!

can you point out the chinese marketing strategies being employed in thailand! do the thais know they are being controlled by chinese marketers?

[sallymae]

I think you can be successful but you have to be more creative. Every person wants to open a bar or restaurant because they know how to eat. They don't know anything about building furniture or rug making, so they stick to what they know and get in line with the other thousand farang thinking the same way they do.

Thais are poor so to make money in business here I think its best to focus on the export market. You want to take advantage of cheap Thai labor.

I never leave my house during rush hour. I really think I would hate to work in Thailand.

beer bar

english teacher

that are the things which are already done by 1 zillion farangs. New ideas are needed.

i thought guys open restaurants becoz thats what their gfs tell em to open, not becoz they know how to eat

. i cant believe there are a 100o farang wanting to open restaurants due to their knowledge of eating

[benw10]

I don't work or do business here but think I have a pretty solid grasp on the environment - all I can say is that if I were to go into business in Thailand I would avoid the tourism industry or anything servicing Farang like the plague. It is becoming more and more clear that the Thai's are not too concerned about tourism and expats are not wanted.

That said, the country and especially the region and Asia in general, have a bright future, much better than America or Europe - and the economy and market focused on serving the Thai's will only get stronger and stronger. The problem with cashing in on this is you have to have a keen understanding of what Thai's want and more important, what they will want in the future.

I don't know of many examples of Foreigners mastering marketing to Thai's or providing services to Thai's - but that is where you want to be.

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

good post and very true....in 10 years time the thais will not need western tourists(as much!)and especially expats...unfortunately china has taken over the marketing stratagies in Thailand and hence this is why they control marketing forces all over the country.And due to the high ratio of Thai/Chinese/japanese businesses this is where the future for the east and industries in general is.....low costs,high turnover!

westerners beware!!

can you point out the chinese marketing strategies being employed in thailand! do the thais know they are being controlled by chinese marketers?

many of the large brands, drinks ,restaurants etc, are thai/chinese family owned, and though we think of these power houses as being more thai than chinese some of these families maintain very strong, influential and financially rewarding relationships with family and business associates in china.

[sallymae]

dont be so cryptic guys. name names. i d rather patronize thai , not the chinese.

china already got its claws in the us buying up all its debt.

[cseika]

Well I am a Japanese American and I opened a English Language School in Thailand. We are located in Chonburi. We are on our third year of business. Our main customers are primarily Thais. Here are my answers to your questions as follows.

1.) The economic and political events generally did not effect our business much the previous year. Other than the whole swine flu issue. During that time the ministry of education forced us to close for 10 days and due to the medias, our income were severely effected.

2.) The short answer is "no" If you have the budget to start business both here and in a more expensive 1st world country and the sole purpose of your business is to make you rich then absolutely NO. However, if you wish to stay in Thailand for other personal reasons, then perhaps starting your business here would be a wiser idea than to work for a Thai employer. As the starting cost is very low comparing to a more developed country. However, as I've mentioned the income you generate will not be as significant as in for example, Japan, Korea, Taiwan obviously due to economic reasons.

3.) Our business survived "OK". I really didn't make profit out of it last year. However, that was due to the additional expense of expanding and hiring more employees.

4.) Honestly, I'm not sure about this one. This is only our 3rd year, and from what I can see, the business patterns are a little hard to predict. However, if I don't make profit this year, the plan is to shut down.

5.) Our business hire foreign teachers as well as Thai workers. Perhaps one of our main issue is the work quality and ethics of our people. In plain words, employees are lazy. Especially the foreign teachers. From my experience most teachers are in Thailand teaching, just to stay in Thailand, and not necessarily that they give a dam_n about teaching English to Thais. The same goes for the Thai secretaries who spends 4-5 hours on the internet and phone everyday. As in anywhere else in the world, getting your people to work as a "TEAM" to push one common goal is probably the most difficult.

I hope this answers your questions. Just out of curiosity, what kind of business do you run?

[manarak]

I think manarak will have a visit soon for making so much money so easily whilst working without a work permit <grins> . . . I must try making webpages if it's so easy!

me tooooooooooooooo .

people give such bad business advise here its down right ludicrious.

concentrate on the export market, what kind of advise is that

ah, but you have to have ze skillz!

if you got ze skillz, then you need ze ideaz - the zillionst blog won't help making $$$.

for the moment, I have not moved to the LOS. I'll move when I'll be doing 5000 EUR a month on the net. And that's soon.

[sanook2me]

5.). Especially the foreign teachers. From my experience most teachers are in Thailand teaching, just to stay in Thailand, and not necessarily that they give a dam_n about teaching English to Thais. The same goes for the Thai secretaries who spends 4-5 hours on the internet and phone everyday.

Maybe you should have got one of your not giving a dam_n employees to edit your post

I opened a English Language School in Thailand

Well done for posting, I am assuming English is your second language...or at least i hope so..

[cseika]

5.). Especially the foreign teachers. From my experience most teachers are in Thailand teaching, just to stay in Thailand, and not necessarily that they give a dam_n about teaching English to Thais. The same goes for the Thai secretaries who spends 4-5 hours on the internet and phone everyday.

Maybe you should have got one of your not giving a dam_n employees to edit your post

I opened a English Language School in Thailand

Well done for posting, I am assuming English is your second language...or at least i hope so..

Ok, so there are typos in my post, and your point is? Not that it matters but it IS my 1st language. I was trying to help someone out here and what was your purpose in your post? I don't understand Mr. English is your 1st language?

[JulesMad]

My question to those who work here or run a business:

a. Being that it seems to me thailand every year has some political event / something disruptive that causes concern about stability issues, would it be fair to say to always be prepared and not think to far ahead?

b. Do you feel thailand is still a good place to work or do business here?

c. Regarding your business or place you work did you manage to get through last year ok or did your business or place you work lose money?

d. How do you feel about this year prospects, same as last year, good, better, worse?

e. What challenges have you been facing so far

I ask these questions as I work here and run a business and am just curious to hear about your personal experiences so far.

A. It is almost impossible to plan, due to the ever-changing rules and laws (for farang!)

B. NO

C. Loose a lot of Money, due to world recession and stupid (Thai) behaviour

D. Last year was already bad enough; let's hope it will be better....

[berniefromny]

Well I am a Japanese American and I opened a English Language School in Thailand. We are located in Chonburi. We are on our third year of business. Our main customers are primarily Thais. Here are my answers to your questions as follows.

1.) The economic and political events generally did not effect our business much the previous year. Other than the whole swine flu issue. During that time the ministry of education forced us to close for 10 days and due to the medias, our income were severely effected.

2.) The short answer is "no" If you have the budget to start business both here and in a more expensive 1st world country and the sole purpose of your business is to make you rich then absolutely NO. However, if you wish to stay in Thailand for other personal reasons, then perhaps starting your business here would be a wiser idea than to work for a Thai employer. As the starting cost is very low comparing to a more developed country. However, as I've mentioned the income you generate will not be as significant as in for example, Japan, Korea, Taiwan obviously due to economic reasons.

3.) Our business survived "OK". I really didn't make profit out of it last year. However, that was due to the additional expense of expanding and hiring more employees.

4.) Honestly, I'm not sure about this one. This is only our 3rd year, and from what I can see, the business patterns are a little hard to predict. However, if I don't make profit this year, the plan is to shut down.

5.) Our business hire foreign teachers as well as Thai workers. Perhaps one of our main issue is the work quality and ethics of our people. In plain words, employees are lazy. Especially the foreign teachers. From my experience most teachers are in Thailand teaching, just to stay in Thailand, and not necessarily that they give a dam_n about teaching English to Thais. The same goes for the Thai secretaries who spends 4-5 hours on the internet and phone everyday. As in anywhere else in the world, getting your people to work as a "TEAM" to push one common goal is probably the most difficult.

I hope this answers your questions. Just out of curiosity, what kind of business do you run?

WITH ALL DUE RESPECT SIR. FROM WHAT YOU DESCRIBED I THINK YOUD DO YOURSELF A FAVOR BY CLOSING NOW.

[Deke]

My 28 years of working here tells me this:

1. You need some kind of unique professional experience that is not easily duplicated.

2. You need to think long term and not give up in the first few (or several) years when things are tough.

The above imply that you can fill some kind of niche and have a reasonable amount of capital to start.

Overall, I'm glad I set up my small engineering practice here. There have been many ups and downs over the years due to political and economic uncertainty as well, in some cases, due to my own mistakes. On the other hand, there have been many successes and opportunities that I was able to take advantage of.

Money-wise, I can't say that deciding to hang out my shingle in Thailand as opposed to my home country was necessarily the best decision. What I can say is that although I don't consider myself rich by western standards, I live very comfortably and have few regrets.

One other thing that is true of small business owners anywhere. If you want to be successful, you need to be willing to put in the 80 - 90 hour weeks that often required.

Just my $.02

[simon43]

Agree with Deke on this one. I've worked for 7 years in Thailand using 2 skills that I have:

1 - A niche-market, specialist software skill that is in demand, both in Thailand and overseas. This is my main source of income

2 - Recognition that the customer is always right, even when they are wrong! This helped me immensly to be successful with my hotel business in Phuket. Whilst tourist numbers may be in decline, most tourist businesses do not need 100s of sales per day to be profitable. If you provide a good customer service and your reputation gets around, then the downturn in tourist numbers will not affect you.

I've also made an effort to integrate into the community, by learning Thai, by learning about Thai culture, by doing volunteer work. This does not make me a Thai apologist. There are many things I do not agree with about Thailand, and I'm able to defend my position on that because of my knowledge about the country and country etc.

Simon

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I don't work or do business here but think I have a pretty solid grasp on the environment - all I can say is that if I were to go into business in Thailand I would avoid the tourism industry or anything servicing Farang like the plague. It is becoming more and more clear that the Thai's are not too concerned about tourism and expats are not wanted.

That said, the country and especially the region and Asia in general, have a bright future, much better than America or Europe - and the economy and market focused on serving the Thai's will only get stronger and stronger. The problem with cashing in on this is you have to have a keen understanding of what Thai's want and more important, what they will want in the future.

I don't know of many examples of Foreigners mastering marketing to Thai's or providing services to Thai's - but that is where you want to be.

Many of the business copiers have big pensions and will continue to stay open even if they are losing money hand over fist

Is there a Blizzard in the air ?

Are you referring to Thai's or Farang with large pensions? Or both...? What types of businesses do these people run, bars?

good post and very true....in 10 years time the thais will not need western tourists(as much!)and especially expats...unfortunately china has taken over the marketing stratagies in Thailand and hence this is why they control marketing forces all over the country.And due to the high ratio of Thai/Chinese/japanese businesses this is where the future for the east and industries in general is.....low costs,high turnover!

westerners beware!!

can you point out the chinese marketing strategies being employed in thailand! do the thais know they are being controlled by chinese marketers?

[LaoPo]

Well I am a Japanese American and I opened a English Language School in Thailand. We are located in Chonburi. We are on our third year of business. Our main customers are primarily Thais. Here are my answers to your questions as follows.

1.) The economic and political events generally did not effect our business much the previous year. Other than the whole swine flu issue. During that time the ministry of education forced us to close for 10 days and due to the medias, our income were severely effected.

2.) The short answer is "no" If you have the budget to start business both here and in a more expensive 1st world country and the sole purpose of your business is to make you rich then absolutely NO. However, if you wish to stay in Thailand for other personal reasons, then perhaps starting your business here would be a wiser idea than to work for a Thai employer. As the starting cost is very low comparing to a more developed country. However, as I've mentioned the income you generate will not be as significant as in for example, Japan, Korea, Taiwan obviously due to economic reasons.

3.) Our business survived "OK". I really didn't make profit out of it last year. However, that was due to the additional expense of expanding and hiring more employees.

4.) Honestly, I'm not sure about this one. This is only our 3rd year, and from what I can see, the business patterns are a little hard to predict. However, if I don't make profit this year, the plan is to shut down.

5.) Our business hire foreign teachers as well as Thai workers. Perhaps one of our main issue is the work quality and ethics of our people. In plain words, employees are lazy. Especially the foreign teachers. From my experience most teachers are in Thailand teaching, just to stay in Thailand, and not necessarily that they give a dam_n about teaching English to Thais. The same goes for the Thai secretaries who spends 4-5 hours on the internet and phone everyday. As in anywhere else in the world, getting your people to work as a "TEAM" to push one common goal is probably the most difficult.

I hope this answers your questions. Just out of curiosity, what kind of business do you run?

Re #4:

If you have the chance to open up (again) in any major city China you will find that your chances will be a lot higher than in Thailand. Most young Chinese, including those in their twenties and thirties are EAGER to learn English! They will work and study hard to improve their skills and the local authorities might even want to help you setting up the business or in cooperation with a Chinese business partner.

If you don't try, you.....

LaoPo

[LaoPo]

Agree with Deke on this one. I've worked for 7 years in Thailand using 2 skills that I have:

1 - A niche-market, specialist software skill that is in demand, both in Thailand and overseas. This is my main source of income

2 - Recognition that the customer is always right, even when they are wrong! This helped me immensly to be successful with my hotel business in Phuket. Whilst tourist numbers may be in decline, most tourist businesses do not need 100s of sales per day to be profitable. If you provide a good customer service and your reputation gets around, then the downturn in tourist numbers will not affect you.

I've also made an effort to integrate into the community, by learning Thai, by learning about Thai culture, by doing volunteer work. This does not make me a Thai apologist. There are many things I do not agree with about Thailand, and I'm able to defend my position on that because of my knowledge about the country and country etc.

Simon

:D

Ah.....what a relieve to see someone who understands the concept, but above all the importance of SERVICE & COMMUNICATION; skills most businesses lack in a gigantic way, including people building and running a website and selling something, whatever. A lot of people can build (have built) a website and buy and sell some products but many do not understand how to communicate with their clients...clients who make it possible they eat, survive.

Most think that sales is done, once a client buys from them. How wrong.

The feedback my wife is getting in her e-business is so overwhelmingly warm and positive that most are pleasantly surprised by the PERSONAL touch and letters they receive, even in cases that it's not really necessary; a little note, a little attention, a little extra...the clients are not used to receive such attention.

They are not used to that and appreciate that so much, it's hard to explain. BUT THEY LIKE IT VERY MUCH!

Keep it up Simon43!

LaoPo