Recent Clashes With Thailand Real War: Cambodia PM Hun Sen

[ballpoint]

But based on what? You could find arguments that half Thailand is Cambodia and you can find arguments that half Cambodia would be Thailand. The only reasonable way is to have it overlapping like it was before Cambodia went crazy.

Based on the general location of the current border, which country the residents identify with, and topographical features. The current border is pretty much defined by a mountain range along much of its length, the watershed line would be a logical place to put it. The borders of empires past have no relevance what so ever to those of the present day. Don't get me wrong, joint administration would be the logical, and civilised, way to solve the problem, but if both countries cannot agree to do so then the actual border will have to be formally deliniated sometime. The sooner the better for the residents and foot soldiers of both sides.

Edited February 10, 2011 by ballpoint

[dude007]

Hun Sen accused Thai troops of firing cluster bomb at Cambodian troops.

1) Does any one know if Thailand has cluster bombs?

2) Aren't cluster bombs dropped from planes?

1) almost sure yes

2) almost sure yes but they can be fired from the ground like mortars...

[dude007]

quote:

The border between Thailand and Cambodia has never been completely demarcated and the issue of Preah Vihear temple has been a long-standing dispute. Although the International Court of Justice ruled in 1962 that the temple itself belonged to Cambodia, the row over the 4.6 square kilometers territory around the temple has never been resolved.

unquote

Better say: has never been raised during the first 45 years after the verdict (1962). Why is it that Thailand needs 45 years to think if it will accept the 1962 verdict or not. The appeal period with the UN is 10 years! This has been politicised by the yellows during their protest against Taksin, when his Minister of Foreign Affairs (Taksins own lawyer) arranged a fair and correct deal with the Cambodians on Preah Vihear, accepted by Thailand as well (except by the yellow shirts), but he made an awful mistake not to consult the parliament first and had to resign. Even now, these yellows want "blood" and are asking for "war". Abhisit has vowed to every one of their demands (even starting a war as was requested to chase the Cambodians from this disputed land, but with the exception to step down) and still they continue to disturb and to jeopardise peace. Major Gen Chamlong Srimuang, please teach your yellow people to think FIRST before shooting! No one likes to be shot at for no reason, and that applies to the Cambodians as well!

[Just1Voice]

Without trying to take sides of this issue, and look at things objectively, what I hear are the drums of war being pounded, while other, possibly peaceful solutions, such as mediation by the UN or ASEAN, are being ignored by Thailand. Why does Thailand continue to insist that bilateral talks will work, when they have shown absolutely zero positive effect so far? What are they afraid of by allowing the UN or ASEAN to mediate the situation? If they feel they are in the right, and have the evidence to back it up, it would seem they would be willing to take this to a higher level. However, if they know, or even doubt to some degree that they are wrong in this situation, then Thai Pride & Arrogance will prevent them from changing the course they are on now, no matter what the rest of the international community might say, and no matter how many lives it may cost, as saving face is much more important, to a Thai, than saving lives.

If this continues to escalate into war, it's a war Thailand can't win. They might have the larger army, and more "toys", but being an American who is also a Vietnam Vet, I can assure you that being bigger and better equipped is absolutely NO guarantee of victory. And while the Thai army might win in a head-to-head confrontation, I also have some doubts about that. My reasons for stating that is that Thailand has no real experience in actual warfare, while Cambodian troops are very experienced. A good example of this is in the border war with LAO, a country whose entire population is about the same as Bangkok's, Thai troops invaded and took over a village, raising the Thai flag over it, only to be routed and chased out that night by a much smaller Pathet Lao unit. And does Thailand actually believe that Cambodia would stick to a "tank-v-tank, soldier-v-soldier" scenario? If so, I feel sorry for them, as Cambodia would, in all likelihood, show them a whole new meaning of "guerrilla warfare" with men/women being sent into BKK, Chiang Mai, Pattaya, Phuket, etc., through a totally porous border to wreak total havoc with explosives, car bombs and assassinations.

I love Thailand, and her people, but her government, and some nationalists with their own agenda, is leading her into a war that, in the long run, they can't win.

Edited February 10, 2011 by Just1Voice

[SomTumTiger]

Why do so many people think Cambodia is "in the right" on this issue. Is it their great record of human rights, and free and fair elections? Their long history of stability and social justice? Their cool, calm, measured responses from their leadership?

You guys are out to lunch.

[dude007]

America not stupid-- to intervene this issue on Thai side. This is smoke screen war to take Thai mind off civil rights and social problems and democracy issues. That is plain and simple, I think.

Lek

Bkk

Khun Lek, although your English is very Thai, you made your point clear and well! This happens many times in countries which are facing internal problems (and Abhisit has its deal in these): the Government looks for a common enemy and start problems: all country fellows reunite in this war against the "common enemy" and the real [internal] problems are forgotten. Up to the Thais to be smarter and to think rational. There is nothig they can do about the 1962 verdict: Preah Vihear is Cambodian soil and it is of no major importance whether the laon, the pergola, the garden, the frontyard or the backyard is included or not...

[dude007]

Without trying to take sides of this issue, and look at things objectively, what I hear are the drums of war being pounded, while other, possibly peaceful solutions, such as mediation by the UN or ASEAN, are being ignored by Thailand. Why does Thailand continue to insist that bilateral talks will work, when they have shown absolutely zero positive effect so far? What are they afraid of by allowing the UN or ASEAN to mediate the situation? If they feel they are in the right, and have the evidence to back it up, it would seem they would be willing to take this to a higher level. However, if they know, or even doubt to some degree that they are wrong in this situation, then Thai Pride & Arrogance will prevent them from changing the course they are on now, no matter what the rest of the international community might say, and no matter how many lives it may cost, as saving face is much more important, to a Thai, than saving lives.

If this continues to escalate into war, it's a war Thailand can't win. They might have the larger army, and more "toys", but being an American who is also a Vietnam Vet, I can assure you that being bigger and better equipped is absolutely NO guarantee of victory. And while the Thai army might win in a head-to-head confrontation, I also have some doubts about that. My reasons for stating that is that Thailand has no real experience in actual warfare, while Cambodian troops are very experienced. A good example of this is in the border war with LAO, a country whose entire population is about the same as Bangkok's, Thai troops invaded and took over a village, raising the Thai flag over it, only to be routed and chased out that night by a much smaller Pathet Lao unit. And does Thailand actually believe that Cambodia would stick to a "tank-v-tank, soldier-v-soldier" scenario? If so, I feel sorry for them, as Cambodia would, in all likelihood, show them a whole new meaning of "guerrilla warfare" with men/women being sent into BKK, Chiang Mai, Pattaya, Phuket, etc., through a totally porous border to wreak total havoc with explosives, car bombs and assassinations.

I love Thailand, and her people, but her government, and some nationalists with their own agenda, is leading her into a war that, in the long run, they can't win.

You are very right! Good advice!

[Buchholz]

My reasons for stating that is that Thailand has no real experience in actual warfare, while Cambodian troops are very experienced.

Perhaps those Cambodian soldiers that do have experience from 30 and 40 years ago aren't around anymore in 2011 for the 20 year-old soldiers there now.

As an ex British army sargeant resposible for the abilities of my men in the role we played , I would have been disgusted with myself had my men performed in such an incompetant manner as I saw displayed by the Cambodians at the front line on ctn footage . They were firing blindly from thier bunkers , crouching behind the sand bags with not a clue where the rounds of amunition were going except 'Somewhere towards the enemy' , weapons jaming due most likely to failure to clean and maintain in operative condition . Where were the artillary 'Sighters who normally guide the gunners 'for acuracy as artillery is normally not in sight of targets , men need to be trained whilst in action to hone thier capabilities , shame when your officers fail you in battle , that was the role of the British army sargeants .

[DP25]

Better say: has never been raised during the first 45 years after the verdict (1962). Why is it that Thailand needs 45 years to think if it will accept the 1962 verdict or not. The appeal period with the UN is 10 years!

The 1962 verdict did not rule on the land under dispute.

[Buchholz]

Without trying to take sides of this issue, and look at things objectively, what I hear are the drums of war being pounded, while other, possibly peaceful solutions, such as mediation by the UN or ASEAN, are being ignored by Thailand. Why does Thailand continue to insist that bilateral talks will work, when they have shown absolutely zero positive effect so far? What are they afraid of by allowing the UN or ASEAN to mediate the situation? If they feel they are in the right, and have the evidence to back it up, it would seem they would be willing to take this to a higher level. However, if they know, or even doubt to some degree that they are wrong in this situation, then Thai Pride & Arrogance will prevent them from changing the course they are on now, no matter what the rest of the international community might say, and no matter how many lives it may cost, as saving face is much more important, to a Thai, than saving lives.

If this continues to escalate into war, it's a war Thailand can't win. They might have the larger army, and more "toys", but being an American who is also a Vietnam Vet, I can assure you that being bigger and better equipped is absolutely NO guarantee of victory. And while the Thai army might win in a head-to-head confrontation, I also have some doubts about that. My reasons for stating that is that Thailand has no real experience in actual warfare, while Cambodian troops are very experienced. A good example of this is in the border war with LAO, a country whose entire population is about the same as Bangkok's, Thai troops invaded and took over a village, raising the Thai flag over it, only to be routed and chased out that night by a much smaller Pathet Lao unit. And does Thailand actually believe that Cambodia would stick to a "tank-v-tank, soldier-v-soldier" scenario? If so, I feel sorry for them, as Cambodia would, in all likelihood, show them a whole new meaning of "guerrilla warfare" with men/women being sent into BKK, Chiang Mai, Pattaya, Phuket, etc., through a totally porous border to wreak total havoc with explosives, car bombs and assassinations.

I love Thailand, and her people, but her government, and some nationalists with their own agenda, is leading her into a war that, in the long run, they can't win.

You are very right! Good advice!

Relevant and good advice if it was still the 1970's.

It might be more relevant as well to mention equally the Cambodian "nationalists with their own agenda"

[Buchholz]

America not stupid-- to intervene this issue on Thai side. This is smoke screen war to take Thai mind off civil rights and social problems and democracy issues. That is plain and simple, I think.

Lek

Bkk

Not so plain and simple as you didn't include the other half of the equation:

This is smoke screen war to take Cambodian mind off civil rights and social problems and democracy issues.

[Steely Dan]

Why do so many people think Cambodia is "in the right" on this issue. Is it their great record of human rights, and free and fair elections? Their long history of stability and social justice? Their cool, calm, measured responses from their leadership?

You guys are out to lunch.

In a beauty contest Abhisit comes out streets ahead of Hun Sen, even if it's a close call between the PAD leaders and Hun Sen, however this is all completely irrelevant if you read the ICJ judgement it is clear that Thailand is considered to have aquiesed to the 1907 French map. I haven't seen the map, but if it allows Cambodia to build a road to the temple then Cambodia are legally right end of story. If however the topography of the region does not enable the Cambodians to build a road without encroaching on Thai territory then Thailand has every right to dictate access. Bring on the map, the French have offered a copy afterall.

[creck]

quote:

The border between Thailand and Cambodia has never been completely demarcated and the issue of Preah Vihear temple has been a long-standing dispute. Although the International Court of Justice ruled in 1962 that the temple itself belonged to Cambodia, the row over the 4.6 square kilometers territory around the temple has never been resolved.

unquote

Better say: has never been raised during the first 45 years after the verdict (1962). Why is it that Thailand needs 45 years to think if it will accept the 1962 verdict or not. The appeal period with the UN is 10 years! This has been politicised by the yellows during their protest against Taksin, when his Minister of Foreign Affairs (Taksins own lawyer) arranged a fair and correct deal with the Cambodians on Preah Vihear, accepted by Thailand as well (except by the yellow shirts), but he made an awful mistake not to consult the parliament first and had to resign. Even now, these yellows want "blood" and are asking for "war". Abhisit has vowed to every one of their demands (even starting a war as was requested to chase the Cambodians from this disputed land, but with the exception to step down) and still they continue to disturb and to jeopardise peace. Major Gen Chamlong Srimuang, please teach your yellow people to think FIRST before shooting! No one likes to be shot at for no reason, and that applies to the Cambodians as well!

The situation changed with Cambodia preparing to seal off Thailand from the temple. First by raising the status of the Temple and then preparing a development plan which is waiting to be approved. They are now trying to complete a road even though the plan is not approved.

It is clear that a certain Mr T’s men made a deal with Cambodia I guess, not all of it visible. It seems that they may have given away rights to the temple’s approach in exchange for what they believed would be bigger returns. That government ran the country like a business. But forgot that pride in Thailand as a country comes before profit for a lot of the population and politicians.

I am not a lawyer but I guess there was no way to appeal or reopen the case with the ICJ. The result then has to stand. If Thailand could have made a better case and won, I don’t know, but some judges certainly thought the result was wrong. The dissenting opinion was that it was unrealistic to expect Siam to stand up to the might of France on two grounds. One that did not have the knowledge or skill to show the map was wrong. Also they were scared of France and did not want any confrontation that they knew they would lose. It seems reasonable to me,

[DP25]

Why do so many people think Cambodia is "in the right" on this issue. Is it their great record of human rights, and free and fair elections? Their long history of stability and social justice? Their cool, calm, measured responses from their leadership?

You guys are out to lunch.

Really has nothing to do with Cambodia for many. It could be Burma or North Korea and they'd be cheering them on.

[rogerdee123]

Without trying to take sides of this issue, and look at things objectively, what I hear are the drums of war being pounded, while other, possibly peaceful solutions, such as mediation by the UN or ASEAN, are being ignored by Thailand. Why does Thailand continue to insist that bilateral talks will work, when they have shown absolutely zero positive effect so far? What are they afraid of by allowing the UN or ASEAN to mediate the situation? If they feel they are in the right, and have the evidence to back it up, it would seem they would be willing to take this to a higher level. However, if they know, or even doubt to some degree that they are wrong in this situation, then Thai Pride & Arrogance will prevent them from changing the course they are on now, no matter what the rest of the international community might say, and no matter how many lives it may cost, as saving face is much more important, to a Thai, than saving lives.

If this continues to escalate into war, it's a war Thailand can't win. They might have the larger army, and more "toys", but being an American who is also a Vietnam Vet, I can assure you that being bigger and better equipped is absolutely NO guarantee of victory. And while the Thai army might win in a head-to-head confrontation, I also have some doubts about that. My reasons for stating that is that Thailand has no real experience in actual warfare, while Cambodian troops are very experienced. A good example of this is in the border war with LAO, a country whose entire population is about the same as Bangkok's, Thai troops invaded and took over a village, raising the Thai flag over it, only to be routed and chased out that night by a much smaller Pathet Lao unit. And does Thailand actually believe that Cambodia would stick to a "tank-v-tank, soldier-v-soldier" scenario? If so, I feel sorry for them, as Cambodia would, in all likelihood, show them a whole new meaning of "guerrilla warfare" with men/women being sent into BKK, Chiang Mai, Pattaya, Phuket, etc., through a totally porous border to wreak total havoc with explosives, car bombs and assassinations.

I love Thailand, and her people, but her government, and some nationalists with their own agenda, is leading her into a war that, in the long run, they can't win.

You are very right! Good advice!

yes I agree also

But also think one of the reasons the Thai Govt is a bit shy of bringing this border issue to the the UN or some third party etc .... is because Thailand will lose land in many places along the border where the border has shifted (intentionally or not) over the years. Particularly (but not limited to) the refugee crisis on that border in the late 70's and 80's.

[Thai at Heart]

But forgot that pride in Thailand as a country comes before profit for a lot of the population and politicians.

I think the old saying "pride always comes before a fall" is however, particularly apt to describe Thailand's stance on this issue.

[Buchholz]

On a positive note, the other paper is reporting that Army troops are going to assist in rebuilding the houses in the village that were destroyed from the Cambodian artillery shelling.

Hopefully, they'll also be involved in piecing their school back together.

Edited February 10, 2011 by Buchholz

[creck]

From the International Court of Justice website http://www.icj-cij.o...se=45&k=46&p3=5

"...the maps were communicated to the Siamese Government as purporting to represent the outcome of the work of delimitation; since there was no reaction on the part of the Siamese authorities, either then or for many years, they must be held to have acquiesced. The maps were moreover communicated to the Siamese members of the Mixed Commission, who said nothing. to the Siamese Minister of the Interior, Prince Damrong, who thanked the French Minister in Bangkok for them, and to the Siamese provincial governors, some of whom knew of Preah Vihear. If the Siamese authorities accepted the Annex I map without investigation, they could not now plead any error vitiating the reality of their consent.

...in 1934-1935 a survey had established a divergence between the map line and the true line of the watershed, and other maps had been produced showing the Temple as being in Thailand: Thailand had nevertheless continued also to use and indeed to publish maps showing Preah Vihear as lying in Cambodia. Moreover, in the course of the negotiations for the 1925 and 1937 Franco-Siamese Treaties, which confirmed the existing frontiers, and in 1947 in Washington before the Franco-Siamese Conciliation Commission, it would have been natural for Thailand to raise the matter: she did not do so.

The natural inference was that she had accepted the frontier at Preah Vihear as it was drawn on the map, irrespective of its correspondence with the watershed line.

Moreover, when in 1930 Prince Damrong, on a visit to the Temple, was officially received there by the French Resident for the adjoining Cambodian province, Siam failed to react."

Decision made. Time to move on and end the senseless sabre-rattling.

I am not a lawyer but I guess there was no way to appeal or reopen the case with the ICJ. The result then has to stand. If Thailand could have made a better case and won, I don’t know, but some judges certainly thought the result was wrong. The dissenting opinion was that it was unrealistic to expect Siam to stand up to the might of France on two grounds. One that they did not have the knowledge or skill to show the map was wrong. Also they were scared of France and did not want any confrontation that they knew they would lose. It seems reasonable to me,

The problem comes with Cambodia preparing to seal off Thailand from the temple. First by raising the status of the Temple and then preparing a development plan which is waiting to be approved. They are now trying to complete a road even though the plan is not approved.

the decision has not been made on a quite large chunk of land that holds the key of approach to the temple.

[Buchholz]

Abhisit argued that Cambodian troops used the Hindu temple as a shield. "Thailand is gravely concerned about the use of Phra Viharn (Thai accent for Preah Vihear) by Cambodia for military purpose, which is in violation of international law, in particular the article 4 (1) of the 1954 Hague Convention for the Protection of Cultural Property in the Event of Arm Conflict," he said in the letter to UN yesterday.

Cambodian soldiers walk at the 11th-century Preah Vihear temple on the border between Thailand and Cambodia February 9, 2011.

Reuters

Cambodian soldier smokes a cigarette at his unit's position in the 11th-century Preah Vihear temple on the border between Thailand and Cambodia February 9, 2011.

Reuters

Cambodian army soldiers walk around Cambodia's 11th century Hindu Preah Vihear temple, which was enlisted as UNESCO's World Heritage in Preah Vihear province, about 245 kilometers (152 miles) north of Phnom Penh, Cambodia, Wednesday, Feb. 9, 2011. Hundreds of Cambodian soldiers were camped Wednesday at a cliff-top Khmer temple and World Heritage site.

AP

http://news.yahoo.com/nphotos/slideshow/photo//110209/481/urn_publicid_ap_org9c9a257faa2f458abad2512214704af6/

Associated Press Sighted Armed Cambodian Forces Camping in Preah Vihear Temple

According to a report by an international news agency, hundreds of Cambodian soldiers have fortified Preah Vihear Temple and its surrounding area.

The Associated Press has reported that hundreds of Cambodian soldiers in camouflage uniforms have fortified Preah Vihear Temple and the surrounding disputed area with sandbag bunkers.

A number of artillery shells, rocket launchers, and mortars were also sighted in the area. The reporters said the weapons were aimed at Thailand.

One of the Cambodian soldiers said he was transported to the area from his regular post and will return once the fighting has ended.

The report also indicates that there is only minor damage from the fighting, such as bullet marks on the temple's walls, contrary to Cambodia's claim that the temple was severely damage in the clashes, which prompted Phnom Penh's request for a UNESCO inspection.

The Thai government has submitted a protest to UNESCO, claiming that Cambodian forces have been camping in the World Heritage site to carry out attacks against Thailand.

At the same time, Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen has accused Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva as the aggressor.

Hun Sen has vowed that he will seek to put Abhisit on trial at the International Criminal Court.

UNESCO has canceled its plan to send its inspection team.

-- Tan Network 2011-02-10

[MengWan]

it is clear that Thailand is considered to have aquiesed to the 1907 French map

It is clear, too, that it has acquiesced to a Treaty saying that "watershed line" would be used ...

There's a flaw that cannot be put under the carpet, either change the Treaty and keep the map or

forget the Treaty and keep the map !

PS: In colonial times, it was the colonial power who was always right, even in its mistakes, because

the "other ones" were under-men, people to beat to make them just do what one want !

[zthyadat]

Hun Sen should know what he's talking about: wasn't he a member of the Khymer Rouge? Anyway, it's about time we had another war again perhaps it'll bring down the value of the Thai Baht!!!!!

Perhaps you may have intended the request for war as a humorous bit of sarcasm. Sadly, it falls flat and is in very poor taste. Do you really want to have a war which would see a return to kids being blown to bits or coming back with missing limbs? Do you not understand that there would be a significant impact upon the civilian population and the environment in a war zone? Is a 10% devaluation of the baht worth the misery that a war would bring? Do you realize that a war with Cambodia would shutdown of a large part of tourism. What of the tourists and other civilians that would be trapped? Are you going to take care of them?

How about this option? I ask the Thai military to explode some ordinance in close proximity to you, not enough to kill you, but sizeable enough to maim you, perhaps blindness or a loss of a leg or arm, and I give you 1000 baht. The 1000 baht will represent your gain from the currency fluctuations and the ordinance discharge will be a sharing of the joys of war. Is that ok?

I think it is pretty obvious to anyone over the age of ten that it was sarcasm, so let a little air out of your windbag and take it as he intended it. Or someone could respond to your suggestion as being in poor taste - do you really want to see that poster maimed? Would you really give him 1,000 baht to teach him a lesson?

We all know war is misery, that this situation is insane and little more than a political tool. But thanks for filling us all in, wise man.

[Steely Dan]

it is clear that Thailand is considered to have aquiesed to the 1907 French map

It is clear, too, that it has acquiesced to a Treaty saying that "watershed line" would be used ...

There's a flaw that cannot be put under the carpet, either change the Treaty and keep the map or

forget the Treaty and keep the map !

PS: In colonial times, it was the colonial power who was always right, even in its mistakes, because

the "other ones" were under-men, people to beat to make them just do what one want !

If you read the 1962 Judgement by the ICJ it clearly states that even if the watershed line was mentioned in the original treaty this was trumped by the subsequent map and Thailand not disputing it.

Here is an extract from the ICJ judgement.

From these facts, the court concluded that Thailand had accepted the Annex I map. Even if there were any doubt in this connection, Thailand was not precluded from asserting that she had not accepted it since France and Cambodia had relied upon her acceptance and she had for fifty years enjoyed such benefits as the Treaty of 1904 has conferred on her. Furthermore, the acceptance of the Annex I map caused it to enter the treaty settlement; the Parties had at that time adopted an interpretation of that settlement which caused the map line to prevail over the provisions of the Treaty and, as there was no reason to think that the Parties had attached any special importance to the line of the watershed as such, as compared with the overriding importance of a final regulation of their own frontiers, the Court considered that the interpretation to be given now would be the same.

Your point about colonial bully boys is of course true as it is just about everywhere in the world where colonial powers have dictated borders, but the ICJ decided in Cambodia's favour despite dissenting comments that Thailand was afraid to contest the map.

[MengWan]

it is clear that Thailand is considered to have aquiesed to the 1907 French map

It is clear, too, that it has acquiesced to a Treaty saying that "watershed line" would be used ...

There's a flaw that cannot be put under the carpet, either change the Treaty and keep the map or

forget the Treaty and keep the map !

PS: In colonial times, it was the colonial power who was always right, even in its mistakes, because

the "other ones" were under-men, people to beat to make them just do what one want !

If you read the 1962 Judgement by the ICJ it clearly states that even if the watershed line was mentioned in the original treaty this was trumped by the subsequent map and Thailand not disputing it.

Here is an extract from the ICJ judgement.

From these facts, the court concluded that Thailand had accepted the Annex I map. Even if there were any doubt in this connection, Thailand was not precluded from asserting that she had not accepted it since France and Cambodia had relied upon her acceptance and she had for fifty years enjoyed such benefits as the Treaty of 1904 has conferred on her. Furthermore, the acceptance of the Annex I map caused it to enter the treaty settlement; the Parties had at that time adopted an interpretation of that settlement which caused the map line to prevail over the provisions of the Treaty and, as there was no reason to think that the Parties had attached any special importance to the line of the watershed as such, as compared with the overriding importance of a final regulation of their own frontiers, the Court considered that the interpretation to be given now would be the same.

Your point about colonial bully boys is of course true as it is just about everywhere in the world where colonial powers have dictated borders, but the ICJ decided in Cambodia's favour despite dissenting comments that Thailand was afraid to contest the map.

I am NOT a judge of any colonial power (even if my grand-father was on one the the gunboats on the Chao Phraya), for me an Annex has less value than the text it is meant to precise.

In technical matters, I would have stick to that position ! (example, in computer programming, the chart is OK but the code is bugged ...)

[yastamon]

Hun Sen accused Thai troops of firing cluster bomb at Cambodian troops.

1) Does any one know if Thailand has cluster bombs?

2) Aren't cluster bombs dropped from planes?

Cluster muitions can either be dropped from airborne platforms or fired from ground platforms rocket or canon based. The thai government is it has any could procure them from many nations as they are manufactured by quite a few countries around the world.

[Robroy]

B)Hun Sen dosent know real war even if it hit him in the head.

Not strictly true. Hun Sen was blinded in one eye as the Khmer Rouge (to which he belonged) were taking Phnom Penh.

In other words he was literally hit in the head by a real war.

Perhaps before making your next comment you could pick up a book on regional history.

[w11guy]

Now the UN will have to act.

That's laughable. You mean like they act to stop Israel breaking resolutions or act to stop UK joining an illegal war against Iraq or the 100s of other things they don't bother with. The UN is a joke.

[dighambara]

Seems like the Cambodians want a war, and furthermore they think the international community will side with them. Also seems like the Thais are not interested in war, but don't want to loose face when provoked? More a case of 'cry wolf' for Hun Sen?

Hun Sen doesn't want the Cambodian people to see how much he is stealing from the national treasury. The more noise on the border the less the citizens check what he is doing.

[IvanDobsky]

The problem comes with Cambodia preparing to seal off Thailand from the temple. First by raising the status of the Temple and then preparing a development plan which is waiting to be approved. They are now trying to complete a road even though the plan is not approved.

the decision has not been made on a quite large chunk of land that holds the key of approach to the temple.

True enough. Calm and level-headed men could resolve the issue. The temple could be shared and accessed from both sides but there are too many nationalistic scoundrels on both sides to allow that to happen.

[dumpling]

Hun Sen should know what he's talking about: wasn't he a member of the Khymer Rouge? Anyway, it's about time we had another war again perhaps it'll bring down the value of the Thai Baht!!!!!

Please show some reprehensibility with the posts, war is something no one needs.If the situation does blow up don't you think foreign nationals will be advised to leave and as for going out and spending your new valued baht good luck!!

reprehensibility - it doesn't mean what you think it does!

it should be "responsibility" it was late, I was tired, i apologise

[Maseratimartin]

Seems like the Cambodians want a war, and furthermore they think the international community will side with them. Also seems like the Thais are not interested in war, but don't want to loose face when provoked? More a case of 'cry wolf' for Hun Sen?

Can anyone other than me smell Mr T.....?

Yeah it is time somebody sponsor this bullet for Mr. T.... ! Every year the same bull shit....

What Cambodia is thinking...they will win.....Mr T... comes back?....borders closed! They loose every day....

Ok...we always appreciate the cheap workers from Cambodia....but then just more come from Laos.

Just close the borders and shut them down....their own people in Cambodia will bring these politicians down!