Phuket Air's operating licences suspended

[Faro]

I booked and flew Phuket Air to London last November, returning in December.

I couldn't praise the the two flights enough. I was in economy and the staff were lovely and very attentive. They cleaned all the toilets every 1/2 hour and sprayed them.

The food was very good and it took off on time and landed on time both ways.

My only criticism was that the flight was sold to me as a direct flight, when in fact it was only the return to Bangkok that was direct.

On top of that, the price was very good at 26000 Baht. I only just missed a promotion at 22000 Baht.

If all there flights were as good as the ones I experienced, I would be very happy to fly with them again.

On my return, I was Phuket Airs best ambassador and trying to get my friends to travel with them. I feel sad that it has turned out this way. I hope that they can have a successful turn around.

[DaveYo]

Oh that story, they were canned cause I recall that incident. As of the journalists, they somehow disappeared once things got heated up.

As of that design concering the issue in 150 B.C., it is way flawed. There is no evidence to support such, via the ancient artifacts found up to today, much less it be able to hold water cause it will spill out. Also in those days they did not have the intelligence much less wanted such technology. They were more interested in the Gladiators etc and the skies which indeed interested them a great deal hence the names given per se of what is known today.

As of the jet engine, perhaps maybe Whittle won the bet on the patent, (not sure), but the Germans themselves did not copy from Whittle much less even bothered to patent their technology since it was considered top secret and was controlled from Heil Hitler in those days. He wasn't such an idiot to tip off the enemies out west of what he was doing or creating that is for sure.

Such information was found out via the spy network against Heil Hitler particularly from the Frenchies. This part is a fact.

Daveyo

[DaveYo]

Hmmm, ones experience on the service given is normal for most airlines. I would be much more worried on the mechanical aspects of the plane, since it is my forte of strength, than cabin service.

Most folks have no idea what goes on behind closed doors.

Daveyo

[Thetyim]

Actually, back in my high school days I used to talk with a buddy about the value of an intense exit.  A sheerly aware moment before the black, I guess.  Maybe I wouldn't feel so romantic about it once it was upon me...yeah, probably.

Still, I've sat through some JARRING turbulence that had most fellow passengers freaking out.  I just sat there looking around and kind of laughing a bit.  I had the vision of the plane coming apart, like in that flick Fight Club.  Yeah, maybe I am sick...ha ha.  Why freak over something beyond control, though? 

I think you have just the right qualities to become a pilot for PhuketAir

[quiddity]

Actually, back in my high school days I used to talk with a buddy about the value of an intense exit.  A sheerly aware moment before the black, I guess.  Maybe I wouldn't feel so romantic about it once it was upon me...yeah, probably.

Still, I've sat through some JARRING turbulence that had most fellow passengers freaking out.  I just sat there looking around and kind of laughing a bit.  I had the vision of the plane coming apart, like in that flick Fight Club.  Yeah, maybe I am sick...ha ha.  Why freak over something beyond control, though? 

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I think you have just the right qualities to become a pilot for PhuketAir

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Where do I sign up? Ha ha.

[lampard10]

"The principles behind the jet engine have been understood for thousands of years. The first precursor to the modern jet engine was invented by Heron around 150 BC."

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Actually it was during the ice age the principle was first discovered. Someone farted while he was walking on a frozen lake.

[lampard10]

Paraffin/Kerosene? (Esso Blue or Pink? ... for those Brits who can remember    )

Rather than argue linguistic anomalies, just call it by its international name, designed specifically to avoid confusion, the embarrassment of putting in the wrong fuel, and silly arguments on web sites:

1.  Jet engines burn AVTUR  (‘Aviation - turbine’)

2. Internal combustion engines burn AVGAS (Aviation gasoline - although should that really be Avpet to the purist?      )

And hey, Aviador 88, Lampard 10 and Dave Yo, what a rare pleasure to find people who know what they’re taking about.

tsh-tsh-tsh-tsh-tsh!  Jing jok (Rotary pilot and part-time wall lizard)

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Actally the terms you have given are all military terms for the various fuels. I havn't heard avtur and avgas talked about since I left the RAF. BTW you forgot AVPIN. Used to start a Lightning with that.

[aviador88]

Did you remember this story? About 4-5 years ago (I'm not sure), some journalists follow a few pilots from British Airways and they find out that they drunk a great quantity of alcohol just before flying. It was quite a big scandal for a few day and then .... nothing.... Does any one know what happend? 

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I don't know about that particular story but the drunken pilot thing is no joke. I've got a friend who worked for a major US carrier for 8 years. He used to be a serious partier before he got married and would see the pilots out drinking until 3:00 and piloting red-eye flights at 5:30...still wasted and reeking.

Apparently, a trick throughout the industry is to hit the oxygen tanks to kill off the hangover. Thank God for auto-pilot, I guess. Some cats operate better with alcohol in the system, actually. I don't know if this is the case with these guys but...

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Sadly there are people who do that. Take the case of a 707 a few years ago on a fuel and overnight stop in Ankorage AL. The FO and FE had the airplane ready to go when the captain arrived in a taxi. The man was so boozed up he fell out of the car, couldn't walk and had to be shoved up the stairs by the 2 crewmen. Which in itself would have been workable, having to other qualifier pilots on board. (In the US every Flight engineer now has to be a pilot first not like the "olden" days when a grease monkey with dirty fingernails would do.) Anyway the captain insisted on flying, over rotated on takeoff causing the tail to strike the ground with the airplane veering off the runway, turning into a fireball.

To continue boring you (by the way I am 70 years old but the way the system works they (the FAA) consider you having one foot in the grave and prohibit you from line-flying past your 60th birthday. I believe in the UK the limit is 55 ) So most of us would fly charter afterwards where there is no age limit as long as one can pass the semi annual physical.

I was in San Juan Puerto Rico one day on a 3 day layover. I went to the bar and met the crew of a Superconnie. The captain had been flying DC 2's 3's and 4's for eastern airlines. The flight engineer was a weird factotum with, like I said greasy fingernails from nursing those old compound radials. The Co-pilot was a young fellow with shoulderlong hair who also happened to own the airplane. The captain was an interesting guy and we swapped war stories until about 3 AM. By then the man was so drunk that the crew had to carry him to his room even though they had left a 7 AM wake up call. I too had to get up early. Low and behold there was this old geezer, coffee cup in hand sober as a judge. I couln'd believe it.

Greets, the ol Capt'n.

[maerim]

All airlines know the amount of fuel needed to fly to each destination plus the reserves.

Which is handy to know as filling stations in mid Atlantic are few and far between.

Thanks Dave Yo always nice to know your on the job to put anyones mind at rest.

[lampard10]

All airlines know the amount of fuel needed to fly to each destination plus the reserves.

Which is handy to know as filling stations in mid Atlantic are few and far between.

Thanks Dave Yo always nice to know your on the job to put anyones mind at rest.

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Yeah.......like the Colombian 707 left to circle over La Guardia till it ran out of fuel and nose-dived into the oggin.

BTW keep them coming....I'm really enjoying this thread.

[aviador88]

Paraffin/Kerosene? (Esso Blue or Pink? ... for those Brits who can remember    )

Rather than argue linguistic anomalies, just call it by its international name, designed specifically to avoid confusion, the embarrassment of putting in the wrong fuel, and silly arguments on web sites:

1.  Jet engines burn AVTUR  (‘Aviation - turbine’)

2. Internal combustion engines burn AVGAS (Aviation gasoline - although should that really be Avpet to the purist?      )

And hey, Aviador 88, Lampard 10 and Dave Yo, what a rare pleasure to find people who know what they’re taking about.

tsh-tsh-tsh-tsh-tsh!  Jing jok (Rotary pilot and part-time wall lizard)

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Oy vay , Rotary wing contraptions that defy the laws of God given aeronautical propulsion.

We "fixed wing guys" had a saying: Flying a helicopter is like masturbating. Everybody loves doing it, but hates to admit it

Greets.

[MaiChai]

DaveYo, what do you think of the maint for Air Asia Thailand? I use them quite alot, and I know the planes are not new, but they seem well maintained, and they don't seem to have too many delays due to JIT maintenance.

Thx in advance.

[falux]

Pilots are bus drivers on a better machine.

[mpdkorat]

no offence meant...but, funny thing is...

I'm German, the jet engine was indeed invented in Germany during WWII and we call the plane fuel... kerosene 

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I'm English and I know nothing about jet engines or any other engine for that matter. But I do know where google is. check this out:

http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/bljetengine.htm

But I'm sure Frank's jet was a lot less boring and quieter.

[danintrang]

We "fixed wing guys" had a saying: Flying a helicopter is like masturbating. Everybody loves doing it, but hates to admit it 

Masturbating in a helicopter?

[mpdkorat]

We "fixed wing guys" had a saying: Flying a helicopter is like masturbating. Everybody loves doing it, but hates to admit it 

Masturbating in a helicopter?

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Slow..... Must be running on Mekong

[dragonmasterzip]

When I flew on North West Airlines from the U.S. to Japan there was a steady stream of fuel pouring out of the end of the wing - many, many gallons.  The pilot said it was normal and that heat expansion from sitting on the ground for too long was causing them to discard fuel.

How routine are large fuel discharges like that?

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Very common. Fuel expands rapidly when heated. would you rather some fuel leak out, or have the wing explode due to excessive internal pressures.

Too bad they don't teach basic science anymore.

[John K]

Is the discount carrier who’s jet went nose first in the everglades part owner?

[mpdkorat]

When I flew on North West Airlines from the U.S. to Japan there was a steady stream of fuel pouring out of the end of the wing - many, many gallons.  The pilot said it was normal and that heat expansion from sitting on the ground for too long was causing them to discard fuel.

How routine are large fuel discharges like that?

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Very common. Fuel expands rapidly when heated. would you rather some fuel leak out, or have the wing explode due to excessive internal pressures.

Too bad they don't teach basic science anymore.

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Lucky we have you around to teach us all here. Maybe next time you will give us a class on manners. Are you German??

[lampard10]

hello CDB

[CHOPTHAI]

no offence meant...but, funny thing is...

I'm German, the jet engine was indeed invented in Germany during WWII and we call the plane fuel... kerosene 

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This forum is getting more interesting by the minutes!

Checked up an interesting website:

www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp121-c3.pdf

It has provided chemical composition facts regarding the aviation fuel [JP-5 & JP-8]. It had clearly stated that aviation fuels contained 52% paraffins with the rest were additives. Aviation jet fuel is known chemically as "kerosene" and not as "paraffins". In Malaysia, the country that had been a British colony for over a hundred years, the word "paraffin" is normally being associated with "oil lamps" and the word "kerosene" is being associated as "cooking fuel" [semantically different from other countries]. When I was with the engineering department of a local airline, we always referred the "liquid fuel" used for the aircraft as "jet fuel" and not by any other name. We will definitely say: "refuelling" and not "rekerosening" or "reparaffining".....

BTW, according to my research, the first turbine engine [forerunner of the present turbofan] was invented by the Germans! It was first flown in 1939! Anyhow, Sir Frank Whittle perfected it and was now being accredited with that honour for being the father of jet engines. In Malaysia, about 30 years ago, we studied history based on textbooks written by British historians, thus, if you ask any Malaysian you might get the answer as: "It was the British who first invented the jet engine".

If one care to perform a research, a different dimension and perspective may unfold in one's mind if the mind is open enough!

It is very difficult to navigate through this great semantic divide, as we are constantly being bombarded with "prescribed knowledge" by those who wanted us to trod along a certain path.

Ask the Japanese why they attacked China in 1937 and they will argue until the cows come home that it was China who provoked them to do so as in accordance to the history books written by their historians.

Cheers, just a few cents worth of thoughts. No malice intended.

[Tywais]

no offence meant...but, funny thing is...

I'm German, the jet engine was indeed invented in Germany during WWII and we call the plane fuel... kerosene 

The patent for jet engines, on which the modern ones are based, was granted to Sir Frank Whittle in 1930. The Germans used his design for their experiments. Whittle used his design to develop the W.1 plane which flew first in 1940.

Sorry about this!

[Tywais]

no offence meant...but, funny thing is...

I'm German, the jet engine was indeed invented in Germany during WWII and we call the plane fuel... kerosene 

The patent for jet engines, on which the modern ones are based, was granted to Sir Frank Whittle in 1930. The Germans used his design for their experiments. Whittle used his design to develop the W.1 plane which flew first in 1940.

Sorry about this!

http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/bljetengine.htm

Dr. Hans von Ohain and Sir Frank Whittle are both recognized as being the co-inventors of the jet engine. Each worked separately and knew nothing of the other's work. Hans von Ohain is considered the designer of the first operational turbojet engine. Frank Whittle was the first to register a patent for the turbojet engine in 1930. Hans von Ohain was granted a patent for his turbojet engine in 1936. However, Hans von Ohain's jet was the first to fly in 1939. Frank Whittle's jet first flew in in 1941.

[danintrang]

We "fixed wing guys" had a saying: Flying a helicopter is like masturbating. Everybody loves doing it, but hates to admit it 

Masturbating in a helicopter?

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Slow..... Must be running on Mekong

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Not so keen on Mekong, thanks.... Just teasing...

[mpdkorat]

Not so keen on Mekong, thanks.... Just teasing...

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Sorry I was I wan't going to reply to this, but I just had to.... What are you teasing?

[LeeX123]

This forum has gotten very interesting and the science behind fuel is all very interesting too.

However, I note that the discussion and resulting sub-discussions are related to fuel. How about FIRE ?? FIRE.

BECAUSE on my Dad's flight with PHUKET AIR returning to the UK from Thailand in January this year, the aircraft had to make an EMERGENCY LANDING in Bangkok muinutes after take-off becuase many passengers saw FIRE balls coming out of the engine(s) on the right hand side, and some reckon they saw a FIRE on the wing!

It frightened my Dad immensley and even the air cabin crewe were shitting bricks, suffuice to say that he refused to re-board the plane after the techinical bods had declared, after an hour of shining their "toy torches" (you know, the kind that get attached to back of a promotional packet of Cornflakes) inside the engines on the tarmak, the plane "safe" for take off again.

In fact he was so horrified by the event that he refused to fly with PHUKET again, and stayed on an extra week in BKK 'till he could arrange an alternative flight with Thai Airways.

So there is not just one incident, but at least two extremely dangerous incidents that I know of now. Chances are that they're been involved in a catalogue of scrapes and shit.

FYI two oustaded 30+ year old ex-KLM Jumbos do the LGW-BKK-LGW route.They're possibly not fit to fly. Closer inspection of the internal cabin shows, amongst other things, scorch marks where internal wiring has melted!

All the passengers from the flight in January swapped mobile numbers and em addresses and there was to be a campaign to stop Phuket Air flying into UK airspace, but alas as in so many cases, apathy kicked in after a few weeks - and nothing really got done.....

There's still loads of individual accounts of the January flight in various email forms. Wonder whether they are worth sending on somewhere??

What I do know is that when I bump into farang who brag to me that they got their flight cheaper than my Thai flight by £ 20 or so, I kind of feel duty bound to warn them no to take their return flight, when I learn they are flying with Phuket.

My old man reamins in good humour though...When he flew out last time, he had printed his own T-Shirt by way of registering his own protest (since nothing had transpired from the promised "passenger revolt"). On the font he'd printed "He who dares"....On the back "Fly Phuket Air"...

[marios]

Oh that story, they were canned cause I recall that incident.  As of the journalists, they somehow disappeared once things got heated up.

As of that design concering the issue in 150 B.C., it is way flawed.  There is no evidence to support such, via the ancient artifacts found up to today,  much less it be able to hold water cause it will spill out.  Also in those days they did not have the intelligence much less wanted such technology.  They were more interested in the Gladiators etc and the skies which indeed interested them a great deal hence the names given per se of what is known today.

As of the jet engine, perhaps maybe Whittle won the bet on the patent, (not sure), but the Germans themselves did not copy from Whittle much less even bothered to patent their technology since it was considered top secret and was controlled from Heil Hitler in those days.  He wasn't such an idiot to tip off the enemies out west of what he was doing or creating that is for sure.

Such information was found out via the spy network against Heil Hitler particularly from the Frenchies.  This part is a fact.

Daveyo

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'

"As of that design concering the issue in 150 B.C., it is way flawed. There is no evidence to support such, via the ancient artifacts found up to today, much less it be able to hold water cause it will spill out. Also in those days they did not have the intelligence much less wanted such technology. They were more interested in the Gladiators etc and the skies which indeed interested them a great deal hence the names given per se of what is known today."

My post will concentrate mainly on the paragraph above.

What do you mean by 'they did not have the intelligence'.They did not have to-day's ,or 19th century's techonlogy yes, but no intelligence??

Any way, Heron's turbine was a metal sphere mounted on horizontal hollow axle.

Along the diameter perpenticular to the axle there were two angled nozzles so that steam issuing from them caused the sphere to rotate. Water was fed into the sphere through the hollow axle and below the sphere there was fire burning(to create the steam into the sphere)

Historically this is termed as the first turbine.

It is worth noting that during that period 1st century BC to 1st century AD, a number of people,Heron being the most eminent, did invent many things we use today such as the pulley, the threaded bolt, the lathe, lubricated bearings with a bronze sleeve and numerous others. the most amazing feat were the automata whereby a whole 'play' was activated on the stage, the play depicting a tale from the greek mythology by a series of timed movements of figures, thunder and lightning simulation etc. Any book on Heron or Alexandrian engineering can provide all information.

On the issue of airflight safety my opinion is that one has to avoid budget airlines.

No matter how well run they may be, they are still budget airlines, meaning that they will do anything to cut costs.This may mean parts replacement later than now, grounding time less frequent etc. (of course there may be exceptions to this)

On the other hand state run airlines or large international airlines tend to stick to safety procedures more responsibly I think.The state run more so. the reason? The service managers(civil servants) are not under the same pressure to cut corners. They stick to the guidelines, they replace parts freely, may be more freely than sound engineering practice dictates. Result: a less efficient business venture but, in my opinion a safer plane as a general rule.

[alex100]

If you used to work for an airline,then you will realise that planes run on paraffine not petrol...

And if you'd have a clue you'd know that planes run on kerosene and not on candle wax

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American planes run on Kerosene..British ones on Paraffin...please don't run people down without checking your facts. Kerosene is just another fine example of the Sceptic Tanks bastardising a word to try and make it their own.. WE invented the jet engine so WE invented what runs it

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Huh, I thought the germans were the first ones to fly jets, during the second world war. I saw one of the planes, in a war museum in London! I might be wrong of course.

It was not a jet it was actaully a rocket quite different Sir Frank Whittle from Lutterworth Leicestershire UK invented the Jet Engine

Concerning fuel, I found a very interesting page: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question105.htm

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[lampard10]

.This may mean parts replacement later than now,

It's the parts that come from dodgy dealers you have to worry about,ie past shelf life,no certificates or just taken from wrecks without further servicing. Even state run airlines come up against this problem. I can remember working on contract for a small company,servicing planes from a well known larger airline in the UK. This larger Airline had it's own servicing section but they were handling the 'C ' checks for an even larger airline,who in turn were contracted out to a foreign operator that was paying mega-bucks. This goes on all the time,all over the world.

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[Sir Burr]

However, Hans von Ohain's jet was the first to fly in 1939. Frank Whittle's jet first flew in in 1941.

Frank Whittle's jet aeroplane first flew on 15th May 1940.