Three More Dead In Fresh Bangkok Violence

[nakachalet]

are we to presume that these individuals were just shot by the authorities for being in the wrong place at the wrong time?

NO.... THAT WOULD BE GRAVELY INCORRECT TO PRESUME SUCH....

individuals who are still there participating in the demonstration regardless of how good their intentions are....

....are there by their own choice.... which means that are knowingly or unknowingly participating in demonstration which has been ruled by the court to be unlawful....

furthermore.... it has been over a month now that the weakly apisit govt has been warning each day and night beseeching individual demonstrators to leave the premise.... because their gathering has been ruled by the court to be illegal....

it has now been over two weeks that the repeated warnings have been given to the redshirts to leave the illegally occupied areas....

many protesters including the leaders presumes that in the past.... many times the police (nicknamed by the reds as red tomatoes) and the soldiers (nicknamed as watermelon which is green outside but red inside....) succumbed conveniently to the mobs because of more reasons than one.... that they would this time also retreat in good will.... if the redshirts are to apply more pressure....

as we learn from current confrontation.... the redshirt leaders are deadly wrong....

my deepest sympathy goes to those poor and innocent northeastern followers who are not able to return by choice to their families, again because of various reasons.... some are still hanging on to the promise of their district representatives that.... each would earn 200,000 THB if they could bring the apisit govt down.... by whatever means....

coming back to the point.... the people who are still there.... are there by their own free will and personal choice.... which means to continue to show their power to disrupt govt orders as well as ordinary people life style....

whether or not the reds would seize the children and students as human shield to protest themselves is undeterminable at present.... their willingness to enter and disrupt the hospital at chula.... showed plenty what the many reds would do to satisfy their own needs and desires....

garath.... at present.... it can be presumed that most illegal demonstrators are there not by accident.... but by their own free will to show who is really the boss.... this is my humble conclusion....

Edited May 15, 2010 by nakachalet

[TAWP]

Obviously, you have not been around Thailand very long. Who do you believe grows the local food and raw materials within Thailand? Who drives the taxis, buses, etc.? Who are the majority of the people in the military? Who are the majority of the people who work the low paid service industries in BKK and the tourist towns? They are rural people (non-BKK, Pattaya, Phuket) who, in general, side with the red shirts. Redshirts and their supporters are harder working people than most of the elites who sit in cozy desk chairs.

Wrong, you seem to under the illusion that the north has the poor people while the rest of the nation has very few of them. Could not be further from the truth.

Oh, and so you know, most office-people I know off, that work for 8-12k a month in travel agencies and many other things, all come from poor backgrounds, some support the reds, some do not...but they all have 'desk chair' jobs...so they are not real workers?

[asiawatcher]

maybe the focus should be at removing the red shirt leaders. take away the leadership that is fueling this fire. I guess they are not going to turn themselves in like they said. I certainly hope the charges that are racking up are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, including denying bail for fear of being a flight risk. enough is enough. Condolences to the families of those that needlessly have taken part of this cowardly fueled farce.

Concur - some well placed snipers bullets and the problem goes away. Their arrest warrants mean nothing - they are inciting riots, destroying public property and have a total disregard for any law from within or without of Thailand. Time is up boys, only a matter of time before you wear one or those who you cowardly hide behind, do, and then it will be mayhem. But yes, keep yelling abuse from the stage and you will have any not votes when the time comes. And that I cannot wait for - so maybe the lesson will be learned by then.

[TAWP]

The head shot fatalities ratio just seems way too high.

I remember the video a while back of people sitting behind the road-divider. They are hard cover and no bullet will penetrate them. But all the Reds peeked up with their heads behind the cover to look and occasionally aim their slingshots...so if one was hit anywhere at that time, it would have to be in the head, with most of the bullets (towards center mass) hit the cement wall...

[KayT]

My condolences to those who have died.My condolences to their families.My condolences to the business people who are no longer in business. My condolences to the Thai reputation as a happy friendly place to come that has been callously killed by the display at hand.

Sadness fills my heart as I see and hear.

All are being damaged by this.It is not longer a Red/Yellow fight.It is no longer a poor vs rich fight.It is not about winning anymore.

It is about what is right and what is wrong.Where has the humanity gone?

Yes I agree with standing up for what one believes in. But first care for and respect yourself and from this grows care and respect for your fellow man.

NO one should ever look down upon another.We are all equal.We are all one species and we need to remember that we are ALL someones family.Mother,father,brother,sister....Family.

I can understand hurt and pain and suffering.I have been subject to abuse and been downtrodden as well.And yet I am not taking up arms to hurt,damage,maim and kill.I am not spouting hate and vitriol to inflame and incite.I am not pursuing power to push my will upon others.

Until each person can remember that everyone feels and each has their own history that makes up that person we will continue to have the type of behaviour we have seen these last few years.

For all who take the time to read my post I thank you.I hope it helps to inspire some compassion in your heart no matter if you are Red,Yellow or Striped with Polka Dots.

Light and Love to all

[fasteddie]

If the Reds want political reform they should go through the correct channels.

Please remove these red shirts so people can get back to their normal lives.

"By any means necessary"

Please tell me you're joking, is not voting in two successive governments ''the correct channels''?

[eltelboy]

Obviously, you have not been around Thailand very long. Who do you believe grows the local food and raw materials within Thailand? Who drives the taxis, buses, etc.? Who are the majority of the people in the military? Who are the majority of the people who work the low paid service industries in BKK and the tourist towns? They are rural people (non-BKK, Pattaya, Phuket) who, in general, side with the red shirts. Redshirts and their supporters are harder working people than most of the elites who sit in cozy desk chairs.

Wrong, you seem to under the illusion that the north has the poor people while the rest of the nation has very few of them. Could not be further from the truth.

Oh, and so you know, most office-people I know off, that work for 8-12k a month in travel agencies and many other things, all come from poor backgrounds, some support the reds, some do not...but they all have 'desk chair' jobs...so they are not real workers?

Exactly right.....some posters seem to think everyone having an office job in Bangkok is part of a yellow shirt 'elite' who sit on their backsides and do nothing. Also why do people keep saying that the red shirts are all Isaan farmers when quite clearly their is a large number of them presently in Bangkok that are not. There are some real stereotype postings.

Edited May 15, 2010 by eltelboy

[patjem]

are we to presume that these individuals were just shot by the authorities for being in the wrong place at the wrong time?

I doubt they'd just popped out to buy a packet of cigs!

Nevertheless the picture we see on this thread is shocking.

All this nonsense could and should have been stopped by now. All they had to do is secure the area.

Sheer incompetence.

Yes, that's 'all'. How might you suggest they secure the area without and violence erupting? These damned reds came to Bangkok looking for one thing - a bloody fight and, very unfortunately, that is exactly what they have got on their hands. They had a deal, they should have taken it and gone home, taking those poor innocent people with them. Any ensuing violence is 100% of their will and their making.

Well you can't now, as the cat is well and truly out the bag.

In a hostage situation, the decision to storm is made when all else has failed, and you have to then reason that there really is only one course of action for the greater good, how many lives you will save as opposed to how many might be lost.

The tanks should have rolled through the barricades ages ago. No doubt there would have been some loss of life, but the chances are most would flee for their life ( I speak from experience I legged it away from Pratunam yesterday at the sound of gunfire). But you coud drop down hundreds of canisters of tear gas, shower the area with noise and water or simply send troops in en mass.

I'd assume once the main area is secured and hopefully the thousands of relatively peaceful demonstrators dispersed, the gloves could come off in dealing with the hardcore.

I'm not supporting this action by the way, you just asked me how it's done, to summarise, the same way every other half competent force does it.

(believe it or not I am broadly behind the red cause up to a point).

Hey, Red Apologist,

HOSTAGE SITUATION this has not ever been by the authorities, however the red shirts guards have offended on that front on numerous time over the last few week.

Are you a source of such propaganda & red rhetoric, or merely misguided by it?

[asiawatcher]

Also why do people keep saying that the red shirts are all Isaan farmers when quite clearly the majority of them that are presently in Bangkok are not.

Guess again!

[gemini81]

maybe the focus should be at removing the red shirt leaders. take away the leadership that is fueling this fire. I guess they are not going to turn themselves in like they said. I certainly hope the charges that are racking up are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, including denying bail for fear of being a flight risk. enough is enough. Condolences to the families of those that needlessly have taken part of this cowardly fueled farce.

Concur - some well placed snipers bullets and the problem goes away. Their arrest warrants mean nothing - they are inciting riots, destroying public property and have a total disregard for any law from within or without of Thailand. Time is up boys, only a matter of time before you wear one or those who you cowardly hide behind, do, and then it will be mayhem. But yes, keep yelling abuse from the stage and you will have any not votes when the time comes. And that I cannot wait for - so maybe the lesson will be learned by then.

agreed, and their sheep can't think individually or coordinate much. plus, who wants to take a chance these remaining 3 or so leaders will get out on amnesty, or evade by fleeing the country. now they're even assaulting soldiers unprovoked, who for all they know, maybe come from a "red" family.

[whybother]

If the Reds want political reform they should go through the correct channels.

Please remove these red shirts so people can get back to their normal lives.

"By any means necessary"

Please tell me you're joking, is not voting in two successive governments ''the correct channels''?

The TRT won the 2005 election, but in 2006 Thaksin called elections again (to get one of his corrupt policies through). He didn't win the 2006 election against no opposition (according to constitutional rules).

The PPP got 40% of the vote in the 2007 election, and formed a coalition to get into government. When the coalition fell apart, the Democrats were able to form government.

The problem with the reds is that they don't understand the democratic system. They think that the red party should be in government even if the majority of people didn't vote for them.

Edited May 15, 2010 by whybother

[gemini81]

If the Reds want political reform they should go through the correct channels.

Please remove these red shirts so people can get back to their normal lives.

"By any means necessary"

Please tell me you're joking, is not voting in two successive governments ''the correct channels''?

The TRT won the 2005 election, but in 2006 Thaksin called elections again (to get one of his corrupt policies through). He didn't win the 2006 election against no opposition (according to constitutional rules).

The PPP got 40% of the vote in the 2007 election, and formed a coalition to get into government. When the coalition fell apart, the Democrats were able to form government.

The problem with the reds is that they don't understand the democratic system. They think that the red party should be in government even if the majority of people didn't vote for them.

that is definetely a warning and strong statement about themselves. Khmer rouge reincarnated if they could.

[bkkjames]

The time for political solutions has passed, reds declined.

Now you see the result.

How long before more moderate members of the red establishment step forward and solve the problem?

Not long I hope.

[gregb]

The time for political solutions has passed, reds declined.

Now you see the result.

How long before more moderate members of the red establishment step forward and solve the problem?

Not long I hope.

The more moderate members already left. They weren't stupid.

What you have left leading the reds are the violent and dangerous terrorists, criminals and psychopaths.

I fear you will be waiting for a long time.

[xerostar]

All this death and blood letting could have been avoided if Abhisit had uttered a simple sentence:

"We will dissolve Parliament and hold elections as soon as possible".

But no, he wants to hold onto power for a few more months just to save face!

"No one shows greater love than when he lays down his life for his friends".

RIP poor reds who followed their hearts and did the best for what they believed in. (true democracy)

Far more than any of you cold-hearted yellow followers would have done (an apt name "yellow").

[brianb1944]

<<"The current situation is almost full civil war," said Jatuporn Prompan>> the first report says.

Typical idiotic hyperbole. It's a confined conflict in central Bangkok.

Exactly, a maximumof 10,000 lawless thugs holding a city of 10 million people to ransom is hardly civilwar

[Old Man River]

Obviously, you have not been around Thailand very long. Who do you believe grows the local food and raw materials within Thailand? Who drives the taxis, buses, etc.? Who are the majority of the people in the military? Who are the majority of the people who work the low paid service industries in BKK and the tourist towns? They are rural people (non-BKK, Pattaya, Phuket) who, in general, side with the red shirts. Redshirts and their supporters are harder working people than most of the elites who sit in cozy desk chairs.

Wrong, you seem to under the illusion that the north has the poor people while the rest of the nation has very few of them. Could not be further from the truth.

Oh, and so you know, most office-people I know off, that work for 8-12k a month in travel agencies and many other things, all come from poor backgrounds, some support the reds, some do not...but they all have 'desk chair' jobs...so they are not real workers?

Exactly right.....some posters seem to think everyone having an office job in Bangkok is part of a yellow shirt 'elite' who sit on their backsides and do nothing. Also why do people keep saying that the red shirts are all Isaan farmers when quite clearly their is a large number of them presently in Bangkok that are not. There are some real stereotype postings.

Correct. In addition, many think all the farmers in Isaan support this Red Shirt movement, something the Red Shirts leaders keep saying, but of course that stereotype isn't the case either. Many farmers don't want any part of these guys. Hence, the 1 million demonstrators promised by the Red Shirts that were going to come into Bangkok and burn the city down turned out to be mostly honest laborers from the Bangkok suburbs mixed with street thugs.

[TAWP]

All this death and blood letting could have been avoided if Abhisit had uttered a simple sentence:

"We will dissolve Parliament and hold elections as soon as possible".

But no, he wants to hold onto power for a few more months just to save face!

All this death and blood letting could have been avoided if Thaksinhad uttered a simple sentence:

"We will accept and abide to the parliamentary process."

But no, he wants to regain the power and hold onto it for many more years just to save face!

[gemini81]

The time for political solutions has passed, reds declined.

Now you see the result.

How long before more moderate members of the red establishment step forward and solve the problem?

Not long I hope.

The more moderate members already left. They weren't stupid.

What you have left leading the reds are the violent and dangerous terrorists, criminals and psychopaths.

I fear you will be waiting for a long time.

Sadly so, if you view the videos over the last 3 days, they are just gagging for fighting and violence, just inciting it. the soldiers don't want it. can't believe they aren't using more hardened force with their own lives on the line. its just the ones trying to turn the place into war remaining.

[MKAsok]

Anyone else hearing there are people on the platform and the tracks at BTS Chitlom?

[Otis]

If the Reds want political reform they should go through the correct channels.

Please remove these red shirts so people can get back to their normal lives.

"By any means necessary"

you mean corruption?

"By any means necessary." means to descend into the depths of hel_l and utilize the cruelest methods of control known to man. OC

[eltelboy]

Obviously, you have not been around Thailand very long. Who do you believe grows the local food and raw materials within Thailand? Who drives the taxis, buses, etc.? Who are the majority of the people in the military? Who are the majority of the people who work the low paid service industries in BKK and the tourist towns? They are rural people (non-BKK, Pattaya, Phuket) who, in general, side with the red shirts. Redshirts and their supporters are harder working people than most of the elites who sit in cozy desk chairs.

Wrong, you seem to under the illusion that the north has the poor people while the rest of the nation has very few of them. Could not be further from the truth.

Oh, and so you know, most office-people I know off, that work for 8-12k a month in travel agencies and many other things, all come from poor backgrounds, some support the reds, some do not...but they all have 'desk chair' jobs...so they are not real workers?

Exactly right.....some posters seem to think everyone having an office job in Bangkok is part of a yellow shirt 'elite' who sit on their backsides and do nothing. Also why do people keep saying that the red shirts are all Isaan farmers when quite clearly their is a large number of them presently in Bangkok that are not. There are some real stereotype postings.

Correct. In addition, many think all the farmers in Isaan support this Red Shirt movement, something the Red Shirts leaders keep saying, but of course that stereotype isn't the case either. Many farmers don't want any part of these guys. Hence, the 1 million demonstrators promised by the Red Shirts that were going to come into Bangkok and burn the city down turned out to be mostly honest laborers from the Bangkok suburbs mixed with street thugs.

Indeed, my Thai wife's farming village in the North East have nothing and want nothing to do with violence and Thai's turning on Thai's. Also all the surrounding villages have nothing to do with the protest either so this civil war seems a very far-fetched claim as it seems more like isolated gangs of thugs on motorways. The red shirt leaders have to keep talking the game up to keep their faint hopes alive.

[Screws]

i'm sure there will be a lot of 'armchair general' farangs happy that the army are just shooting unarmed people!

Have a look at this picture. Can anybody see a just reason for killing this person??

http://image.ohozaa.com/is/28931_397050999...3_2895502_n.jpg

where exactly is your proof that this poor person was shot by the army ?????

Yes or maybe. If that is his rifle against the garden I would say yes. If it is a stick then I thinks he deserves to be wounded - but hel_l, sometimes you miss.

[gemini81]

If the Reds want political reform they should go through the correct channels.

Please remove these red shirts so people can get back to their normal lives.

"By any means necessary"

you mean corruption?

"By any means necessary." means to descend into the depths of hel_l and utilize the cruelest methods of control known to man. OC

have you seen the footage for crying out loud? soldiers having weapons stripped and used against them or the one in the truck getting beat to within an inch of his life? I don't think flowers in your hair and white doves are gonna stop the remaining thugs.

[whybother]

All this death and blood letting could have been avoided if Abhisit had uttered a simple sentence:

"We will dissolve Parliament and hold elections as soon as possible".

But no, he wants to hold onto power for a few more months just to save face!

"No one shows greater love than when he lays down his life for his friends".

RIP poor reds who followed their hearts and did the best for what they believed in. (true democracy)

Far more than any of you cold-hearted yellow followers would have done (an apt name "yellow").

Or the reds could have waited for the scheduled elections.

That would be the democratic thing to do.

[bkksteviejai]

Some other pix of the same...

Another angel of another pix..

So a pix tells only so much.... A moment in time.. Thats all..

Lets hope for and end... Sooner the better..

Anyone else see something odd here? Did they send out four people to lie down next to a person who was shot? Or is the entire thing staged?

As I said, red shirt propaganda attempt - first they took a pic of one guy and a couple of bottles of ketchup - didn't look exiting enough so the rest of the crew lay down to make it have more impact - one could laugh if it wasn't so bloody stupid and sad - what a deranged bunch of wanke_rs

Looks to me like they are keeping the F*kin heads down, not playing dead. But I guess it depends on what you want it to be??....chai mai?

[Pushit]

Must be tough for Thai Army Officers trying to command conscripted soldiers against a riotous mob when the only military experience they have is cleaning Benz, mowing lawns, gardening and driving the "wives" to the hairdressers/shopping.

[Norcan]

Anyone else hearing there are people on the platform and the tracks at BTS Chitlom?

Just spoke to my Mrs. who is station supervisor at BTS National Stadium.

Red Shirts have entered Chidlom, Siam and Rajadamri stations and are in the control rooms there. They forced the supervisors to leave.

There are no BTS staff at those three stations now, only protesters.

Edited May 15, 2010 by Norcan

[animatic]

are we to presume that these individuals were just shot by the authorities for being in the wrong place at the wrong time?

might be this picture.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/1023/2893...09094778009.jpg

The photo is fake, posed

the supposed dead are arranged in too orderly a posture,

with their arms tucked under them, all face down,

legs straight...

They need to teach their actors how to look like battle casualties.

Sorry, don't believe it.

Back to drama school

I would have to agree with this having seen real dead people,

and many photos of the same. They must think we are stupid,

or that the picture editor of at least one newspaper is...

[gemini81]

Anyone else hearing there are people on the platform and the tracks at BTS Chitlom?

Just spoke to my Mrs. who is station supervisor at BTS National Stadium.

Red Shirts have entered Chidlom, Siam and Rajadamri stations and are in the control rooms there. They forced the supervisors to leave.

There are no BTS staff at those three stations now, only protesters.

Oh no! They're gonna trash the place faster than they trash their own homes. what a zoo. should have the soldiers up there before hand, pickin' em off.