Red-Shirts To Intensify Pressure

[cheguevara]

dutchweller, carefully dodging the question as to whether he's Thai or not.

[dutchweller]

dutchweller, carefully dodging the question as to whether he's Thai or not.

And what constitutes me being Thai?

My passport?

I have 2

where i was Borne?

Where I was raised?

or my Parents? I also have 2 one Dutch 1 Thai....

[hammered]

Honest answer - Thailand is at a tipping point - I'm sorry some businesses have lost profits - some have people have lost their lives - I understand some farang businessmen here are angry - but to have a couple of posts saying oh yes it's so bad we lost profits and our staff earning a fortune had to be re-deployed doesn't make me cry in my night time cocoa.

To talk of 'many people of that class' is so condescending and arrogant. We stopped talking about class and looking down on rural workers at the turn of the Century – and I don't mean this one just gone. Just listen to the 'tone' of the post – nothing to do with the crisis or the thread – all about 'our profit and our lost business'. - then another known yellow poster jumps in 'oh I so agree'! Jeeze

Yellow? RED? PINK? Black?

Actually I was not talking about profits at all I was ANGRY that I had to tell my staff they are no longer employed and have lost there income altogether and to imply that any of us are earning a fortune is just missinformation ...

And for you information our owners are THAI and they built there business up from nothing...

I am employed on a LOCAL contract.. subject to losing my job is just as real for me.

SO dot try and justify this crap with the class issue.

Then be more careful in your choice of words - everyone is sad if anyone loses their jobs - including farangs - but it does not mean that the whole red cause is S**t. There are many issues which have a just cause - sorry your career got caught up in it - but don't condemn the whole thing and don't paint all the people as hating the reds - it's not true. Good luck anyway.

Well every day I walk though the Sea of RED and I have not seen a single Iota of evidence to say the reds camped out in the CBD are there for the betterment of Thailand....I see people setting up Stalls Hawking crap, and having a great ol time .....

I dont try to tell me that these people are not paid to be there as I have first hand experience that they indeed are as I have had staff tell me to my face sorry I can earn more money from the reds if I go protest with them because the hotel has no Service charge this month with no customers.

So if your REDS in ChangMai are not the same as the ones I see every day perhaps you should ask them to change T shirt colors so we can differentiate them

The reds in CM are well known for killing poeple, beating up farmers and gays.

[cheguevara]

Anybody complaning in 2008? Commodities are volatile, particularly since the grain to gasahol schemes began. If oil goes back up I doubt the farmers will be complaining.

I know Thai rice isn't exactly the same as some other global markets but it won't be too different. About $USD250/ST

Care to explain why the government has promised the farmers 10,000 Baht per ton and then only gives them 6,100 or 6,200 Baht? Seems a little fraudulent to me, to say the least.

Do you care to explain why the oil was promised to be 250$ a barrel but it's only 85$ now?

That's an entirely different issue, don't you think? The poor rice farmers were promised 10,000 Baht as part of a new government scheme. And then they're only paid 6,000 Baht.

You can't really compare that to oil companies making 1 billion profit instead of 3 billion profit.

Dodging the question doesn't make the problem go away.

Edited April 20, 2010 by cheguevara

[cheguevara]

dutchweller, carefully dodging the question as to whether he's Thai or not.

And what constitutes me being Thai?

My passport?

I have 2

where i was Borne?

Where I was raised?

or my Parents? I also have 2 one Dutch 1 Thai....

You don't. You wish, but you don't. Spare us the lies and get back on topic.

[SpoliaOpima]

Abhisit has made a complete and utter fool of himself.

The danger is that his refusal to hold an election for fear of getting voted out may result in a split in the army with potentially disatrous consequences.

He is very stubborn , i would agree with you . It is sad , result may be civil war , and army mutinies . And the guy owes his job to a military coup to start with .

Wait a minute, you have confused cause and effect. Blame the Tai Rouge for not compromising and negotiating. Any blood that has flowed and will flow is on their hands as a result.

[tb86]

yeah and im asking did the farmers ever get 10bht per kilo? I will ignore the uncalled for flame,,,so would any of us expect to survive by selling 15kg of rice per day, no we would not. How much of the year do they work on the rice? thats a actual question 4 months maybe? so why arent they working during the in between time, jan till august? many of them are some maybe not.. and thats not because anyone is forcing them to stay home, dont work for 8 months of the year no wonder your poor,get a second or third job, ever seen anyone harvesting rice at night? so i think your yearly income numbers may be a bit skewed for some.

You've gone about as low as you can go. You're basically telling all the poor people of Thailand that they're poor because they're too lazy to work. Shame on you.

no just those that dont help themselves, if i didnt work for 8 months of the year and bitched about not having any money would anyone on here feel bad for me? Sorry this is real life man... And its my own responsibility to take care of me and my family, not a government.or my nighbors..

[lannarebirth]

Anybody complaning in 2008? Commodities are volatile, particularly since the grain to gasahol schemes began. If oil goes back up I doubt the farmers will be complaining.

I know Thai rice isn't exactly the same as some other global markets but it won't be too different. About $USD250/ST

Care to explain why the government has promised the farmers 10,000 Baht per ton and then only gives them 6,100 or 6,200 Baht? Seems a little fraudulent to me, to say the least.

Do you care to explain why the oil was promised to be 250$ a barrel but it's only 85$ now?

That's an entirely different issue, don't you think? The poor rice farmers were promised 10,000 Baht as part of a new government scheme. And then they're only paid 6,000 Baht.

You can't really compare that to oil companies making 1 billion profit instead of 3 billion profit.

Dodging the question doesn't make the problem go away.

I can't quite remember what the OP is about but I doubt its about rice so this will be my last post on the subject. When I sell rice I get the local market price, when the market price is beneath the governments benchmark one may seek subsidy from the government for the difference. I've never had to. I don't know why you haven't managed to get the market price or the benchmark price and you've provided no evidence either. This is from a week ago:

http://www.commodityonline.com/news/Thaila...-27279-3-1.html

Anyhow, as I said most rice farmers, particularly small scale rice farmers are very pleased with the governments new scheme. It seems to be large growers, millers and "middlemen" that don't like it very much. Not coincidentally these are the same groups that have benefitted the most in the past under more corrupt regimes.

[cheguevara]

yeah and im asking did the farmers ever get 10bht per kilo? I will ignore the uncalled for flame,,,so would any of us expect to survive by selling 15kg of rice per day, no we would not. How much of the year do they work on the rice? thats a actual question 4 months maybe? so why arent they working during the in between time, jan till august? many of them are some maybe not.. and thats not because anyone is forcing them to stay home, dont work for 8 months of the year no wonder your poor,get a second or third job, ever seen anyone harvesting rice at night? so i think your yearly income numbers may be a bit skewed for some.

You've gone about as low as you can go. You're basically telling all the poor people of Thailand that they're poor because they're too lazy to work. Shame on you.

no just those that dont help themselves, if i didnt work for 8 months of the year and bitched about not having any money would anyone on here feel bad for me? Sorry this is real life man... And its my own responsibility to take care of me and my family, not a government.or my nighbors..

What has the government done to provide job opportunities for the poor and uneducated? Don't say that they're too lazy to learn as well. I'm sure if they had money, they would love to get an Oxford education like Abhisit has.

[SpoliaOpima]

Back to the topic at hand, the "peaceful" protesters:

http://ap.cjonline.com/pstories/20100420/612240229.shtml

[jdinasia]

dutchweller, carefully dodging the question as to whether he's Thai or not.

And what constitutes me being Thai?

My passport?

I have 2

where i was Borne?

Where I was raised?

or my Parents? I also have 2 one Dutch 1 Thai....

You don't. You wish, but you don't. Spare us the lies and get back on topic.

Hmmm He answered you (though you were not entitled to an answer) and now you claim to know that what he said is not true .....

so simply ... Prove it.

[cheguevara]

Abhisit has made a complete and utter fool of himself.

The danger is that his refusal to hold an election for fear of getting voted out may result in a split in the army with potentially disatrous consequences.

He is very stubborn , i would agree with you . It is sad , result may be civil war , and army mutinies . And the guy owes his job to a military coup to start with .

Wait a minute, you have confused cause and effect. Blame the Tai Rouge for not compromising and negotiating. Any blood that has flowed and will flow is on their hands as a result.

According to your logic, if I disagree with someone from your family (as an example) and refuse to negotiate with them, then someone from your family decides to shoot someone from my family, the blood is on my hands?

[tijnebijn]

dutchweller, carefully dodging the question as to whether he's Thai or not.

And what constitutes me being Thai?

My passport?

I have 2

where i was Borne?

Where I was raised?

or my Parents? I also have 2 one Dutch 1 Thai....

Just quite please , you really are disturbing this thread with your nonsense .

This is a forum not a place to attack one another or react too quick when being attacked capish ?

[cheguevara]

That's an entirely different issue, don't you think? The poor rice farmers were promised 10,000 Baht as part of a new government scheme. And then they're only paid 6,000 Baht.

You can't really compare that to oil companies making 1 billion profit instead of 3 billion profit.

Dodging the question doesn't make the problem go away.

It might be, but seems your brain is not capable of more than repeating the same 2 lines of text over and over and over.

Completely discarding any promises your paymaster has given and sticking to single thing that not even Abhisit promised but can't deliver.

While I do pity the farmers and do strive to provide them with better life through many thousands of baht I donate to various organizations every month, mainly dealing with rural youth, I pity them even more to have a bunch of corrupt mercenaries and their "jewels of intelligence" followers representing them.

EDIT: typo

Since you can't find a way to disprove or beat my arguments, your attacks are now getting personal?

Edited April 20, 2010 by cheguevara

[tb86]

yeah and im asking did the farmers ever get 10bht per kilo? I will ignore the uncalled for flame,,,so would any of us expect to survive by selling 15kg of rice per day, no we would not. How much of the year do they work on the rice? thats a actual question 4 months maybe? so why arent they working during the in between time, jan till august? many of them are some maybe not.. and thats not because anyone is forcing them to stay home, dont work for 8 months of the year no wonder your poor,get a second or third job, ever seen anyone harvesting rice at night? so i think your yearly income numbers may be a bit skewed for some.

You've gone about as low as you can go. You're basically telling all the poor people of Thailand that they're poor because they're too lazy to work. Shame on you.

no just those that dont help themselves, if i didnt work for 8 months of the year and bitched about not having any money would anyone on here feel bad for me? Sorry this is real life man... And its my own responsibility to take care of me and my family, not a government.or my nighbors..

What has the government done to provide job opportunities for the poor and uneducated? Don't say that they're too lazy to learn as well. I'm sure if they had money, they would love to get an Oxford education like Abhisit has.

so they need the government to help them learn to be a taxi driver, work in construction, or a factory or a restaurant, or any of the million jobs out there that one could do with little to no education if they chose to, just like plenty of people in bangkok do?

[humfurry]

dutchweller, carefully dodging the question as to whether he's Thai or not.

And what constitutes me being Thai?

My passport?

I have 2

where i was Borne?

Where I was raised?

or my Parents? I also have 2 one Dutch 1 Thai....

You don't. You wish, but you don't. Spare us the lies and get back on topic.

Well Che... it seems that you have a good internet connection behind the Red barricade of used tires and bamboo pickets. And it's good to know that you're out there in the sweltering sun, sleeping on the streets at night and that you're willing to spill your blood to defend your cause! Because you know that the Army is coming, but we know you're a true "peoples" revolutionary.

Then again, maybe you're sitting in a big comfy chair and sucking down a latte with the Red leadership in the lobby of the Hyatt?

[Slip]

Abhisit has made a complete and utter fool of himself.

The danger is that his refusal to hold an election for fear of getting voted out may result in a split in the army with potentially disatrous consequences.

He is very stubborn , i would agree with you . It is sad , result may be civil war , and army mutinies . And the guy owes his job to a military coup to start with .

Wait a minute, you have confused cause and effect. Blame the Tai Rouge for not compromising and negotiating. Any blood that has flowed and will flow is on their hands as a result.

According to your logic, if I disagree with someone from your family (as an example) and refuse to negotiate with them, then someone from your family decides to shoot someone from my family, the blood is on my hands?

Ridiculous, as ever. what the hel_l are you going on about man.

[rabo]

What I find funny is that when Somchai Wongsawat was Prime Minister and the PAD laid siege on the government house and Suvarnabhumi airport, Abhisit called for the government to dissolve parliament and "respect the will of the Thai people".

Now it is Abhisit who is in that exact same situation. Will be dissolve parliament and "respect the will of the Thai people"?

Abhisit is not Mr. Thaksin's brother-in-law.

[cheguevara]

Ridiculous, as ever. what the hel_l are you going on about man.

I quoted the wrong post, sorry. Honest mistake, I'm human. Blame me.

[Tod Daniels]

And how do you know who handed them out? Or are you another colour coded apologist of red or yellow on here?

<SNIPPED FOR BAD ENGRISH> or not. ...

Then again maybe you shouldn't be so "hammered" when you post.

It is barely understandable even in "horse speek" (whore speak) or "thai-engrish".

I'm sure you have spell check, USE IT. If you've been a member since 2006, I think you can sa-peak engrish better than the piss poor way you did. Give it a try man, or have you lived in Nakhon Nowhere too long?

As an aside: I heard from less than semi-relaible sources (out on my soi drinking with the redz, yellowz, dark bluez as well as the local Police) that it was none other than the "Friends of Newin" who made and distributed the stickers on Silom.

Good on Newin if he had the balls to do that. .. Finally a thai with balls. ..

[sbk]

I have just had to prune this thread. Extensively.

Drop the flames, behave in a civil manner. Do not quote a flame but use the report button.

I, for one, am getting fed up with the tit for tat schoolyard behavior. I do hope that makes everything quite clear to all posters concerned.

[eeconomist]

What I find funny is that when Somchai Wongsawat was Prime Minister and the PAD laid siege on the government house and Suvarnabhumi airport, Abhisit called for the government to dissolve parliament and "respect the will of the Thai people".

Now it is Abhisit who is in that exact same situation. Will be dissolve parliament and "respect the will of the Thai people"?

Abhisit is not Mr. Thaksin's brother-in-law.

Talk is cheap. They don't call a person Mr Lip Service for nothing!!

[monkfish]

I have just had to prune this thread. Extensively.

Drop the flames, behave in a civil manner. Do not quote a flame but use the report button.

I, for one, am getting fed up with the tit for tat schoolyard behavior. I do hope that makes everything quite clear to all posters concerned.

The report button but doesn't seem to work or does it depend on who you are reporting?

So better just return the flames!!

Edited April 20, 2010 by monkfish

[commons]

You got it. In order to cling on to his unelected position, Abhisit is willing to risk splitting the army, which could easily lead to a civil war.

And we should recall that Abhisit's original justification for his unelected grabbing of power was that two people had been killed in the street fighting. He promised reconciliation.

Now that over 20 people have died in exactly the same circumstances, we hear nothing from Abhisit as he cowers in his hole.

He is nothing more than a self-serving hypocrite.

Ahhhh another nutcase for the ignore list... they sure do seem to be coming out of the woodwork of late.

Why are all the RED-farangs so bitter? Fresh supply of farm girls cut off?

You are not very good at presenting a logical position. If you are ignoring me, then why would you respond with the above post. By responding, you have contradicted yourself, again.

And on to your insult of rural people by your 'farm girls cut off' comment. If you are saying that farm girls are prostitutes, then that is a demographic slur that deserves contempt and no further comment. If you are saying that the red cause is likely to increase the availability of prostitutes, using a demographic slur to somehow reinforce your point, then you are wrong again - the red agenda is to make the rural poor more prosperous, hence this would reduce the availability of prostitutes who may at the moment have no other financial recourse.

You really seem to be a very unpleasant person, who insults instead of debates, and who has no respect for the rural majority of Thai people.

i'll not dissect your post. i'm just wondering - you want to show off some rhetorical skills? like... you put words in a row, throw in some fancy terms - & you'll believe it's convincing or makes sense? are your posts an example of "political discussion" trained in some kind of institution [not for the mental... etc]?

your whole post is an insult to rational argument. you insinuate notions no-one declared. you draw conclusions that are not supported.

& now you _whine_ when somebody counters you?

[commons]

Abhisit has made a complete and utter fool of himself.

The danger is that his refusal to hold an election for fear of getting voted out may result in a split in the army with potentially disatrous consequences.

He is very stubborn , i would agree with you . It is sad , result may be civil war , and army mutinies . And the guy owes his job to a military coup to start with .

Wait a minute, you have confused cause and effect. Blame the Tai Rouge for not compromising and negotiating. Any blood that has flowed and will flow is on their hands as a result.

According to your logic, if I disagree with someone from your family (as an example) and refuse to negotiate with them, then someone from your family decides to shoot someone from my family, the blood is on my hands?

you ever heard the term "fallacy", dear che?

[cheguevara]

I said above that I quoted the wrong post. How hard is that to comprehend?

[commons]

I said above that I quoted the wrong post. How hard is that to comprehend?

again i don't get what you try to say. i don't care about whatever post you quote or mis-quote. you stated:

"According to your logic, if I disagree with someone from your family (as an example) and refuse to negotiate with them, then someone from your family decides to shoot someone from my family, the blood is on my hands?"

_this_ _is_ _not_ _a_ _quote_, che? you understand me? _this_ _is_ _an_ _example_ of what you may be inclined to call "reasoning", ok?

my reply to that was, "you ever heard the term "fallacy", dear che?"

[cheguevara]

If you would have read the original post I intended to quote, you wouldn't need to ask. Again, I quoted the wrong post, my fault, my bad. If I'm damned into all eternity for quoting the wrong post, so be it.

The bunny is dead. Stop beating the bunny.

Edited April 20, 2010 by cheguevara

[brahmburgers]

BB's comments in red

What I find funny is that when Somchai Wongsawat was Prime Minister and the PAD laid siege on the government house and Suvarnabhumi airport, Abhisit called for the government to dissolve parliament and "respect the will of the Thai people". Now it is Abhisit who is in that exact same situation. Will be dissolve parliament and "respect the will of the Thai people"?

Two different protests. One was relatively peaceful (Yellows), the current one is dead-set on causing injury and mayhem. Two different PM's. One was a wonk who never had an original idea or took an initiative in his life (Somchai), the other is head and shoulders better. I could say 'apples and oranges' but it's more like comparing a cupie doll and a scholar.

Relatively peaceful? We seem to forget that the PAD was armed when they seized government house? And armed when they seized the airport? They even stationed armed guards at the airport entrances and closed it with barbed wire. And they were quite peaceful, I agree, when they chased the guy down the street and beat him until he was almost dead, then dumped him in a ditch, which was caught by television crews.

Not nice, for sure, but not as bad as harboring a slew of disguised killers armed with automatic weapons and grenades who are glad to use them any chance they can - against security detailsOh yeah, and they were also quite peaceful when they cleared they finally cleared the airport and one of their own yellow guards was found dead, killed by their own yellow shirts. How come only you and no one else ever heard of that?

Abhisit supported those guys. After all, he made one of them his Foreign Minister as a 'thank you'. But he's on the other side of the fence now. He's the one being pushed out and I can understand why it's suddenly not acceptable anymore to instantly dissolve parliament and call for new elections, which he clearly knows will lose, because he doesn't have the support of the majority of the Thai people.

Abhisit is not spooked by the thought of an election. His party may not get the majority next time around, but the Reds are doing many things now which will ensure they get a lot less than their 'less-than-majority vote' they got previous times. I may be wrong, but I would bet the Thai voters will hand the Red factions a resounding 'NO' next time there's a vote ...including Issan voters. Should be interesting, even with tainted elections that Thailand is known for.

[SpoliaOpima]

And how do you know who handed them out? Or are you another colour coded apologist of red or yellow on here?

All I know is a lot of people who are neither red or yellow believe that aim. Who handeed them out I will leave to the conspiuracy theorists and red and yellow cheerleaders of whom there are enough on here

I doubt Red shirts handed the stickers out. Thaksin has forcefully denied it. Nor do I believe this is the real issue at hand.

Dont see how it could be anything else but a political smear tactic.

It must be true then.

Now we have fake reds giving out fake stickers. Can you really take these people seriously? They're just playing games and seeing how much trouble they can stir up. The reds don't really have a single voice and yes, some of the reds want Thaksin back, and yes some would make him president. When the dust settles some of the protesters will be shocked to learn what they were really fighting for.

Yep and I guess fake reds are distributing these fake bandanas many of the Tai Rouge are wearing. In case you don't read Thai, it says 'Thaksin.'

Edited April 21, 2010 by SpoliaOpima