Anti-Red Shirts Protest Grows

[whiterussian]

Please feel free to note that similar numbers will be seen in the US regarding wealth distribution. Please also note that BKK consists of millions of people from the NE that are living there and reaping the benefits of being in the capital and sending $$ home.

Im not at all surprised!!!! (but thanks!)

Re: Jobs... yup, jobs are great.. it's when the agro jobs back north are gone, that it hits the fan...

[bubba]

Please feel free to note that similar numbers will be seen in the US regarding wealth distribution. Please also note that BKK consists of millions of people from the NE that are living there and reaping the benefits of being in the capital and sending $$ home.

Im not at all surprised!!!! (but thanks!)

Re: Jobs... yup, jobs are great.. it's when the agro jobs back north are gone, that it hits the fan...

Interesting comment, particularly since while Thaksin was in office, he personally pushed through the China free trade agreement which allowed immediate and almost unlimited tax-free import of Chinese agricultural products. Remember when northern Thai garlic farmers were blocking roads and dumping garlic because they could not compete with Chinese garlic? They had Thaksin to thank for that.

[tominbkk]

Can you imagine if 30000 or so Bangkokians decided to get even by going to a big rice growing area and stomping down all the shoots and destroying the crops for several thousand farmers and families. Then they might learn what it is like to disrupt another person's right to livelihood. At this point they have no idea about that, as they have no ability to empathize.

Personally, at this point of no return I don't see how a little bit of water cannon and non explosive tear gassing will hurt anyone.

It's time.

[johncitizen]

Just getting water splashed on him?

Btw. the sign in black on the bottom reads "Blight of the Earth," which is what the students who were slaughtered at Thammasat were called.

Edited April 3, 2010 by johncitizen

[yoshiwara]

the curent situation is bigger than only to bring Thaksin back.

This is the story actively peddled by both the Thaksin apologists and the fellow travellers (I don't like Thaksin but....) who follow up the rear.

Do not be fooled.

The current situation described by the apologists: 'the poor', 'the class war', 'the elite' is one which gets those who like to think of themselves as radicals excited.

(The forum 'come on you reds' team)

This is the image red leaders wish to paint for you re the 'current situation'.

However, it is the key focal objective (not the means to that objective, nor the picture on the canvas) which defines everything in their strategy.

The objective is nothing less than the return of Thaksin to power and financial control.

Nothing else. No compromise.

Thaksin knows this. He wrote the script.

Any vehicles such as 'the bigger picture' which provide a wrapper and legitimisation of his campaign are and will be used.

the red cheerleaders like to think of themselves as a part of a popular front.

But in reality they are the carriors of Thaksin's palenquin.

However much they wriggle.

Wise words for certain.

Many movements through history have been simply Trojan mimics, once the horse is in the city, suddenly it ceases to be a friendly gift horse and unloads a mass of invaders.

This forum has had, literally, people saying that they speak on behalf of 'all poor people'. This is completely fairy-tale bed-time stories .

Robin Hood, stealing from the rich & giving to poor. Lovely bedtime stories for children, but somehow out of place in a planet that is Owned 100% by corporate super-cartels. Even the wealthiest governments on Earth, are owned 100% by hyper-corporations. There is not one politician alive, who is in power without the support and approval of corporate interests.

What totally amazes me, is not that the unfortunate people who are Thaksins street-pawns in this sorry game, do not understand the basic sociological facts of Corporate dominance, but that people on discussion boards can pontificate about "I speak for all poor people ! Now is the time !" etc lol. when it is painfully obvious that who-ever is in charge will become a comedy sock-puppet for the multinational Corporations within seconds of assuming power.

The best one can hope for in a leader, is a sane one who follows the corporate orders from above and tries to balance the interests of the people below. The notion that any of these red leaders seen so far could manage the former with decorum, is laughable. And once those Ruling-elitist foreigner business~corporates walk away, these internet-revolutionaries will have to build their phones, computers & broadband out of hessian weave & wishful thinking, because there won't be much tech-business left.

It is this beautiful developing land, which suffers when it is forcibly dragged back into low-tech.

To me, this thaksinite story was never "Robin Hood" as it has been spun here , it was "The pied piper of hamelin" & a lone piper followed by a procession who would only listen to his tune.

Evidently .

But then perhaps yu should try to explain this upcountry where Thaksin has rock-star status

It is a tragedy, particularly as Thaksin ensures that the peasant forces remain subordinate to the landowning class which is a part of his 'popular front'.

It is this class subordination which gives the lie to the red forces claim that they are waging a 'class war'.

Not that Thaksin represents anything other than his own ruling class aspirations.

He just doesn't want to share with other bourgeois interests.

In an economic period of accelerated regional economic unequal and combined development, the economically significant declining classes are always going to be led by other forces.

Thaksin has taken advantage of this.

But following Thaksin's wagon will end in defeat.

[siampolee]

Nice post concerning the disparity in income in Thailand. however rather a shame it's 12 years old,

All this talk about empowering the poor is all very well and I am all in favour of a change in society, however the programme is going to take 15-20 years to kick in properly.

Nothing is going to change overnight, debt forgiveness is fine if those whose debts have been forgiven are actually educated in how to manage their finances.

Sadly the greater majority of the fund allocated to villages were spent on consumer goods that produced no gain in the short or long term apart from an increase in local standing status wise.

When trucks and cars were repossessed then those social gains went down the pan and the losers were saddled with an even greater debt than before, this is what happened in my wife's village to a number of families.

Granted there were others who used the funds wisely and even now they are still reaping the rewards of their consolidation of resources, they understood debt created poverty.

Thaksins schemes were all initiated as popular vote garnering gimmicks which of course had a payback clause, Thaksin reaped the rewards by embarking on a crusade of robbery and law changing nepotism violence and a level of corruption that defies definition.

If this creature Thaksin is returned to power along with his toadying acolytes you will see the biggest hate and revenge campaign waged upon their perceived opponents as the current Red Shirt Brigades actions show, corruption will rule and believe you me the poor of this country will be enslaved both financially and politically.

Look at the henchmen Verra a two faced bigot

Weng a communist who like Veraa can't make up what little minds they may have as to what they wants, (note the use of THEY rather than We ) both seem to advocate a policy format favoured by the likes of and along the style of MaoTse Tung and Ho Chi Min,Pol Pot etc.

Jutaporn a psychopath, do we really think these creatures could represent Thailand on the international stage ?

Do we/you really think these creatures have both Thailand's and its peoples best interests at heart ?

This is not a fight about DEMOCRACY.

It's about paving the way for the return of a despot and the return of his ill gotten gains and the installing of a despotic regime led by a crazed group of megalomaniacs

[johncitizen]

Siampolee, Abhisit announced just yesterday that he is going to forgive half of all farmers debt. Do you consider that a wasteful vote buying exercise as well?

[jfchandler]

Just came back home from an ill-advised trip down around the Central World area... Gotta say... never seen anything like it... What do I mean?

Not that there was a couple mile section of Sukhumvit Road/Rama I totally blocked off most of the day by a procession of Red Shirt cars and pickups that just stopped dead in the street, turning the whole area into a big parking lot.

Not that Siam Paragon, Central World and most of the other major shopping centers around the Chidlom/Ploenchit/Siam Square area were closed by mid afternoon (except for a few that allowed the Red Shirts in to use their bathrooms). Fortunately, Big C Radjadamri stayed open and the BTS Sukhumvit Line kept running.

But chiefly, in spending a couple of hours walking around the area during the afternoon, I hardly saw a single police officer and certainly no Army presence... anywhere.... No police vehicles, none on foot. None around the major intersections....

Even when I walked around some of the major shopping centers, it was their local security guards standing around at the barricades...and police nowhere to be seen. Maybe they were staging (basing) somewhere... I dunno....

Finally, on the way home, was walking past the Ploenchit BTS station intersection on Sukhumvit Road .... traffic was pretty much dead along Sukhumvit there... But there was some cross traffic making it up Wireless Road. And as I looked down, it was guys in Red Shirts with whistles who were waving some traffic thru while a single traffic policeman stoodby talking on his radio.

Be real curious what others saw while out and around today. I keep reading about the tens of thousands of police and soldier supposedly mobilized for all this. But around the central part of town today, I sure didn't see any.

[Bkung]

Thailand 60% population are farmers and Mr Toksin already brain waste these people,

Near the junction of the place where I stayed a group of motorcyclist listen to 'Hitler' style channel while waiting for customer.

Middle and upper class will never win this war , We have to only pray and hope all the best for this lovely country !

Edited April 3, 2010 by Bkung

[siampolee]

Johncitizen.

Hoisted by my own petard

I personally regard the move as a vote garnering exercise, however the scheme as I understand it involves the debt being reduced by up to 50% by money being moved to the debt holding bank, The onus is then on the debtor to pay the balance back to the bank rather than the money going into a communal village fund where it would be available without strings attached as to the purpose of the funds being disbursed.

The establishment of a micro banking system as has been done in Bangladesh would be a good move along with a debt counselling along with an education in money management scheme too.

I've lived here fro 20years and not one government has actually tried to educate the average person in basic money management skills. Somchai or Porntip have a debt they go to the friendly local loan shark at 20% a month for their much needed funds.

The banking system here does not cater to the man or the woman in the street it is in fact as I see it at the same level as the banks in the England of my youth in the 1950's where banks were considered the realm of the upper classes.

The man and the woman in the street need the education in financial matters and the bankers need to come out of their ivory towers and realise that their is indeed a very large market place for them and their banking system far removed from A.T.M. cards with the ordinary people.

make financial education available and all will prosper, handouts give no return apart from a parliamentary seat perhaps and even a ministers portfolio which will enrich the post holder but not the man or woman who voted for then as we all to plainly see is the case with Thaksin and his cronies

[johncitizen]

@ Siampolee,

Financial education would be a responsible move on the part of the big banks, but I wonder if they would see it in their interests to provide such. The international financial crisis was caused precisely because banks encouraged irresponsible spending and then offloaded the bad debt in the form of pre-packaged securities to other IFI's- and I very much doubt they have learned their lesson after such a quick bounce-back to form. Any such initiative would have to be government led, or else I doubt they would ever happen.

Good call, anyway.

[Ijustwannateach]

People haven't taken my hints, therefore this thread will temporarily be closed while I am issuing warnings and cleaning up.

Done. Continued attempts to take the thread off-course in the manner of deleted material will receive warnings. Further warnings will also be accompanied by penalties.