Thai Army Tells Red Shirts To Disperse From Rally Base

[dobadoy]

You people are all results orientated. You really prefer having the Army trying to remove 50,000 armed protesters with grenade launchers and machine guns as opposed to having elections? Lets run an election, see that the Dem's coalition government is still in tact and get on with our lives. What do you want from Anupong? Perhaps he doesn't want ten thousand dead bodies on his conscience.

So lets say half way through the term of the next government, an rich wealthy elite billionnaire decides to fund 100,000 people go sit in the middle of bangkok with molotovs and assorted weapons and demand an immediate election. Is that how you want the country run?

edit: sorry, adjectivitis

Edited April 22, 2010 by dobadoy

[asiancup2007]

kinovino Confusion. Police investigating sounds that might came from BTS station.

terryfrd Nation TV says it was M79 explosion. At least 2 soldiers hurt. Ambulances on the way.

Unfortunatley won't be able to take them to Chula hospital, wonder how the poor patients in there are coping?

There is one doctor for every 5,300 people in the northeast, compared with one per 850 in Bangkok and one in 2,800 for the country over all, according to government statistics.

Yes, a situation that predates both Abhisit AND Thaksin's premierships. So how is it relevant here?

The patients in Chula wont want for doctors that's all.

[animatic]

The result of a forced early election caused by street mob action,

is an endless cycle of the same, with coups to remove the most nut case leaders in between.

The PAD may have started this ball rolling, but the buck must stop now or it will be endless.

So actually, I want to PREVENT a horrendous result.

Edited April 22, 2010 by animatic

[chadintheusa]

Simple question

If in your home nation over 20 coups were done by the power elite using puppets as their tools, would you be ok with that?

If the power elite had previously shot down a thousand university students at the University of Iowa, would you be ok with that?

If you were told you had to crawl on the ground when talking to the upper class or even approaching them, would you be ok with that?

If your supreme court had the power to throw out your elected PM or President, which is not the case in Europe or North America, would that be just fine with you? Only the Parliament can remove the PM or in USA, Congress can throw out the President. The court cannot.

Why are you OK with a constitution put into place after a military coup by a captain?

Obviously the Captain was acting for the regime. Why is it ok? Would it be ok with you in your home country for a Captain to take over from your PM or President?

Why do you make fun of the poor here? Would it be ok with you to laugh at the poor in your own nation?

Are you racists?

Are you just angry old men playing sick games?

People are dead and hurt and you laugh.

Why?

Just wondering.

Well the US supreme court has crowned a president before.

[dobadoy]

The patients in Chula wont want for doctors that's all.

And my point was not about the number of doctors, but about the pyschologically traumatic effect of being trapped in the middle of a violent uprising with bombs, guns and thugs with molotov cocktails outside the hospital doors.

Your point was, again? I didn't quite get it.

[generalgrant]

You people are all results orientated. You really prefer having the Army trying to remove 50,000 armed protesters with grenade launchers and machine guns as opposed to having elections? Lets run an election, see that the Dem's coalition government is still in tact and get on with our lives. What do you want from Anupong? Perhaps he doesn't want ten thousand dead bodies on his conscience.

So lets say half way through the term of the next government, an rich wealthy elite billionnaire decides to fund 100,000 people go sit in the middle of bangkok with molotovs and assorted weapons and demand an immediate election. Is that how you want the country run?

edit: sorry, adjectivitis

I would prefer a working class PM.

I would prefer a REAL election and then I would enjoy the Elite not doing over 20 coups.

Why is it anyone from the west would defend this un-democratic system?

Go ahead a google and watch and see the many times this regime has shot and killed non-violent protesters at Universities.

Yeah--the reds are armed now and they had better be because if they were not, this regime would have no problem in killing them.

Defending this current regime is sick.

Are you really farangs from the west or just Thais pretending to be farangs posting propaganda?

[dominique355]

Why doesn't Abhisit hold an election, get a legitimate public mandate, and then use it to confound the reds? I'll tell you why - he would lose an election, because people simply don't like him enough for him to keep his job democratically. He is seen by the majority (i.e. the whole country - not just Bangkok) as not understanding them and failing to represent their best interests, and they think he sucks for that.

The only way that Abhisit can keep the seat that he stole is by hiding like a craven-hearted coward, while killing his own people and splittig the country in half. I look forward to seeing him pay for it.

I agree that Abhisit would probably loose the election if he would give in to the Red mob. And that would also be a good example for any other colored shirts to stage a similar sit-in on Rajaprasong until the then elected government will step down and call for new elections and then ... see what I mean?

No government can give in to black-mailing of a handful of desperadoes, not matter what color their shits are.

But Abhisit would probably loose elections now because those who supported him, are disappointed about his weakness, not because they want the Reds in power.

[Redsunset]

BOOOOOM! Someone just shot a grenade at the electric train.

[hammered]

Sounds like reds lobbed a big firework into the multicolouredsd injuring 2 people including a foreigner

Getting tense

[traderjm]

Oh how rich that is. A classic case of the pot calling the kettle black. If you review all the posts here you’ll note a surprising lack of substance and facts on any posts supporting the Bangkok Elite and the current government. Those posts are indeed bereft of reasoning and logic and like your post, for the most part, consist mainly of name calling. “Crackpot” is a good example. Indeed, the posts which support the government that was illegally overthrown by a military coup are well reasoned. The posts that now simply call for new fair and free elections seem unassailable.

You must be joking?

The "facts" have been posted time and time again but nobody on the RED seems able to understand anything that doesn't agree with exactly what they want to say and hear word for word. Anyone that attempts to point out that fact is called a Yellow... its tiresome childish and about what I would expect from anyone associated with or sympathetic to that movement.

Fair and free elections.. good lord man do you live in a cave?

[FreedomDude]

I just peeked in at the Red rally from the North side. Despite the primary attention now on the situation at Silom, the Red crowd at Ratchasaprong is as HUGE as its EVER BEEN. Solid sea of red stretching from Ratchaprasong all the way northward over the canal to Pratunam. No sign of troops, police or conflicts of any kind on the north side.

Is there a thread free from the political debates where we can just share field reports?

[Netfan]

And he is not in charge. Watch your back mate. If he shouts fire, who knows which way the bullets will be flying. Certainly Thailand will be flying up the UN's list of oppressive regimes and even onto US sanctions lists.

PAD, the people who wrested power from the People on the premise they were too stupid to vote, through mob rule and army control by their elite backers are now coming back on to the street to ensure that the power is not returned through the ballot box.

Can I have accurate soundbite of the day for that please on the BBC?

Nice organisation and I am not surprised they are disguising themselves as multi colourted protesters.

Once the yellow shirts go on, then the army will split.

Geesh never really took note of your posts much before but you are a crackpot I see.. time to ignore your ramblings. Why are so many of the RED-farangs unstable?

Oh no need to answer won't be read

Oh how rich that is. A classic case of the pot calling the kettle black. If you review all the posts here you’ll note a surprising lack of substance and facts on any posts supporting the Bangkok Elite and the current government. Those posts are indeed bereft of reasoning and logic and like your post, for the most part, consist mainly of name calling. “Crackpot” is a good example. Indeed, the posts which support the government that was illegally overthrown by a military coup are well reasoned. The posts that now simply call for new fair and free elections seem unassailable.

And in your last sentence you ignore the fact that Abhisit offered elections - a year early, which the Reds turned down. And now their leaders cannot agree on whether to negotiate or not.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Netfan

[Chaimai]

You people are all results orientated. You really prefer having the Army trying to remove 50,000 armed protesters with grenade launchers and machine guns as opposed to having elections? Lets run an election, see that the Dem's coalition government is still in tact and get on with our lives. What do you want from Anupong? Perhaps he doesn't want ten thousand dead bodies on his conscience.

So lets say half way through the term of the next government, an rich wealthy elite billionnaire decides to fund 100,000 people go sit in the middle of bangkok with molotovs and assorted weapons and demand an immediate election. Is that how you want the country run?

edit: sorry, adjectivitis

I would prefer a working class PM.

I would prefer a REAL election and then I would enjoy the Elite not doing over 20 coups.

Why is it anyone from the west would defend this un-democratic system?

Go ahead a google and watch and see the many times this regime has shot and killed non-violent protesters at Universities.

Yeah--the reds are armed now and they had better be because if they were not, this regime would have no problem in killing them.

Defending this current regime is sick.

Are you really farangs from the west or just Thais pretending to be farangs posting propaganda?

As a myopic propogandist, you are not making a bad fist of it yourself.

Wake up and come into the real world.

[asiancup2007]

The patients in Chula wont want for doctors that's all.

And my point was not about the number of doctors, but about the pyschologically traumatic effect of being trapped in the middle of a violent uprising with bombs, guns and thugs with molotov cocktails outside the hospital doors.

Your point was, again? I didn't quite get it.

Violent uprising? Hardly. That'll probably come sometime after the slaughter.

Edited April 22, 2010 by asiancup2007

[saintofsilence]

I just peeked in at the Red rally from the North side. Despite the primary attention now on the situation at Silom, the Red crowd at Ratchasaprong is as HUGE as its EVER BEEN. Solid sea of red stretching from Ratchaprasong all the way northward over the canal to Pratunam. No sign of troops, police or conflicts of any kind on the north side.

Is there a thread free from the political debates where we can just share field reports?

Thats a good idea a field report thread it is very confusing with some many threads

[humfurry]

kinovino Confusion. Police investigating sounds that might came from BTS station.

terryfrd Nation TV says it was M79 explosion. At least 2 soldiers hurt. Ambulances on the way.

Unfortunatley won't be able to take them to Chula hospital, wonder how the poor patients in there are coping?

There is one doctor for every 5,300 people in the northeast, compared with one per 850 in Bangkok and one in 2,800 for the country over all, according to government statistics.

So I'm to assume from your post that people in the northeast don't get sick as often? Try to be a bit more specific... birth death ratio for example.

Consider cosmetic surgeons, dermatologists, dentists and the fact that doctors in Bkk like to make money. I can drive for 3 kilometers and see 50 dermatologists offices and another 50 (have a perfect smile) teeth whitening clinics.

I do agree that the NE needs doctors and more hospitals, but I think the numbers are a bit skewed due to the fact that skin lightening isn't an issue in the NE.

Edited April 22, 2010 by humfurry

[dobadoy]

Yellows facebook page now screaming for all yellows to get out of Silom area as reds are appearing with M16s.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=108372992525155

[FatherF]

Excellent idea! What about it MODS?

FF

[FreedomDude]

I just peeked in at the Red rally from the North side. Despite the primary attention now on the situation at Silom, the Red crowd at Ratchasaprong is as HUGE as its EVER BEEN. Solid sea of red stretching from Ratchaprasong all the way northward over the canal to Pratunam. No sign of troops, police or conflicts of any kind on the north side.

Is there a thread free from the political debates where we can just share field reports?

Thats a good idea a field report thread it is very confusing with some many threads

Yes, it really would be helpful. The situation could become dangerous for many people very quickly, and the Thai tv stations seem intent with showing nothing but soaps in the evenings. It would be nice to know what others are seeing and what's happening out there.

[FatherF]

TNN reports 3 were injured, including at least one foreigner.

[hammered]

Do we have to keep having people waving the US constituion and establishment of the US around? It has nothing to do with this and if developed further could involve us going completley off topic over how ther US has not developed as the fathers would have wanted.

Anyway what does it have to do with this situation?

[dobadoy]

Another explosing being reported in the last few seconds on facebook.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=108372992525155

[hammered]

Sounds like soldiers are saying grenades not fireworks used against people at Silom

[dobadoy]

The facebook reports are saying 4 M79 grenades in total, but no info about where they have been fired from or to or whom by.

[commons]

One the reasons why this forum is either frustrating or fun - my point was one of perception and how things can be seen differently. Your point, whilst I am sure valid, does not further the discussion on the issue raised but simply takes it down an avenue of red vs yellows, negating any attempt at a neutral discussion of the perception of the crisis today outside of taking sides. I am not saying your are wrong just seeing if there is room for a more mature debate.; Oh well, I tried

Can I safely assume you are NOT addressing this to me? As my reply that you quoted had nothing to do with REDS vs. Yellows...

Just to clear things up a little...

In reply to this:-

The problem here is one of perception, jingthing. As an exercise, let's assume you are right - I know I am right, I can hear you saying...but bear with me. Assuming you are right and there are many many people of the same opinion, there are equally many many of the opinion that something is rotten in the "State of Denmark" - both on a national and dare I say it, international stage. For those that do not have the unique wisdom of the posters here on this forum, the perception is that the Abhisit government has arrived at this point following a coup, international airport closures that resulted in literally tens of thousands of stranded foreigners and a few other shenanigans besides, those probably more of relevance here in Thailand, disqualifed parties, red cards, yellow cards etc etc. If I was to sit down with my father or brother or my mates from the pub and say the present government is legal, they would say "get out of here, there the ones who did this this and this......leaving my Aunt Mo not able to get back for little Johnny's christening"...So, whilst I might agree with you, it is equally good reasoning to see the other side of the coin too...

It is part of the reason why one cannot see this problem just fading away if they all packed up and went home this evening.

You wrote:-

I would ask one simple question. The TWO gov't before the current one obtained their power under the exact same rules. I did not see the REDS crying then about democracy. Did you?

Regardless of whether you believe those two were ousted via the courts or political games, it does not change that they STARTED in exactly the same way AFTER elections AFTER the coup... so why pray tell did the REDs not complain then???

and now you write:-

Can I safely assume you are NOT addressing this to me? As my reply that you quoted had nothing to do with REDS vs. Yellows...

My perception that this indeed did go down an alleyway of red vs yellows is obviously awry...mea culpa

in reply to danc. i'm sorry, i'm too late to reply to your original post na:

i like your post trying to differentiate between "perception of events" & so-called "true facts" (by one side or the other). i feel sad that your original approach - leaving realm of "absolute truth" for insight into human mentality, "perception", or "views" as the Buddha said - have either been ignored, neglected or mis-interpreted.

i guess/believe/think... your approach, you sharing mind, was/is one of the more sensible & constructive ones on TV. as it opens realm for negotiations. leave attachment to views behind ("they're bad, they _did_ THESE horrible things. i _can't_ stand pain to talk to ENEMY") - but open game for realizing humble self-assessment & ... realize/enjoy opponent as partner :-) as they say, "it takes 2 to tango" :-)

thank you danc

[Netfan]

Do we have to keep having people waving the US constituion and establishment of the US around? It has nothing to do with this and if developed further could involve us going completley off topic over how ther US has not developed as the fathers would have wanted.

Anyway what does it have to do with this situation?

It has nothing to do with this situation, but it helps the Red apologists divert attention from the fact that their movement has dissolved into anarchy with the infighting amongst the leadership.

[hammered]

Looking at Terry Fredricson Twitter and it seems he thinks at least one of the explosions wasnt a firewok. Looking heavy

BBC also reporting at least explosions

Edited April 22, 2010 by hammered

[animatic]

Do we have to keep having people waving the US constituion and establishment of the US around? It has nothing to do with this and if developed further could involve us going completley off topic over how ther US has not developed as the fathers would have wanted.

Anyway what does it have to do with this situation?

He is trying to make it a rational for a peoples revolution here.

Thing is the Am Rev leaders were a MUCH more THOUGHTFUL bunch than these Reddened guys.

The quotability of US founding fathers centuries later is rather high per capita.

Not as The UN is not my father in the bunch.

And their ideas about how to create just and lasting government were actually functional for long periods.

While not perfect certainly.

Non of their work lays ANY justification for these Red Shirt moves, since the preponderance of

' Red Shirt Philosophy', Id either unclear, fascist o text book Maoist.

He also utterly misuses the General Grant moniker because he acts and speaks NOTHING like Grant.

Unless he drinks to excess and is utterly undiplomatic... Grant was a direct, efficient and brutal general,

and an utterly inept president.

General Lee on the other hand might have made an excellent president; and I'm from the north too.

Oh PS.

I know people who have been to the palace and met the top royals,

they never had to get on their knees. Only bow deeply and respectfully.

Not too much to ask for any national leader and respected elder, let alone to an actual King.

Edited April 22, 2010 by animatic

[hammered]

Do we have to keep having people waving the US constituion and establishment of the US around? It has nothing to do with this and if developed further could involve us going completley off topic over how ther US has not developed as the fathers would have wanted.

Anyway what does it have to do with this situation?

We will sell to no man, we will not deny or defer to any man either Justice or Right.

Magna Carta England 1215

What? The idea from America bothers you, it started of course long ago and the Americans were Brits in revolution you know. The British were fighting for these rights for a thousand years.

Would you get on your knees to another man?

Just curious.

Sounds like you are on good stuff

Just point out that international and local media are reprting explosions in Silom and that is probably of more import than bringing up other countires constittions

Plus what has the US consty got to do with going down on anohter guy? Unless you have some fetish that way and each to their own on that kind of stuff

Oh an dplease dont lower things to idiotic levels these are serious times

[humfurry]

TNN reporting bombs in Sala Daeng...

Edited April 22, 2010 by humfurry