Two Thai Teenagers Held Over 9y-Old Schoolboy Shooting

[samjaidee]

Post #6 - cup-O-coffee, on 2010-09-02 15:21, said:

One of the best thought out posts I've seen on here for a long time. If you missed it, go back and read it.

Thank you.

[samjaidee]

My very deepest sympathies to the family, friends and classmates of the victim.

This happened in the neighborhood where I live and work and is quite upsetting. A few months back, two colleagues were on a bus on that route (maybe the same number--I don't recall) and were held on the floor at gun point along with other passengers. The young men who had them get on the floor, did so for their own protection. It seems they had fled a fight with another school (or gang) and some of the students from the other school were approaching with guns out, so they told everyone to get down on the floor. When the bus stopped, the students fled. No shots fired on the bus or at the bus, but still a little too close to home.

Scott is a hero.

.

Actually Scott's colleagues are heroes. :D

[ilyelol]

The remarkable thing about kids is that they are human beings too, who happen to be more dramatic in expressing their emotions. They haven't grown up enough to know to conceal their true feelings and resort to cunning and trickery. So, reading about these kids behavior is a good indicator of the social undercurrent going on, but that the kids have not learned to conceal yet.

Thailand's problem solving process goes like this; fight or flight.

When they fight, it is no holds barred and no quarter asked for or given.

When they make flight, there is no possibility to get them to return to the issue or location to talk rationally. They have no rationale. This is how they get programmed through their childhood. No human is born with Intel Pentium inside, and a host of software to know how to cope with life. It has to get programmed in as the human grows up. Clearly, the evidence surrounding us is a strong indicator of what type of programming is going on. Animal from the start, and human being by programming that brings out our better nature; otherwise, our animal nature will rule.

These days in Western countries, if a father administers tough love and corrects his children with a swat to the bum, he goes to jail, gets a restraining order, goes through mandatory anger management class, etc. The old days are gone, and the new Western world will see the affects of children who do not respect each other due to the inability to understand and respect each individual's boundaries.

The West is a good example of how wrong it is for governments to involve themselves in matters far better left to responsible, caring, and loving parents. Mommy is the nurturer, and Daddy is "The Line". Don't step over the line. But the West has systematically removed Daddy from the home, which is now run by the remainder of the family unit. I hope Thailand's government does not intervene as the West has. I hope they begin putting the yoke of responsibility back onto the Father and Mother.

But one problem here with the Thai fathers is one that bring s a saying to mind: "I am my father's son". The governments of the West had to make laws to get the father out of the home. The irony here is that Thailand needs to make laws to get the fathers back into the the home. There never was any need to get the fathers out of the home because the culture here does not seem to cultivate a patriarchal responsibility in a society that is known to be matriarchal. Hence the mom making a statement, and leaving me asking, "where the heck is dad?".

On a side note, I find it interesting that of all the children in orphanages in Thailand, over 60% have parents who have not yet signed a waiver of release for their kids to be in an orphanage. Hence they cannot get adopted. Is this another facet of an issue where Thai parents simply do not want to be involved with their children after they get past that cute and cuddly age? If the beast is not programmed to be a human of better nature, then it will grow into an adult beast, with all the facade of simulating a normal adult. But when you look at the track record, the diagnosis is clear.

What makes a person stop-check their self before stepping across the line? Clearly, Thailand has not found an answer to that, nor a deterrent to those who do. I think the reason for this is that tugging at any one strand of this social structure will cause the entire web to tremble.

To the people who abhor any form of physical correction towards children, then I wonder if they are also against having a strong military presence to protect their right to abhor violence. After all, isn't a military supposed to be prepared to punch the enemy in the snout and make them think twice about stepping across the line?

Idealists seem to hide behind the ankles of the realists when the doo-doo hits the fan. But when everything is peaceful and serene, they come out from under their rocks and condemn violence in all forms, regardless of the necessity in life to administer it at certain times, and to certain individuals, as a deterrent to far worse behavior - to get that beast back on the track to becoming a human of better nature.

Let's corral the idealists together and put them in the same neighborhood where these unruly animals live. I wonder if they will start a neighborhood charity and spend time with these not fully matured, feral humans, and mentor them onto the path of becoming human beings of a better nature. I am quite certain it will not be long before they cry for someone other than themselves to "get tough" on these kids.

You will never find an idealist in a fox-hole, and negotiating with children is the height of folly!

didnt read further..

reminds me of the black ghetto's ... common joke is.. no black kid ever has a daddy... well those black kid we're the #1 gun shooters in statistics.

if they ever kept legit statistic in thailand, it would probably be the same

[LikeHeat]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

Well said, Rich !

This tragedy occured through some unfortunate kid being shot in the face and neck. The report didn't make it clear whether this was by one bullet or multiples. Either way, even for a 16 year old, you've probably got to be a living Saint to believe the statement "I didn't intend to hurt him"

My condolences to the victim's family and friends for this tragic and completely senseless loss of a loved one. RIP young fella

I guess you do not know what a shotgun is. One shot and it discharges many small pellets, each capable of killing if it strikes a vulnerable spot. Also, I can interpret the kid as saying he did not intend to hurt the 9 year old. He was after the rival kids, probably 16 and older. The thing with a shotgun is that is really does not miss or discriminate, and will spray the entire target area. This is something the kids do not get from their video games or soap operas. This could be the first time that kid has ever fired a shotgun. I know that the first time I fired at a target and saw the effects, I knew right then and there that it was not a toy and if the trigger is pulled then some serious damage is going to happen. I doubt the kid had any sort of that idea in his head.

My condolences to the family of the 9 year old, and the other kids as well. They all have lost children in the incident. This should not be happening.

[newermonkey]

Would that normally be the death sentence if the the 19yo is found guilty ?

[Robby nz]

Takeing each class for a visit to the BKK Hilton to see whats in store for them if they get out of line might be a good and cheap idea.

Seeing cells full of chained prisoners could be a little though provoking.

[smokinbilly]

The remarkable thing about kids is that they are human beings too, who happen to be more dramatic in expressing their emotions. They haven't grown up enough to know to conceal their true feelings and resort to cunning and trickery. So, reading about these kids behavior is a good indicator of the social undercurrent going on, but that the kids have not learned to conceal yet.

Thailand's problem solving process goes like this; fight or flight.

When they fight, it is no holds barred and no quarter asked for or given.

When they make flight, there is no possibility to get them to return to the issue or location to talk rationally. They have no rationale. This is how they get programmed through their childhood. No human is born with Intel Pentium inside, and a host of software to know how to cope with life. It has to get programmed in as the human grows up. Clearly, the evidence surrounding us is a strong indicator of what type of programming is going on. Animal from the start, and human being by programming that brings out our better nature; otherwise, our animal nature will rule.

These days in Western countries, if a father administers tough love and corrects his children with a swat to the bum, he goes to jail, gets a restraining order, goes through mandatory anger management class, etc. The old days are gone, and the new Western world will see the affects of children who do not respect each other due to the inability to understand and respect each individual's boundaries.

The West is a good example of how wrong it is for governments to involve themselves in matters far better left to responsible, caring, and loving parents. Mommy is the nurturer, and Daddy is "The Line". Don't step over the line. But the West has systematically removed Daddy from the home, which is now run by the remainder of the family unit. I hope Thailand's government does not intervene as the West has. I hope they begin putting the yoke of responsibility back onto the Father and Mother.

But one problem here with the Thai fathers is one that bring s a saying to mind: "I am my father's son". The governments of the West had to make laws to get the father out of the home. The irony here is that Thailand needs to make laws to get the fathers back into the the home. There never was any need to get the fathers out of the home because the culture here does not seem to cultivate a patriarchal responsibility in a society that is known to be matriarchal. Hence the mom making a statement, and leaving me asking, "where the heck is dad?".

On a side note, I find it interesting that of all the children in orphanages in Thailand, over 60% have parents who have not yet signed a waiver of release for their kids to be in an orphanage. Hence they cannot get adopted. Is this another facet of an issue where Thai parents simply do not want to be involved with their children after they get past that cute and cuddly age? If the beast is not programmed to be a human of better nature, then it will grow into an adult beast, with all the facade of simulating a normal adult. But when you look at the track record, the diagnosis is clear.

What makes a person stop-check their self before stepping across the line? Clearly, Thailand has not found an answer to that, nor a deterrent to those who do. I think the reason for this is that tugging at any one strand of this social structure will cause the entire web to tremble.

To the people who abhor any form of physical correction towards children, then I wonder if they are also against having a strong military presence to protect their right to abhor violence. After all, isn't a military supposed to be prepared to punch the enemy in the snout and make them think twice about stepping across the line?

Idealists seem to hide behind the ankles of the realists when the doo-doo hits the fan. But when everything is peaceful and serene, they come out from under their rocks and condemn violence in all forms, regardless of the necessity in life to administer it at certain times, and to certain individuals, as a deterrent to far worse behavior - to get that beast back on the track to becoming a human of better nature.

Let's corral the idealists together and put them in the same neighborhood where these unruly animals live. I wonder if they will start a neighborhood charity and spend time with these not fully matured, feral humans, and mentor them onto the path of becoming human beings of a better nature. I am quite certain it will not be long before they cry for someone other than themselves to "get tough" on these kids.

You will never find an idealist in a fox-hole, and negotiating with children is the height of folly!

A very good post with many wise points

[Thunderbird4ever]

There is a law in Thailand that the parents can be held responsible for their kids up to the age of 20 years old - maybe need to start enforcing that law! Don't know the details but sure need to think about it!

What good is that? The dam_n parents are incapable of being responsible for themselves, have you ever watched them riding a motorbike or driving a car?? I would rather the family cat was responsible for the children than some of the parents.

Actually if parents knew this law was enforced everyday in Thai life and they would do a better job as a parent. Its just too much arai ka dai mentality in this country and also towards raising a child . Their threathened to get a slap or get slapped and to respect elderly people no matter what and thats about it. Its little effort to teach about real moral and ethics over a long period of time with a deeper meaning towards humans human lives. We are not talking about people from wealthier families as much of the learning process around morals and good behaviour is done in good schools often interational ones.

Yes it would stress the parents in a very different way!

And yes also enforce death penalty. These kids are no good for nothing. Their lives is destroyed now and once out on the street again, A 90 % chance they will do something horrible again. Neck shot, problem gone.

My thoughts goes to the victims family. especially the brother who had to watch younger brother taking the bullits. What a fukced up act of a youngster killer! For sure the parents is to blame for some of it.

[hungryhippo]

Seems to me the best course of action is to remove the rivalry between schools. This could easily be done by hosting events where students are mixed between different schools. This would be good for a student's social skills as well.

[ableguy]

The remarkable thing about kids is that they are human beings too, who happen to be more dramatic in expressing their emotions. They haven't grown up enough to know to conceal their true feelings and resort to cunning and trickery. So, reading about these kids behavior is a good indicator of the social undercurrent going on, but that the kids have not learned to conceal yet.

Thailand's problem solving process goes like this; fight or flight.

When they fight, it is no holds barred and no quarter asked for or given.

When they make flight, there is no possibility to get them to return to the issue or location to talk rationally. They have no rationale. This is how they get programmed through their childhood. No human is born with Intel Pentium inside, and a host of software to know how to cope with life. It has to get programmed in as the human grows up. Clearly, the evidence surrounding us is a strong indicator of what type of programming is going on. Animal from the start, and human being by programming that brings out our better nature; otherwise, our animal nature will rule.

These days in Western countries, if a father administers tough love and corrects his children with a swat to the bum, he goes to jail, gets a restraining order, goes through mandatory anger management class, etc. The old days are gone, and the new Western world will see the affects of children who do not respect each other due to the inability to understand and respect each individual's boundaries.

The West is a good example of how wrong it is for governments to involve themselves in matters far better left to responsible, caring, and loving parents. Mommy is the nurturer, and Daddy is "The Line". Don't step over the line. But the West has systematically removed Daddy from the home, which is now run by the remainder of the family unit. I hope Thailand's government does not intervene as the West has. I hope they begin putting the yoke of responsibility back onto the Father and Mother.

But one problem here with the Thai fathers is one that bring s a saying to mind: "I am my father's son". The governments of the West had to make laws to get the father out of the home. The irony here is that Thailand needs to make laws to get the fathers back into the the home. There never was any need to get the fathers out of the home because the culture here does not seem to cultivate a patriarchal responsibility in a society that is known to be matriarchal. Hence the mom making a statement, and leaving me asking, "where the heck is dad?".

On a side note, I find it interesting that of all the children in orphanages in Thailand, over 60% have parents who have not yet signed a waiver of release for their kids to be in an orphanage. Hence they cannot get adopted. Is this another facet of an issue where Thai parents simply do not want to be involved with their children after they get past that cute and cuddly age? If the beast is not programmed to be a human of better nature, then it will grow into an adult beast, with all the facade of simulating a normal adult. But when you look at the track record, the diagnosis is clear.

What makes a person stop-check their self before stepping across the line? Clearly, Thailand has not found an answer to that, nor a deterrent to those who do. I think the reason for this is that tugging at any one strand of this social structure will cause the entire web to tremble.

To the people who abhor any form of physical correction towards children, then I wonder if they are also against having a strong military presence to protect their right to abhor violence. After all, isn't a military supposed to be prepared to punch the enemy in the snout and make them think twice about stepping across the line?

Idealists seem to hide behind the ankles of the realists when the doo-doo hits the fan. But when everything is peaceful and serene, they come out from under their rocks and condemn violence in all forms, regardless of the necessity in life to administer it at certain times, and to certain individuals, as a deterrent to far worse behavior - to get that beast back on the track to becoming a human of better nature.

Let's corral the idealists together and put them in the same neighborhood where these unruly animals live. I wonder if they will start a neighborhood charity and spend time with these not fully matured, feral humans, and mentor them onto the path of becoming human beings of a better nature. I am quite certain it will not be long before they cry for someone other than themselves to "get tough" on these kids.

You will never find an idealist in a fox-hole, and negotiating with children is the height of folly!

WOW..... myself I dont consider a 19 year old a child, do the crime do the time.

[dighambara]

Every time you fire a gun you are solely responsible for what happens due to this.

Could the parents be lined up at the arrest too?

Interesting - - Every time you ?? Drive a car, use a knife, pick up a stick or use a pencil - - HMMM

Strange way of saying people are responsible for their own actions - almost sounds as if you were blaming the tool rather than the boy who used it...HMMM

[Thules]

Yes, Hippo,

But what is the root cause of such rivalvy, that you're justly wishing to remove ? What causes such intense rivalvy that causes some unfortunate kid to be shot in the face and killed ?

[dighambara]

Back in the 1990s I worked at a public institution (an RIT school) in Bangkok that had a vocational division.

"one group of students began chasing another onto the field. Myself and a few other teachers stopped to look. Then we heard the sound... pop... pop... pop... pop... pop... I ducked behind a cement pillar. The other teachers stayed where they were. Several laughed that I ducked for cover and was yelling for them to do the same. "Mai bpen rai" they said, "they are not shooting at us'" Amazing Thailand indeed.

This happen wherever citizens are not required military training. I worked across the street from where a fellow went around shooting people. I carefully walked to every window to close the blinds so we wouldn't become targets. At least four windowas were reopened so people could watch. I went back an closed them again and explained, in harsh terms, what I thought of their imtelligence or lack thereof.

[risky11]

cup-O-coffee, post #6

Excellent post, thanks for that.

[KeyserSoze01]

Ah, as we all know, a few thousand baht will change hands and all will be forgotten...

TiT after all...

[asiawatcher]

Back in the 1990s I worked at a public institution (an RIT school) in Bangkok that had a vocational division.

Brawls on the soccer field were frequent. If you were lucky it was only sticks and knives, but guns were drawn from time to time and I witnessed gunfire on more than one occasion and did once see a kid get shot in the stomach. Fortunately the kid that was shot survived, but we also had several kids from the school that were not so lucky when gunfire was exchanged off-campus and yes, on a bus.

The shootings on campus never made the news media. There were no police cars. No ambulances. Nothing. It never happened. Injured kids were quietly taken to the hospital and nobody talked about it. During my tenure the school director was even voted RIT Director of the Year despite the soccer field hosting as many brawls as it did football games.

The brawls were always between departments in the school, i.e Automotive vs Welding. The school's response was to suspend every kid in the department for two weeks. Well, who did the shooting? Never mind, they are all equally guilty so everybody gets a two-week holiday to cool off.

I wondered, and still wonder if maybe the kids didn't spend every waking minute together but actually had the courses mixed up with other kids there might be less violence? Imagine if for non-department courses, i.e. English, history, etc the automotive kids were mixed with the welding kids, mixed with the masonry kids, mixed with the HVAC kids, etc and they actually got to know each other has someone other than the "enemy" they might get along better. I mentioned this once to a few of the Thai teachers around me whose response was along the lines that such a move would be a terrible complication of scheduling, entirely too much work for someone, and why are you even thinking about it? Yes, I know, gin kao de-gwah.

I also found remarkable the awareness or lack thereof of what bullets can do. One time I was walking along the edge of the soccer field, our office over-looked one end of it, when from the north side of the field (the vocational side of the school) one group of students began chasing another onto the field. Myself and a few other teachers stopped to look. Then we heard the sound... pop... pop... pop... pop... pop... I ducked behind a cement pillar. The other teachers stayed where they were. Several laughed that I ducked for cover and was yelling for them to do the same. "Mai bpen rai" they said, "they are not shooting at us'" Amazing Thailand indeed.

I would be interested to see if this is swept under the carpet as in times gone past that you mention! A sad state of affairs.

[meelousee]

"I did not intended to hurt him. I apologise to his family," he told reporters.

Well, that makes it all okay then. Condolences to the family of the slain boy. It did not have to happen. There is plenty of blame to go around here, but it starts with these two punks. Life without parole. Done. Next time we hear anything about them is in 2060 when its reported they've died in prison. Next in responsibility are the heads of the schools. For years their line has been "boys will be boys" and they have refused to come down on the rivalries between these schools, they have even promoted the rivalries. Give the headmaster of this school the word - shut down the school if he does not resign. The education minister should be called in front of the governor or PM and have a plan within 48 hours to clean up the rest of the schools or he's gone. Word goes out to all schools, next sign of trouble, they all shut down, for good.

No it does not start with "these two punks" It starts with their punk mothers and fathers!

The school is not there to raise your children education begins at home as with all social behavior models.

[Colabamumbai]

The remarkable thing about kids is that they are human beings too, who happen to be more dramatic in expressing their emotions. They haven't grown up enough to know to conceal their true feelings and resort to cunning and trickery. So, reading about these kids behavior is a good indicator of the social undercurrent going on, but that the kids have not learned to conceal yet.

Thailand's problem solving process goes like this; fight or flight.

When they fight, it is no holds barred and no quarter asked for or given.

When they make flight, there is no possibility to get them to return to the issue or location to talk rationally. They have no rationale. This is how they get programmed through their childhood. No human is born with Intel Pentium inside, and a host of software to know how to cope with life. It has to get programmed in as the human grows up. Clearly, the evidence surrounding us is a strong indicator of what type of programming is going on. Animal from the start, and human being by programming that brings out our better nature; otherwise, our animal nature will rule.

These days in Western countries, if a father administers tough love and corrects his children with a swat to the bum, he goes to jail, gets a restraining order, goes through mandatory anger management class, etc. The old days are gone, and the new Western world will see the affects of children who do not respect each other due to the inability to understand and respect each individual's boundaries.

The West is a good example of how wrong it is for governments to involve themselves in matters far better left to responsible, caring, and loving parents. Mommy is the nurturer, and Daddy is "The Line". Don't step over the line. But the West has systematically removed Daddy from the home, which is now run by the remainder of the family unit. I hope Thailand's government does not intervene as the West has. I hope they begin putting the yoke of responsibility back onto the Father and Mother.

But one problem here with the Thai fathers is one that bring s a saying to mind: "I am my father's son". The governments of the West had to make laws to get the father out of the home. The irony here is that Thailand needs to make laws to get the fathers back into the the home. There never was any need to get the fathers out of the home because the culture here does not seem to cultivate a patriarchal responsibility in a society that is known to be matriarchal. Hence the mom making a statement, and leaving me asking, "where the heck is dad?".

On a side note, I find it interesting that of all the children in orphanages in Thailand, over 60% have parents who have not yet signed a waiver of release for their kids to be in an orphanage. Hence they cannot get adopted. Is this another facet of an issue where Thai parents simply do not want to be involved with their children after they get past that cute and cuddly age? If the beast is not programmed to be a human of better nature, then it will grow into an adult beast, with all the facade of simulating a normal adult. But when you look at the track record, the diagnosis is clear.

What makes a person stop-check their self before stepping across the line? Clearly, Thailand has not found an answer to that, nor a deterrent to those who do. I think the reason for this is that tugging at any one strand of this social structure will cause the entire web to tremble.

To the people who abhor any form of physical correction towards children, then I wonder if they are also against having a strong military presence to protect their right to abhor violence. After all, isn't a military supposed to be prepared to punch the enemy in the snout and make them think twice about stepping across the line?

Idealists seem to hide behind the ankles of the realists when the doo-doo hits the fan. But when everything is peaceful and serene, they come out from under their rocks and condemn violence in all forms, regardless of the necessity in life to administer it at certain times, and to certain individuals, as a deterrent to far worse behavior - to get that beast back on the track to becoming a human of better nature.

Let's corral the idealists together and put them in the same neighborhood where these unruly animals live. I wonder if they will start a neighborhood charity and spend time with these not fully matured, feral humans, and mentor them onto the path of becoming human beings of a better nature. I am quite certain it will not be long before they cry for someone other than themselves to "get tough" on these kids.

You will never find an idealist in a fox-hole, and negotiating with children is the height of folly!

Thais do not want to talk, Do not want to talk about problems etc. But will kill.

[tonititan]

Well said, Rich !

This tragedy occured through some unfortunate kid being shot in the face and neck. The report didn't make it clear whether this was by one bullet or multiples. Either way, even for a 16 year old, you've probably got to be a living Saint to believe the statement "I didn't intend to hurt him"

Also, I can interpret the kid as saying he did not intend to hurt the 9 year old. He was after the rival kids, probably 16 and older.

That's how I read it too. I'm guessing that he probably meant "I didn't intend to hurt HIM." He probably does feel genuine remorse for killing a 9 year old boy. Of course it doesn't make it ok that he was trying to hurt someone else, but that could explain the quote that seems completely ridiculous to most of us.

[blakegeee]

Back in the 1990s I worked at a public institution (an RIT school) in Bangkok that had a vocational division.

"one group of students began chasing another onto the field. Myself and a few other teachers stopped to look. Then we heard the sound... pop... pop... pop... pop... pop... I ducked behind a cement pillar. The other teachers stayed where they were. Several laughed that I ducked for cover and was yelling for them to do the same. "Mai bpen rai" they said, "they are not shooting at us'" Amazing Thailand indeed.

This happen wherever citizens are not required military training...

Really???!!! You aren't actually serious, are you?

[spectrumisgreen]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

... don't forget he apologised to the family too!!! Like killing someone is something you CAN apologise for!!!!!!!

As I've grown up and matured I've realised that the world we've made is a crazy ****** up place and we aren't [therefore IT isn't] about to change anytime soon.. all we can do is try to look out for ourselves and our loved ones and try to make the best of the light which naturally comes before and after the dark...

[ThaiRich]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

... don't forget he apologised to the family too!!! Like killing someone is something you CAN apologise for!!!!!!!

As I've grown up and matured I've realised that the world we've made is a crazy ****** up place and we aren't [therefore IT isn't] about to change anytime soon.. all we can do is try to look out for ourselves and our loved ones and try to make the best of the light which naturally comes before and after the dark...

I teach this age group, 3rd grade. I have been at my school for nearly 6 years. So, the students that are in 3rd grade I have known since they were in kindergarten 1. Today at school I was looking around at "my kids" and tried to imagine one of them with bullets in his/her face and neck and it just made my blood boil. My stomache is in knots thinking about this happening to an innocent young child. I hope justice is served and not someones bank account.

[scorecard]

There is a law in Thailand that the parents can be held responsible for their kids up to the age of 20 years old - maybe need to start enforcing that law! Don't know the details but sure need to think about it!

Holding the parents responsible is ceratinly part of the puzzle, and there are obviously many aspects to the puzzle.

When there are school shootings in the US I often wonder if the parents are absent, separated etc., or in some cases are the parents both working two jobs to keep food on the table, to pay school fees etc? And in Thailand although successive governments make claims about free education etc., eductaion is in fact very expensive for low income earners.

In Thailand, and obviously many other countries, we have many many families where both parents work, often long hours to earn enough for the family to survive. Simple example: in my soi we have mother and father working their tits off operating a noodle stand from about 0900 to 2200 every day, seven days a week.

The point; seems to me that Thailand (and many other countreis) need to urgently make big changes in education, policies which force a better sharing of the wealth etc., so that a much larger proportion of society have a good quality of life, and parents can spend more time with their children. To be really serious, does capitalism produce severe downside as well as, in some cases, wealth?

My sincere condolences to the family and friends. And lets not forget that the parents of this young boy will never recover from this very sad and senseless loss.

[phomsanuk]

Tragic, where did he get the gun?

[Sabre]

Would that normally be the death sentence if the the 19yo is found guilty ?

Generally speaking, if a an accused person cooperates with the police/courts and pleads guilty a Thai court will not impose the death penalty even in circumstances where it is available.

I suppose it's a question of leverage - nobody would ever plead guilty or cooperate with the police if they thought they were going to get the death penalty anyway.

[Hugh Jarse]

"I did not intended to hurt him. I apologise to his family," he told reporters.

Well, that makes it all okay then. Condolences to the family of the slain boy. It did not have to happen. There is plenty of blame to go around here, but it starts with these two punks. Life without parole. Done. Next time we hear anything about them is in 2060 when its reported they've died in prison. Next in responsibility are the heads of the schools. For years their line has been "boys will be boys" and they have refused to come down on the rivalries between these schools, they have even promoted the rivalries. Give the headmaster of this school the word - shut down the school if he does not resign. The education minister should be called in front of the governor or PM and have a plan within 48 hours to clean up the rest of the schools or he's gone. Word goes out to all schools, next sign of trouble, they all shut down, for good.

Social control begins in the family (I'm assuming these yobs have a family or some kinsfolk), and that is where right and wrong must begin. Don't just blame the schools and those running them.It is much more complicated .We all learn more out of school that in it . Poverty and chaotic family life leads to all kinds of social disintegration .The elites and power wielders of this country have a monumental job ahead of them improving childrens access to education, along with financial support for (poor) families to help them send their children to school without incurring debts to userers(sp?).

My deepest sympathies to the parents of the dead.

[Thules]

Actually Sabre, I hope that I would differ from your opinion.

If I were to be innocently accused of some crime which I didn't commit but never the less facing the death sentence, I hope I would go to my death, as a proud and inoicent man, rather than rot in a Thai jail for19 years as a convicted but innocent person.

Then again, this is easier to say when one's fortitude isn't really being put to that test.

[Loz]

THe firetrucking TWUNT in the seat next to me who actually works in this net cafe is watching clip after clip of school kids fighting and laughing out loud. He's early twenties and to my mind a firetrucking Tuwnt for thinking this is funny. I know its stupid and verging on hypocritical but I want to put his head though the window to show him how funny it is to be bullied. I don't enjoy violence and the fact that this young man for the last half hour has been laughing at nothing other than young girls mainly, fighting and hurting each other on phone video clips loaded to Youtube and the odd boys fight where he delights in pointing out the blood from heads being smashed against the black board makes me want to give him a taste of this brand of humour. Not good for me, not good for him. But this is THailand. THis is what they think is funny. I won't miss this.

SOmetimes I really <deleted> hate this place for the kind of things that seem socially acceptable. I think Porn is a more suitable subject in a net cafe that high school boys and girls kicking each others heads in. WOuld love to take the admirers of this violence to the Nazi Death camps for a few days. Maybe a few re-enactments could be arranged to help them understand.

[moskito]

Instead of send them to jail they should send the parents there!

Usually Thaiparents have no idea what their kids do in there free time, THIS should change and then the kids will maybe.

[stormstereo]

Every time you fire a gun you are solely responsible for what happens due to this.

Could the parents be lined up at the arrest too?

I would go even further and say every time you bring a gun or a knife you are a potential murderer.