Thai PM Abhisit Says Seeking Political Solution To Crisis

[KKvampire]

When Abhisit did try negotiations the Reds were not known to be terrorist but now they are known to be. Negotiations with terrorist cannot be made as it will set precedence for others to become terrorist to make political change. That must be the end of talks. The only way forward will be many Reds arrested and much bloodshed and mess to clean up. I believe it will happen but the government forces are trying to make sure they are as ready as possible.

Many countries have negotiated with past terrorists, in UK history, when those so called terrorists, who after the success of their activities became Head of State of their country, they got the priviledge to finished up having tea with the Queen in Buckingham Palace, i.e. the IRA in N/Ireland, the 'Stern Gang' in Israel, Robert Mugabe in Zimbabwe, and many others, history shows that negotiations with the so called terrorists can not be avoided and must proceed in order to solve serious political problems.

The government has "negotiated" with these Red Shirts. But they don't want a settlement but victory.

I lived in Uk through the bombings of London and other cities in the 1970s and 1980s. Dont compare what happened there or in Zimbabwe with this red mob wanting elections within 30 days and causing havoc in the capital to get their way.

Apples and Oranges

[KKvampire]

Zeinab Badawi the Hard Talk interviewer is pretty pathetic , she couldnt even get her facts right on the elections since the coup in 2006. Abhisist destroyed her poor questions, Needed better researchers on that BBC programme

[stevotoo]

Zeinab Badawi the Hard Talk interviewer is pretty pathetic , she couldnt even get her facts right on the elections since the coup in 2006. Abhisist destroyed her poor questions, Needed better researchers on that BBC programme

She didn't explore the military reshuffle issue either

[bkkjames]

Zeinab Badawi the Hard Talk interviewer is pretty pathetic , she couldnt even get her facts right on the elections since the coup in 2006. Abhisist destroyed her poor questions, Needed better researchers on that BBC programme

She didn't explore the military reshuffle issue either

You do understand that the topics for discussion are pre-agreed before taping?

[stevotoo]

Zeinab Badawi the Hard Talk interviewer is pretty pathetic , she couldnt even get her facts right on the elections since the coup in 2006. Abhisist destroyed her poor questions, Needed better researchers on that BBC programme

She didn't explore the military reshuffle issue either

You do understand that the topics for discussion are pre-agreed before taping?

Maybe it should be called 'Quite Hard Talk' then

[sausageandmash]

The problem is, he's not doing anything. I just cannot understand why Thai police don't have horses. During the Poll Tax riots in London in 1990, the police were far outnumbered by protesters. The police charged them on their horses and won the day. You see a policeman galloping towards you, you tend to run.

[stevotoo]

The problem is, he's not doing anything. I just cannot understand why Thai police don't have horses. During the Poll Tax riots in London in 1990, the police were far outnumbered by protesters. The police charged them on their horses and won the day. You see a policeman galloping towards you, you tend to run.

And the Poll Tax riots brought down the government

[rixalex]

You see a policeman galloping towards you, you tend to run.

Or shoot the horse.

[stevotoo]

You see a policeman galloping towards you, you tend to run.

Or shoot the horse.

Good point- horses are not so good against M79s

[SanSaiExPat]

Laws? The reds don't need no stinkin' laws...

The same can be said of those that take power by military force.

The military took power by military force. Then there were elections. The rules and consequences for violation of those rules were clear. The party that came to power from those elections blatantly broke the rules. Their fault. Nobody made them do it. And they were even filmed doing it. So they were dissolved. So sorry. Try to follow election rules next time.

.

Correction: A rigged election was held where the major opposition political party was outlawed and its members prevented from running for political office for 5 years. So yes after the current government disemboweled the opposition political party they held elections only they could win. As has been said before on this board. The current government may be legal but it lacks legitimacy.

[way2muchcoffee]

Laws? The reds don't need no stinkin' laws...

The same can be said of those that take power by military force.

The military took power by military force. Then there were elections. The rules and consequences for violation of those rules were clear. The party that came to power from those elections blatantly broke the rules. Their fault. Nobody made them do it. And they were even filmed doing it. So they were dissolved. So sorry. Try to follow election rules next time.

.

Correction: A rigged election was held where the major opposition political party was outlawed and its members prevented from running for political office for 5 years. So yes after the current government disemboweled the opposition political party they held elections only they could win. As has been said before on this board. The current government may be legal but it lacks legitimacy.

The Democrats didn't disembowel anything. The TRT and PPP committed suicide through massive corruption, vote buying, and electoral fraud.

[quiksilva]

cue someone to pipe up that the gov. is illegitimate because it was formed after a coup.

So what? The same could be said for any government that was formed over the past, what... 20 years+

So were they illegitimate too? and what about the two previous administrations were they illegitimate as well?

[midas]

This morning I watched Abhisit being given a hard interview by Zeinab Badawi

on BBC Hardtalk. The last 10 minutes was really tough and he looked quite uncomfortable.

It will be show again this afternoon for the last time at 16:30 on BBC World.....it is worth seeing

[tonywebster]

The Democrats didn't disembowel anything. The TRT and PPP committed suicide through massive corruption, vote buying, and electoral fraud.

So did the dems, but only one party was dissolved, strange eh?

Ah well, it won't be long before they get dissolved, and if they don't I can only see the situation getting worse with the highlighting of hypocrisy.

[tonywebster]

This morning I watched Abhisit being given a hard interview by Zeinab Badawi

on BBC Hardtalk. The last 10 minutes was really tough and he looked quite uncomfortable.

It will be show again this afternoon for the last time at 16:30 on BBC World.....it is worth seeing

excellent, hope she made him squirm

[LevelHead]

For those who want an opinion on the low down of who the black shirts on April 10th were, the following link might help.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2010/04/27/

Perhaps reading any article about the Army...... ? Obviously I do not condone what is written in various places on the site, however it is an opinion of some posters, not me, and one based on "speaking with generals" who do not want to be named. Might be interesting to some.

.

Thanks for the link - a very interesting article with a loud ring of truth to it. On another note, below is a quote from the comments page on another article there that I'm cutting and pasting. The original poster asks if the quote 'sounds familiar'. Uncannily so to this poster. <snip>

The article is very interesting and based on its contents appears to be from "insiders" owing to its levels of accuracy.

[RussellHantz]

Post the video link when you find it, thanks !

[midas]

This morning I watched Abhisit being given a hard interview by Zeinab Badawi

on BBC Hardtalk. The last 10 minutes was really tough and he looked quite uncomfortable.

It will be show again this afternoon for the last time at 16:30 on BBC World.....it is worth seeing

excellent, hope she made him squirm

Actually I would have prefered to see him up against Tim Sebastian from the old days or even

Stephen Sackur but Zeinab Badawi was ok .

The only thing i think she missed out on was retaliating on tonywebsters point about

the problems with his party and the electoral commision but still he was lost for words

a few times in the end

Edited April 28, 2010 by midas

[rixalex]

The current government may be legal but it lacks legitimacy.

Legal but illegitimate? Is that possible?

If you are saying there was something a little unotherdox about the way the Dems came to power, i would agree, but has their ever been a Thai election that has been entirely clean? I would venture probably not. It only seems to become an issue when it's not your side in power. Were the reds out on the streets campaigning against the way Somchai was installed as PM by a convicted criminal on the run from his crime? No, of course not. Did Somchai lack legitimacy? Judging by your high standards, surely he must of done?

[LikeHeat]

OzMick, If what you say is correct then that would be why they have so much power in Isaan. If the mouth stops you will feel the effects really bad in a couple of weeks or so, but if that other orifice stops and clamps shut you feel the effects, really, really badly in only a couple of days.

Newin

Interesting choice. My initial response was to reject this possibly out of hand. I mean Newin? Really? But on second thought he controls a political stronghold at the mouth of Isaan. He might be the kind of person who would appeal to the rural people who largely despise the Democrats at this point. Difficult to say. I haven't been able to get a sense of how his defection from the PPP has affected his popularity. I can see the appeal of this choice amongst the power brokers, but personally I don't think I could support this man. Seems a bit of a slimeball.

way2much, you are looking at Isaan the wrong way round. It's not the mouth, it's the orifice at the other end!

[rixalex]

This morning I watched Abhisit being given a hard interview by Zeinab Badawi

on BBC Hardtalk. The last 10 minutes was really tough and he looked quite uncomfortable.

It will be show again this afternoon for the last time at 16:30 on BBC World.....it is worth seeing

excellent, hope she made him squirm

Actually I would have prefered to see him up against Tim Sebastian from the old days or even

Stephen Sackur but Zeinab Badawi was ok .

Yes, the last time he was interviewed by Badawi and i found it quite a boring 30 minutes - certainly lost something from the days of Sebastian and Sackur.

However Abhisit comes out of it, i'm pleased that we have a PM ready and willing to put himself forward to answer tough questions.

It's refreshing and a big change from previous PMs, who wouldn't even face tough questions in their own language.

[kissdani]

The current government may be legal but it lacks legitimacy.

Legal but illegitimate? Is that possible?

If you are saying there was something a little unotherdox about the way the Dems came to power, i would agree, but has their ever been a Thai election that has been entirely clean? I would venture probably not. It only seems to become an issue when it's not your side in power. Were the reds out on the streets campaigning against the way Somchai was installed as PM by a convicted criminal on the run from his crime? No, of course not. Did Somchai lack legitimacy? Judging by your high standards, surely he must of done?

Its about the current government, finger-pointing at someone else justifies nothing and that is not the source of legitimacy.

[rixalex]

Its about the current government, finger-pointing at someone else justifies nothing and that is not the source of legitimacy.

I'm not saying it justifies it, i'm saying that if anyone - that includes the reds - seriously and sincerely wants to do something about improving democracy, we need to look at deeper and more constructive ways to achieve that, rather than simply Kicking out a legally formed government because we think it's a bit dodgy, to have it replaced by something equally dodgy, which we all know it would be.

[clausewitz]

[clausewitz]

In his first week in power over a year ago he announced how his main goal was to find National reconciliation and how he would actively work towards this. Has he succeeded so far?

That was at the same press meeting where he vowed to bring the PAD protestors who closed the airport to justice.

In the same afternoon he announced his new Foriegn Minister would be Kasit Promiya (PAD Spokesman)

YES

I clearly remember him saying that national reconciliation was his top priority. If he had actually meant it, he would have started negotiations looooooooooong ago. (and yes, that includes negotiations with Thaksin. but as usual, Abhisit was extremely stubborn about not negotiating with Thaksin - a big mistake as it turns out).

Now time has run out and he is scrambling. Its irresponsible.

Kasit was never a PAD spokesman.

He never was a PAD organizer.

Nor a PAD decision maker of any sort.

He did make a few speaches from PAD statges,

but not as a PAD member, strictly as a guest speaker.

Mostly anti-Thaksin and anti- Prah Veahar give away.

Kasit was never a PAD spokesman, nor any form of representative of PAD

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/JL16Ae01.html

Democrat MP Somkiat Pongpaiboon was one of the PAD's co-leaders, while the protest movement's de facto spokesman, Kasit Piromya

----------

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/search/read.php?newsid=30106725&keyword=Kasit+Piromya

Among those summonsed is Foreign Minister Kasit Piromya, who led the protests at Suvarnabhumi

Edited April 28, 2010 by clausewitz

[clausewitz]

It is Thaksin who wants control over the military reshuffle and have the military reporting to him and not a higher person.

The avoidance is the Thaksin interest behind you.

But we can see the shadow.

Even you can't hide that.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2...orps/#more-9327

While Abhisit has argued strongly that parliament must approve the government’s budget before it is dissolved, he also has a strong interest in a smooth annual reshuffle of civilian and uniformed officials. He and his allies need to ensure that people on whom they can rely are in position at the time of the next elections and that they continue to control the security apparatus

[travelingmike]

I posted this in another thread but it really belongs here!.

OK I have watched the CNN interview or the bit that is posted - see the live news today thread..

and noboby cares what my opinion is but me but.....

Abhisit doesn't believe his own spin; sorry, but he reminded me of one of my own UK mob, Tory or Labour - that sort of weasly politician that we get in UK who deny, prevaricate and, leave bits out in answers, stumble about but do everything but look confident or in control when they know they are on, shall we say, shaky ground. Humphreys or Paxman would have had him for breakfast or dinner respectively.

The very interview itself is an attempt to convey the Thai government message that this government is indeed legitimate, despite the world's scepticism, the interview actually opening with that very question of why do so many question your government's legitimacy. His reply says what he is programmed to say but the world has up to now not, I am afraid, bought it and for me, they are not going to be any closer to buying it after this interview. Sorry, but I am a media observer and that is what I observe...

And it seems remarkably that jingthing and myself are in agreement!!!

Your comments might be interesting, if you leave out the phrase "the World"

The Thai Government of the day is indeed legitimate.

If you are a media observer, you sound a lot like a one-sided observer.

On the other hand, aren't we all media observers.

And who is able to observe without any alignment?

We both are obviously not able to observe without any bias.

The reds want dissolution of the parliament.

If Parliament is silenced, democracy is completely gone.

Until the next election the Government can do anything without parliamentary control.

More to the point would be if the reds asked the Government to become demissionary pending elections.

Parliament remains in session, the government becomes a caretaking one.

Now suppose the election ends with the same results as last elections.

No party gets a majority, which would not be a bad thing, because coalition governments are mostly better for a country and the people.

And also suppose the coalition that will be formed excludes the Thaksin followers, just like the coalition of the day.

What will the reds do then?

Declare the elections not valid?

Go back to the streets again?

Go on till the country will be in civil war?

Or maybe a military coup ala Burma?

Open your eyes.

The only thing the reds want is the return of Thaksin.

Maybe, just maybe, we will see reason rise from all this trouble which is threatening to break up this country.

I also agree, anytime somebody is overly dramatic, I think of Fox news. "the world" really doesnt know what is going on in thailand, the most I have gotten from someone is "what is going on in thailand?" I have heard no judgments from people who have not been to thailand. So I think the poster seems to be doing a bit of his own spinning. Thaksin is an a-hole, this is backed up by his actions and his red shirts are criminals-also plenty of actions proving this.

[ovenman]

Abhisit just has to swallow his pride and make way for elections.

Simple as that.

Gee, we can have an election and the people of Isaan and the North will go in droves to elect PM Chalerm. Maybe he can get one of his sons appointed to head up the police or maybe the Ministry of Justice. Or some other equally repulsive scenario. Then we would have true democracy, eh!

Thailand is broken and will be broken for a long time to come. Thaksin and his allies broke it. That is their legacy. Their followers are pissing and bleeding all over their own future. My prediction is that Thailand will be the sick man of Asia for at least the next couple of decades after all this red shirt garbage is over. Hope I'm wrong but that's the way I see it. Simple as that.

Very succinctly put.

[hammered]

My feeling is that Abhisit has little control and that there are a hardcore group who will replce him and crack down far more violently if he doesnt do what they want to a minimal degree first. Right now having Anhisit going on about poltical solutions that he is in no position to bring off is probably better than what could replace it. Listen to Chamlong, Newin, some Dem MPs and other shadowy characters. This is a very very high stakes power game and it likely wont be resolved by any "normal" political play at the stage it is at now

Reporters have been asking Abhisit about his duty. Unless everyone steps back this one is going to end in tears.

[Publicus]

My feeling is that Abhisit has little control and that there are a hardcore group who will replce him and crack down far more violently if he doesnt do what they want to a minimal degree first. Right now having Anhisit going on about poltical solutions that he is in no position to bring off is probably better than what could replace it. Listen to Chamlong, Newin, some Dem MPs and other shadowy characters. This is a very very high stakes power game and it likely wont be resolved by any "normal" political play at the stage it is at now

Reporters have been asking Abhisit about his duty. Unless everyone steps back this one is going to end in tears.

I'm sure Abhisit would quit rather than preside over a crackdown, probably Anupong too.

It might well be an indicator if one or both do quit that there would be a severe crackdown.