Chances Are ?

[a2396]

I would like to ask, from all the learned members here, who are familiar with the whys & wherefores of Thai culture: What are the chances of marriage, for a Thai lady who has already had a child? I am talking about marriage to a Thia man NOT Farang. The child was had without benefit wedlock, if that makes any difference. Most people I know say the chances of marriage to a Thai man are slim to none. The lady is 26 and college educated, very attractive.

[IanForbes]

I asked the same question about 6 months ago and got mixed answers. However, it's been my experience that Thai men do NOT want to take on the responsibility of someone else's child. That is why the women often leave their child at home with mother while she is off working in a different city. And, I'm talking about office work, not bar work. Good luck to the lady.

[rgs2001uk]

In my observations, chances are very slight if within her own social standing, unless wealthy.

The woman may have to lower her expectations and step down a class or two.

There is a young Thai woman of about 23 or 24 living in the same soi I live in, very attractive, none of the Thais in the soi are in the least interested,(peer pressure, loss of face, second hand are some of the excuses) the best she can hope for is to be a mia noi.

[sceadugenga]

Sounds like she's over her use by date and over educated anyway.

My wife has three college educated nieces around that age with good jobs, very attractive and no men of any race on the horizon.

They won't lower their standards either, the village men have no chance even if they were interested in a 26+ year old, which they're not.

[givenall]

Thai culture make it hard for people to have others children as their own. My Thai wife and I were thinking about adapting a Thai child and we were advice against by the agency saying when they grow up they will look for their natural parents and live the adapted ones.

It really means they only have loyalties to the blood parents. It also true that when you have a Thai wife (may husband) the mother, brother, sisters, sometime cousins come first before the husband or wife (is the culture)

[thaihome]

Funny, but I know of at least two Thai men that married women that already had children. This would have been back in the early 80’s as the children are now in their 30’s. In both cases these were men that owned [farming] property and would not be considered "dirt poor"

What I think happens these days is the women are unwilling to commit to another man having in many cases been burned badly the first time.

TH

[anchan42]

Funny, I have just been to a wedding on Sunday and the bride, my wife cousin, had 12 old son from her ex-husband.

I myself dated a woman who had three years old son. My brother is married to a women who has 9 years old son. My sister-in-law was about 36 when she married my brother. My wife's sister dated a man who had a son once.

All involve are Thais.

[hawthorne]

well better than the unattractive, no personallity and uneducated chick.

[eurasianthai]

Well new generation of Thai men do not want to marry anyway.

Same for westerners.

And if the lady has a child, it sure does not make it any easier for her to find an husband.

Thai or foreigner...

[TheJoker12]

There are MANY Thai women who fall into this category. They are educated and not happy with the selection of Thai men who are in their league. They are not pretty enough or not from a good enough family to get the type of man that they think they deserve and are not willing to settle. I really wonder what ends up happening to them?

I think there are significantly more educated Thai females than males.

[TheJoker12]

Thai culture make it hard for people to have others children as their own. My Thai wife and I were thinking about adapting a Thai child and we were advice against by the agency saying when they grow up they will look for their natural parents and live the adapted ones.

It really means they only have loyalties to the blood parents. It also true that when you have a Thai wife (may husband) the mother, brother, sisters, sometime cousins come first before the husband or wife (is the culture)

Another clueless farang!

[bina]

actually a good question:

many of the country women i met who had second thai husbands had the kids from the first marriage living with grandparents and they told me i t was to protect the kids... apparently they felt (or experienced) that the second husband would mis-treat the children from the first father (one sis in law said her second husband disliked the boys from her first husband/the second sis in law has the second husband adores the kids from previous husband)...and other men ive spoken too also many seem to have more problems with sons from first marriages (maybe authority problems or perceived authority problems?). others have mentioned that they prefer that the girls stay with grandparents to not be around a 'strange' father (that is, an adult male that isnt biological father, and perhaps lead to incest etc?).

although in the west this might not be an issue (not sure having not lived in the states for some 30 yrs), here in israel it is also an issue among many men, not wanting , or barely tolerating, children , especially sons, from previous marriages. when a woman + 2 remarries, everyone asks how the new husband likes or gets along with the kids, and says 'bravo' for him being such a good husband. it is apparently a major worry here also. could be that we are also a bit 'oriental' in outlook here as well : not accepting people that arent 'blood kin' in to the family. blood is always thicker then water here and i assume the same for thailand. having your own offspring succeed overrules the urge to be a just father figure, regardless (being a father to someone else's child). although adoption of children within the same family is practiced .

the first thng men do here when they remarry is usually have a 'child of their own' . it seems to be instinctual among males, where as women will mother others' children usually with less problems . yes there are the evil step mothers also i know, but mostly males want to nurture their own offspring, nto someone else's...

anchan: although they married with kids from previous fathers, u didnt mention the daily behavior/treatment /responses of the kids and the second ,new father. so of course its done, the question is, if possibly the higher the education and economic background and sophistication of the family, the less problematic it becomes for the man to accept others' children. OR IF the mothers pay more attention to the actions of the male towards her children and may be less likely to want to give the children up for the sake of the new marriage, hence , their chance of marrying again are reduced (since they want a hsband that will also get along with and see the 'others' children, as their own...

hope that was understandable... my english goes at this hour

bina

israel

[BigWheelMan]

This is the same the world over.

Because a woman with someone else`s little brats come as a package.

My cousin got married 4 years ago to a woman in England who had 2 kids from a previous relationship. The brats would never accept him as their father and when the children were naughty and my cousin told them off, his wife would say, don`t shout at MY children like that.

Remember that the husband will always be second in her life, the kids number one.

I hate other peoples kids, no thanks.

Edited February 1, 2010 by BigWheelMan

[BlackArtemis]

My sister in law divorced with a 4 year old and she got into a relationship and eventually married a thai/chinese guy. He treats my niece better than her real father ever did and even states he is the father.

Both my sister in law and brother in law come from well to do and highly educated families though. I would not see this as the norm.

[Loz]

Most people I know say the chances of marriage to a Thai man are slim to none. The lady is 26 and college educated, very attractive.

Not to the vast majority of "eligible" Thai men.

don't confuse pretty with attractive. Bar girls can be pretty, but not many men of "standing" would consider them attractive.

[a2396]

Most people I know say the chances of marriage to a Thai man are slim to none. The lady is 26 and college educated, very attractive.

Not to the vast majority of "eligible" Thai men.

don't confuse pretty with attractive. Bar girls can be pretty, but not many men of "standing" would consider them attractive.

Yes, I suppose it would not be so easy for her to conceal her rather "checkered" past from another Thai. She never was a bar girl to my knowledge, but was a Mia Noi to a Thai man for several years.

[IanForbes]

Good reply, bina. And, although somewhat harsh, Bigwheelman was correct. Children VERY often play the mother against the new man. In my second marriage it was very evident with my wife's adult son. She always took his side in everything and I was expected to go along with it. That included smashing my home, smashing two of our cars, smashing up his rented place (before he moved in with us), stealing my cameras and tools, and generally doing what most druggies do. The mother refused to accept the fact that her beloved son was doing drugs. I tried everything I could think of to help him, but to no avail. And when I finally had to get the police to remove him from my home, the mother, who had already left, blamed me.

No, it's no picnic trying to be a good father to someone else's children.

[Loz]

Glad you clarified for those who are not wanting to assume. I think that most THai men know their culture well enough to be pretty sure that either she was a mia noi or married very badly. Both traits are not desirable in ones future life partner, no matter how bad a catch the bloke himself might be. Yes its a double standard but you know Thailand is no stranger to such things, right?

[thaihome]

Glad you clarified for those who are not wanting to assume. I think that most THai men know their culture well enough to be pretty sure that either she was a mia noi or married very badly. Both traits are not desirable in ones future life partner, no matter how bad a catch the bloke himself might be. Yes its a double standard but you know Thailand is no stranger to such things, right?

You say this despite numerous actual stories saying exactly the opposite.

Note the difference in “bar stool opinions” and actual interaction with non-sex industry, i.e. normal, Thais.

TH

[markwhite]

There are a number of couples in the moo baan where I live where the mother has children by a different father. One child is the son of the father's mia noi but she died so the son came to live with his dad and first wife, and he's a locally repsected politician. There's a couple who were both married to different people who then had an affair, got divorces and now live together with the woman's kids from the first wife. And there's a ex bar-girl who has an 18 year old son from before her marriage, and 3 kids with her new husband. One of my wife's sisters left her husband with her kids and married again.

So in my experience, it seems to be as much a part of life here s it did back in the UK.

[MangoMungo]

"Most Thai men"

Have any of you thought that you can't paint us all with the same brush?

News flash, we're all unique and look for different things in a spouse.

Sorry to spoil everyone's convenient generalization of Thai males.

[Loz]

"Most" only means 51% or more.... Not "ALL".

Thaihome, I don't frequent bars as such and live in Rural Thailand where I meet folks from all walks of life. Just because you don't share my experience and the views formed thereof, please don't presume to speculate of their origins.

[Pakboong]

Loz, if you must call Thais of the female gender ladies, it is politically correct to call Thais of the male gender gentlemen.

Edited February 2, 2010 by Pakboong

[tonititan]

This is the same the world over.

Because a woman with someone else`s little brats come as a package.

While I think that this could have been said with a little more sensitivity, I think that the poster's sentiments are pretty true. It's doesn't seem to be unique to Thailand or even Asia. I think that in many western countries, it is more difficult for women who have children from a previous relationship to date and find a new partner, for lots of reasons. Please note that I said "more difficult," not impossible...as several posters on this thread have proven. It's hard enough for single people to find the right person, and having children seems to make it even more complicated. Even as a woman, I have my own reasons for not really wanting to date a man who has children from a previous relationship.

[anchan42]

anchan: although they married with kids from previous fathers, u didnt mention the daily behavior/treatment /responses of the kids and the second ,new father. so of course its done, the question is, if possibly the higher the education and economic background and sophistication of the family, the less problematic it becomes for the man to accept others' children. OR IF the mothers pay more attention to the actions of the male towards her children and may be less likely to want to give the children up for the sake of the new marriage, hence , their chance of marrying again are reduced (since they want a hsband that will also get along with and see the 'others' children, as their own...

I agree with you. There are more things to worry about if you have a child and want to get re-married. However, from what I have seen the chance is not as slim as some people in here might think. Perhaps due to more thinking are required they usually end up with better husbands.

My brother sold his house and moved in with his wife. They have a daughter together. As far as I can tell they live happily together.

For my wife cousin,I think her husband will moved in with her and her son. He seems to get along fine with the boy.

My sister in law broke up with her boyfriend because he lied to her that he had divorced his wife. He, in fact, was still living with his wife and also had one more girl besides my sister in law.

For my ex-girl friend, the boy was taken away from her by his grand parents. Her husband died in a motorcycle accident and the grand parents look at the boy as his replacement. I did not really agree with it. I think the boy is much better off with his mother but I was not in the position to get involved.

We are all middle-class, teacher, factory and office workers, bus(สองแถว) driver, small shop owners, etc. No body here can be classified as rich.

Edited February 2, 2010 by anchan42

[Loz]

Loz, if you must call Thais of the female gender ladies, it is politically correct to call Thais of the male gender gentlemen.

I don't believe I did call them ladies. My only reference was to bar "girls".

[Loz]

Thai culture make it hard for people to have others children as their own. My Thai wife and I were thinking about adapting a Thai child and we were advice against by the agency saying when they grow up they will look for their natural parents and live the adapted ones.

It really means they only have loyalties to the blood parents. It also true that when you have a Thai wife (may husband) the mother, brother, sisters, sometime cousins come first before the husband or wife (is the culture)

this is a new angle... I never thought of adapting a thai child. What were you thinking? LPG, CNG? or just lopping off some limbs?

[yabaaaa]

Does it all change when the original Father is dead and a new one moves in?

[dmax]

simple ! if he has money then the chances are good, if he has no money then the chances are nil, if he has big money then you,ve just asked a silly question

[thaihome]

"Most" only means 51% or more.... Not "ALL".

Thaihome, I don't frequent bars as such and live in Rural Thailand where I meet folks from all walks of life. Just because you don't share my experience and the views formed thereof, please don't presume to speculate of their origins.

I apologize if my statement as to the source of your opinion offended you. Nevertheless, there are numerous stories being told here of Thai women with children from other men, married, not married, widowed or whatever, that have married new men. Do you have a storey of a Thai woman with children that as been unable to marry another man because of the cultural prejudice you seem to see? You should have at least one such storey, huh?

Just a bit of semantics as well, “most” is usually defined as more the just a majority:

most

determiner

1.

a. a great majority of; nearly all most people like eggs

Maybe next you should limit your statements to "in your experience in your rural village with Thai people of all walks of life", even though that may be an oxymoron.

TH