Clashes Continue, Turning Central Bangkok In Virtual Warzone

[redparrot]

Is it just me or does 900 Generals seem a bit excessive?

[h90]

Security forces are a bit hamstrung in their assignment. They're not there to forcibly evict the protesters. Instead they're there to surround them / cordon them off, so new rowdies can't enter. It is hoped that protesters will see the futility of continuing their militancy. Though it's a minority of them who are actively sparring with the military, they're supported by the others of their group.

Perhaps CRES tactics will work, in that non-confrontational protesters will realize the party is over, and leave - in which case, only the rowdies remain. A key element is for CRES to stick with it, and not wilt away, as they did on April 10th.

Some reports say that protesters are not being allowed to leave - being kept at the site by more militant members of their group - either forcefully and/or by bullying (let's see if reporters can get inside and find the veracity of that). If true, it's more despicable than firing at soldiers. Meanwhile, the core question remains; WHAT ARE THEY REALLY FIGHTING FOR?

No it won't work.....In not later than 3 days the reds can walk in and out again, while the army is sleeping.....not later than Monday.....and all was for nothing.

[esprit]

Yeh, that pal is the rub - you think Americans think __________________________________ (fill in the blank space in your head). Why don't you and others like you ask something once in a while...you presume to know more than you think you know. It's called bias and prejudice, not to mention ignorance and arrogance.

Don't forget brainwashed, politically correct imbecility.

Don't forget that disobediance of army commanding officers to obey command, cowardice of the entire police force to carry out their duties and the complet incompetance of the entire collection of politicians can be neatly be summed up as the mentaly detached morons whom have the IQ more asociated with an amoeba rather than the human race of the 21st centuary. These folks are a throw back to past centuries. Until the me, me ,me and how far would you like my tonque up your a*rse attitude is changed we will still see all this pigs struggling to get at the trough !

Edited May 15, 2010 by esprit

[bkkjohnny69]

Oh Ok, you know something? If I walked up to the Whitehouse with a Molotov cocktail flaming in my hand because I wanted to change the government, I would honestly expect to be shot...

Hello bkkjohnny69, news for you: this is not the USA.

In Bangkok some people don't like it if protesters are shot and killed by the army. face it.

Maybe you should go to the USA, guess that is your home and not BKK, right?

It was an analagy... doh!

Take the location out, put what ever location you want in there, same same...

If you act in a violent manner, you must be prepared to meet the consequences in any country.. especially under a state of emergency.

To generalise the violent minority as mere "protesters" is absurd, take your blinkers off.

As for the invitation to repatriate myself, these schoolground style comments are getting quite boring now..

[h90]

Is it just me or does 900 Generals seem a bit excessive?

I read that (don't know where) and actually never questioned it. Anyone know?

[Ulysses G.]

It is about the farangs who spreading here their hate at TVF.

Please do a little research and provide quotes for these farangs who are spreading their hate and begging for violence.

Huh? That is a lot of posts. By the time he finished, it would be next week and the whole thing would (hopefully) be over. He has a point and denying it is absurd.

[Who, me ?]

Is it just me or does 900 Generals seem a bit excessive?

I read that (don't know where) and actually never questioned it. Anyone know?

900 ? Did I read 900 ?

If so, where are they. I guess that if they have been promoted to this grade, they have experience, gained on the battlefield, or that they had a proper training and show skills during their career....Honestly, this does not reflect on the troops, and when we can see those young soldiers facing the reds, honestly, they really don't make me feel that they are experienced enough, or trained at this kind of operation....

[noel2499rk]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

[OzMick]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100513/ts_nm/us_thailand_279

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/shirt+...2951/story.html

Seh daeng in coma

It's a clear attempt to decapitate the red shirt military leadership," said Anthony Davies, a security consultant with IHS-Jane's." "It's a smart tactical move that will cause confusion in the red shirts' military ranks and send a message to the leadership that if they don't want to negotiate and come out, they can expect extreme consequences."

WELL DONE ANTHONY! A man with a real understanding of the situation - notice he doesn't make a connection to anybody, but gives credit where due.

[moetownblues]

Why are the reports in the thai media so different from that in the world media?

"Three journalists, one of them a Canadian with the France 24 television channel, were shot and wounded covering the unrest, underscoring the risks facing media in the capital, where a Japanese cameraman was killed last month."

Nelson Rand, a reporter who was covering fighting between troops and protesters for France 24, was hit by three bullets from a military assault rifle and "gravely wounded", his network reported. Thai news reports he was hit in the hand????????

"The army had warned Thursday it would deploy snipers around the Reds' protest site" Are the snipers for the media to stop the real story comming out or to systymatically pop of civilians?

"The prostesters threw stones and fireworks at the troops as the two-month standoff descended into more violence". "The soldiers... had no choice but to respond to these attacks," Panitan told a news conference, adding that troops were authorised to use live ammunition in self-defence, for warning shots or against armed gunmen.

At one point troops fired directly at protesters and then advanced up a road, shooting into the air, according to an AFP reporter. STONES V'S LIVE ROUNDS yes that's an even match (<deleted>)

"Abhisit has already started civil war," top Red Shirt Nattawut Saikuar told reporters.

"We urgently demand the government withdraw the military and stop all violence," he said. "I don't know how we can survive tonight if Abhisit does not agree to a ceasefire. We hope that Abhisit does not want war."

The incident has generated a lot of comments on talk back radio in Australia and it appears that the international community is opposed to the actions of the government and the yellow shirts some calling it straight out murder of civilians by troops.

It doesn't matter which side you support red or yellow you would have to agree that the actions taken by the government is way over the top and has tarnished the reputation of Thailand in the eyes of the world. I also believe that the latest action has destroyed the tourist industry to a point of almost wiping it out.

You are obviously another red shirt supporter!!! How do I know?? Because you lie, you distort reality, and to be fair you probably believe the nonsense you write.

STONES V's LIVE ROUNDS !!! ?????

Are you even watching the news, Have you seen what has been happening over the past few weeks. If you think the red shirt rabble are only armed with stones, you are either daft or naive or both!!

The international community are NOT opposed to the actions. I do not know what Australians are saying but they are not the international community.... only a very small part thereof.

I do not agree that the Govt actions are OTT. Quite the opposite. I think Abhisit has been more than patient (bordering on the ridiculous IMHO)

The latest action has not destroyed the tourist industry, however the illegal behaviour by the red shirt terrorists has certainly not helped.

The Govt needs to put a stop to this retarded behaviour, unfortunately people will be killed..... but they have had fair warning. Any red shirt that gets killed from here on in, has only themselves to blame... they should pack their bags and go home!!

I am niether red nor yellow and sit on the fence and look in. What I wrote is what is being reported in the media and not necessarily my personal views. My question was about the different stories of the event going around and if you think it was aimed at taking the red or yellow shirt side then you are wrong.

Edited May 15, 2010 by moetownblues

[humfurry]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Damning to who.... Ask your self a question. Which side of the fence was he on?

[esprit]

Anybody got an update on the taxi blockage at Din Deng tollway exit ?

[noel2499rk]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Damning to who.... Ask your self a question. Which side of the fence was he on?

So by this logic everybody on the wrong side of the fence should be shot, wouldn't it be more cost effective to simply to drop a large bomb.

[timekeeper]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

or it could be this one that gets the award

reds shooting a soldier

[Thailand]

By PRAVIT ROJANAPHRUK

THE NATION

"Are you yellow or red?" an old lady asked me.

After telling the shop owner, a Thai-Chinese lady in her late fifties that I'm from The Nation, widely regarded as an anti-red media, she began confiding that she "dislikes reds".

Just in case anybody was unsure about bias.

I have seen similar comments on the forum recently. I had sympathy with what the Reds were trying to do and certainly up until a few days ago it appeared that they had achieved their objective. They had the government on the run and had election dates on the table, an offer of an easy way out for all that would/should have avoided more bloodshed.

If anyone was unsure of their "not so hidden agenda", certainly that of the main leaders and their swelled bank accounts then that became apparent when every reasonable attempt at compromise was rejected or simply ignored. Sadly the women and children are/were unaware of that agenda being continually fed the democracy line. Seh Daeng actually came out and confirmed what most knew already, that the return of Thaksin and him reclaiming the money and power was what it is all about.

Mt Thaksin, you had a lot of followers and sympathy from many despite your well known failings and there may well have been a chance of a return someday. Talking to my many Thai friends that has now changed dramatically and you have become a pariah in what you call your beloved country. I doubt if you will ever be in Thailand again unless it is the way that your many enemies would prefer, but they are more likely to prevent even that.

What's the answer to this very sad situation this lovely country is in? No idea- but hopefully it is resolved soon.

[LevelHead]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Very damning.

Abhisit and his Democrat/Bhumjathai coalition just get more and more blood on their hands as they try to cling to power regardless to the loss of life.

[Thai at Heart]

As for the FARANG tourists that you seem to dislike so much- they prop up the economy in this country, without them the economy will crash imo.

You seem to thing that Tourism is the main source of income for thais. Its not. Remove yourself from Tourist Thailand and go check the rest of it out......tourist schmourist.

As i stated above i have and still do get out and see Thailand, as for tourist area's - i don't live in one. Do you understand anything about economics? Because if your capital city and economic centre crashes so does the country, who do you think will suffer most if that happens??? The elite and the army, NO it will be the poor people of rural thailand who suffer first and suffer the most. Tourism brings a huge amount of money into the Thai economy, NOTICE i use the word ECONOMY, because without an economy the country will fail not just Bangkok. Check the official government figures, they are online, even from Thaksins time. If the tourists go, the Farang that live here wont be far behind, is that what you want???? No one but thai's in thailand? "we all hate tourists and farang"???? Sounds very much like the point of view an Austrian bloke had in 1939!!. If you'd actually read my post you'd know a lot of my friends are very poor and NOT from tourist Thailand, they dont support the reds at all, are they all wrong??? Will you kick them out of thailand with the farang and tourists if you get your way?????

Rant over...

I would point out that tourism, while not a large percentage of the whole economy, benefits the lower income working people more than some of the other sectors of the economy e.g. banking, import/export, etc.

We have been over the importance of Tourism to the Thai economy. I believe whilst it is not the majority of income as some keep stating, it's overall percentage in the Thai GDP is larger than stated. This also presumes that the government statistics can actually estimate the total size of the economy however.

There is so much black money flying around in this country, I actually believe that Thai GDP is probably 10% higher than stated.

If I have been asked once "Would you like VAT on the receipt?" once, I have been asked a million times, and there are noodle stands with revenue of hundreds of thousands a month that show the government virtually nothing in terms of documented receipts. Add in the back handers and dodgy "entertainment" industry in the country, and actually 10% might be an underestimation.

There is an entire economy running in the country of informal business relationships which the government will never be able to touch in this country. Cash is still king here.

[timekeeper]

Red Head Syndrome

this syndrome manifests itself by aggressively, demeaning anyone who dares to speak badly of a red shirt supporter

sadly for some, red head syndrome can be a terminal disease

its predicted by experts in the country where it was first detected that there will be many deaths before it completely eradicated

its rumored a reclusive, megalomaniac, billionaire has isolated the cure for this serious psychosis but refuses to administer it for free for the benefit of the sufferers.

he expects to personally dispense the cure in the country of its origin and make more billions from exploiting this red syndrome phenomenon

although the authorities would like access to a swift and painless cure for the sufferer's, they are reluctant to accept this billionaires extreme terms and conditions for the release of the cure to the infected masses

consequently they continue to work tirelessly to try stop this virus spreading any further and to try to contain it to one single area of contamination in the center of Bangkok

government agencies currently have this area surrounded and is monitoring the inhabitants activities

its become apparent that one major symptom of the syndrome is the fear of being in enclosed spaces

some badly infected individuals have been trying to break out of this isolation area and have reacted violently towards their guards

its feared that some of the inhabitants of this isolation area will succumb to the violent effects that this syndrome can create within the host

for these sad individuals there can be no cure.

Copyright 2010 Timekeeperpedia @ curesforredheadsyndrome (dot) com

[moetownblues]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

OMG that is certainly danming evidence against the yellowshirts. People waving white flags in surrender and the shooting of foriegn jurno again after it is clearly visible he is wounded and begging for help. That is straight out attemted murder. The only threat he poses is revealing the truth so kill him I guess was thier reason.

[neverdie]

It is about the farangs who spreading here their hate at TVF.

Please do a little research and provide quotes for these farangs who are spreading their hate and begging for violence.

Huh? That is a lot of posts. By the time he finished, it would be next week and the whole thing would (hopefully) be over. He has a point and denying it is absurd.

Maybe so UG, but if he quoted you as to saying something you DIDN'T say, would you still agree with his/her action?

[humfurry]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Damning to who.... Ask your self a question. Which side of the fence was he on?

So by this logic everybody on the wrong side of the fence should be shot, wouldn't it be more cost effective to simply to drop a large bomb.

You're the one dragging bombs into this.

So what was he doing there in the first place?

Were the soldiers taking fire?

Why wasn't he wearing regular press ID. (green armband)

Just a few more questions you need to ask yourself.

[schmutzie]

Ok farangs, explain this to me... It seems many members on this forum are bad mouthing the (poorly trained) Thai military for doing a crack down on the Red protesters. Yes, there have been shootings from both sides. The Red protesters have been occupying parts of the capital city since March. They have disrupted local Thais from going to work or even losing their jobs due to businesses having to close. PM Abhisit (in a no win situation) offered new elections on November 14. The Reds would not accept the offer unless more demands were met. Here is my question: Would your country allow this kind of demonstration go on for months, cripling the capital city? All democracies have rules and ordnances for demonstrators to follow and once you go beyond the "guide lines" -watch out. (If you are American, think of Kent State or the Chicago Democratic convention in the 60's; if you are French, think of the Paris riots not too long ago.) -Heaven forbid if this kind of protesting was done in China.

When I see the military facing the angry protesters, I feel sorry for these guys; for, they look scared and in a situation they don't want to be in. I know it is the "Thai way" to not enforce city ordnances and rules (I am assuming there are city ordnances and "rules" when a group congregates to protest) but this is a good example where things get out of hand if you let protesters do what they want in the beginning -- allowing thousands to squat an area in the middle of the city to set up "camp".

<snip>

Ok non-farang, this situation would never have occurred in England, Germany, US, France etc. At the first signs of violence the protesters would have been cleared out. This is not the way business is done in the West.

<snip>

Actually, if the UDD wanted to organise a march in say a European country, they would first have to obtain a police permit. As part of that they would need to inform the police what routes they were intending to use, how many people and for how long they intended the march/protest to last.

This will allow the police to cordon off the route, provide sufficient security/assistance etc.

"Protesting" in any other way would simply be illegal and be considered a public disturbance.

[timekeeper]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Very damning.

Abhisit and his Democrat/Bhumjathai coalition just get more and more blood on their hands as they try to cling to power regardless to the loss of life.

this would be very damning of the 'peaceful' reds if any of the media majors would ever dare to show it in their 'balanced' view of things..........

Edited May 15, 2010 by timekeeper

[waza]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Damning to who.... Ask your self a question. Which side of the fence was he on?

So by this logic everybody on the wrong side of the fence should be shot, wouldn't it be more cost effective to simply to drop a large bomb.

You're the one dragging bombs into this.

So what was he doing there in the first place?

Were the soldiers taking fire?

Why wasn't he wearing regular press ID. (green armband)

Just a few more questions you need to ask yourself.

I have to agree, he looked more like a black shirt guard than a reporter

[humfurry]

webfact

Today, 2010-05-15 08:00:27

Group: Admin

Posts: 11,133

Joined: 2003-02-11

Member No.: 327

3 injured as van trying to clash through security checkpoint at Makkasan

A van was speeding to the security checkpoint under the Airport Link Makkasan station at about 30 minutes after midnight, prompting troops to fire at it.

After the van was stopped because of the firing, troops found three persons inside. They were severely injured with bullet wounds. One of them is a boy, who appears to be 10 years old.

The driver has apparently drunk.

-- The Nation 2010-05-15

From the Sat update thread.

Abhisit as PM allows army to shoot children.

Disgraceful.

Well they are shooting kids now, but no doubt its done to "international standards" ? !! Disgrace.

What, no comment on the drunken father speeding into a police/military check point with his kid in the car?

[timekeeper]

webfact

Today, 2010-05-15 08:00:27

Group: Admin

Posts: 11,133

Joined: 2003-02-11

Member No.: 327

3 injured as van trying to clash through security checkpoint at Makkasan

A van was speeding to the security checkpoint under the Airport Link Makkasan station at about 30 minutes after midnight, prompting troops to fire at it.

After the van was stopped because of the firing, troops found three persons inside. They were severely injured with bullet wounds. One of them is a boy, who appears to be 10 years old.

The driver has apparently drunk.

-- The Nation 2010-05-15

From the Sat update thread.

Abhisit as PM allows army to shoot children.

Disgraceful.

Well they are shooting kids now, but no doubt its done to "international standards" ? !! Disgrace.

actually on TNN24 i saw protestors making and carrying said molotov cocktails and then they focused in on two individuals with poorly disguised assault rifles at their sides who promptly ran away when they saw the camera on them.

so much for these poor peaceful protestors.......

and more ''peaceful'' protest here

[LevelHead]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

OMG that is certainly danming evidence against the yellowshirts. People waving white flags in surrender and the shooting of foriegn jurno again after it is clearly visible he is wounded and begging for help. That is straight out attemted murder. The only threat he poses is revealing the truth so kill him I guess was thier reason.

There is now evidence of army shooting people waving white flags, army shooting children, army shooting red shirts in the head (how many are dead now from bullet wounds?).

This is not "international standards" and shows just how desperate that Abhisit and the Democrat/Bhumjaitai coalition are to cling to power and money at all costs......

[whybother]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

No. Not footage of him *being* shot.

Footage of him lying on the ground *after* having been shot.

He was caught in the cross fire between the red shirts and the army, and only metres from the army side.

If he had been shot from that distance by live fire by the army, I don't think he would just have minor injuries.

It is quite possible that he was shot by the army, since it was clearly stated that the army would be using live ammunition, but the video certainly doesn't show that.

[Ulysses G.]

Maybe so UG, but if he quoted you as to saying something you DIDN'T say, would you still agree with his/her action?

No, but I do agree with the point about hateful posts - which is what I commented on.

[Ulysses G.]

Edited May 15, 2010 by Ulysses G.