Tipping Songteaw'S And Equality

[uptheos]

On another thread, someone said; "when I catch a songtaew I always tip. If I know they are chargIng me "local price" I tip very well because I appreciate the fact that they see me as an equal"

I never tip songtaew's, anything extra I negotiate..................how about you?

It seems a strange concept to tip "very well" because someone treats you as equal.................what do you think?

That's all folks.

Edited December 5, 2010 by uptheos

[sarahsbloke]

I pay the same fare as everyone else

18km from the CM fruit market up the 118 to Doi Saket = 17 bht

20km from the CM fruit market to Papong = 15 bht

20km from CM gate to San Glan past Hang Dong = 17 bht

When white people pay more I often hear the comment from Thais 'white people are so stupid with money', so why give everyone a bad impression.

Edited December 5, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[uptheos]

I pay the same fare as everyone else

18km from the CM fruit market up the 118 = 17 bht

20km from the CM fruit market to Papong = 15 bht

20km from CM gate to San Glan past Hang Dong = 17 bht

And so you should.

[jdinasia]

Frankly, what you do with your money really doesn't matter to me

Tip/Don't tip ... I just can't see it as an issue for anyone but the person tipping or not tipping

[Ulysses G.]

I pay the same price as the locals or wait for more honest driver to come along.

[jayjay0]

I pay the same fare as everyone else

18km from the CM fruit market up the 118 = 17 bht

20km from the CM fruit market to Papong = 15 bht

20km from CM gate to San Glan past Hang Dong = 17 bht

And so you should.

Not exactly honest here are we.

Many is the time I have seen a Thai pay 20baht. Iride them often as I do not have any other means of transoport than my two feet and have lots of experience with them. And yes some of thm wait for change but most don't

Don't understand Thai so if they are saying we are stupid with are money I don't here it for that matter I don't hear them talking at all.

[sarahsbloke]

I don't consider leaving the 3 bht change from a 20 bht note as a 'generous tip' although you are welcome to think that.

Edited December 5, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[jayjay0]

I pay the same price as the locals or wait for more honest driver to come along.

Not sure what you are talking about. When I get a songtow the price is generally not discussed I just get in. If the price comes up it is because he is greedy and I will get the next one or if in a hurry agree.

I pay 20 baht every time I ride. To be honest I would feel stupid and petty standing there waiting for a three baht change.

You people who pay the bare minimum do you have a income as low as the average Thai who rides in a songtow?

Or are you just a cheap charlie trying to make a buck off of other peoples life's?

By the way I am not broke paying the extra two or three baht.

[jayjay0]

I don't consider leaving the 3 bht change from a 20 bht note as a 'generous tip' although you are welcome to think that.

Sorry I missed the post that said three baht was a generous tip can you repost it for me?

It is a small tip but I give it any way. In reality it is about 11% of the original price so if you are looking at it that way it would still not be considered generous.

[surayu]

As a general rule i would say, reward people who deserved it, the quality, the dedication, any action taken to give you even a better thing of what you should have expected, as in the end you are just making a courtesy with your tip after having received one, i would however STRONGLY suggest anyones giving a tip after having been ripped off to STOP that habit, in this way you are giving out a very wrong message to the ill intentioned as it simply means : "yes i appreciated your scams, please give me some more" and that's going to affect also all other people going there after you, do not support criminals and their crimes, enough said :jap:

[sarahsbloke]

You people who pay the bare minimum do you have a income as low as the average Thai who rides in a songtow?

Or are you just a cheap charlie trying to make a buck off of other peoples life's?

By the way I am not broke paying the extra two or three baht.

Not sure if I am 'cheap charlie' or not .........

but at least I can read the Songtow destination from the Thai script above the cab, so I know where it's going!

Maybe if you saved all those 3 bht tips, you could afford to go to school and learn to read Thai?

Cheap Charlie that reads Thai ........ or rich and ignorant, which is best?

Edited December 5, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[uptoyoumyfriend]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

Edited December 5, 2010 by uptoyoumyfriend

[uptheos]

I pay the same price as the locals or wait for more honest driver to come along.

Not sure what you are talking about. When I get a songtow the price is generally not discussed I just get in. If the price comes up it is because he is greedy and I will get the next one or if in a hurry agree.

I pay 20 baht every time I ride. To be honest I would feel stupid and petty standing there waiting for a three baht change.

You people who pay the bare minimum do you have a income as low as the average Thai who rides in a songtow?

Or are you just a cheap charlie trying to make a buck off of other peoples life's?

By the way I am not broke paying the extra two or three baht.

Regardless of what your views are on tipping, I don't understand why paying the correct fare is "trying to make a buck off other people's lives"? Surely buying any product or service at the standard price, is contributing towards their livelihood and I could understand your statement if people didn't pay anything.

[uptheos]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

I think you make a good point.

If a person feels they have been 'treated as an equal' and because of this tips generously, then they can't possibly seen as equal.........can they?

[eek]

On the occasion i use a songtaew, i say where im going, get in, and pay 20 baht. Only if im headed out to someplace such as the bus station will i either be stated a price, or i will sort out the price at the end of my journey. I dont ask how much before i get in, because i know it will be reasonable (on those very rare times that a driver has stated an exaggerated price I have laughed and sorted out a reasonable price.) A few times my journey hasnt been far and i was handed back change, without even asking.

I personally wouldnt "tip" (i just hand over my 20 baht..dont particularly consider that tipping..especially seeing as most Thai do the same). I personally think tipping inappropriately is not a good thing to do..for MANY reason. If i need to get into what those reasons i think are, i will, but suffice to say, i tip what i consider to be the right place at the right time, and for me tipping a songtaew driver isnt one of them.

[jdinasia]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

I think you make a good point.

If a person feels they have been 'treated as an equal' and because of this tips generously, then they can't possibly seen as equal.........can they?

That certainly fits your world view --- then again the argument is flawed. If a person tips because they want to (and yes some Thai people do this)., then refuse to take a songtheaw that is price-gouging ... it negates your concept and creates a system that would in fact tend to do the opposite of what you suggest. (The hope for a tip would be there, but the gouging would occur less)

Then again, I don't take songthaew and think the "you people that tip are spoiling it for the rest of the faRang here" is incredibly silly

[uptheos]

On the occasion i use a songtaew, i say where im going, get in, and pay 20 baht. Only if im headed out to someplace such as the bus station will i either be stated a price, or i will sort out the price at the end of my journey. I dont ask how much before i get in, because i know it will be reasonable (on those very rare times that a driver has stated an exaggerated price I have laughed and sorted out a reasonable price.) A few times my journey hasnt been far and i was handed back change, without even asking.

I personally wouldnt "tip" (i just hand over my 20 baht..dont particularly consider that tipping..especially seeing as most Thai do the same). I personally think tipping inappropriately is not a good thing to do..for MANY reason. If i need to get into what those reasons i think are, i will, but suffice to say, i tip what i consider to be the right place at the right time, and for me tipping a songtaew driver isnt one of them.

Sure it happens, there are lots of honest songteaw drivers, and at such times I don't understand why a person would feel the need to 'tip generously' just because they felt treated as an equal, unless of course most of the time they actually feel unequal and this is such a relief for them.

A key sentence.

Edited December 5, 2010 by uptheos

[lingnoi1977]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

I think you make a good point.

If a person feels they have been 'treated as an equal' and because of this tips generously, then they can't possibly seen as equal.........can they?

That certainly fits your world view --- then again the argument is flawed. If a person tips because they want to (and yes some Thai people do this)., then refuse to take a songtheaw that is price-gouging ... it negates your concept and creates a system that would in fact tend to do the opposite of what you suggest. (The hope for a tip would be there, but the gouging would occur less)

Then again, I don't take songthaew and think the "you people that tip are spoiling it for the rest of the faRang here" is incredibly silly

I agree with you jdinasia.

The OP has taken the foot note in the "My Wife, My Hero" post and applied his one-eyed opinion. That is fine albeit out of context and opportunistic.

I've too noticed that my generous tipping habits have affected an upsurge in spending in Chiangmai. It was me...sorry

What I really don't understand is how tipping is a measure of equality...?

[jdinasia]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

I think you make a good point.

If a person feels they have been 'treated as an equal' and because of this tips generously, then they can't possibly seen as equal.........can they?

That certainly fits your world view --- then again the argument is flawed. If a person tips because they want to (and yes some Thai people do this)., then refuse to take a songtheaw that is price-gouging ... it negates your concept and creates a system that would in fact tend to do the opposite of what you suggest. (The hope for a tip would be there, but the gouging would occur less)

Then again, I don't take songthaew and think the "you people that tip are spoiling it for the rest of the faRang here" is incredibly silly

I agree with you jdinasia.

The OP has taken the foot note in the "My Wife, My Hero" post and applied his one-eyed opinion. That is fine albeit out of context and opportunistic.

I've too noticed that my generous tipping habits have affected an upsurge in spending in Chiangmai. It was me...sorry

What I really don't understand is how tipping is a measure of equality...?

I think it got into the OP's mind that tipping as a REWARD for not being ripped off is the norm for some people. Personally, I tip if and when I want to.

[orang37]

Sawasdee Khrup, TV CM Friends,

ioho we are, in this thread, discussing two sets of circumstances :

1. regularly scheduled songthaew's that run a fixed route such as the yellow ones from Wararot (Kad Luang) to Mae Rim, or the ones at Chiang Mai Gate running out to Hang Dong. for those: prices are well known, fixed, and no need to tip. to our minds these are the songthaews Khun SarahsBloke is discussing.

2. the "free roaming" red songthaews which you flag down. with those we always make sure we have a clear agreement on price with the driver: because we've had some attempted rip-offs in the past when we didn't.

But, in case #2, we take into account the following: the location, the time of day or night, the likelihood of the driver getting a return fare from the location you are going to, and whether or not the driver has been waiting in a queue (like at Airport Plaza or the Night Bazaar). These factors go into our evaluation of whether the driver's asking price, or the price we bargain them down to is reasonable. If it's not reasonable, we say thanks, and walk away.

And there are special circumstances in which we are willing to pay more: like we've locked up our bicycle at the train station, and we want to go Airport Plaza via the SuperHighway, and do not want to go through town at 5PM through heavy traffic. Or we (rarely) want the driver to take our bicycle in the truck with us.

We do tip, a small amount, when we feel we've been given some special sense of extra good service, or when some contingency has come along that has made the driver wait for us longer than agreed upon.

For short trips within town, between populous areas in daytime hours, we'd seldom pay more than twenty baht, but you always have to be willing to accept that the other people already in the van may take you way out of your way. And it's quite hard, even speaking fairly fluent 'daily conversational Thai,' to get the driver to tell you where the other five people in the van are going ... and you may not be able to gauge the delay anyway, since you may have no idea where Thanon Sirikmankarajan Soi #X is anyway.

In conclusion, this humble flea in the ear of a mangy soi dog dares to lay at your lotus feet the idea that red songthaews ain't taxis. And, they have every right not to take you if they don't like the "deal."

best, ~o:37;

[Loaded]

There is no equality in Thailand and this is fundamental to the mores of Thai society. When 2 Thais meet they must establish seniority and the junior partner wais first to show he/she knows their place in the food chain. Telling Thais that you want to be seen as an equal to a songtaew driver is naive.

Edited December 5, 2010 by Loaded

[jayjay0]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

I think you make a good point.

If a person feels they have been 'treated as an equal' and because of this tips generously, then they can't possibly seen as equal.........can they?

That certainly fits your world view --- then again the argument is flawed. If a person tips because they want to (and yes some Thai people do this)., then refuse to take a songtheaw that is price-gouging ... it negates your concept and creates a system that would in fact tend to do the opposite of what you suggest. (The hope for a tip would be there, but the gouging would occur less)

Then again, I don't take songthaew and think the "you people that tip are spoiling it for the rest of the faRang here" is incredibly silly

Thank you for saying it was a silly idea.

I have lost a lot of sleep over that tossed and turned all night I was spoiling it for all the other forigners.

I tip because I feel they deserve it if I don't tip I feel they don't deserve it.

My Thai wife on the other hand gives me a funny look if I don't tip. Go Figure.

But wait hold the show. She has walked in there shoes I haven't. Have you?

[mamborobert]

Whilst the idea of being treated as an equal is nice, the reality for many farangs is that we are "more than equal". Many farangs have greater education, income, savings, experience, and options.

I ride them everyday and tip generously probably 80% of the time. It means bugger all to me but often I am the only one travelling, have a pleasant chat, learn something new, and know that a tip makes a big difference. ......petrol and some staples have gone up.... and there have been other threads on the "skyrocketing" prices.

Its not patronising or pandering, I know what I am doing, and I am making a personal choice.

I appreciate that some may say this sets a trend...so be it. A trend in being nice when I can.

Beats some of the farang trends others I saw at Loi Kratong, street drinking, shirtless, drunk, and more than a few on the nose.

Its my money, makes me feel good, and does good.

[sarahsbloke]

My Thai wife on the other hand gives me a funny look if I don't tip. Go Figure.

What about when she pays the bill?

Does she ever tip when it's her money?

Just interested ..........

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Are we all sure it's 17 baht right now? I thought it was 15. Not too long ago I took one for 10. (Short distance, but ok)

[jdinasia]

i think that if you want them to see/treat you like a local you don't tip them.

did you follow the discussion about minimum wage in thailand?

it is the tourist's excessive throwing about of money in the first place that gave them the idea of overcharging falangs .

I think you make a good point.

If a person feels they have been 'treated as an equal' and because of this tips generously, then they can't possibly seen as equal.........can they?

That certainly fits your world view --- then again the argument is flawed. If a person tips because they want to (and yes some Thai people do this)., then refuse to take a songtheaw that is price-gouging ... it negates your concept and creates a system that would in fact tend to do the opposite of what you suggest. (The hope for a tip would be there, but the gouging would occur less)

Then again, I don't take songthaew and think the "you people that tip are spoiling it for the rest of the faRang here" is incredibly silly

Thank you for saying it was a silly idea.

I have lost a lot of sleep over that tossed and turned all night I was spoiling it for all the other forigners.

I tip because I feel they deserve it if I don't tip I feel they don't deserve it.

My Thai wife on the other hand gives me a funny look if I don't tip. Go Figure.

But wait hold the show. She has walked in there shoes I haven't. Have you?

Who amongst us hasn't been "in there shoes"? I wasn't born with a silver-spoon in my mouth and when I was in college there were occasions where all there was to eat for me was Ramen noodles. My partner on the other hand, has never wanted for anything and he sees things in the same light that I do (except he will NEVER bargain in a market, the price is either value for money or not.) He tips for service above and beyond ... and tends to round up on change.

So in answer to SB, yeah, he tips.

[jayjay0]

My Thai wife on the other hand gives me a funny look if I don't tip. Go Figure.

What about when she pays the bill?

Does she ever tip when it's her money?

Just interested ..........

Actually you did not read the whole post basically the question was have you ever walked in there shoes.

The answer to your question is I don't know and when we are out together I pay the bill.

If what she does has something to do with it she supports her mother do you support your mother?

just interested

[sarahsbloke]

If what she does has something to do with it she supports her mother do you support your mother?

just interested

My mother has been dead 30 years .... ...

My wifes mother, I give 3,000bht a month, after all I have abducted her entire farm labour force to come and live with me.

(I didn't want to live in the jungle and grow rice)

[phaethon]

I find it difficult to tip songtaews; tuk-tuks are easier to tip and motorcycles are, literally, a push-over.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

I try to rarely use them. If they were not spewing foul air I suppose I would be supportive.

I just ask the price before i get on. If they are asking high. I.E >15 baht for a short ride then just no thank you and wait for the next.

I would even like walking more if I didn't have to smell the exhaust funk constantly.

The reality is on a lot of roads there are too many of them already disrupting the traffic flow and fouling the air.

A little free market action could help the transportation ecology.