Woman Injured After Falling Onto Bangkok Skytrain Tracks

[MrHammer]

I've lived in quite a few places and overall I'd rank the level of politeness and overall adherence to rules on the BTS to be quite high. And certainly the crime factor is non-existant.

In China by comparison during peak times it's an absolute free-for-all with shoving, elbowing, and cutting in front of people being par for the course. Yes, the person who just elbowed you in the gonads and burped into your navel is that elderly grandmother holding the shopping bags- and she's about to shove you out of the way as she makes a break for the train. After having lived in China for a while and visiting Thailand again I was absolutely amazed when a Thai person held an elevator door open and waited for me. In China the MO is to hit the door close button as fast as humanly possible and then make a dour face at you if you manage to insert an appendage between the closing doors to force them open again.

Then there's Japan. At peak times on the Tokyo Saikyo-sen people are literally shoved in to the trains by assistants wearing white gloves. What amazed me is that people volunteer themselves for this- you'll see a full train and someone will run up, inserting a single hand and foot into the train. Then an assistant will come and push and push as the doors try to close until the person winds up inside wedged tightly against the glass looking something like a bug splat on a car windshield. Inside the train it's so tight that if you arms are down they stay down, if they're up they stay up. When the train moves the weight shifts so everyone hops to the back two steps, then forward one step, and sways back again while pretending not to look at the person whose ear is 1cm way from your nose. And then there are the elderly businessmen gropers, or chikan, which necessitated female-only train carriages.

So all in all I'd say the BTS ain't too bad.

That's a hilarious description of the Tokyo subway. The truth is, as much as it's an inconvenience it's small things like this that make living in a foreign country so fascinating.

[Thai at Heart]

Undoubtedly the award for "Rushing into elevators before letting people out" goes to the mainland Chinese.

Of other idiotic things that you can see there, the practice of "calling" the elevator from below you by pushing the up button and vice versa if the elevator is above you, as opposed to pressing the button for which direction you would like to go.

Edited January 21, 2010 by Thai at Heart

[bkkjames]

I noticed today that the security guards on the platform level have been reinvigorated in their efforts to keep everyone away from the yellow line. There was also some announcement in Thai (didn’t catch it all) about not falling on the tracks)

[atyclb]

I learn more of life in thailand by reading TV than traveling around, visiting refugee camps, leper colonies, and my family in Burirum. TV contributors can be erudite and witty, but often are bitter old men who appear to hate themselves. I mean, why sit at the keyboard and criticise Thailand, her people, her culture? Don't like it? Just go someplace else. I think that Thailand is one of the most civilized countries on earth. Every country has their own ignoramises. I was just surprised that noone criticized George Bush for the BTS incident.

Rest assured the buriram mass transit system accidents are few and far betwee.

[atyclb]

The majority of people are polite but all it takes are a few to make life miserable. The ones that block exiting passengers are either #ignorant, unpolite, uncaring(sabai sabai zombie land), can be low education, or the self entitled subset, any socioeconomic level. They do not care about the announcement and arrows that make it clear to stand on the sides til passengers exit.

They bother polite Thai's also but the culture is non-confrontational.

Driving habits in developing countries IMO are similar and thailand has not the monopoly on poor driving.

Many expats appear to live in a separate western subculture and do not become conversational in the language. This alienates them from the mainstream society and can make them bitter and resentful.

[NamSod]

Thats why you keep a handy electrical zapper with you to keep them from pushing you.

[thailandfaq]

Being Thai, it seems odd she was not aware of the dangers of the "chan korn" principle...aka survival of the fittest [or most aggressive]

Maybe thats why she fell..maybe she was trying too hard to "pai korn" - she was obviously the one in front no?

Whatever the case, nobody deserves to suffer accidents like this, but i am sure that both the person who fell and the person who caused the fall were applying the "Chan Korn" (ฉันก่อน) principle, and if not then it wouldn't have happened.

I find the Chan Korn principle on public buses in BKK quite amazing; the people ascending clash with the people descending.

I remember once commenting out loud in Thai on a bus at On Nut BTS how all the people pushing to get down the stairs (and up) were perhaps dressed like ladies and gentlement, but that their behaviour seemed little different from the Bufallos in a stall when you throw the fodder in the trough - they also push and huddle each other in a similar manner. My comment continued to explain that putting on a top hat and tuxedo does not make you a gentleman, rather it is your behaviour which makes you such.

Of course i recieved some open mouthed stares.

[mauiguy90]

I noticed today that the security guards on the platform level have been reinvigorated in their efforts to keep everyone away from the yellow line. There was also some announcement in Thai (didn't catch it all) about not falling on the tracks)

Since the morning after the accident, I've noticed that very few people stand close to the yellow line anymore. Those that did were generally farang, who may not have heard the news about the accident. Since then, I've also noticed less people blocking those exiting from the skytrain as well.

Edited January 21, 2010 by mauiguy90

[Bagwan]

You don't need to travel the world sampling ignorant, self serving people availing themselves of public mass transport systems. To witness a real stampede just attend Liverpool Job Centre when a vacancy is announced. The building empties in nanoseconds.

[thailandfaq]

I have never put in my 2 satang's worth of comments here but here goes. I cannot get over how negative most of the comments are regarding thai society, not just in this article but in so many others. (I am farang, and have lived here 10 years.) so to comment on the comments:

Those of you who think that there is no discipline regarding accessing the skytrain have never been to Cairo, to name but one city. Here, there is no need to have cars just for women so they don't get molested. People blocking the exits for people leaving the train are for the most part farangs who, giving them the benefit of the doubt (a courtesy that most here don't seem to want to extend to Thais) I would say are probably new to the system. I have never experienced shoving, though yes some people do get on the trains quickly to get a seat, and I must say I am probably one of those. When the trains are full, people generally wait for the next train rather than really overdoing it, and I find that Thais are most respectful of personal space. I would say the rudest people I have run into were farang...and ok the chinese are definitely number one in this department.

I think people who live here should stop complaining about trivial matters that are totally unimportant (and I don't mean that falling onto the tracks is trivial). Thailand is not perfect but to me it is better than anywhere else. That's why I'm here and for the most part, that is why most of you are here also. So enjoy and quit your bitching.

Good point sir..actualy you are completely right if we refer to the whole of Thailand and not just Bangkok in the rush hour or Business areas.. .. well done for making this point. The pushing and shoving is generally restricted to Bangkok in the corporate areas, and areas where Thai Culture is not evident (ie skytrain, Sathorn, Silom, Sukhumvit and BKK public transport). Otherwise in the Provinces it is as you say. Thais are reserved well mannered and tolerant, which can't be said too much about us Farang. And yes sir you are right that when it comes to pushing and shoving some Farang are very much the culprits and the same goes for level of arrogance. Somecountries tend to be more arrogant and assuming than others.

I as yourself have lived for ten years in Thailand and to be honest prefer Thais as company to Farang. Yes yes i just have to commend your comment, although i have made a previous comment here telling how i once criticized bad manners on a Bangkok Bus, you have made an important point clear that this is not the case in general in all places

Edited January 21, 2010 by thailandfaq

[mojaco]

I've lived here 16 years. "Politeness" is a taught social skill, and the Thai are very polite per their historic ways. But one has to be taught why cutting in line (a deadly offense in California), or pushing is "impolite" in this incredibly changed city culture.

And Farangs are worse examples by far. Tonight getting on a tightly packed BTS at Saladaeng I had be rude to the Farang leaning against the pole so my wife could hold on. But his girlfriend (or wife) got up to let my wife sit down (we are an older couple). So which one is inherently more polite? The Thai are if someone teaches what is polite in this modern westernized age.

Farang in Bangkok are far worse. Why did Suan Plu Immigration have a sign telling those wearing that white one-piece flowing semi-transparent covering some religions wear to wear underclothes? We Farang are pots calling the kettle black when it comes to polite behavior.

Edited January 21, 2010 by mojaco

[tonywebster]

You don't need to travel the world sampling ignorant, self serving people availing themselves of public mass transport systems. To witness a real stampede just attend Liverpool Job Centre when a vacancy is announced. The building empties in nanoseconds.

the 1980s called, they asked for their stereotype back

[ivowatson]

For such a 'suparb' mannered country - some areas defy common sense. Drivers are one - put a nice Thai behind the wheel of a car and they become the Dr Jekyl/Mr Hide character. Put a Thai in a queue and the same applies. BTS/MRT is the worst example. Crowds on platforms, train arrives and before passengers can get off the ignorant little s**ts just push and shove into the train, same in department stores, lifts, 711's etc.

Sad - for such a decent race of people. Learn some courtesy and manners.

So true. All those decent, friendly, peace-loving, smiling people. Who would expect that? Or is it just sublime marketing? What I really don't get is some complaining "this is turning in a Thai thing again". What would you expect? This is Thailand and I'm not at all interested in what's happening in Africa, the US or Britain. Call me selfish but I would like it to improve here, making my life easier here, not anywhere else. Manners or the lack of, that's the key point. But try to tell a Thai he/she doesn't have good manners. They'll be very angry not because you say so but because they'll realize you're right and you're not supposed to know.

[nasajsc]

I found some pics of the woman - in the first pic, if you blow it up, it

does not appear there is anybody directly behind her, not saying she jumped,

but it does not look like there is a huge crowd - if there was a huge crowd i

would expect to see many people crossing the yellow line, especially around

where the girl is.

what do others think?

[Lancashirelad]

Most if not all stations on the London undetground have anti-suicide pits between the rails so that if someone does fall (or jumps) onto the track as the train approaches there is room for them to lie underneath the train without coming to any further harm than any they may have sustained by the fall. Ofcourse you also must be lucky not to touch the live rail.

Now looking at those pics above it appears the rails are built up off the concrete bed so, again, there is room for a train to pass over a horizontal person.

No ones mentioned the poor driver yet - quite traumatic for him!

London Underground has a specialist "Therapy Unit" to deal with drivers' post-traumatic stress.

[tonywebster]

Most if not all stations on the London undetground have anti-suicide pits between the rails so that if someone does fall (or jumps) onto the track as the train approaches there is room for them to lie underneath the train without coming to any further harm than any they may have sustained by the fall. Ofcourse you also must be lucky not to touch the live rail.

Now looking at those pics above it appears the rails are built up off the concrete bed so, again, there is room for a train to pass over a horizontal person.

No ones mentioned the poor driver yet - quite traumatic for him!

London Underground has a specialist "Therapy Unit" to deal with drivers' post-traumatic stress.

yes they do have trauma unit and I believe 6 months off work for the unfortunate driver

[dude007]

The BTS system is, in my opinion, brilliant, but as the system expands without any visible increase in capacity accidents like this will happen.

Hopefully this lady will make a full and speedy recovery.

I fully agree with this statement: the skytrain is brilliant and difficult to improve! But time has perhaps come to increase the length of the trains with one or two more carriages, especially during the rush-hours.

Normally the Thaisch are very educated in correctly lining up at the train stations (central station is exemplary) and I am surprised to learn that this deplorable accident has happened... I hereby wish the lady quick recovery and hopefully she will soon forget!

[TAWP]

Farang in Bangkok are far worse. Why did Suan Plu Immigration have a sign telling those wearing that white one-piece flowing semi-transparent covering some religions wear to wear underclothes? We Farang are pots calling the kettle black when it comes to polite behavior.

They have it since the bottom 10% of foreigners living here are the ones making those stupid mistakes and behaving badly. I would however venture to say that most of the people I know, all making good salaries and dressing decently, would never be subjects to any of these signs nor are either group a direct average of farangs here. But the former, as described in your post is definitely not.

[dude007]

I have never put in my 2 satang's worth of comments here but here goes. I cannot get over how negative most of the comments are regarding thai society, not just in this article but in so many others. (I am farang, and have lived here 10 years.) so to comment on the comments:

Those of you who think that there is no discipline regarding accessing the skytrain have never been to Cairo, to name but one city. Here, there is no need to have cars just for women so they don't get molested. People blocking the exits for people leaving the train are for the most part farangs who, giving them the benefit of the doubt (a courtesy that most here don't seem to want to extend to Thais) I would say are probably new to the system. I have never experienced shoving, though yes some people do get on the trains quickly to get a seat, and I must say I am probably one of those. When the trains are full, people generally wait for the next train rather than really overdoing it, and I find that Thais are most respectful of personal space. I would say the rudest people I have run into were farang...and ok the chinese are definitely number one in this department.

I think people who live here should stop complaining about trivial matters that are totally unimportant (and I don't mean that falling onto the tracks is trivial). Thailand is not perfect but to me it is better than anywhere else. That's why I'm here and for the most part, that is why most of you are here also. So enjoy and quit your bitching.

Good point sir..actualy you are completely right if we refer to the whole of Thailand and not just Bangkok in the rush hour or Business areas.. .. well done for making this point. The pushing and shoving is generally restricted to Bangkok in the corporate areas, and areas where Thai Culture is not evident (ie skytrain, Sathorn, Silom, Sukhumvit and BKK public transport). Otherwise in the Provinces it is as you say. Thais are reserved well mannered and tolerant, which can't be said too much about us Farang. And yes sir you are right that when it comes to pushing and shoving some Farang are very much the culprits and the same goes for level of arrogance. Somecountries tend to be more arrogant and assuming than others.

I as yourself have lived for ten years in Thailand and to be honest prefer Thais as company to Farang. Yes yes i just have to commend your comment, although i have made a previous comment here telling how i once criticized bad manners on a Bangkok Bus, you have made an important point clear that this is not the case in general in all places

Finally a point and a statement which really makes sense... Living now for 20 years in Thailand, I am glad to hear that because indeed when it is related to the boarding of the skytrain I have been surprised how polite and well educated these Thais are perfectly lining up in a double row to board the train, and indeed, when the train is full, they gently wait for the next one, continuing the perfect lining up of the waiting passengers. Just compare with the metro in China or elsewhere and then make your comments.

But it doesn't mean that Thais are perfect. They are indeed lightly touched and the slightest comment or remark pulls down their language barrier by which they completely negate you as if you were "air". Their culture is then felt superficial but superficial is still better than no culture at all and after all, the superficial is the thing that most of the people see at first (the "land of smiles"). Other countries (and I like your comparison with Cairo ) are no match to this level of politeness and education!

Thanks for making such good point! I like your comment!

[on-on]

People blocking the exits for people leaving the train are for the most part farangs who, giving them the benefit of the doubt (a courtesy that most here don't seem to want to extend to Thais) I would say are probably new to the system.

I agree with your general thrust in that people on TV love to lob increasingly negative cultural/racial stereotypes at the Thais and I find this ridiculous, but your assertion here is completely absurd. I commute via skytrain and subway almost every day and it is about 99.99999% Thai people who, at every stop now, line up directly in front of the door preventing you from exiting. It did not used to be like this - this has happened in the last couple of years.

There aren't many farangs here to begin with and while I've seen a propensity for tourists to do stupid things like lean on the pole and prevent others from using it or push around the car as they crane their necks around trying to read the map on the inside they seem to know for the most part that when there's a door you're not supposed to stand in the middle of it. I love Thailand, have very few problems here and don't spend my time sitting around whinging, but anyone who lives here who has not noticed that there is a very odd (by Western standards, which don't matter since this is Thailand) cultural ethic for dealing with entrances and exits to anything isn't paying attention. Whether it's the automated gate into the BTS, the entrance to an escalator, the entrance to the BTS, the top or bottom of the stairwell or anything else it's incredibly common for people to just stop and stand in the middle of that entrance or exit while they do whatever it is they're doing (or sometimes nothing at all). This behavior would get you knocked clean out of the way in many cities in the West, which isn't much of a comment on our hospitality when it comes to foot traffic, but is a comment on individual ability to order oneself so as not to cause problems for other people in a busy city of millions of people. The only place I see this kind of behavior back home is in a crowded grocery store full of women pushing carts around and not paying attention to where they're going. That's the only metaphor I can think of.

The only one that I do get tuned up about is the standing in front of the doors. I lived in DC and commuted by rail every day there and you never saw that kind of behavior. If I had I'd have put my head down and walked right over people there just like I do here.

Edited February 2, 2010 by on-on