Thailand Fights Addiction To Plastic Bags

[QED]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

Hehe, a few people have tried, but it really is a simple calculation.

1,800 tons = 1,800,000 kgs. Divide that by 600,000 and you get 3 kg per bag! Hahaha.

The Hong Kong article says they used 4 per person per day, which sounds more realistic, so maybe there were a few 0's missing off the end of the 600,000:blink:

We have stopped giving out plastic bags in South Australia.

Plus South Australia recycles 70% of what can be recycles from out total rubbish.

Not bad for a small population of 1.2 million.

If that could be done world wide the landfill areas would take longer to fill and less pollution.

We use our cloth bags to do our weekly shopping.

I think Thailand recycles 100% of what can be recycled judging by the enthusiasm of the bin men in sifting through my rubbish every 3-4 days!

[Jirapa]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

Yep, I would have though that at least two bags/person/day are handed out. The 7/11 even use two large bags, one inside the other, as "one might break" for anything heavier than a packet of peanuts.

If 600,000 bags weigh 1,000 tonnes, then they reckon each bag weighs 3 gramms. Which is a bit much. But I think the figure of 600,000 is on the low side.

What is this, Maths for retards? If 600,000 bags weigh 1,000 tonnes, then 600 bags weighs 1 tonne= 1,000 kg = 1,000,000g. Each bag weighs 1666g or 1.666kg, which is simply ridiculous. 1.66g I might accept!

Tescos carrier bags must weigh about 3 grams so on a big shop you could be putting 30-60 grams of plastic into the environment which is roughly an ounce or 2. I don't think consumers should be charged for using plastic bags as the price is already factored into our bill as is the aircon, lighting and staff so charging us again for something we've already paid for isn't on. It would be like being hit with an additional 20B register tax at the cashier for her to add up your purchases.

As individuals we can make a difference but I can't really see many of us walking into Tescos with 10-15 cloth bags rolled up under our arms even if Tescos offered us a 1 Baht discount on the bill for each bag we supply. It's really the responsibility of the government to introduce strict legislation and the big corporate chains to abide by it.

If Tescos, Big C, etc... who must hand out purchase orders for billions of plastic bags every year started giving those contracts to companies producing biodegradable bags then their present suppliers would have to follow suit and go green. More competition cheaper recyclable bags! I'm sure the big chains are already making a profit on plastic bags they factor into our bills as I doubt we're getting them at cost price and certainly not for free.

Problem solved!

Edited June 28, 2010 by Jirapa

[Thai at Heart]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

Yep, I would have though that at least two bags/person/day are handed out. The 7/11 even use two large bags, one inside the other, as "one might break" for anything heavier than a packet of peanuts.

If 600,000 bags weigh 1,000 tonnes, then they reckon each bag weighs 3 gramms. Which is a bit much. But I think the figure of 600,000 is on the low side.

What is this, Maths for retards? If 600,000 bags weigh 1,000 tonnes, then 600 bags weighs 1 tonne= 1,000 kg = 1,000,000g. Each bag weighs 1666g or 1.666kg, which is simply ridiculous. 1.66g I might accept!

Tescos carrier bags must weigh about 3 grams so on a big shop you could be putting 30-60 grams of plastic into the environment which is roughly an ounce or 2. I don't think consumers should be charged for using plastic bags as the price is already factored into our bill as is the aircon, lighting and staff so charging us again for something we've already paid for isn't on. It would be like being hit with an additional 20B register tax at the cashier for her to add up your purchases.

As individuals we can make a difference but I can't really see many of us walking into Tescos with 10-15 cloth bags rolled up under our arms even if Tescos offered us a 1 Baht discount on the bill for each bag we supply. It's really the responsibility of the government to introduce strict legislation and the big corporate chains to enforce it.

If Tescos, Big C, etc... who must hand out purchase orders for billions of plastic bags every year started giving those contracts to companies producing biodegradable bags then their present suppliers would have to follow suit and go green. More competition cheaper recyclable bags! I'm sure the big chains are already making a profit on plastic bags they factor into our bills as I doubt we're getting them at cost price and certainly not for free.

Problem solved!

Ah, but why should the price of the bag be included into the bill?

I wonder if the companies actually factor a "profit" onto the bag? Tesco doesn't do anything for free.

Bags should be "visibly" charged, and not only the ones at the large chain stores. If you want to reuse and save a baht or two good for you, in essence you are already receiving essentially free bin liners by "buying" them from Tesco or Makro.

Just wait and see how avidly Thai's will pack their own groceries if they have to pay 0.5 baht a bag. In fact, before long, they will no doubt move to systems as they have in the US where there is no-one on the till and you scan, pay and pack all on your own.

7-11 has set up an entire food delivery industry that insists that the product has to be put into a plastic bag. How else can you put sauce on your sausage?

Edited June 28, 2010 by Thai at Heart

[witold]

Well, you all might be jumping in on the eco-bandwagon.

Not me. I like plastic bags. And I think I know why many Thais like them as well.

First, you don't have to carry your own bag to the store! Or plan ahead how many bags to bring based on your expected purchase amount. I remember this sort of BS from living under Communist rule and it was never fun or convenient.

Second, I own a motorcycle. I do put stuff in my backpack, but I also tie stuff outside of the backpack. Try tying those cloth bags - not possible. I presume Thais would run into the same problem on their scooters.

**

BTW, I live in Washington, DC. The city recently instituted a 5 cent price for every plastic bag purchased.

[Jimi007]

Simple solution would be that the Thai stores to start buying "biodegradable" bags and use them. Yes, they exist are being used elsewhere and in fact everywhere else it seems. They are actually made from "vegetable oil" and "plasticizers". I have been given them to me here a few times so I know they do exist here. The bags are identified by a "recyclable" label printed on it. They literally self destruct in 3-6 months with exposure to heat or UV light.

They use them at Villa Market, but I haven't seen any other markets use them. The bakery I go to uses paper bags, but then put a plastic bag over it.... Phuket tried a charge for plastic bag scheme, but Carrefore and a few others didn't want to go along with the idea so, it was scrapped, it seems. I reuse most all the bags to wrap things in or for trash bags. Sometimes we run out of bags to reuse, and I've had to buy trash bags. They used to wrap a lot of things in banana leaves, but they keep building condos and shop houses, etc. everywhere, so there aren't as many banana trees around anymore... Ah, progress?

[bkkjames]

Plastic bags are one thing but I notice from our daily trash at home the amount of packaging (plastic) is incredible. I give the beer and softdrink cans to the guy downstairs in our building but the rest I assume goes straight to the landfill.

[thaihome]

Considering the Crown Property Bureau owns the company that makes most of those bags, don't count on this movement going very far until they move into producing green products.

Do you have a particular company in mind you can name to back up this statement?

TH

[thaifrelst]

Most civilized countries charge for the plastic bags. Maybe except for special brand shops. The commercial affect would be to high for that.

Chain stores like Tesco and others will allways use plastic bags. That goes for all countries.

The big bags are not the problem. They can be used for other purposes also. The small red ones which you see floating everywhere on the streets and in the nature are the problem. Also the packaging from all kind of shit people consume on the streets are left all over.

But,but, - the main problem in Thailand is how to get rid of the garbage. In cities,towns and villages.

There is hardly a waste container anywhere.

And if we had one the problem would be how to get the thai people to use them.

When I grew up in my country ( Norway) the school teacher took us out in the school yard and the nearby streets to pick garbage for putting it in to waste containers. I can not remember that anybody complained because we have to do that.

Most of us was happy to come from the class room.

[crazygreg44]

Plastic bags In New Zealand last about 1- 2 months in the ground. We went through this no bags and 'save the planet

bags'. Eventually the speed of getting people through the checkouts won I guess.

There is an Australian company which has a plant, in Melbourne I think, that makes diesel fuel from plastic bags. 1 kilo of bags 1 kilo of fuel.

There was research done at Chulalongkorn University some years ago on the problem of getting plastic bags to degrade

Not sure of the outcome

I give you a lifetime supply of Beer if you can proof to me that there is a method to make 1 kg Diesel from 1 kg plastic bags !!! :lol:LMAO !!!!!!

[anon467367354]

If one notices what the Thai people buy, everything comes in a plastic bag, and every plastic bag goes into another one. I frequently mention to the clerks at stores after I decline a plastic bag and why, that sai tung mai ka/khrub should be said at every transaction. Laws are not enforced, and suggestions or just background noise, and this pertains to educated and non educated alike. There has to be a penalty and it has to be enforced, but then again geng jai comes into play and it won't be. It has to be a part of doing business, paeng gwaa. If it doesn't cost more, there is no deterrent. Sad but true, to do it because it's the right thing to do is not even part of the realm.

[crazygreg44]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

Hehe, a few people have tried, but it really is a simple calculation.

1,800 tons = 1,800,000 kgs. Divide that by 600,000 and you get 3 kg per bag! Hahaha.

The Hong Kong article says they used 4 per person per day, which sounds more realistic, so maybe there were a few 0's missing off the end of the 600,000:blink:

We have stopped giving out plastic bags in South Australia.

Plus South Australia recycles 70% of what can be recycles from out total rubbish.

Not bad for a small population of 1.2 million.

If that could be done world wide the landfill areas would take longer to fill and less pollution.

We use our cloth bags to do our weekly shopping.

I think Thailand recycles 100% of what can be recycled judging by the enthusiasm of the bin men in sifting through my rubbish every 3-4 days!

60 MILLION plastic bags per day sounds more like a fact than 600,000 for Bangkok alone, where an estimated 10 million people live, running into 7/11 5 times a day leaving the figure at 5-6 bags per day per capita. 600,000 - another proof of applied "thai" statistic maths !!!!

[harleyclarkey]

Plastic bag charge introduced in Ireland 4th March 2002 .

True enough Kevin.....Ireland was the first country to charge for plastic and it worked...reduced usage by 90%+. Now 25 cents/10 baht for a small plastic bag.

Bout the only good thing those stupid, lazy, incompetent, fraudulent, thieving, nepotist, egotist, self serving, greedy dopes in power here did.

[sirchai]

If one notices what the Thai people buy, everything comes in a plastic bag, and every plastic bag goes into another one. I frequently mention to the clerks at stores after I decline a plastic bag and why, that sai tung mai ka/khrub should be said at every transaction. Laws are not enforced, and suggestions or just background noise, and this pertains to educated and non educated alike. There has to be a penalty and it has to be enforced, but then again geng jai comes into play and it won't be. It has to be a part of doing business, paeng gwaa. If it doesn't cost more, there is no deterrent. Sad but true, to do it because it's the right thing to do is not even part of the realm.

Hope the clerks don't think you disappeared from a Si Maha Po....

[presscamera]

<br>I take my own cloth bags to Tesco, Carrefour, etc.  They look at me like I'm crazy!  And it's hard to tell the clerks at 7/11, etc., that you don't want a plastic bag.  It's only a can of coke!  I don't need a bag for it.<br><br>My wife says it's a Thai thing...they feel if they don't get a bag, they are getting ripped off...go figure...<br>

<br><br>Make Sure that they are made of Cloth as in Australia what used to be Green Callico Bags the ones that  the Supermarkets try to sell you to save the world are now in fact made of WOVEN  POLYETHYLYNE  but look like cloth to my knowledge that is plastic.  Soon their will be a campaign to ban them as well.

[crazygreg44]

TVF has a new topic to talk bad about Thai people.

Blame the Farang. Where plastic bags and soft drinks came from? Not so long time ago there where no plastic bags and no polystyreen food-containers. Food was packed in banana leaves.

There is a lot of recycling going on for all kinds of material. And believe it or not many plastic products in Thailand are made of biodegradable plastic.

Biodegradable plastic in use in Thailand ?? Please show me some !!! I would really like some proof !!!! I hope you know what you write !!! Do you know

what "biodegradable" means ? Can t see any of this anywhere near here !

[bkkjames]

TVF has a new topic to talk bad about Thai people.

Blame the Farang. Where plastic bags and soft drinks came from? Not so long time ago there where no plastic bags and no polystyreen food-containers. Food was packed in banana leaves.

There is a lot of recycling going on for all kinds of material. And believe it or not many plastic products in Thailand are made of biodegradable plastic.

Biodegradable plastic in use in Thailand ??   Please show me some !!!  I would really like some proof !!!!   I hope you know what you write !!!  Do you know

what "biodegradable" means  ?  Can t see any of this anywhere near here !

Exactly, every piece of plastic I pick up is made in China but I guess that's the farang's fault. 

[sotsira]

Don't forget the drinking straws. I even see them drinking beer with them. This has to be doing a lot of damage also.

Yes it makes you get drunk a lot faster!

[shiatsuman]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

If BKK produces 1,800 tons of plastic waste per day for a city of 9million it would be interesting to compare it to a western european or north american city of the same size.

my bet is that the west still produces many times the waste as the east, plus all the unseen waste of processing transporting and marketing produce to the supermarkets.

In rural thailand the main form of packaging is the bannana leaf , plastic bags used for drinks I thing are better than other disposable containers.

Recyling in thailand is a major cottage industry providing much needed cash for the poorest people, as opposed to the green recyclying projects of the west.

We have been conditioned to believe that we are consumming less if we play the recycle game, when in fact the cloth bag is just the fig leaf to cover our excess

[bkkjames]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

If BKK produces 1,800 tons of plastic waste per day for a city of 9million it would be interesting to compare it to a western european or north american city of the same size.

my bet is that the west still produces many times the waste as the east, plus all the unseen waste of processing transporting and marketing produce to the supermarkets.

In rural thailand the main form of packaging is the bannana leaf ,  plastic bags used for drinks I thing are better than other disposable containers.

Recyling in thailand is a major cottage industry providing much needed cash for the poorest people, as opposed to the  green recyclying projects of the west.

We have been conditioned to believe that  we are consumming less if we play the recycle game, when in fact the cloth bag is just the fig leaf to cover our excess

I have yet to see the cottage industry you speak of recycling plastic bags? Bottles yes, scrap metal, wood yes, but bags from supermarkets and convenience stores nope. 

[GungaDin]

TVF has a new topic to talk bad about Thai people.

Blame the Farang. Where plastic bags and soft drinks came from? Not so long time ago there where no plastic bags and no polystyreen food-containers. Food was packed in banana leaves.

There is a lot of recycling going on for all kinds of material. And believe it or not many plastic products in Thailand are made of biodegradable plastic.

your post is typical xenophobia.

you sound like the taliban leader with 5 mobile phones. 

& a laptop.....

-------------------

My local fried rice vendor serves the take-aways on a banana leaf in Polystyrene box!

Explain the Thai "logic" in that K.'kissdani'!

[Navalator]

<br>

<br>My wife says it's a Thai thing...<br>

<br><br>God I hate it when people say that "Oh, it's a Thai thing", corruption - "its a Thai thing", lateness, "its a Thai thing" or, my personal favorite, Greng jai (being considerate) "its a Thai thing" - as if no other nation has the concept of being considerate towards other people - 555555<br><br>:-)<br>

<br><br>I totally agree.  I have lived in several countries (cultures) around the world and get very annoyed when the excuse for everything is "It's a Thai thing". There are thoughtless people and morons everywhere in the world, Eastern and Western hemispheres included. I think that people who use that phrase are closet racists, Thai wives notwithstanding. Using the phrase indicates intolerance and ignorance. Edited June 28, 2010 by Navalator

[kitski]

There is nothing wrong in charging for a plastic bag. Even in Thailand, all Macro stores charge their plastic bags. If you do not take a plastic bag and put your things inside, they will give you the goods '"on hand", unpacked (except for fish, and vegetables that came already in a thin transparent bag that you wont have to pay it). If you put your things in a orange bag, same as the one given for free in Rimping, Lotus, or Big C, then the Macro's clerk will charge it. In my country you have to pay for all plastic bags. Well, here in Thai you still can refuse them, politely, by asking the clerk to put more things in the same bag. When I go to shopping I always prefer to get 3-4 bags instead of 10-15, easy to handle to my car, etc. I did not go so far to go shopping with my own bags, but this is because I am quite lazy and always forgetful... <br>

[kissdani]

TVF has a new topic to talk bad about Thai people.

Blame the Farang. Where plastic bags and soft drinks came from? Not so long time ago there where no plastic bags and no polystyreen food-containers. Food was packed in banana leaves.

There is a lot of recycling going on for all kinds of material. And believe it or not many plastic products in Thailand are made of biodegradable plastic.

Biodegradable plastic in use in Thailand ?? Please show me some !!! I would really like some proof !!!! I hope you know what you write !!! Do you know

what "biodegradable" means ? Can t see any of this anywhere near here !

Yes, for example the cloth hanger and clothespin i bought to hang up clothes for drying in the sun. I kept them on the balcony and now they turn to dust when touched.

There are products in the stores with a 3R sign Reduce, Reuse, Recycle.

http://www.3rkh.net/

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/project-to-promote-use-of-biodegradable-bags-launched-78514467.html

http://www.alibaba.com/countrysearch/TH/biodegradable-plastic-bag.html

[asiawatcher]

9 million people use 600,000 plastic bags per day? Is that not one bag per person every 15 days? A likely story.

Is that right that they weigh 1,800 tonnes every day, 600,000 plastic bags weigh 1,800 tonnes? They must be thicker and heavier than the bags we get here in Chiang Mai. Correct me if I am wrong as maths was never my strong point.

Yep, I would have though that at least two bags/person/day are handed out. The 7/11 even use two large bags, one inside the other, as "one might break" for anything heavier than a packet of peanuts.

If 600,000 bags weigh 1,000 tonnes, then they reckon each bag weighs 3 gramms. Which is a bit much. But I think the figure of 600,000 is on the low side.

What is this, Maths for retards? If 600,000 bags weigh 1,000 tonnes, then 600 bags weighs 1 tonne= 1,000 kg = 1,000,000g. Each bag weighs 1666g or 1.666kg, which is simply ridiculous. 1.66g I might accept!

Does anybody really care?

[kissdani]

TVF has a new topic to talk bad about Thai people.

Blame the Farang. Where plastic bags and soft drinks came from? Not so long time ago there where no plastic bags and no polystyreen food-containers. Food was packed in banana leaves.

There is a lot of recycling going on for all kinds of material. And believe it or not many plastic products in Thailand are made of biodegradable plastic.

your post is typical xenophobia.

you sound like the taliban leader with 5 mobile phones. 

& a laptop.....

-------------------

My local fried rice vendor serves the take-aways on a banana leaf in Polystyrene box!

Explain the Thai "logic" in that K.'kissdani'!

maybe he use this kind of food boxes: Born-Bio-Packaging

I often say in the 7/11 that i don't need a bag. without getting strange looks. Maybe that is only because you are Farang and speak with a funny accent.

Or if you buy your food for the evening down the soi where all the food vendors are and you give them your own reusable food box to carry the stuff away you will not get strange looks. Try that with your fried rice dealer.

If Farangs think everything is so bad and backward in Thailand and Thai people are so stupid and not intelligent same as Farang, why you Farang coming here at all. Where is there the Farang "logic"?

[wotta]

Plastic bag charge introduced in Ireland 4th March 2002 .

[wotta]

All good statements... but we all go on and on trying to reinvent the wheel.... we all know it has been done before....the only constant is ineptitude...

[Jimi007]

TVF has a new topic to talk bad about Thai people.

Blame the Farang. Where plastic bags and soft drinks came from? Not so long time ago there where no plastic bags and no polystyreen food-containers. Food was packed in banana leaves.

There is a lot of recycling going on for all kinds of material. And believe it or not many plastic products in Thailand are made of biodegradable plastic.

Biodegradable plastic in use in Thailand ?? Please show me some !!! I would really like some proof !!!! I hope you know what you write !!! Do you know

what "biodegradable" means ? Can t see any of this anywhere near here !

While I disagree with the "Blame the Farang" comment, as I see Thais throwing their trash from moving vehicles almost every day and dumping construction debris anywhere they can... But this is printed on my plastic bag from my local super market.

[elkangorito]

I have been taking my bag (a backpack zipper job) with me to 7-11 & similar stores, for the past 3 years or so. The staff at the local 7-11 now know that I do not require any/extra plastic bags.

I have also told them about the pollution that these plastic bags cause.

It's simple...spread the word & soon, people will get the message.

The use of these plastic bags in Thailand cannot be blamed on western civilisation.

[tombkk]

I take my own cloth bags to Tesco, Carrefour, etc. They look at me like I'm crazy! And it's hard to tell the clerks at 7/11, etc., that you don't want a plastic bag. It's only a can of coke! I don't need a bag for it.

My wife says it's a Thai thing...they feel if they don't get a bag, they are getting ripped off...go figure...

When I buy just a small thing at 7-eleven and they start packing it into a plastic bag, I say "I don't want a plastic bag, it's bad for the environment." They giggle or whatever, and while handing me the product say that they know about it.

It appears to be company policy to hand out these bags voluntarily instead of asking: "Do you want a bag?", which would be the first step. It would also save 7-eleven a lot of money, if I may say so.