Girl Involved In Bangkok Tollway Accident Will Be Sent To A Home: Police

[soidog52]

Come on... does this whole thing will going on again. Wasn't yesterday not enough? People, get a life and stop to bash a 16 or 17 year old on an internet forum. If you want to do something useful then go out and spend your time telling others to repect their fellow traffic partners. Ask them to use seat belts (if available) when sitting next to them on a bus, talk to friends, whatever. This here does not change a thing other then giving you the chance to vent your personal frustration.

Think about it... how does third hand information and some pictures can make certain how this girl feels right now. If there is any human fibre left in her she will feel devastated that some many people lost their life because of her. That's human nature for (almost) all of us, rich or poor.

You (and me) have every right to demand that she is held responsible and that a court sentence will be found that shows her (and probably her mum and dad) that she made a big mistake. Not more, not less. Underage, first time offender... think about how this would be handled where you come from. Rather mild I guess...

MILD??? you have to be joking. In my country she would be facing involuntary manslaughter charges, and more charges relating to driving underage and without a license. She would probably be detained in a juvenille detention center til she went to trial. If she was found guilty she would be returned to the juvenille detention center til she was 18 and then she would be transfered to a womens prison until she was elegible for parole.

Shunima, I think that the reason that people are "bashing the girl" on an interenet forum is that they can see this girl getting off scot free, it is more a case of people expressing there disgust at a system that allows that to happen.

,

In my country she would have had a license for over a year and a learners permit for 6 months prior to that. I think I understand why 18 is the magic number for Thailand but don't want to stereotype driving styles by race. What are the legal driving ages in European countries, Australia, UK???

[rogerman]

Come on... does this whole thing will going on again. Wasn't yesterday not enough? People, get a life and stop to bash a 16 or 17 year old on an internet forum. If you want to do something useful then go out and spend your time telling others to repect their fellow traffic partners. Ask them to use seat belts (if available) when sitting next to them on a bus, talk to friends, whatever. This here does not change a thing other then giving you the chance to vent your personal frustration.

Think about it... how does third hand information and some pictures can make certain how this girl feels right now. If there is any human fibre left in her she will feel devastated that some many people lost their life because of her. That's human nature for (almost) all of us, rich or poor.

You (and me) have every right to demand that she is held responsible and that a court sentence will be found that shows her (and probably her mum and dad) that she made a big mistake. Not more, not less. Underage, first time offender... think about how this would be handled where you come from. Rather mild I guess...

think about how this would be handled where you come from. Rather mild I guess

How wrong can you be....Since this is a minor, the parents would be before the court as well. The child would be in a juvenile detention centre and the parents would probably be in jail as well.....Who cares whether they have contacts or have a good name or are actors....... Anyway most Thais are actors anyway. Thailand knows no justice and money gets them out of trouble.....Haha the funeral that the mother went to, she gave the parents of the deceased a token of 30,000 Baht as compensation.......That would have been more of an insult than a kind gesture

[jackr]

However what I believe will be harsher than any punishment will be the fact that she will have to live with the results of her actions her entire life. This in itself will be a life sentence.

No winners here. Everybody involved has lost. IMO,

A few merit-making trips will no doubt check any bad karma. Thais think differently on life and accountability remember.

[whybother]

So, if she is sent off to a young offenders place until she is of age. Can she then as an adult be done for the manslaughter of 9 people? Like what they would do in the West?

But from reading the numerous threads on numerous forums, her family will probably get her off.

I hope she sleeps well in her cozy wee bed.

Her sister was in the car with her, so I read. Where is she?

Also, she supposedly slipped underneath the steering wheel as the crash occured.... to avoid the airbag.....?????

If they decide that she can't be charged as an adult, the can not wait until she is an adult to charge her. They can't do this in the West either.

[whybother]

think about how this would be handled where you come from. Rather mild I guess

How wrong can you be....Since this is a minor, the parents would be before the court as well. The child would be in a juvenile detention centre and the parents would probably be in jail as well.....Who cares whether they have contacts or have a good name or are actors....... Anyway most Thais are actors anyway. Thailand knows no justice and money gets them out of trouble.....Haha the funeral that the mother went to, she gave the parents of the deceased a token of 30,000 Baht as compensation.......That would have been more of an insult than a kind gesture

Actually, I don't believe the parents would be charged in Australia. They are guilty of bad parenting, but last I checked, that isn't something you can go to jail for.

[ginjag]

Seems the poor child is aging very quickly since the horror she created.According to the OP it seems she gets every day a year older.

This MINOR-KID-CHILD -could be 25 soon, my god, maybe she has the blue book and the owner of the civic, maybe she paid cash for the car. I have asked for all the details of ownership--age--NO-ONE can seemingly answer all --WHY--is the ownership classified ??????----is the I.D. details of the real age of the MINOR classified ?????....................is there anyone out there can get answer to these SIMPLE requests. surely forum could search---save a lot of argument, on--MINOR or not----OWNER or not...

Since when is it anyone's - police, victims or defendants - responsibility to keep you informed about an ongoing investigation?

If you want to have the information so badly you could always try to write a letter to them. If you can write a letter in proper English.

Oh sorry -Mr. cleaver cloggs TAWP. Oxford were you ??.............Just asking for information that is out of my reach, BUT at times other forum members have got information, and posted it. Now I gather these two bits of info in question are being witheld. The minors age and cars legal ownership was something I thought could be available. Thats all My English teacher friend Tawp. I dont mind being corrected TAWP, but being rude and arrogant is not cleaver. I hope my reply is more readable for you. P---k

[whybother]

This MINOR-KID-CHILD -could be 25 soon, my god, maybe she has the blue book and the owner of the civic, maybe she paid cash for the car. I have asked for all the details of ownership--age--NO-ONE can seemingly answer all --WHY--is the ownership classified ??????----is the I.D. details of the real age of the MINOR classified ?????....................is there anyone out there can get answer to these SIMPLE requests. surely forum could search---save a lot of argument, on--MINOR or not----OWNER or not...

Since when is it anyone's - police, victims or defendants - responsibility to keep you informed about an ongoing investigation?

If you want to have the information so badly you could always try to write a letter to them. If you can write a letter in proper English.

Oh sorry -Mr. cleaver cloggs TAWP. Oxford were you ??.............Just asking for information that is out of my reach, BUT at times other forum members have got information, and posted it. Now I gather these two bits of info in question are being witheld. The minors age and cars legal ownership was something I thought could be available. Thats all My English teacher friend Tawp. I dont mind being corrected TAWP, but being rude and arrogant is not cleaver. I hope my reply is more readable for you. P---k

"NO-ONE can seemingly answer all --WHY" "is there anyone out there can get answer to these SIMPLE requests."

You didn't ask. You demanded.

[neverdie]

Oh sorry -Mr. cleaver cloggs TAWP. Oxford were you ??...Thats all My English teacher friend Tawp. I dont mind being corrected TAWP, but being rude and arrogant is not cleaver. I hope my reply is more readable for you. P---k

Nicely said, sadly it won't sink in.

Edited January 4, 2011 by neverdie

[neverdie]

You demanded.

I didnt take it that way, I took it more as enthusiasm

Now now children, I am sure a mod will be in on his way to say, "Play nicely"

[OzMick]

Come on... does this whole thing will going on again. Wasn't yesterday not enough? People, get a life and stop to bash a 16 or 17 year old on an internet forum. If you want to do something useful then go out and spend your time telling others to repect their fellow traffic partners. Ask them to use seat belts (if available) when sitting next to them on a bus, talk to friends, whatever. This here does not change a thing other then giving you the chance to vent your personal frustration.

Think about it... how does third hand information and some pictures can make certain how this girl feels right now. If there is any human fibre left in her she will feel devastated that some many people lost their life because of her. That's human nature for (almost) all of us, rich or poor.

You (and me) have every right to demand that she is held responsible and that a court sentence will be found that shows her (and probably her mum and dad) that she made a big mistake. Not more, not less. Underage, first time offender... think about how this would be handled where you come from. Rather mild I guess...

MILD??? you have to be joking. In my country she would be facing involuntary manslaughter charges, and more charges relating to driving underage and without a license. She would probably be detained in a juvenille detention center til she went to trial. If she was found guilty she would be returned to the juvenille detention center til she was 18 and then she would be transfered to a womens prison until she was elegible for parole.

Shunima, I think that the reason that people are "bashing the girl" on an interenet forum is that they can see this girl getting off scot free, it is more a case of people expressing there disgust at a system that allows that to happen.

,

In my country she would have had a license for over a year and a learners permit for 6 months prior to that. I think I understand why 18 is the magic number for Thailand but don't want to stereotype driving styles by race. What are the legal driving ages in European countries, Australia, UK???

Are you basing that on her claim to be 17, when she is 16yrs 6 months, if the DOB given in a post was correct? They give out licences at 15? In oz, at least NSW and ACT when I applied many years ago, 16/9 for LP and 17 for a Provisional licence which has restrictions regarding power-weight of m/cycles in most states, and I think some regarding passengers in a car (??)

Every country has its own laws for its own reasons, and its own attitude to flouting of its laws. In this country the age is 18, and it is generally ignored at least as far as small bikes are concerned. If this extends to cars it is less obvious, and less common if only for wealth reasons. And this contributes to the huge road toll in this country.

Our own experience colours our attitudes - I find US laws truly bizarre. Letting children drive hotted-up V8s, the alcohol ban until 21, and in today's news, a 10yo given a gun for xmas that he uses to kill his mother.

[Mario2008]

You demanded.

I didnt take it that way, I took it more as enthusiasm

Now now children, I am sure a mod will be in on his way to say, "Play nicely"

Sounds like a plan.

Play nicely, in the spirit of world peace, love you neighbor.

No reason to cause more injury.

[Mitker]

Think about it... how does third hand information and some pictures can make certain how this girl feels right now. If there is any human fibre left in her she will feel devastated that some many people lost their life because of her. That's human nature for (almost) all of us, rich or poor.

"Almost" indeed:

The bodies of two victims, Sastra Chaothiang, a new PhD graduate, and Thammasat University law student Sudawadee Nillawan, were cremated yesterday in their home provinces of Ratchaburi and Ubon Ratchathani, respectively.

Neither the girl involved in the crash or her relatives attended. "There is no contact, message of apology, or even a wreath from them," said Pol Colonel Saran, Sudawadee's father.

Edited January 4, 2011 by Mitker

[OzMick]

Several posters have taken umbrage at my statement in another thread "How can the police justify NOT laying charges?"

From the above article:

".......... Pol Lt-Colonel Phithak Niyomphruek, a senior investigator at Vibhavadi Police Station in charge of the case, said yesterday.

Whether the girl's parents would be charged with a criminal offence depended on evidence compiled during the investigation process, the officer said.

One certain offence against the girl is causing multiple deaths and injuries through an act of carelessness, he said." NB My emphasis

Seems the police and I are of a like mind, and by the Thai website postings, more than a few others.

Nisa, moral equivalence is stupid and has no place in logical argument - and equating the illegality of the van driver not wearing a seat-belt with the actions of the 16-year-old is simply inane, obtuse and repugnant.

You are being less than truthful. You have stated over and over again that the girl is responsible (at fault) for the accident automatically because she was driving without a license and have stated that if one breaks a traffic law they are automatically responsible for an accident.

I simply asked you if the owner of the van should also be responsible (at fault) automatically since she was breaking the law by not wearing a seatbelt and/or IF it turned out she was not properly authorized to be transporting passengers.

I also asked you for a link to where you have stated as fact that this is the law in Australia since I tried to find and couldn't.

I am just baffled that your response is to post the above and indicate you are correct because the police are charging her with "careless driving" when any person being rational and with average intelligence knows this is referring to her admitted speeding and is a charge anyone would face in this same situation regardless of being in possession of a DL or not.

Your google skill are not my problem, but you could try looking at Australian STATES (not "providences") for a start, they set their own rules and they vary state to state. I did say that this was "as I understand it" and quoted an example.

Fortunately, my intelligence is not average, and I can see that a under-age driver is going to have more of a case to answer. The fact that you can't speaks for itself.

[Mario2008]

Guess I wasn't clear.

Further post that keep flaming each other will be deleted without further notice.

[OzMick]

think about how this would be handled where you come from. Rather mild I guess

How wrong can you be....Since this is a minor, the parents would be before the court as well. The child would be in a juvenile detention centre and the parents would probably be in jail as well.....Who cares whether they have contacts or have a good name or are actors....... Anyway most Thais are actors anyway. Thailand knows no justice and money gets them out of trouble.....Haha the funeral that the mother went to, she gave the parents of the deceased a token of 30,000 Baht as compensation.......That would have been more of an insult than a kind gesture

Actually, I don't believe the parents would be charged in Australia. They are guilty of bad parenting, but last I checked, that isn't something you can go to jail for.

Unless it was the parent's who gave her the use of the car. A vehicle is the legal reponsibility of the registered owner. If, for example, it is picked up by a speed camera, the fine is deemed to belong to the owner until another driver is nominated - I wouldn't suggest nominating an unlicenced driver.

anybody had any luck tracking down the owner of the Honda?

Edited January 4, 2011 by OzMick

[capricciocap1]

That girl must not escape justice....no matter what, SHE MUST NOT ESCAPE JUSTICE.

no worries. she have to live with that. she have to live with her hands that had wet already with blood, and for her whole life.

[Mitker]

In my country she would have had a license for over a year and a learners permit for 6 months prior to that. I think I understand why 18 is the magic number for Thailand but don't want to stereotype driving styles by race. What are the legal driving ages in European countries, Australia, UK???

I don't think the absolute age is the point.

The problem is that a legally underage girl has been offered the keys of a car. And this girl enjoy(ed) speeding.

The difference with this girl having lived in a country where 16yo was ok would have been:

- she would have undergone a proper training program (whatever you think about it)

- she wouldn't have felt like that the law didn't apply to her

- she wouldn't have been convinced that, by letting her drive underage, her parents were meaning she was an almighty little girl and that speeding would just prove it

[ianf]

I think it's time to reduce the adult age to 16 or younger now. I felt that the teenagers nowaday know everything and do not listen when the adults try to tell them something.

The most important right of a child is to be child, with all (ir)responsibilities and behaviour that comes with that.

One of the victims said that Thais drink and drive. On New Years eve, one reasonably well-connected Thai guy here in Chiang Mai, staggered to his car having consumed half a bottle or more of whisky. Everyone got in as usual and drove off to the city centre for the fireworks. When asked about being stopped by the police, he laughed and said, "just give them 200 baht". And therein lies the problem. My fried, who witnessed this, wisely refused to get in the car.

[ginjag]

Oh sorry -Mr. cleaver cloggs TAWP. Oxford were you ??...Thats all My English teacher friend Tawp. I dont mind being corrected TAWP, but being rude and arrogant is not cleaver. I hope my reply is more readable for you. P---k

Nicely said, sadly it won't sink in.

I didnt-DEMAND for someone to search for answers---I ASKED. it was a plead to clarify if possible, thats all.

[MikeyIdea]

A few points I like in the posts I missed while being upcountry during New Year. It took some time to get through them all…

“There is no real justice in a situation like this one”

Well, put it like this; We will never be sure if what we get fed in the media is the truth or not. We can still observe though

Age:

Nothing difficult at all here. The girl was 16 years old at the time of the accident. According to CIVIL law, she is now 17 as age counts from the beginning of the year in which birthday is for civil matters. According to CRIMINAL law, she is still 16 though as actual date of birth is used for determining age in criminal matters. She is born 30 มิถุนายน 2537, 30 June 2537.

There have been a few posts from ThaiVisa members who had been travelling with the female van driver and commended her on her safe non-aggressive driving style. Let’s not forget that

It is interesting to note that in the discussion if the girl is at fault or not, the girls mother of all people is by far the best source this far. The girls mother indicate fault, even tells press that her daughter was speeding. Perhaps she will regret being that – either misinformed or honest – one day. Now we can also add the girl herself – initially saying that the accident wouldn’t have happened had she not been speeding.

Now, the above are facts we can read on the lines, we don’t have to read between the lines. What can we read between the lines in the below?

We can and should wonder why the girl shows up on the Honda City Club - incidentally for the first time the same month that she turns 16 – Her post there is from 23 June and she turned 16 30 June. Account was created long before the actual accident killing 9 people took place and the user name is so unusual that discussion about if it’s correct or not feels like a waste of time. If it was the car she drove in the accident or not is not the key information to note. ไปรับรถมาเมื่อวานค่ะเห่อมาก – Bai rap rot ma mowan ka hoer maak.

We can and should wonder why it took nearly 2 days before the interesting news that the girl was stuck and couldn’t get out of her own car after the accident reached media. I couldn’t find anything about it in media until the anti-crowd really had woken up. Plenty of news about the accident but nothing about her being stuck. Or did I just miss it?

What is happening now is just standard procedure. Let’s see what happens the next 2 weeks (it will probably turn quiet after that)

I must comment on that the girl and her family seem… not to follow their lawyers advice. That probably also tells us something

[indothai]

Post by MikeIdea pretty much sums it all up.

The picture of the wrecked white car does look like a Civic to me, latest model,.. I haven't seen any pictures of the rear end, which should clearly indicate if it's a Civic or City.

My opinion of the Honda City story, put into the various media channels to arouse "unwarranted" suspicion. Be it a City or Civic wouldn't matter much to me, as I'm sure the Police knows exactly of the make and model of the vehicle.

My personal opinion: What ever she did before the accident is of nobody's business. She could have hundreds of cars for all I care, well before her legal age to drive.

I would add that the owner of the Civic is still unknown... maybe I'm just out of the loop?

[OzMick]

Post by MikeIdea pretty much sums it all up.

The picture of the wrecked white car does look like a Civic to me, latest model,.. I haven't seen any pictures of the rear end, which should clearly indicate if it's a Civic or City.

My opinion of the Honda City story, put into the various media channels to arouse "unwarranted" suspicion. Be it a City or Civic wouldn't matter much to me, as I'm sure the Police knows exactly of the make and model of the vehicle.

My personal opinion: What ever she did before the accident is of nobody's business. She could have hundreds of cars for all I care, well before her legal age to drive.

I would add that the owner of the Civic is still unknown... maybe I'm just out of the loop?

It may have a big effect on her parent's responsibility/liability if it is shown that they gave her a car for her 16th birthday.

[indothai]

Post by MikeIdea pretty much sums it all up.

The picture of the wrecked white car does look like a Civic to me, latest model,.. I haven't seen any pictures of the rear end, which should clearly indicate if it's a Civic or City.

My opinion of the Honda City story, put into the various media channels to arouse "unwarranted" suspicion. Be it a City or Civic wouldn't matter much to me, as I'm sure the Police knows exactly of the make and model of the vehicle.

My personal opinion: What ever she did before the accident is of nobody's business. She could have hundreds of cars for all I care, well before her legal age to drive.

I would add that the owner of the Civic is still unknown... maybe I'm just out of the loop?

It may have a big effect on her parent's responsibility/liability if it is shown that they gave her a car for her 16th birthday.

I could be wrong, but I thought the car in question was not the one given by her parents.? Meaning, the car she got into the accident with was not given by her parents?

[Nisa]

Post by MikeIdea pretty much sums it all up.

The picture of the wrecked white car does look like a Civic to me, latest model,.. I haven't seen any pictures of the rear end, which should clearly indicate if it's a Civic or City.

My opinion of the Honda City story, put into the various media channels to arouse "unwarranted" suspicion. Be it a City or Civic wouldn't matter much to me, as I'm sure the Police knows exactly of the make and model of the vehicle.

My personal opinion: What ever she did before the accident is of nobody's business. She could have hundreds of cars for all I care, well before her legal age to drive.

I would add that the owner of the Civic is still unknown... maybe I'm just out of the loop?

It may have a big effect on her parent's responsibility/liability if it is shown that they gave her a car for her 16th birthday.

And an even bigger one if it is shown they have been giving her a car each year for her birthday since she was 7-years old

But since we are dealing with logical assumptions based on what we have been reading in the news ... neither of these things warrant conjecture unless one is looking to spread rumors.

[Tywais]

The picture of the wrecked white car does look like a Civic to me, latest model,.. I haven't seen any pictures of the rear end, which should clearly indicate if it's a Civic or City.

I've pointed this out before that it is a Civic 2.0 either 2009 or 2010 as I own one. The 17" low profile tires, the dark leather interior and the side airbags are all standard on the Civic 2.0. However, I did come across a site showing more accident photos including the rear of the Civic and definitely a Civic and year 2009 or 2010 as the rear brake lights are hexagonal. 2009 was a mild face lift year and the brake lights are the main visible difference between the 2008 and earlier models. I did not post the link as some photos are graphic.

The one on FB is a Honda City and it is not clear who the owner is - hers, stepbrother, etc.

[webfact]

UPDATE

TOLLWAY TRAGEDY

Teen to be sent to juvenile center : police

By THE NATION

Police are planning to send the 17-year-old girl blamed for a recent fatal tollway accident to a juvenile centre once she is officially charged today.

The girl, whose name is being withheld because she is a minor, will be charged for reckless driving that caused deaths, injuries and property damage, as well as driving without a licence.

"She will be sent to the centre on Chaeng Wattana Road and officials there will decide if she should be granted bail," Pol Lt Colonel Wijit Danthamrongkul said yesterday in his capacity as an investigator at the Vibhavadi-Rangsit Tollway Traffic Control Centre.

The girl has been summoned to report to police today. According to her mother, she will report as scheduled and provide testimony as to what really happened on the night of December 27. It is believed the girl's sedan brushed the van, which skidded and overturned, resulting in nine deaths and injuries.

Thammasat University will act as a joint plaintiff for relatives of the 14 van passengers killed or injured, a deputy rector said yesterday.

"The university will appoint lawyers to act as joint plaintiffs to pursue criminal prosecution and demand compensation," deputy rector Parinya Thewanaruemitkul said.

She did not say when the university would prosecute, but it would be after an indictment is lodged against the defendant.

-- The Nation 2011-01-05

[indothai]

The girl has been summoned to report to police today. According to her mother, she will report as scheduled and provide testimony as to what really happened on the night of December 27. It is believed the girl's sedan brushed the van, which skidded and overturned, resulting in nine deaths and injuries.

As everyone can clearly see, it was just a brush.

"The university will appoint lawyers to act as joint plaintiffs to pursue criminal prosecution and demand compensation," deputy rector Parinya Thewanaruemitkul said.

I was wondering when the lawyers would show up.

[whybother]

The girl, whose name is being withheld because she is a minor,

They're withholding it NOW???

[speakloud]

Nobody should be criticizing this girl or her parents. This is Thailand we're talking about. You can see kids in Bangkok clubs, its not uncommon to see them driving either. Having a car at the age of 16 in Thailand isn't something new and this could have happened to anyone. It was a mistake and nobody has the right to give her and her family so much trouble. The police and everybody in this country is corrupt. All they care about is money anyways so don't be surprised if she finds a way out of this. Just look at her last name and you'll understand. Many people will think this isn't right, and she shouldn't get away with it but they don't realize the kind of people who live in Thailand. All that matters is money and connections.

[ThiagoBras]

That girl must not escape justice....no matter what, SHE MUST NOT ESCAPE JUSTICE.

she will though...