Pigs 101 (A Start)

[RedBullHorn]

I was wondering for some time on why my new batch of piglets was kind of odd looking to me, they were short in hight and have a shorter snort but have a long and very muscular body with very minimum fat, because my last batch was crossed with Duroc boars so i call up my supplier, he said he ordered them from a Chiang Mai farm after viewing the stocks...it's crossed with Piétrain boars...i'm amazed that Thailand have Piétrain breed.

[fruity]

I was wondering for some time on why my new batch of piglets was kind of odd looking to me, they were short in hight and have a shorter snort but have a long and very muscular body with very minimum fat, because my last batch was crossed with Duroc boars so i call up my supplier, he said he ordered them from a Chiang Mai farm after viewing the stocks...it's crossed with Piétrain boars...i'm amazed that Thailand have Piétrain breed.

RBH

Yep, Pietrain been in Thailand for quite a few years;in-fact, the goverment purchased and imported a number directly from Belgium a few years ago & their destination in Thailand was Chaing Mai, so your current stock is probably descended from those.

Pornchai also has a number of superb stress negative imported Pietrain boars. As a matter of interest how would you rate the temperament of your current Pietrain crosses?

[RedBullHorn]

fruity, compare to my last batch, this batch of Pietrain are so......so.....so...how should i put it...so "user friendly"

For me, i'm very close to my pigs but this batch is very different, so different from my last batch of Duroc cross which most of them will not let me touch them so much. The Pietrain batch will swarm around me when i enter the sheds like as if they missed me, i use to wear flip flop but now i wear knee-high Wellies because they are biting my legs (nothing serious just playing i think) i can touch them, pet them on the head, scatch their cheeks and stroke their back without them running away.

One thing i notice is they drink lesser water but eat more compare to the Duroc cross.

[IsaanAussie]

RBH,

I have Durocs and they are very friendly animals. It's almost a contest to see which one will get the first pat and scratch behind the ear. Makes the cleaning so much easier when the pigs understand what you want to do. I think you get what you give, if they are used to you being in the pen and the routine is regular, they learn the rest.

Then again anything they dont learn you can always beat into them

Isaan Aussie

[bina]

i would be worried if any of my large animals (i.e. farm animals and includes dogs goats donkeys whatever, and even the occasional rooster) became 'mouthy' with me. usually animals that 'mouth' an other animal or person that is a form of dominance and could also become a bite since animals dont know that humans have thin skin, so even a nip from a horse causes damage. even goats! try to nip (they cant bite really well but they can nip and grab, since they dont have upper teeth but sharp gums) when they are pissed off or want to assert themselves. not sure id want a pig mouthing me, they are heavy, intelligent and can have tempers. i always taught me animals not to 'crowd' me when i go in with food or whatever. they learned to stand back, i could approach them to pet or check, they could approach but not ppush, shove, mouth or butt. anybody thats ever had a large horse rub its forehead on u understands what i mean...

btw, do u give your animasl names? they are meant for food in the end i know but do u just number them or do u name them? wilbur comes to mind...

bina

btw, we would name our kids (goat kids not human kids , males that are meant for the table) with food names to differentiate them from the nannies and males that would be sticking around for longer.... t-bone, steak, ribby, makluba (an arab goat meat dish)...

[IsaanAussie]

i would be worried if any of my large animals (i.e. farm animals and includes dogs goats donkeys whatever, and even the occasional rooster) became 'mouthy' with me. usually animals that 'mouth' an other animal or person that is a form of dominance and could also become a bite since animals dont know that humans have thin skin, so even a nip from a horse causes damage. even goats! try to nip (they cant bite really well but they can nip and grab, since they dont have upper teeth but sharp gums) when they are pissed off or want to assert themselves. not sure id want a pig mouthing me, they are heavy, intelligent and can have tempers. i always taught me animals not to 'crowd' me when i go in with food or whatever. they learned to stand back, i could approach them to pet or check, they could approach but not ppush, shove, mouth or butt. anybody thats ever had a large horse rub its forehead on u understands what i mean...

btw, do u give your animasl names? they are meant for food in the end i know but do u just number them or do u name them? wilbur comes to mind...

bina

btw, we would name our kids (goat kids not human kids , males that are meant for the table) with food names to differentiate them from the nannies and males that would be sticking around for longer.... t-bone, steak, ribby, makluba (an arab goat meat dish)...

Maybe I am unique, maybe stupid, but onething to me is sure. Pigs are different. I have never had dealings with an animal like a pig before. They think like us. As Fruity quotes W.Churchill, they treat us as equals. The pigs I like, like me. Go figure?

[bina]

stupid you arent.

but particulary scary if u feel that pigs think like u, or u think like pigs. what does that say about me and my absolute fascination and love for goats (including as bbq)?

bina

[IsaanAussie]

stupid you arent.

but particulary scary if u feel that pigs think like u, or u think like pigs. what does that say about me and my absolute fascination and love for goats (including as bbq)?

bina

I think it says you are a well balanced individual. I enjoy working with my pigs, but it is after all work, a business and their purpose is to supply us with a living. The balance is we treat them well. As for goats, no idea, but if you find yourself eating thorns then perhaps it istime for a holiday.

Isaan Aussie

[IsaanAussie]

A more serious pig topic, PRRS. Like it or not it is upon us. For those like me who dont know enough about this disease I suggest reading the article in the following link. It is in language non-clinical people like me can understand.

http://www.oie.int/d...eb_bulletin.pdf

Good luck to all of us and our pigs.

Isaan Aussie

[RedBullHorn]

IA...i really wish you repost the "String-a-pig" weight approximator system here...to be part of Pig101...

As per my humble request. Thanks.

[IsaanAussie]

IA...i really wish you repost the "String-a-pig" weight approximator system here...to be part of Pig101...

As per my humble request. Thanks.

OK here is a modified version of the weight estimator. There are two of the many ways to do it which produce slightly different results. The first method requires the length and girth to be measured, the second method only the girth. I find the body length of pigs varies so I tend to use Method 1. I have also updated to using a tailors tape.

To use the excel sheet attached simply replace the example numbers in the green shaded boxes with your results.

Thaivisa Pig weight estimation.xls

Isaan Aussie

[IsaanAussie]

I was told yesterday that there is a price rise of 20 baht per bag for pig feed due next month.

[RedBullHorn]

Mine was up 15 Baht per sack, effective 22/11/2010.

[James007anahaif]

Ok Pigsters consider this,

I am a small holding pig farmer like many others. My objectives are not to get rich from pigs but to get comfortable from a range of value added products which relate to an integrated pig farming operation. But as an individual it is difficult to cover as many of the niche opportunities as exist, or to produce the volume necessary to create a significant market base and costing.

How many of you have considered being part of some form of collective marketing operation? Take the opportunity of the reduced returns currently facing us and lets say one main objective of the collective was to achieve a return of 70 baht/kg live weight. How many would be interested in that?

It is my belief that now is the time to strike this opportunity. The niche markets exist and are still too small to warrant interest from the large vertically integrated farming companies. Now is the time for us to vertically integrate for mutual advantage. The options are simply presented by the fall of 10 baht per kilo retail all of which is to be absorbed by the growers, us.

Isaan Aussie

I hasten to add that I would like to talk to anyone who can see this as a positive opportunity. The nay sayers can talk to anyone else they like, under the current circumstances I have little time or patience for negative attitudes.

[James007anahaif]

Sorry if I do this wrong but it's my first attempt.

I have been a pig farmer for a very short time "June2010" but I've already been thinking on those same lines

Want to try and take iy further??????????????

Ok Pigsters consider this,

I am a small holding pig farmer like many others. My objectives are not to get rich from pigs but to get comfortable from a range of value added products which relate to an integrated pig farming operation. But as an individual it is difficult to cover as many of the niche opportunities as exist, or to produce the volume necessary to create a significant market base and costing.

How many of you have considered being part of some form of collective marketing operation? Take the opportunity of the reduced returns currently facing us and lets say one main objective of the collective was to achieve a return of 70 baht/kg live weight. How many would be interested in that?

It is my belief that now is the time to strike this opportunity. The niche markets exist and are still too small to warrant interest from the large vertically integrated farming companies. Now is the time for us to vertically integrate for mutual advantage. The options are simply presented by the fall of 10 baht per kilo retail all of which is to be absorbed by the growers, us.

Isaan Aussie

I hasten to add that I would like to talk to anyone who can see this as a positive opportunity. The nay sayers can talk to anyone else they like, under the current circumstances I have little time or patience for negative attitudes.

[RedBullHorn]

How many pigs do you have now ?

[James007anahaif]

How many pigs do you have now ?

[James007anahaif]

Only 50

Taking it slow, finding out the pit-falls as I go.

Lost a few pigs last time round, due to inexperience

[RedBullHorn]

50 is not "Only"...50 is many... 50 is about 250'000 THB investment on the pigs alone not mentioning the facility cost , i'm doing 50 too this season . Planning more next year...

[James007anahaif]

Sorry didn't realize that. Thought 200 was needed every 4 months to be self-funding and pay living expences.As I said I'm new to this and open to any advice or information.

I'm working as a teacher to keep things going at the moment for a government school. I have a Thai wife who takes very good care of the pigs in the mornings when I'm at work, in the evenings we do it together. She like me is learning all the time.

[IsaanAussie]

Mine was up 15 Baht per sack, effective 22/11/2010.

RBH,

I dont know why but my feed supplier seems to introduce increases a couple of months later than some others. Still mustn't grumble about the delay

IA

[IsaanAussie]

James007&1/2,

Yes I would like to take it further. I have slaughtered pigs and delivered select cuts and beasts cut into just the primary cuts. As I indicated before it makes a better return than by live weight alone. Carefully done there is a good return in the bits that arent wanted by the original customer, ie. the head.

I have also sold pigs for funerals. This week I sold 6 (630Kg) to one funeral. Not spectacular return but a great way to clear barrows and gilts that arent up to breeding herd scratch. Or to clear cull sows. Beats selling to the market suppliers around here.

Get in touch if you wish to discuss it further.

Isaan Aussie

[James007anahaif]

James007&1/2,

Yes I would like to take it further. I have slaughtered pigs and delivered select cuts and beasts cut into just the primary cuts. As I indicated before it makes a better return than by live weight alone. Carefully done there is a good return in the bits that arent wanted by the original customer, ie. the head.

I have also sold pigs for funerals. This week I sold 6 (630Kg) to one funeral. Not spectacular return but a great way to clear barrows and gilts that arent up to breeding herd scratch. Or to clear cull sows. Beats selling to the market suppliers around here.

Get in touch if you wish to discuss it further.

Isaan Aussie

[James007anahaif]

I most certainly would like to discuss it with you.

We live in Ratchaburi. I assume from your name that you come from the Issan area. We have 3 and half rai in Burilam and are due to buy 5 more in May. Raising pigs would be no problem in this area. Our intension was to re-locate to Burilam when finances permitted. Do you want my telephone number?

[James007anahaif]

Sorry if I do this wrong but it's my first attempt.

I have been a pig farmer for a very short time "June2010" but I've already been thinking on those same lines

Want to try and take iy further??????????????

Ok Pigsters consider this,

I am a small holding pig farmer like many others. My objectives are not to get rich from pigs but to get comfortable from a range of value added products which relate to an integrated pig farming operation. But as an individual it is difficult to cover as many of the niche opportunities as exist, or to produce the volume necessary to create a significant market base and costing.

How many of you have considered being part of some form of collective marketing operation? Take the opportunity of the reduced returns currently facing us and lets say one main objective of the collective was to achieve a return of 70 baht/kg live weight. How many would be interested in that?

It is my belief that now is the time to strike this opportunity. The niche markets exist and are still too small to warrant interest from the large vertically integrated farming companies. Now is the time for us to vertically integrate for mutual advantage. The options are simply presented by the fall of 10 baht per kilo retail all of which is to be absorbed by the growers, us.

Isaan Aussie

I hasten to add that I would like to talk to anyone who can see this as a positive opportunity. The nay sayers can talk to anyone else they like, under the current circumstances I have little time or patience for negative attitudes.

[IsaanAussie]

Would someone care to explain the following article and how raising the tariff on soy bean meal helps me reduce costs? Bangkok Post 22/12/10

Tariff revenue cuts meat costs

The government plans to use the duty income charged on imported soybean meal to lower the production cost of chicken, pork and eggs so it can cut the retail prices on these items for consumers.The strategy is part of a broader policy to cut the price of some foods and liquefied petroleum gas (LPG) to reduce the cost of living.

Arkhom Termpittayapaisith, secretary-general to the National Economic and Social Development Board, said the programme was meant to assist small farm raisers of pork, chicken and eggs.

Soybean meal is a raw material in the animal feed industry, and the tariff revenue is quite high at about 500 to 600 million baht a year - sufficient to finance small farmers buying cheaper ingredients to make feed meal.

Normally Thailand imposes a 2% tariff on imports of soybean meal under the quota system approved by the World Trade Organisation. Any imports from non-WTO members will be charged 10%.

Small raisers including farm co-operatives control only about 20% of meat and egg production in the country. The majority is produced by large private companies.

The government plans to announce a series of measures to lessen the cost of living on Friday. It will likely maintain the subsidy programme for cooking gas and LPG for cars and trucks.

The price of diesel, largely used in the transport sector, will be capped at 30 baht a litre in December to January as the government expects oil prices will settle later on.

[RedBullHorn]

As the saying goes "we farmers buy everything in retail prices and sell our products in farmgate prices."

I don't think there will be a reduce price in feed per sack, the price is there to stay, only up up and up no down...

Anyway since when is the government words louder than action...if the government is sincere, give orders to companies like CPF to reduce their feed prices per sack,

you know what CPF gonna say ?

"Ya ya...Soy's price improved but what 'bout the rest of the ingredients, soybeans down but the rest's still up...you think there's only Soybeans in the whole sack...haha..."

[fruity]

As the saying goes "we farmers buy everything in retail prices and sell our products in farmgate prices."

I don't think there will be a reduce price in feed per sack, the price is there to stay, only up up and up no down...

Anyway since when is the government words louder than action...if the government is sincere, give orders to companies like CPF to reduce their feed prices per sack,

you know what CPF gonna say ?

"Ya ya...Soy's price improved but what 'bout the rest of the ingredients, soybeans down but the rest's still up...you think there's only Soybeans in the whole sack...haha..."

RBH,

Firstly, Happy new year!............Secondly: Pigs have always been either " Muck or money" & believe me, that will never change!......Irregardless, where you are, what you feed them bugger all will change! It has always & will always be a matter of 'just hanging on in there'; those that last longest stay to tell the tale; those comments apply worldwide with regards to pig-keeping, not only here in the los.............On a personal note; MANY THANKS for the 'white cement' tip, I have actually witnessed an increase in bone since reading / acting on your tip regarding gilts that are being kept on as sows. Likewise, the Pietrain thread was good. ................Just love them, only one sow in the op, however, she has proved them all wrong & is a fabulous mother (currently on parity three) besides, she ranks as one of the 'cleverest' pigs I've ever met.

Best

Fruity

[IsaanAussie]

Just gotta love these little guys. The white stuff on the noses is a calf milk replacer which I have started using to as a post weaning booster. These were 15 to 18 kgs at 5 weeks.

[IsaanAussie]

Well its a new year so I thought I would update my feed costs data for those interested. The attached chart shows the increase in prices from June last year to todays figures, around 3%. I am still returning an average FCR of 2.6 so the nett cost of feed has increased about 100 baht.

Feed costs per pig Jan 2011.pdf

Also for those interested in Betagro Feeds I discovered today that they have a boosted pre-starter grade which my supplier doesnt carry but will stock. I will give it a try but it seems expensive at 310 baht for 10 Kgs. Lately I have been using Lactoca Calf milk replacer with very good results, that costs 90 baht a small bag which stretches to cover a 30 Kg 951 bagful.

I also talked to an English Speaking Betagro rep who has responsibility for this region. I told him that some forum members would like to try the Betagro products but were unable to find a local source. He said he would help anyone who wants to give it a shot. Remember this is his commitment not mine, but for those who wish to try, his name is Khun Buncha Kulprasertsri and he can be contacted at [email protected] .

Isaan Aussie