Thai Government Accuses Reds Over Huge Weapons Cache

[moetownblues]

Completly the opposite Rubl I say that abhisit should not have killed his own people. Now he has to beg and scrap to the world and prove he was right which is going to be very hard. Hitler lives in heavan compared to this man

[schuimpje]

so if this is "true" it appears the Redshirts pulled back form using full force - unlike the army?

how is this "conciliatory"?

Oh you've got to be kidding me!

These guys have rejected every offer made to them, thinking that the army would never move in, and then when shit hit the fan, they all stand on stage, crying about how unfair the government is.

They have to consider themselves soooo lucky they where not shot like their aerobics-instructor Seh Daeng.

Whatever your theory on that kill, it would have made all of the red shirts likely targets as well.

Curious to see how much support they'll have on 24 June with their next protest....really curious.

[rubl]

The sad part is this all could have been easily avoided at the outset by simply calling some early elections.

These are the same people who agreed to a peace deal and then started adding absurd conditions to go through with it. There is no guarantee that they would have kept their word if elections were called either.

No-one ever managed to explain to me why an election now would solve all problems. Do you already know which constitution to base elections on ? Do you know who is allowed to stand and who not? Do you have a workaable plan to ensure candidate's safety when they travel around to promote themselves? Do you have a plan to observe election day and results and what mandate to give observers? Do you already now how to nullify illegal result and the definition ofillegal results? Do I need to continue?

Discussion the framework offered by the PM, disccussing details, making changes, etc. seems a better start. But then that might be too logical :-)

[travelguy]

The sad part is this all could have been easily avoided at the outset by simply calling some early elections.

These are the same people who agreed to a peace deal and then started adding absurd conditions to go through with it. There is no guarantee that they would have kept their word if elections were called either.

And there is no guarantee the minority of the electorate will accept a majority verdict, but you still go through the process and hope for the best.

[schuimpje]

I find it convenient that all these weapons of mass destruction were found.

Has anyone wondered why they were not used?

Smells a bit fishy.

Yes, there is a possibilitiy that the weapons were planted in order to give army and police the moral high ground.

Bullshi..t have you not seen the videos on youtube idiot!

Trying to find that you-tube video showing the OP wearing that tin-foil hat on Sukhumvit...now where was it?

[rubl]

Completly the opposite Rubl I say that abhisit should not have killed his own people. Now he has to beg and scrap to the world and prove he was right which is going to be very hard. Hitler lives in heavan compared to this man

I'm afraid we can only agree to disagree. Sorry.

[mitrapaap]

Murderer. harsh words, my dear fellow. Would you use the same on K. Thaksin?

85 " official deaths " and over 1800 wounded I call murderer. I believe his nickname was " Mr.Clean and Mr.Polite " ?

Minor league, kindergarten. K. Thaksin managed close to 3000!

The thai government has a lot of A licking to do in the international community. They have destroyed thier own economy not to mention the tourist trade. It is a shame that one government can destroy a country for it's people which will take 60 yrs to rebuild.

When one sees all the evidence of of what happened and had been said by the red leaders, and then sees these red-blind comments blaming the government for all the damage, one could really regret that the army didn't just crash the whole rally the first day.

[block2]

if you think it's over..give yer heads a shake...might of moved away from bangkok but now Thailand is gonna have the same problem up North as they are having down South...it's not rocket science.

[Netfan]

Completly the opposite Rubl I say that abhisit should not have killed his own people. Now he has to beg and scrap to the world and prove he was right which is going to be very hard. Hitler lives in heavan compared to this man

Now there is a brilliant statement, perhaps wrapping up the intelligence of red cheerleaders in 8 words.

Number fatalities in WWII (all nations, including civilians) according to secondworldwar.co.uk: 61 million

[travelguy]

The sad part is this all could have been easily avoided at the outset by simply calling some early elections.

These are the same people who agreed to a peace deal and then started adding absurd conditions to go through with it. There is no guarantee that they would have kept their word if elections were called either.

No-one ever managed to explain to me why an election now would solve all problems. Do you already know which constitution to base elections on ? Do you know who is allowed to stand and who not? Do you have a workaable plan to ensure candidate's safety when they travel around to promote themselves? Do you have a plan to observe election day and results and what mandate to give observers? Do you already now how to nullify illegal result and the definition ofillegal results? Do I need to continue?

Discussion the framework offered by the PM, disccussing details, making changes, etc. seems a better start. But then that might be too logical :-)

CONFUSED...the old constitution seemed to work fine for the majority vote. Since it was fine tuned after the coup, I never once heard anybody say they wouldn't go to the polls under the new constitution. Was it well accepted? Maybe not. But did anybody say they wouldn't go to the polls with the new constitution? NO. But it's a nice red herring when you've got nothing else to go on.

[kalbo123]

During the whole red demonstration did not see a single red weapon besides self made bombs some 2nd world war guns and sling shots..

So after 3 days they come with all this weapons...

PROPAGANDA!!!

Edited May 22, 2010 by kalbo123

[rogera]

My apologies to the forum member who associated the Asian Times with Sondhi. After more research, I see I need to clarify my accusations.

Sondhi was indeed one of the founders of the Asian Times. The newspaper however, folded 12 years ago even before his problems with Mr. T.

It was taken over by former employees, is published in Hong Kong and has an extensive British staff. A detailed reading of its articles will demonstrate a lack of bias in their articles, the comments on Thailand being a small part of their content.

I must say however, I believe an offhand comment trying to tie Sondhi to the article was disingenous at best.

And I do not consider Sondhi any more legitimate than the red shirt leaders.

Suppose you geniuses advise all of the factions how you would stop the vote buying and corruption both at the national and village levels. That might actually be helpful.

@oldgeezer

Thank you for your clarification. Just adds credibility to the article I quoted. I still stand by my assertion and belief that if someone alleges that you made a statement that you did not, and then you did not issue a statement denying the attribution, then it is obvious that the statement is true.

[schuimpje]

---snip snip snip---

You "khwai daeng" supporters and apologists should collectively have your ass**s kicked, and kicked hard. You should have your meager assets seized to help pay for the damage the "khwai daeng" caused in Bangkok. Also, if I ever find that bitch Khun Prateep Ungsongtham, I would personally like to break her jaw for inciting so many people to riot in the Rama IV Road area, I hold her personally responsible for the damage on Rama IV Road and for causing so much terror to people in the Klong Toei area.

I had no real opinions one way or the other regarding Thai politics prior to this whole disgusting display by the "khwai daeng", but I do hope the Thai PM Abhisit Vejjajiva continues to play a major role in SE Asian politics. This man has demonstrated the patience of "Job", he allowed the "khwai daeng" to hang themselves with their own rhetoric, it seems he rejected many options presented to him out of concern for all Thai citizens, even the 'khwai daeng". He has been tested like no other leader in the region and I think he has come out of this with more respect worldwide. Imagine trying to make an Oxford education seem like a liability, Thailand should be lucky they have such an intelligent individual as their PM. Now if the "khwai daeng" supporters in government could just use his example and show concern for all Thai citizens, instead of the unreasonable and ludicrous desires of one Thai / Montenegrin family, this country could actually prosper and benefit all its citizens.

100% yes. Good post.

Best post I've seen for some time.

May I add that I feel terrible for all the trouble that has been caused in your area as well as the rest of Bangkok.

It's heart-warming to see how people are now picking up their lives and working together to clean up everything whilst those red idiots are nowhere to be found. That really shows that there is good people in Thailand, those people make Thailand so great!

I totally agree with your view on Abhisit.

One day in the future, the people of Thailand will look back and finally understand what a great leader he was at this most difficult period in Thai history.

[moetownblues]

Completly the opposite Rubl I say that abhisit should not have killed his own people. Now he has to beg and scrap to the world and prove he was right which is going to be very hard. Hitler lives in heavan compared to this man

Now there is a brilliant statement, perhaps wrapping up the intelligence of red cheerleaders in 8 words.

Number fatalities in WWII (all nations, including civilians) according to secondworldwar.co.uk: 61 million

Abhisit tried but thank god for the internet. Things were different for hitler but the thai government tried thier best.

[rubl]

The sad part is this all could have been easily avoided at the outset by simply calling some early elections.

These are the same people who agreed to a peace deal and then started adding absurd conditions to go through with it. There is no guarantee that they would have kept their word if elections were called either.

No-one ever managed to explain to me why an election now would solve all problems. Do you already know which constitution to base elections on ? Do you know who is allowed to stand and who not? Do you have a workaable plan to ensure candidate's safety when they travel around to promote themselves? Do you have a plan to observe election day and results and what mandate to give observers? Do you already now how to nullify illegal result and the definition ofillegal results? Do I need to continue?

Discussion the framework offered by the PM, disccussing details, making changes, etc. seems a better start. But then that might be too logical :-)

CONFUSED...the old constitution seemed to work fine for the majority vote. Since it was fine tuned after the coup, I never once heard anybody say they wouldn't go to the polls under the new constitution. Was it well accepted? Maybe not. But did anybody say they wouldn't go to the polls with the new constitution? NO. But it's a nice red herring when you've got nothing else to go on.

At the end UDD wanted to use the 1997 constitution, PT is moving back and forth between 1997 and 2007 version. Some coalition parties want self-serving changes to the 2007 constitution. Dem's as usual don't want changes unless. Mind you which constitution to use as base and whether or not to amend first before elections is just one of the many issues which need addressing. Less confused now?

[Arjay]

If these weapons belonged to the red shirts why were there not more soldiers killed when they cleared the protest area?

If the men in black opened up on the army when they cleared the area everyone, even the red shirt apologists,would be saying "So they did have weapons!"

But if they didn't open up on the soldiers there would be an army of red shirt apologists ready and waiting to explain away the damming evidence.

Foolish idiot the soldiers entered behind APC's that's Amored Personal Carriers FYI. The black shirts ran leaving some of their arsenal behind then spread out to burn and loot to make their escape.

[mitrapaap]

Unarmed Reds, Amnesty International decrying the treatment of the poor innocents - BS, pure BS. Armed militants who should be treated as enemy combatants, if shown to have participated in a violent way.

At the suggestion of another poster, I sent a letter to Amnesty Int., basically telling them they have no credibility and they should put someone in charge who has a brain and can think with it.

Oh, that may work, disregarding established human rights standards in favor of your directive. You must have a lot of influence. Did you remember to copy the Norwegian Nobel Institute?

I guess writing them a letter will have more effect, than just bashing in this forum. It's like voting you know, one vote does not make much difference, but if many vote you eventually may win. So maybe you should join him in writing another letter. That's how change starts.

[animatic]

If the burned, gutted Central World doesn't convince you, then you are lost cause.

This is politics and a legal fight from the government to try to prove that the reds are a terrorist organisation. If Thailand wants the world to throw its hands up and actually reach out and have someone help them get hold of Thaksin Shinawatra, I suggest that they get someone infinitely more competent than Suthep to make the case.

I don't want this country to descend into chaos anymore than you. Do I want the country held to ransom like this over and over again in the next few years? NO

So, if you want the rest of the world to help, I suggest that they employ the very best public relations and legal firm and independent observers in the world to make their case in a way that is absolutely water tight and free from any accusation of political bias.

Could you imagine for one second the Thai Foreign ministry making a case in the West on evidence submitted by Porntip. The defence would have an absolute field day. "But your honour, the witnesses competence concerning her forensic science ability must be called into question after she publicly defended the efficacy of the GT 2000 bomb detector. In fact we believe that she continued to support it because of pressure put on her by the Thai military so as not to embarrass them."

I don't find their story credible, pure and simple.

If they can't prove it convincingly to me, what hope do they have of convincing the rest of the world? Furthermore, I doubt burning down Central World represents an act of terrorism, irrespective of how bad their conduct has been.

He's just the barker at the front gate waving his hands and showing a preview.

The real show will come later. Korn did a fine talk in Japan.

Most of the world wouldn't no Suthep from Elmer Fudd.

So really makes no difference, this isn't a court room,

just the court of public opinion, which seemed a bit imbalanced last week.

[rogera]

If these weapons belonged to the red shirts why were there not more soldiers killed when they cleared the protest area?

Because the cowardly and poorly trained "khwai daeng" ran so fast when the Armoured Personnel Carrier's and the real army showed up, they did not have time to trigger the weapons.

If anyone thinks the "khwai daeng" did not have weapons, they should have witnessed what I saw and heard on Rama IV Road after the "khwai daeng" leaders surrendered. Do you "khwai daeng" apologists believe the Metropolitan Electricity Authority (MEA) building on Rama IV Road spontaneously combusted? How about the attempts on the Thai Stock Market library building and the Queen Sirikit Convention Center on Ratchadapisek Road? Did the Bangkok Bank Branch on Rama IV Road also spontaneously combust? At the Maleenont Building housing the Channel 3 TV station, where did those 20 or so grenades that were used in an attempt to burn down that building come from?

Please one of you 'khwai daeng" supporters please explain to me how attacking these and other buildings helps you achieve democracy? How can anyone in their right minds believe these are the actions of peaceful protesters?

The government and the army have acted cautiously and prudently, I have watched them clearing the Rama IV Road, and they are using Bomb sniffing dogs and have found incendiary devices hidden among the tyres stacked on Rama IV Road. Do you think the army and the government stacked those tyres? Do you think the army and the government planted those incendiary devices?

You "khwai daeng" supporters and apologists should collectively have your ass**s kicked, and kicked hard. You should have your meager assets seized to help pay for the damage the "khwai daeng" caused in Bangkok. Also, if I ever find that bitch Khun Prateep Ungsongtham, I would personally like to break her jaw for inciting so many people to riot in the Rama IV Road area, I hold her personally responsible for the damage on Rama IV Road and for causing so much terror to people in the Klong Toei area.

I had no real opinions one way or the other regarding Thai politics prior to this whole disgusting display by the "khwai daeng", but I do hope the Thai PM Abhisit Vejjajiva continues to play a major role in SE Asian politics. This man has demonstrated the patience of "Job", he allowed the "khwai daeng" to hang themselves with their own rhetoric, it seems he rejected many options presented to him out of concern for all Thai citizens, even the 'khwai daeng". He has been tested like no other leader in the region and I think he has come out of this with more respect worldwide. Imagine trying to make an Oxford education seem like a liability, Thailand should be lucky they have such an intelligent individual as their PM. Now if the "khwai daeng" supporters in government could just use his example and show concern for all Thai citizens, instead of the unreasonable and ludicrous desires of one Thai / Montenegrin family, this country could actually prosper and benefit all its citizens.

@JamDown,

Thank you for your post. This just summarises what we, who strongly object to the wonton destruction of Thai property, feel about the red shirts behaviour. If you watch carefully, all the videos of the speeches of Thaksin, Jatuporn, Nuttawut, Arisman et al, which are freely available on U-Tube, you will see that this mayhem had been perfectly planned well prior to the rally at Rachadamnoen, never mind the change of location to Rachadamri. This is nothing short of planned, wilful, criminal behaviour and it deserves the highest penalty prescribed under Thai law. There are absolutely no mitigating circumstances that could cause a reduction in any sentencing that might be given by a court of law. I hope that they all get life.

[schuimpje]

Completly the opposite Rubl I say that abhisit should not have killed his own people. Now he has to beg and scrap to the world and prove he was right which is going to be very hard. Hitler lives in heavan compared to this man

Now there is a brilliant statement, perhaps wrapping up the intelligence of red cheerleaders in 8 words.

Number fatalities in WWII (all nations, including civilians) according to secondworldwar.co.uk: 61 million

Now you forget the little fact that this was a totally biased number... real red apologists will point out that you have to use a german news source...

[kalbo123]

Remember the blacks in the 50's in USA, they used a lot of violence to get their rights.

After a few years these red heroes will be seen as the USA blacks.

Think about this........

MLK was seen as terrorist in those days also now he's a hero!

[schuimpje]

If these weapons belonged to the red shirts why were there not more soldiers killed when they cleared the protest area?

Because the cowardly and poorly trained "khwai daeng" ran so fast when the Armoured Personnel Carrier's and the real army showed up, they did not have time to trigger the weapons.

If anyone thinks the "khwai daeng" did not have weapons, they should have witnessed what I saw and heard on Rama IV Road after the "khwai daeng" leaders surrendered. Do you "khwai daeng" apologists believe the Metropolitan Electricity Authority (MEA) building on Rama IV Road spontaneously combusted? How about the attempts on the Thai Stock Market library building and the Queen Sirikit Convention Center on Ratchadapisek Road? Did the Bangkok Bank Branch on Rama IV Road also spontaneously combust? At the Maleenont Building housing the Channel 3 TV station, where did those 20 or so grenades that were used in an attempt to burn down that building come from?

Please one of you 'khwai daeng" supporters please explain to me how attacking these and other buildings helps you achieve democracy? How can anyone in their right minds believe these are the actions of peaceful protesters?

The government and the army have acted cautiously and prudently, I have watched them clearing the Rama IV Road, and they are using Bomb sniffing dogs and have found incendiary devices hidden among the tyres stacked on Rama IV Road. Do you think the army and the government stacked those tyres? Do you think the army and the government planted those incendiary devices?

You "khwai daeng" supporters and apologists should collectively have your ass**s kicked, and kicked hard. You should have your meager assets seized to help pay for the damage the "khwai daeng" caused in Bangkok. Also, if I ever find that bitch Khun Prateep Ungsongtham, I would personally like to break her jaw for inciting so many people to riot in the Rama IV Road area, I hold her personally responsible for the damage on Rama IV Road and for causing so much terror to people in the Klong Toei area.

I had no real opinions one way or the other regarding Thai politics prior to this whole disgusting display by the "khwai daeng", but I do hope the Thai PM Abhisit Vejjajiva continues to play a major role in SE Asian politics. This man has demonstrated the patience of "Job", he allowed the "khwai daeng" to hang themselves with their own rhetoric, it seems he rejected many options presented to him out of concern for all Thai citizens, even the 'khwai daeng". He has been tested like no other leader in the region and I think he has come out of this with more respect worldwide. Imagine trying to make an Oxford education seem like a liability, Thailand should be lucky they have such an intelligent individual as their PM. Now if the "khwai daeng" supporters in government could just use his example and show concern for all Thai citizens, instead of the unreasonable and ludicrous desires of one Thai / Montenegrin family, this country could actually prosper and benefit all its citizens.

@JamDown,

Thank you for your post. This just summarises what we, who strongly object to the wonton destruction of Thai property, feel about the red shirts behaviour. If you watch carefully, all the videos of the speeches of Thaksin, Jatuporn, Nuttawut, Arisman et al, which are freely available on U-Tube, you will see that this mayhem had been perfectly planned well prior to the rally at Rachadamnoen, never mind the change of location to Rachadamri. This is nothing short of planned, wilful, criminal behaviour and it deserves the highest penalty prescribed under Thai law. There are absolutely no mitigating circumstances that could cause a reduction in any sentencing that might be given by a court of law. I hope that they all get life.

The most severe punishment in Thailand for Terrorism is the Death Penalty as pointed out by Sathit of DSI.

The ultimate punishment though would be to have Takki Shinegra paraded in front of the camera's in an orange prison jumpsuit...

[rubl]

Remember the blacks in the 50's in USA, they used a lot of violence to get their rights.

After a few years these red heroes will be seen as the USA blacks.

Think about this........

MLK was seen as terrorist in those days also now he's a hero!

MLK had a dream, Malcolm-X was a bit more aggressive. Who is admired most and by whom?

[kalbo123]

Remember the blacks in the 50's in USA, they used a lot of violence to get their rights.

After a few years these red heroes will be seen as the USA blacks.

Think about this........

MLK was seen as terrorist in those days also now he's a hero!

MLK had a dream, Malcolm-X was a bit more aggressive. Who is admired most and by whom?

What I am trying to say is that in some cases the old establishment has to get a wake up call

Don't think they got it yet..

We will see some more violence before there comes a dialoge...

[mitrapaap]

Remember the blacks in the 50's in USA, they used a lot of violence to get their rights.

After a few years these red heroes will be seen as the USA blacks.

Think about this........

MLK was seen as terrorist in those days also now he's a hero!

Admit not to be good in history and not to be american, I have a question: Were the black in the 50's in USA allowed to hold (peaceful) demonstrations? Or was anything they did illegal because they had no rights at all and sure not the same rights as anybody else?

I'm really asking the question, not trying to be sarcastic or anything like that, but depending on what the true answer is, you may understand where my question comes from.

[Thai at Heart]

If the burned, gutted Central World doesn't convince you, then you are lost cause.

This is politics and a legal fight from the government to try to prove that the reds are a terrorist organisation. If Thailand wants the world to throw its hands up and actually reach out and have someone help them get hold of Thaksin Shinawatra, I suggest that they get someone infinitely more competent than Suthep to make the case.

I don't want this country to descend into chaos anymore than you. Do I want the country held to ransom like this over and over again in the next few years? NO

So, if you want the rest of the world to help, I suggest that they employ the very best public relations and legal firm and independent observers in the world to make their case in a way that is absolutely water tight and free from any accusation of political bias.

Could you imagine for one second the Thai Foreign ministry making a case in the West on evidence submitted by Porntip. The defence would have an absolute field day. "But your honour, the witnesses competence concerning her forensic science ability must be called into question after she publicly defended the efficacy of the GT 2000 bomb detector. In fact we believe that she continued to support it because of pressure put on her by the Thai military so as not to embarrass them."

I don't find their story credible, pure and simple.

If they can't prove it convincingly to me, what hope do they have of convincing the rest of the world? Furthermore, I doubt burning down Central World represents an act of terrorism, irrespective of how bad their conduct has been.

He's just the barker at the front gate waving his hands and showing a preview.

The real show will come later. Korn did a fine talk in Japan.

Most of the world wouldn't no Suthep from Elmer Fudd.

So really makes no difference, this isn't a court room,

just the court of public opinion, which seemed a bit imbalanced last week.

Korn has come across amazingly well. The moment they started getting him out to talk to the international TV channels, their handling of the message improved 1000%.

I disagree that it isn't a court of a kind, this is presenting evidence to the embassies to justify their position. Next they are going to try to get Thaksin on a terrorism charge, and they need to get all their ducks in a row to present this to the foreign governments. As emotional as everyone gets on here, if they can't get absolutely hard evidence, they would be better not to try, rather than be laughed out of the room by the relevant governments.

I am just bemused as to why they let Suthep do anything. Wasn't he responsible for the "security" at the very beginning of this debacle. Add the Pattaya mess to the guy's list of screw ups and I wonder if even the guys who are on his side listen to him let alone his adversaries. In terms of incompetence, this guy gets all the biscuits.

[Arjay]

Furthermore, I doubt burning down Central World represents an act of terrorism, irrespective of how bad their conduct has been.

That is simply foolish, I really hope you misspoke!

How about seizing an airport? Anyone arrested yet? Oh, forgot, they are the government now. At least the food and music was good...

I think direct comparisons such as this are far fetched and lack credibility and rational balance. Apparently an attempt at Red apologetics.

Having said that,.. I will grant you one thing; the airport seizure was clearly an act of terrorism and was completely unlawful. If the current government and in particular PM Abhisit are genuine on their promise of rectifying such behaviour in Thailand and to being "transparent" ("quote" from the Pm's TV speech on Friday evening) then they should include a full inquiry and pressing of charges and sentencing for those yellow leaders that were involved in the incident of the airport hijacking. That would be a bi-partisan and transparent application of justice and I fear that without such actions being exercised by the current government that they will lack credibility and be seen as being one sided and biased.

Such inaction will continue to fan the flames of resentment back towards the current Abhisit government whereas an inquiry and subsequent legal actions would give them massive credibility!

Ass! Airport seizure didnt involve any M-79's or RPG's! Nobody got hurt. Is that an act of terroism?

[travelguy]

These weapons were actually found earlier, when the army went around from building to building and searched them through with dogs.

Some of the found stuff was from Amarin and Maneeya building carparks. Some of it was from the pond in front of the Wat Pathumwan Naram temple. The rest was from Lumpini park, which seemed to be their weapons depot.

Not to forget the pickup, parked for too long time in front of 7-eleven in Pratunam, suspicious enough that someone checked it and found C4 explosive, wired and armed.

Suspicious? Maybe to some. But living here sure happy that the things were found before they went off.

Now of course, with the reds (now calling themselves Alliance for Democracy) planning more protests in Bangkok in June, I think we can be sure much more of this stuff will be brought in, and probably used.

To think that could all be avoided by calling an election.

Would that solve the problems? Of course not. It would only be a temporary gap before the minority nullified the results. But at least it would buy some time.

[rogera]

The sad part is this all could have been easily avoided at the outset by simply calling some early elections.

These are the same people who agreed to a peace deal and then started adding absurd conditions to go through with it. There is no guarantee that they would have kept their word if elections were called either.

No-one ever managed to explain to me why an election now would solve all problems. Do you already know which constitution to base elections on ? Do you know who is allowed to stand and who not? Do you have a workaable plan to ensure candidate's safety when they travel around to promote themselves? Do you have a plan to observe election day and results and what mandate to give observers? Do you already now how to nullify illegal result and the definition ofillegal results? Do I need to continue?

Discussion the framework offered by the PM, disccussing details, making changes, etc. seems a better start. But then that might be too logical :-)

CONFUSED...the old constitution seemed to work fine for the majority vote. Since it was fine tuned after the coup, I never once heard anybody say they wouldn't go to the polls under the new constitution. Was it well accepted? Maybe not. But did anybody say they wouldn't go to the polls with the new constitution? NO. But it's a nice red herring when you've got nothing else to go on.

Just for clarification purposes, the 1997 constitution was designed to try to limit the vote buying by political parties and to try to coalesce the diverse parties into a two or three party parliament, much along the lines of the UK parliament. That is why the dissolution clause was inserted. However, the drafters of the constitution did not foresee that any one party could get such a large majority that they could change the constitution. This is what happened when Thaksin first got elected in that he got in excess of the two thirds majority necessary to change the constitution. Why he did not do so during his first term may be explained by the fact the he may have not wanted to scare the electorate, particularly the so-called elite, but it is possible that he planned to do it in his second term. Unfortunately for him, and fortunately for the country, due to his greed and arrogance, he did not get the two thirds majority the second time he was elected.

The 2006 constitution changed the clauses that made it possible to gain such a two-thirds majority but the changes also ensured a continuation of coalition governments. However, it still retained the dissolution clauses for vote buying.

Edited May 22, 2010 by rogera

[CHdiver]

During the whole red demonstration did not see a single red weapon besides self made bombs some 2nd world war guns and sling shots..

So after 3 days they come with all this weapons...

PROPAGANDA!!!

I totally agree with you, all just Propaganda. Have a look at this link, that is the prove Red Shirt Violence an Weapon

not