New Lifan 250 Models

[RED21]

I guess almost everyone here has seen the Lifan ad on TV, eh?

Edited November 29, 2011 by RED21

[bbigman21]

Well I took my newly repaired Lifan Custom 250 for a 230 kilo ride everything seemed to be operating properly. I was just turning on to the gravel road in front of my house and it stalled. First thing I think that I have run out of petrol. But I have only driven 230 kilo on a fresh tank of gas nowhere near the 500 killo the dealer says I am supposed to get to the tank. I look inside the tank looks to be about a quarter of a tank left. So I try to restart it. It starts a little roughly but runs home. Again it started a little roughly today I headed to get petrol. I made it about 2 kilo from home and it quite. I look in the tank and cannot see any fuel but can hear it splash when I shake it. So I walk the bike back to the house. Take the truck to get petrol come back to the house. Still won't start! Back to the dealer tomorrow for the 5th time. I have not put 2000 kilo on this bike yet. If this would have been America I would have gotten my money back. I have lost my faith that it will be repaired correctly. And I am starting to wonder what is going to happen.

More updates to follow.

[Fishenough]

Well I took my newly repaired Lifan Custom 250 for a 230 kilo ride everything seemed to be operating properly. I was just turning on to the gravel road in front of my house and it stalled. First thing I think that I have run out of petrol. But I have only driven 230 kilo on a fresh tank of gas nowhere near the 500 killo the dealer says I am supposed to get to the tank. I look inside the tank looks to be about a quarter of a tank left. So I try to restart it. It starts a little roughly but runs home. Again it started a little roughly today I headed to get petrol. I made it about 2 kilo from home and it quite. I look in the tank and cannot see any fuel but can hear it splash when I shake it. So I walk the bike back to the house. Take the truck to get petrol come back to the house. Still won't start! Back to the dealer tomorrow for the 5th time. I have not put 2000 kilo on this bike yet. If this would have been America I would have gotten my money back. I have lost my faith that it will be repaired correctly. And I am starting to wonder what is going to happen.

More updates to follow.

Just an idea from 2 Lifan that have also had a couple of trips back to the dealer with failure to Remedy the issues: faulty fuel stop cocks limiting fuel at still 1/3 of a tank. This is also 2 different models belonging to friends. One of those bikes was taken to the Piston shop to have the carb properly sorted out for 200 B.

Did you try switching the tank valve to reserve?

[elliss]

The Lifan LF250-B (Custom 250) costs 78,000 THB all in, including registration, green book, govt. basic insurance.

it looks good, the price is reasonable ,

whats it going be like , to sell on ??.

[CMX]

Guess I'm just lucky. Go 350 kms and fill up 10.5 liters after hard hills and higher rpm's; don't hit reserve at 400. Here in Chiang Mai, my dealer seems competent (so far).

For example, I left fuel in the carb, gasahol, for 10 weeks and the carb gummed up. Manager sent a truck 10kms, picked it up at my house, cleaned the carb so well that it has run flawlessly since. 700 baht. (I'd checked fuel filter, but gum was inside.)

[bbigman21]

Well I took my newly repaired Lifan Custom 250 for a 230 kilo ride everything seemed to be operating properly. I was just turning on to the gravel road in front of my house and it stalled. First thing I think that I have run out of petrol. But I have only driven 230 kilo on a fresh tank of gas nowhere near the 500 killo the dealer says I am supposed to get to the tank. I look inside the tank looks to be about a quarter of a tank left. So I try to restart it. It starts a little roughly but runs home. Again it started a little roughly today I headed to get petrol. I made it about 2 kilo from home and it quite. I look in the tank and cannot see any fuel but can hear it splash when I shake it. So I walk the bike back to the house. Take the truck to get petrol come back to the house. Still won't start! Back to the dealer tomorrow for the 5th time. I have not put 2000 kilo on this bike yet. If this would have been America I would have gotten my money back. I have lost my faith that it will be repaired correctly. And I am starting to wonder what is going to happen.

More updates to follow.

Just an idea from 2 Lifan that have also had a couple of trips back to the dealer with failure to Remedy the issues: faulty fuel stop cocks limiting fuel at still 1/3 of a tank. This is also 2 different models belonging to friends. One of those bikes was taken to the Piston shop to have the carb properly sorted out for 200 B.

Did you try switching the tank valve to reserve?

Thanks but I tried the reserve it just won't fire up. In other rides I never had petrol problems usually did not hit the gas station until after 400 kilo. I have heard so many good things about these Lifan. It was a bargain but not feeling so now. The last time I was at the dealer I made a joke about trading it for the new keeway. They told me they would give me 49000 for my bike. Which leaves me with the feeling of one this bike will never get fixed and the are not going to give me money back for this lemon.

[canuckamuck]

I have also had trouble with the dealer making competent repairs with my bike, which is a Lifan cross. They replaced three light bulbs before they realized it was a loose connection and the bulbs were not burned out. I have had issues with the front brake since day 1, but they always just scrubbed the pads and gave it back. It turns out the caliper was crap and I am now fitting an aftermarket one.

They have fixed other things successfully for me, so they are not completely incompetent, but they either don't want to find the problem, or they don't really care. One thing I find very frustrating is the fact that when you bring your bike in, the person who fills out the information is just the counter girl. It would make a lot of sense to talk to the mechanic because I am sure the counter girl doesn't know a lot more than the mirrors are for makeup. And we all know how well second hand communication goes over here.

I still like the bike, but I wish it would have been easier to get the initial kinks out.

[bbigman21]

Well I went to load my bike in the back of the truck. And thought I would try to kick it over one more time. It started so I took for a quick ride. It kept losing power. So I thought it was doing something it did last time. So I drove in the shop but by then it evened out. So I took for a 300 kilo ride and it run great. I now believe that the fuel line was plugged up. Still running good!

Edited December 3, 2011 by bbigman21

[bbigman21]

Last update. My bike is running great I have run it 500 kilo in the last two days it is running perfectly. Thanks

[rmacdon61]

Left my 250B sit for 5 months, run each week by father. When I got back fired up but died and after no run. Took out plugs, cleaned installed and did fire but wasn't a happy camper. I did make the mistake of using 95 fuel and now have been told by dealer use 91? 600 bht for a 25 K service trip by dealer, all smiles and runs great. Bought a couple of spare plugs and now have another 1000k on it using 91 gas, all OK.

Have run it now for almost a year and still OK with it. It is a cuiser so corners (real corners) are not its favorite but good performance on open road. I do miss going off onto gravel and still think maybe a cross would suit my style better, but all in all, good buy for the buck. Still looking for a sissy bar rack. PM if you know of one.

[LawrenceLam]

Only ONE dealer (Siamchai) is selling Lifan LF250-B in Hat Yai. And it is being sold at B86,900 excluding registration or any accessories. The dealer is only willing to give a B900 discount.

One question:

In order to register the bike under a foreigner's name, I must have a valid address. So I need a VISA. Being a tourist guide in Malaysia, I enter Thailand about five times a month. Unfortunately I am not attached to any company there and do not have a work permit. Is there anyway I can apply for a VISA?

Edited December 7, 2011 by LawrenceLam

[Richard-BKK]

Only ONE dealer (Siamchai) is selling Lifan LF250-B in Hat Yai. And it is being sold at B86,900 excluding registration or any accessories. The dealer is only willing to give a B900 discount.

One question:

In order to register the bike under a foreigner's name, I must have a valid address. So I need a VISA. Being a tourist guide in Malaysia, I enter Thailand about five times a month. Unfortunately I am not attached to any company there and do not have a work permit. Is there anyway I can apply for a VISA?

In Thailand it's common that the customer pays for the distributor-to-dealer transport cost of the motorcycle, we see that with all bike brands.

For VISA I have seen people buying a motorcycle with a tourist visa, but what I hear that is highly dependable where you are, Pattaya and Bangkok seems not so difficult, Phuket is much stricter on the rules... (maybe it changed...). By the way with tourist visa I not mean VISA-on-Arrival (what is not really a visa).

[Benjie]

Its good to start seeing some feedback about these Chinese bikes, it sounds like the Lifans reliability is pretty poor and from what I understand they are supposed to be the best of the bunch.

[CMX]

Its good to start seeing some feedback about these Chinese bikes, it sounds like the Lifans reliability is pretty poor and from what I understand they are supposed to be the best of the bunch.

So far, I'd think that we have far too few reports to support making a summary conclusion. Couple of Lifan 250 riders I've met are happy with their bikes, over all, for what it is. It is early.

I also think that negatives are more likely to be reported than positives. Time will tell.

[wantan]

Its good to start seeing some feedback about these Chinese bikes, it sounds like the Lifans reliability is pretty poor and from what I understand they are supposed to be the best of the bunch.

So far, I'd think that we have far too few reports to support making a summary conclusion. Couple of Lifan 250 riders I've met are happy with their bikes, over all, for what it is. It is early.

From what i read here at TV i still would consider buying a Lifan. I heard nothing very bad. But good to know that there are glitches with Lifan too. So i am warned, i will get what i pay for

I also think that negatives are more likely to be reported than positives. Time will tell.

I heard this many times and i doubt this. A forum member reports the good things AND the bad things. I do not believe the story of the "Happy customers who drive away without reporting their happiness". Of course they will not keep on writing posts every week "Oh, i am so happy with my Lifan and i have no trouble". But they will report their experiences with Lifan everytime it fits to the topic. Good or bad, makes no difference.

[JSixpack]

it sounds like the Lifans reliability is pretty poor

That's not what it sounds like at all. Maybe you can't quite get over that word "Chinese"?

[BigBikeBKK]

I heard this many times and i doubt this. A forum member reports the good things AND the bad things. I do not believe the story of the "Happy customers who drive away without reporting their happiness". Of course they will not keep on writing posts every week "Oh, i am so happy with my Lifan and i have no trouble". But they will report their experiences with Lifan everytime it fits to the topic. Good or bad, makes no difference.

You're wrong.

Marketing 101

More than one-quarter of consumers (26%) say they are more likely to tell family, friends, and coworkers about a bad experience with a product or service than a good one,

Read more: http://www.marketingprofs.com/charts/2011/4669/bad-news-about-brands-travels-fast#ixzz1gChs29TO

[wantan]

I heard this many times and i doubt this. A forum member reports the good things AND the bad things. I do not believe the story of the "Happy customers who drive away without reporting their happiness". Of course they will not keep on writing posts every week "Oh, i am so happy with my Lifan and i have no trouble". But they will report their experiences with Lifan everytime it fits to the topic. Good or bad, makes no difference.

You're wrong.

Marketing 101

More than one-quarter of consumers (26%) say they are more likely to tell family, friends, and coworkers about a bad experience with a product or service than a good one,

Read more: http://www.marketing...t#ixzz1gChs29TO

I was talking about bike related statements in a biker forum, not about what the average crackbrained US consumer is doing. Has nothing to do with marketing. Its about sharing interesting experiences. It is not very interesting that a bike is running. This should be the normal case and is neither a positive nor a negative statement. Interesting for other bikers is, if a bike runs 20,00km without any problem. Or if it breaks down after just 20km.

[BigBikeBKK]

I heard this many times and i doubt this. A forum member reports the good things AND the bad things. I do not believe the story of the "Happy customers who drive away without reporting their happiness". Of course they will not keep on writing posts every week "Oh, i am so happy with my Lifan and i have no trouble". But they will report their experiences with Lifan everytime it fits to the topic. Good or bad, makes no difference.

You're wrong.

Marketing 101

More than one-quarter of consumers (26%) say they are more likely to tell family, friends, and coworkers about a bad experience with a product or service than a good one,

Read more: http://www.marketing...t#ixzz1gChs29TO

I was talking about bike related statements in a biker forum, not about what the average crackbrained US consumer is doing. Has nothing to do with marketing. Its about sharing interesting experiences. It is not very interesting that a bike is running. This should be the normal case and is neither a positive nor a negative statement. Interesting for other bikers is, if a bike runs 20,00km without any problem. Or if it breaks down after just 20km.

And you're in sales?!

[Benjie]

People must just think differently from me I guess, because I don't think that braking issues, burning out 3 lamps, losing power, carb voltage issues, starter problems, plug problems, faulty fuel stop cocks, 75% of ownership time at the dealership etc... sounds reliable in the slightest.

I can easily get over the word Chinese and understand that probably 80% of the things I use reliably on a day to day basis are made there, however they are not Chinese brands - Which is IMO the difference.

[wantan]

And you're in sales?!

No, should i? It has nothing to do with marketing or sales. This is a forum where members share their experiences. Positives and negatives. Very easy. Of course there are some more glitches with cheap bikes and it is good that someone is reporting them. So other forum members can form their own opinions before purchasing.

[JSixpack]

People must just think differently from me I guess, because I don't think that braking issues, burning out 3 lamps, losing power, carb voltage issues, starter problems, plug problems, faulty fuel stop cocks, 75% of ownership time at the dealership etc... sounds reliable in the slightest.

I can easily get over the word Chinese and understand that probably 80% of the things I use reliably on a day to day basis are made there, however they are not Chinese brands - Which is IMO the difference.

Couple of guys had trivial glitches, others didn't, some of which may reflect setup. Friend of mine who's got a Lifan approaching 3000km, ridden daily, hasn't had the slightest problem. At this point, everyone who owns a Lifan is happy w/ his Lifan and isn't complaining. Besides, you ignore all the satisfied Lifan owners outside Thailand.

Glitches happen to bikes of Japanese brands too, new or old. And one may buy a lemon of any brand. You seem not to have noticed. In fact, some Japanese bikes may have some innate, potentially expensive, problems, like the Honda V4 premature camshaft wear problem. The Phantom has the cam chain tensioner issue. So if you had owned one of those, you'd deny there was any problem because, after all, it isn't a Chinese brand. I couldn't own a Phantom because it's "unreliable" owing to an issue or two.

I'm just following your bias, which you continue to deny is a bias, to its logical conclusion. I suspect if you hadn't learned that Lifan is a Chinese brand then you'd feel completely differently, as the evidence doesn't at all warrant its being labeled as "unreliable."

[Benjie]

People must just think differently from me I guess, because I don't think that braking issues, burning out 3 lamps, losing power, carb voltage issues, starter problems, plug problems, faulty fuel stop cocks, 75% of ownership time at the dealership etc... sounds reliable in the slightest.

I can easily get over the word Chinese and understand that probably 80% of the things I use reliably on a day to day basis are made there, however they are not Chinese brands - Which is IMO the difference.

Couple of guys had trivial glitches, others didn't, some of which may reflect setup. Friend of mine who's got a Lifan approaching 3000km, ridden daily, hasn't had the slightest problem. At this point, everyone who owns a Lifan is happy w/ his Lifan and isn't complaining. Besides, you ignore all the satisfied Lifan owners outside Thailand.

Glitches happen to bikes of Japanese brands too, new or old. And one may buy a lemon of any brand. You seem not to have noticed. In fact, some Japanese bikes may have some innate, potentially expensive, problems, like the Honda V4 premature camshaft wear problem. The Phantom has the cam chain tensioner issue. So if you had owned one of those, you'd deny there was any problem because, after all, it isn't a Chinese brand. I couldn't own a Phantom because it's "unreliable" owing to an issue or two.

I'm just following your bias, which you continue to deny is a bias, to its logical conclusion. I suspect if you hadn't learned that Lifan is a Chinese brand then you'd feel completely differently, as the evidence doesn't at all warrant its being labeled as "unreliable."

Problem is 100's of thousands have bought Japanese bikes, with perhaps the odd problem, whilst I've yet to even see a Lifan on the streets and there's lots of reports here in Thailand of some pretty big (yet basic) issues. You call them trivial glitches but they don't sound like that to me. I don't care if the ones they send to the USA or wherever are great, I live in Thailand so am curious about the ones available here.

Are you seriously suggesting that these bikes are as reliable as the japanese ones. Or are you just saying that because they are cheaper buyers have to put up with some faults? Because 3000km isn't a feat in my eyes.

[CMX]

Of course Lifan does not have a statistically reliable track record here. Of course buying one requires taking that risk, as well as those down the road, after lengthy use. Also, of course a dense network of experienced mechanics does not exist. These risks, however, do not indict the bike itself, though they are important considerations before purchase.

As for the worth of the bike with regard to reliability, all anyone can say is that the jury is necessarily still out. Not enough have been sold for a long enough time to give a hint of a verdict.

I can insist, for example, that mine has performed flawlessly (as I can and do), and naysayers will say, "Well, that's just one." And they are right, just as anyone would be in taking a few complaints as serving as useful evidence. Useful probabilities cannot be determined by a few reports, least of all in low numbers on the I'net.

However, this coming year may well show us a number of new bikes in the 150-250 class. More Lifans too will show up, it seems. It will be a gamble for a while, but the Chinese will one day deliver first class vehicles. Who can doubt it? Until they do, they'll be cheaper, so long as they can figure some way around Thailand's protective tariffs.

[BigBikeBKK]

but the Chinese will one day deliver first class vehicles. Who can doubt it?

Actually I very much doubt it. Chinese industry has never been known for quality. Contrast China to countries that are known for quality manufacturing, such as Japan or Germany. I don't want to sound racist, but I honestly feel like the Chinese culture is not one that values quality. The Japanese and Germans on the other hand are well renowned for their constant pursuit of perfection and amazing QC. Then you get the countries / cultures that fall in the middle, such as the US, Italy and UK- they produce goods of fairly good quality, but generally lag behind the Germans and the Japanese in most QC polls. Of course I'm making big generalizations- there are some glowing exceptions, particularly amongst motorcycle manufactures where in recent years the UK's TRIUMPH, the US's Harley Davidson and Italy's DUCATI have been some of the fastest growing and most profitable motorcycle companies in the world thanks to their quality bikes, innovation and marketing. The Japanese manufacturers are losing market share, not because their quality is suffering, but rather, IMO, because they haven't been offering much in the way of exciting new models and their offerings are starting to look a bit tired.

To date the Chinese compete only on price, never on quality. Sure there are foreign firms that have manufacturing facilities in China, but in such cases the QC is always assured by foreign managers.

So sorry, I really can't imagine that I'll see a Chinese brand vehicle that matches Japanese or German quality in my lifetime.

[wantan]

but the Chinese will one day deliver first class vehicles. Who can doubt it?

Actually I very much doubt it. Chinese industry has never been known for quality. Contrast China to countries that are known for quality manufacturing, such as Japan or Germany. I don't want to sound racist, but I honestly feel like the Chinese culture is not one that values quality. The Japanese and Germans on the other hand are well renowned for their constant pursuit of perfection and amazing QC. Then you get the countries / cultures that fall in the middle, such as the US, Italy and UK- they produce goods of fairly good quality, but generally lag behind the Germans and the Japanese in most QC polls. Of course I'm making big generalizations- there are some glowing exceptions, particularly amongst motorcycle manufactures where in recent years the UK's TRIUMPH, the US's Harley Davidson and Italy's DUCATI have been some of the fastest growing and most profitable motorcycle companies in the world thanks to their quality bikes, innovation and marketing. The Japanese manufacturers are losing market share, not because their quality is suffering, but rather, IMO, because they haven't been offering much in the way of exciting new models and their offerings are starting to look a bit tired.

To date the Chinese compete only on price, never on quality. Sure there are foreign firms that have manufacturing facilities in China, but in such cases the QC is always assured by foreign managers.

So sorry, I really can't imagine that I'll see a Chinese brand vehicle that matches Japanese or German quality in my lifetime.

If you compare China to Germany or Japan than you can not neglect its size and power. Its not the question if the chinese actually can build quality bikes. Its the question if the chinese want to do this in near future. If they want than they can establish quality factories pretty quick i guess. There is enough money to buy the knowlede they would need for it. But we will see what they want

[CMX]

So sorry, I really can't imagine that I'll see a Chinese brand vehicle that matches Japanese or German quality in my lifetime. ~ BigbikeBKK

Tony,

One takes your point about cultures and the accepted notion that Japanese and German passions for quality (versus price and bling) are part of their being.

However, QC in particular has a lot to do with financial success today in vehicles. The popularity of Japanese bikes tells that story and makes money for them. In time, I suppose that once Chinese see where the money is that their QC will improve. Lifan might one day be an example. In computers, Lenovo seems to have done well, and it appears that Chinese internet savvy is second to none (as in finding ways through extremely guarded western firewalls). Their own space program seems robust. And as for foreign-run enterprises that ensure QC, I cannot but suppose that cross-cultural learning is taking place through this aspect of globalization. These days, even American autos can demand respect, in many cases, for durability and reliability.

An example of another nation stepping up the pace is Korea, which sells suddenly enormously popular (and studies report them very reliable) cars these days.

But only time will tell.

Now as to your living long enough to see it, we have the problem of speeding in the countryside around curves and over hills where speed - braking = speed remaining before hitting the unseen object. Keep it on the track, and I've little doubt that you'll find my speculations are correct. Might be a grandpa, though, riding a Lifan 800 cruiser.

Edited December 14, 2011 by CMX

[Richard-BKK]

About a year ago somebody on this forum said that Lifan, with its cars, would never meet Japanese or European cars on safety standards. But, Lifan has received the E-mark certificate issued by the Dutch government for the Lifan 520. Matter of fact the Lifan 520 also passed European parameters of homologation ECE-R 94 procedures. ECE-R 94 is a standard for crash tests, which brings the Lifan 520 on the same crash safety level as the Renault Megane and Rover Freelander, etc... and is higher than some new Japanese build cars.

And with 5-years warranty on the body work and engine, Lifan apparently is very confident in the quality.

Others suggest that Lifan with its cars cannot meet the strict European emission rules, but, the Lifan 520 is compliant with the Euro V emission standard.

All this in just in a few years, a very short time to get a middle-class sedan on the same safety level and environmental friendly level as European European manufacturers... Back in the '70s Japanese car and motorcycle manufacturers had also problems meeting European and American standards and for some manufacturers it took them more than 20 years to be able to get the same safety ratings...

For motorcycles, 2012 Lifan will have some surprises....

[JSixpack]

but the Chinese will one day deliver first class vehicles. Who can doubt it?

Actually I very much doubt it. Chinese industry has never been known for quality. Contrast China to countries that are known for quality manufacturing, such as Japan or Germany. I don't want to sound racist, but I honestly feel like the Chinese culture is not one that values quality. The Japanese and Germans on the other hand are well renowned for their constant pursuit of perfection and amazing QC.

You seem unaware of the evolution of Japanese quality. Japanese were once known for producing junk. My dad would snort at the idea of anything Japanese and wouldn't have any of it. Even I could see the toys I had that were made in Japan were cheap crap. Everybody sneered at the first Datsuns and Toyotas, tin boxes.

Did you know that Hong Kong Chinese were once renowned for laziness? It was the local culture. Culture changes w/ changes of government and economic opportunity.

[bbigman21]

Hey Richard BKK are you selling your new Lifan on baht sold?

Latest update Lifan custom 250 it is running great actually better than when I bought it. Only small problem that I have noticed is I let it sit one day. It run shoddy the next. Thought iwas having the power loss again. I am guessing the fuel was just gummed up. Because it burned out. Now running great. So I make sure to ride everyday. Now just got to find someplace with decent accessories. I want some hard bags and floor boards.