Which Land Based Business To Generate 3-4M Per Year ?

[jamescollister]

Well said IA. Don't think there are many rich Farangs who make there home in Issan, but better your own boss than a wage slave for someone else and at the end of the day what more do you need than food on the table, a place to sleep and a few cold ones at the end of the day. Jim

[glomp]

Even if the elusive "western magic management" farms got setup and you got on with starting to regain your investment in a few years the mechanised agriculture corps will get in to thailand hardcore. if they arent't already.

that 200 rai economy of scale head start will be turned in to nothing.

Well Glomp,

I am definitely no magician and all my years of management dont amount to much more than the ability to plan things out as best I can. I often wonder what the hell I was thinking when I started all this, why get involved at all? One thing I do know, and agree with FEF completely on, if you are prepared to put in the hard yards day after day, you have an advantage over the normal easy going Thai subsistence farmer. Those helping will work at your pace and things get done not just talked about.

The mechanisation issue is a no brainer, it's simple progress from draught animals to rice tractors to GPS guided John Deeres. No different here or anywhere else and in the context of this thread scale is a must if you want to compete and produce incomes in the millions.

But IMHO that isnt what most of us are involved in. I personally am at a very small scale and have no ambitions towards getting much bigger, just better. The "full rice bowl is enough" attitude of rural Thais satisfies me these days, a pair of shorts and a tee-shirt from Big C to work in and a few beers at the end of the day are my needs. I find plenty of challenges in daily life to give me the mental stimulation to keep going.

Am I dreaming? Am I kidding myself? Can I make it work or will it all end up being yet another well intentioned folly for the locals to scoff at? Perhaps, but it will not be for the lack of trying. Like many others I spent a long time planning and started this knowing that it was a race to get things done before that corner was reached when the money runs out. That corner is approaching, fast. I freely admit the thought scares me but it wont stop me. For me, its about living where and how I choose, doing what I want and not just what I need to do.

So I suppose its a matter of knowing what you want and making it happen. Not just sitting around then asking, "What Happened?" For those with sufficient resources to absorb all the pitfalls Thailand poses all I can say is lucky you. For the battlers like me, good luck to you. To everyone, as we say in Australia, "Have a go you mug!"

Isaan Aussie

If you need to get 3-4 million baths each year you have invested a fair chunk of change and are not easily mobile. If monsanto starts controlling who can sell rice/veggies/fruit in quantities over the local consumption you will have problems if you are not in the old boys network.

There are market forces all over the world working to corner the food markets, in Iraq and Afghanistan american companies are killing of local farming. In the west there is work on making growing your own food illegal with "quality laws" implemented in small increments.

Farmers in this forum complain about low returns, to get 3mill you would have to produce something incredibly high yield to limit the input capital to something manageable. If it's a 3-4% return we are looking at it would make much more sense to put the capital in the bank and buy a small farm for the farming lifestyle and do it for some extra beer money.

But each to his own. I'm just asking people to realize they are putting their nest eggs in to the good will of their wives and the local government. They can tell you to bugger of and you will have to sell your organs for food.

Edit: IA we are talking about different issues a bit, you are talking about the quality of life style farm. The op and me are talking about starting a large farming corp from the start. This will probably not be taking it easy in your golden years. Not owning your land and living like a second class citizen would give me an ulcer.

Edited March 13, 2011 by glomp

[IsaanAussie]

Well I suppose Jim and I will have to just accept our second class status, grin and bear It. This book has a pretty ragged cover after all so your call is fair enough.

But I will ask you to note and forgive a few petty exceptions I take to your comments. Mine is not a life style farm, its a <deleted> Hard Work Farm. I live the life I choose, but it is hardly in style! I would like to mention that you show little trust in those around you. That's a shame.

Good luck with your corporate endeavours I hope you do well. I know I did, and I know those I worked for did even better. I also know I enjoyed it.

But for me those "CP" days are past Game, Set and Match Point, the hair has worn off the ball. It isnt about feeding the world, changing or controlling it, or owning more of it. As Jim said, food on the table and a few beers is enough reward. If that means selling, or eating my own kidneys then so be it I suppose. Needs are as needs must.

I will finish with a personal observation. Rural Thailand is riddled with petty jealousy, winners and losers, its frustrating and an absolute and utter waste of time. I tell my wife, If you dont want to lose then dont play. When I was taught to play cricket, I learnt its the good balls you must play, let the bad ones go through to the Keeper.

So continue to defend your stumps my friend!

Isaan Aussie

[saakura]

It can be done I have almost done it. It is for sure a long term project and you will have to upfront 15,000,000 Baht but the long term gains are worth it.

I done it like this, in the UK I have contacts in the furniture business so I decided to build a factory in Thailand so far the journey has been very very demanding, but nothing in life that's worthwhile is ever easy.

I bought land (paddy field) in my wife's name and had her sign over a 30 lease to me, on this land I have built a 5600 sq ft factory with space left over for a further 30,000 sq ft if we grow. I have bought panel saws, power presses, compressors, pipe bender, degreasers, ovens and lots besides.

I decided not to outsource any fabricated components only raw materials so I can control the quality of all products leaving this factory.

The one resource that is abundant here in Issan Thailand is skilled workers at low wages, plus most raw materials are a lot less over here than in Europe.

We have just received our first 3 orders and have started production, there is still a further 2-3 years of learning curve to go through before things will run smoothly.

So to answer your question yes it is possible and 3-4 million is more than achievable on 20 Rai but this way is not land based.

You seem to be very brave and determined + hardworking and fortune favours the brave. I wish your venture every success and admire the positive way in which you have replied to the OP.

[SGD]

For a start, there is no real exit route from such a venture. It isn't like cashing in a building and heading off to the desert. Unloading large tracks of land in semi rural Thailand isn't easy and certainly not something you can rely upon doing in any given timeframe save for accepting a few cents on the dollar. That needs a risk premium. The inability to own land is largely immaterial to me as there would be a corporate structure and I have Thai children who can naturally inherit. That said, it does rather make it a one way proposition.

Then you have the volume issue. What is viable today may change tomorrow or in the years to come. As stated, if economies of scale are eroded then where does that take you to ? If the maximum you can get is 10k per rai and you want 4m then you obviously need 400 rai which is huge and most likely impossible on a cost basis.

[glomp]

IA belive me I think what you and jim are doing is way cool. You are obviously people who aren't scared of hard work and have the required spirit to make it work. Not all people have this and still, unless you know you can hack it I would take a breather before sinking the money in to it.

Having the money is not even 50% of the required input. I could carry coal on my back for sustenance but this is not the same "hard work" you are talking about now is it. When I come home from moving A to B I don't have to care. When you come home you have A to Z to think about. It's like those threads about economic assistance to the thai relatives, unless they have the backbone and initiative to run a business that money will just turn to nothing.

Of course you work hard on your farm, if you didn't it wouldn't have been farming?

Edit: I feel I am repeating myself in a lot of threads and we all are, but what can we do. Even if we made stickies people will still rehash the same threads.

Edited March 13, 2011 by glomp

[Foreverford]

Well I suppose Jim and I will have to just accept our second class status, grin and bear It. This book has a pretty ragged cover after all so your call is fair enough.

But I will ask you to note and forgive a few petty exceptions I take to your comments. Mine is not a life style farm, its a <deleted> Hard Work Farm. I live the life I choose, but it is hardly in style! I would like to mention that you show little trust in those around you. That's a shame.

Good luck with your corporate endeavours I hope you do well. I know I did, and I know those I worked for did even better. I also know I enjoyed it.

But for me those "CP" days are past Game, Set and Match Point, the hair has worn off the ball. It isnt about feeding the world, changing or controlling it, or owning more of it. As Jim said, food on the table and a few beers is enough reward. If that means selling, or eating my own kidneys then so be it I suppose. Needs are as needs must.

I will finish with a personal observation. Rural Thailand is riddled with petty jealousy, winners and losers, its frustrating and an absolute and utter waste of time. I tell my wife, If you dont want to lose then dont play. When I was taught to play cricket, I learnt its the good balls you must play, let the bad ones go through to the Keeper.

So continue to defend your stumps my friend!

Isaan Aussie

Well Mr Glomp with the pomp and some ceremony what say you to the I/A style of life. You aren't being very much, in, in the, in part, of informative.

"If you need to get 3-4 million baths each year you have invested a fair chunk of change and are not easily mobile.......Farmers in this forum complain about low returns, to get 3mill you would have to produce something incredibly high yield to limit the input capital to something manageable. If it's a 3-4% return we are looking at it would make much more sense to put the capital in the bank and buy a small farm for the farming lifestyle and do it for some extra beer money."..."Edit: IA we are talking about different issues a bit, you are talking about the quality of life style farm. The op and me are talking about starting a large farming corp from the start. This will probably not be taking it easy in your golden years. Not owning your land and living like a second class citizen would give me an ulcer. "

I really don't think you really understand what has been said in this particular post and that has led to your ignorance (note the use of "ignorance"; for non-English speakers that doesn't mean anything like foolish, vain and plain rude, it means you are just unknowledgeable and haven't been informed yet). Right from the front I explained to SGD If you need to get 3-4 million baht each year (I figured a little less than 3-4% because nowdays that isn't an easy "bank" "secured" investment for the amount of money involved) it would take 100-200 million and he said he wasn't into that game so we started to change the way we tried to inform him of other possibilities in today's market. It remained rather civil until recently as we who have to go into town covered in over-alls, dusty clothes, oily fingernails, you pick the one you want to use, because we need something NOW and if we don't get it, we will ended up taking serious loses. This is the way I've seen it my whole life. the farmer lives his life right out in front on his sleeve and has no time to be pretentious because it is just too much work and the thing a farmer doesn't need is more work. So other than a few digs you don't really have any new information to add. I explained to SGD he would need to hire the half a dozen administrative folks to run his 100-200 million corp and he didn't want that "lifestyle" so it appears you just jumped into the middle of this intelligent (another word with the "in" that folks that are dialed in try to use) discussion to throw out a pet rant and get rid of some pent up tensions that may be based on your corporate defeatist type of view. Or is it style? As the Dead said in "The New Speedway Boogie" "Please don't dominate the rap Jack if you got nothing new to say.." we heard all your "rap" before it ain't new and it's not that pertinent to this discussion. What a waste of time to put all that down in words but it's hard to have someone call your soul ugly and I didn't have to read between the lines to affronted by it.

Hey I/A I got to go ain't got no more time for this stuff as i was going to really lay down a great "Down on the Farm" this morn but now n o tim e but it had Stevie Ray vaughn Quincy Jones and BB King in it and I know they enjoyed and enjoy their lifestyle and feel yours and many other farmers similar to you are truly admirable as i do to. Now with "Sixes" it's a different game just like this post sometimes you have to take the bad balls and do something with them as you only get six deliveries. Since my first fourth ball of this over wasn't a yorker and i got a glomper I decide to step up and take full on and play it straight up the wicket right at the bowler. yeah the Irish remind of farmers. Now how diod that last result turn out with the mighty English? Fords and Googlies Forever

[glomp]

Yeah my pet rant is people not pissing their money away. From talking to other people travelling to Thailand the thoughts go, open a bar to open a hotel and then to open a farm because that is "real work".

I guess my "dark soul" saved me from opening the bar in pattaya , the cafe in bangkok, the hotel complex in samui or the farm in issan.

Boy is my face red.

Edit: I know you all had it tough. You used to 'ave to get up out of shoebox at twelve o'clock at night and lick road clean wit' tongue. You had two bits of cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at mill for sixpence every four years, and when you got home our Dad would slice us in two wit' bread knife.

You have seen it all, we know.

Edited March 13, 2011 by glomp

[IsaanAussie]

Well, hi to all you positively motivated land based businessmen out there. All you contributors to the greater good. All you achievers.

I get up very early some mornings, like today, to earn a little income from other activities during this period where my land based business needs a little help with the cash flow. I believe "real" businessmen call it managing the forward cash position, but like all stereotypes I could be wrong.

I used to have a secret. But the cat is now out of the bag, or I my case the pig is out of the poke. Apparently later today I fully intend to piss those meagre earnings away yet again. More fool me, will I never learn?

I love Python humour, it always brings a smile and a song, "Always look on the bright side of life"

Isaan Aussie

[Foreverford]

Yeah my pet rant is people not pissing their money away. From talking to other people travelling to Thailand the thoughts go, open a bar to open a hotel and then to open a farm because that is "real work".

I guess my "dark soul" saved me from opening the bar in pattaya , the cafe in bangkok, the hotel complex in samui or the farm in issan.

Boy is my face red.

Edit: I know you all had it tough. You used to 'ave to get up out of shoebox at twelve o'clock at night and lick road clean wit' tongue. You had two bits of cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at mill for sixpence every four years, and when you got home our Dad would slice us in two wit' bread knife.

You have seen it all, we know.

Gee I guess this "pet" response is directed to me but like most of it before, it doesn't make too much sense. We all know in this Forum that we should be very appreciative of the people whose entire motive is to "save" us farmers or possible future farmers. Again sir I ask you to not ignore your ignorance. If you have read this thread and other similar ones that we have addressed in the past, most of us are doing exactly what you are saying in your mean, condescending and rude manner. We are trying to be informative and more times than not have directed most people to not to persue this type of "lifestyle" "business", without tons of research and time and observation before they ever sink one satang into a farming endeavor. Your previous posts show that you have either completely failed to see and understand this or in fact you really haven't even read it completely.

Hey I/A I'll still give you my money for all the piss that you process and blend from your farm it is sure making my carrots and tomatoes thrive. It is not getting away, you're an alchemist and have turned it into gold. Now ol' Jerry Jeff Walker had a great song he sang about "pissin' in the wind, and it's blowin' on all my friends making the same mistakes I swear I'll never make again" and maybe that is your theme song glomper guy but I think that is exactly why we have this forum to try to help ourselves and others from making this their song through the exchange of "hands on" experience and "know how" and successes and failures. Good ol' Jerry in later years added a line (never be satisfied always try to make it better) to end of this great song and he said "The way I see it now it's like trading buffalo chips for micro-chips." Fords and Buffalo Chips Forever

[David006]

Well I suppose Jim and I will have to just accept our second class status, grin and bear It. This book has a pretty ragged cover after all so your call is fair enough.

But I will ask you to note and forgive a few petty exceptions I take to your comments. Mine is not a life style farm, its a <deleted> Hard Work Farm. I live the life I choose, but it is hardly in style! I would like to mention that you show little trust in those around you. That's a shame.

Good luck with your corporate endeavours I hope you do well. I know I did, and I know those I worked for did even better. I also know I enjoyed it.

But for me those "CP" days are past Game, Set and Match Point, the hair has worn off the ball. It isnt about feeding the world, changing or controlling it, or owning more of it. As Jim said, food on the table and a few beers is enough reward. If that means selling, or eating my own kidneys then so be it I suppose. Needs are as needs must.

I will finish with a personal observation. Rural Thailand is riddled with petty jealousy, winners and losers, its frustrating and an absolute and utter waste of time. I tell my wife, If you dont want to lose then dont play. When I was taught to play cricket, I learnt its the good balls you must play, let the bad ones go through to the Keeper.

So continue to defend your stumps my friend!

Isaan Aussie

Christ mate you make be feel like a lazy bugger..goodonya ...like your philosophy

This thread seems to have slid into a bit of a discussion about lifestyle? The OP obviously is still in a western mindset that requires to chase wealth accumulation whereas many semi or full time expats in the rural environment here have moved on from that without sacrificing work ethic but doing their best to fulfill their needs and have a good life for them and theirs. I think that's what it is all about really....

A mate in Melbourne ( think he plays the stock market)asked me how profitable was the rubber business...my answer was it kept us in the comfortable lifestyle I/we have in Thailand.

No we will never be as "rich" as the locals seem to think ( "why you not have new Vigo"..lol)and it is a bit of struggle sometimes to find adequate funds for overseas "obligations" ...but sure beats charging around the world being nice to people so they will buy stuff...

Okay, the sun just popped over the hills and time to fill the water tanks then get out the brush cutter ...the grass is getting a bit high and the wife is worried about snakes...a couple of hours of that ..then a few beers and watch it grow back...lol Have a great day

[SGD]

Christ mate you make be feel like a lazy bugger..goodonya ...like your philosophy

This thread seems to have slid into a bit of a discussion about lifestyle? The OP obviously is still in a western mindset that requires to chase wealth accumulation whereas many semi or full time expats in the rural environment here have moved on from that without sacrificing work ethic but doing their best to fulfill their needs and have a good life for them and theirs. I think that's what it is all about really....

A mate in Melbourne ( think he plays the stock market)asked me how profitable was the rubber business...my answer was it kept us in the comfortable lifestyle I/we have in Thailand.

No we will never be as "rich" as the locals seem to think ( "why you not have new Vigo"..lol)and it is a bit of struggle sometimes to find adequate funds for overseas "obligations" ...but sure beats charging around the world being nice to people so they will buy stuff...

Okay, the sun just popped over the hills and time to fill the water tanks then get out the brush cutter ...the grass is getting a bit high and the wife is worried about snakes...a couple of hours of that ..then a few beers and watch it grow back...lol Have a great day

I wondered when this fact would raise its head. I thought it would start with the "why on earth do you need 3m to 4m a year ?" question or perhaps the "you don't need that much to live in the sticks" sort of theorising but I thought I had covered that, at least in part, when explaining that I'd rather get out of the rat race sooner than later and would desire such an income producing business. I was really trying to avoid stating that I don't make minimum wage and I certainly wasn't about to think of making that in Thailand.

I really don't have a western mindset on many levels but neither do I have a mindset where I just pitch up and make buttons and somehow pretend that that is fine and I'm happy with it and if I could make more money I'd refuse because I don't want to appear less Thai. I know my requirements are an unusual proposition but that is why I turned the argument on its head, trying to compute the land / crop requirements to generate X income. I don't want people having a dig at each other but that appears where some want to drag this thread.

Perhaps my ideas don't work in agriculture, that's fine.

[IsaanAussie]

SGD,

Be like the "best' of us, never give up, believe there is always time and scope for improvement. I think you ideas would work fine in any industry. I suppose it is just a matter of researching options until you find one that is worth committing to, and in a way that you can sustain. Methods other people use are good to refer to and even draw on, but we are all individuals and will never come up with exactly the same solution or outcome to a similar set of issues.

I try to avoid generalising as it becomes to easy to assume all men are in fact created equal. Not all bars, hotels and farms here will fail. I have finished my first set of extra income producing tasks for the day, had breakfast and a quicj wake up shower. So its time for me to go piss it all away again.

Have a great day guys!

The dawn has dawned, the sun has riz, wonder how them piggies is?

Isaan Aussie

[jamescollister]

May as well throw my 2 bits worth in. First this don't invest more than you can affort to lose is a plan to fail. If you plan to fail why bother, when the going gets tough you will just walk away. If you can't walk you have to adapt.

When the wife and I decided to go into rubber, it was all or nothing. The wife is not a village girl or farmer, but a school teacher and the choice was nice house in OZ go to work come home for most of the rest of our lives. The decision was made and everything went in the plantation, Was it worth it, time will tell, but last season we made money. No outside income, lived on what the trees producted. This year if the price stays up the trees will produce more and we have another 600 coming on line. So this year if all goes well we will make more expendable income than I would have made working in OZ. We have a nice house [ no mortgage ] a new Pajero [ on payments ] plenty of rice and beer in the ice. Unlike AI and some of the others on here I very seldom do any real work.I

If anyone decides to do anything in Thailand you have to go in boots and all, failure can not be an option. Otherwise why make the effort. Jim

[JurgenG]

It can be done I have almost done it. It is for sure a long term project and you will have to upfront 15,000,000 Baht but the long term gains are worth it.

I done it like this, in the UK I have contacts in the furniture business so I decided to ...

That sums it up, expertise and/or the right contacts (preferably "and").

I know personally people (foreigners) in Isaan who make the money the OP is looking for, they work in fields as diverse as growing papaya, managing resorts, selling hardware ...What they have in common is they know their trade and they know the right people, either suppliers or buyers.

The first question anyone thinking about starting his own business should ask himself is : what is my expertise ?

[IsaanAussie]

May as well throw my 2 bits worth in. First this don't invest more than you can affort to lose is a plan to fail. If you plan to fail why bother, when the going gets tough you will just walk away. If you can't walk you have to adapt.

When the wife and I decided to go into rubber, it was all or nothing. The wife is not a village girl or farmer, but a school teacher and the choice was nice house in OZ go to work come home for most of the rest of our lives. The decision was made and everything went in the plantation, Was it worth it, time will tell, but last season we made money. No outside income, lived on what the trees producted. This year if the price stays up the trees will produce more and we have another 600 coming on line. So this year if all goes well we will make more expendable income than I would have made working in OZ. We have a nice house [ no mortgage ] a new Pajero [ on payments ] plenty of rice and beer in the ice. Unlike AI and some of the others on here I very seldom do any real work.I

If anyone decides to do anything in Thailand you have to go in boots and all, failure can not be an option. Otherwise why make the effort. Jim

I completely agree Jim, its the old story of 6P's. Piss Poor Planning, Piss Poor Performance. I focus on winning and if I don't then I plan on winning next time. How much can I afford to lose on anything I really want, why everything, of course? For God's sake it's only money stacked against you living your life, get some real perspective guys. What are you planning to do as you age? Just get old?

The worst financial outcomes I have ever had have been when I listened to the "professional planners" who promised to maintain and grow "my" money with risk proof schemes that didnt amount to a hill of beans. They took their "unearnt" fees, I was left holding the empty bean sack. Well now this Jack will grow his own beanstalks from the few beans left in the bag, and frankly all you risk averse wordsmiths and naysayers can take a flying leap. When you land check out the background of the wealthest men in the world and how much they were prepared to risk for something they believed in and were prepared to make happen.

Let me ask a question given we all enter and exit this world with nought. Where and how exactly does one acquire expertise without already having it? Life is a continual learning experience and with absolutely no apologies, all that expertise pifal is "well read" rubbish! At best it doesnt belong on a forum focused on farming. Get onto some sort of blood sucking, no risk profession forum instead.

To get back to a more positive note, let me add this, the other day I referred to approaching "the corner", that point where you have to borrow money against invested assets to keep the wheels turning. Well it seems that you Jim, me Ol' China Plate have just turned it. Well done son! The road to dream fullfilment lays ahead with the sun shining. For me I can see the glow but not the Sun yet. Even if we both crash and burn, at least the questions will have been asked and answered.

Fear of Failure or Thrill of Success? I know which life I want.

Isaan Aussie

[JurgenG]

Let me ask a question given we all enter and exit this world with nought. Where and how exactly does one acquire expertise without already having it? Life is a continual learning experience and with absolutely no apologies, all that expertise pifal is "well read" rubbish! At best it doesnt belong on a forum focused on farming. Get onto some sort of blood sucking, no risk profession forum instead.

To get back to a more positive note, let me add this, the other day I referred to approaching "the corner", that point where you have to borrow money against invested assets to keep the wheels turning. Well it seems that you Jim, me Ol' China Plate have just turned it. Well done son! The road to dream fullfilment lays ahead with the sun shining. For me I can see the glow but not the Sun yet. Even if we both crash and burn, at least the questions will have been asked and answered.

Fear of Failure or Thrill of Success? I know which life I want.

Isaan Aussie

You really sound like my old Grand Pa, and, like him, it seems they may be snow on the roof but there is still fire in the chimney

More seriously, I come for an old family of farmer, the name of one my ancestor is engraved on the bell of our village, but times have changed. All of of my relatives that are still in farming, or related fields, have all post high school diplomas. Look at the profit (that's howI understand it anyway) the OP wants to generate, this is not small scale gardening ...

[David006]

Christ mate you make be feel like a lazy bugger..goodonya ...like your philosophy

This thread seems to have slid into a bit of a discussion about lifestyle? The OP obviously is still in a western mindset that requires to chase wealth accumulation whereas many semi or full time expats in the rural environment here have moved on from that without sacrificing work ethic but doing their best to fulfill their needs and have a good life for them and theirs. I think that's what it is all about really....

A mate in Melbourne ( think he plays the stock market)asked me how profitable was the rubber business...my answer was it kept us in the comfortable lifestyle I/we have in Thailand.

No we will never be as "rich" as the locals seem to think ( "why you not have new Vigo"..lol)and it is a bit of struggle sometimes to find adequate funds for overseas "obligations" ...but sure beats charging around the world being nice to people so they will buy stuff...

Okay, the sun just popped over the hills and time to fill the water tanks then get out the brush cutter ...the grass is getting a bit high and the wife is worried about snakes...a couple of hours of that ..then a few beers and watch it grow back...lol Have a great day

I wondered when this fact would raise its head. I thought it would start with the "why on earth do you need 3m to 4m a year ?" question or perhaps the "you don't need that much to live in the sticks" sort of theorising but I thought I had covered that, at least in part, when explaining that I'd rather get out of the rat race sooner than later and would desire such an income producing business. I was really trying to avoid stating that I don't make minimum wage and I certainly wasn't about to think of making that in Thailand.

I really don't have a western mindset on many levels but neither do I have a mindset where I just pitch up and make buttons and somehow pretend that that is fine and I'm happy with it and if I could make more money I'd refuse because I don't want to appear less Thai. I know my requirements are an unusual proposition but that is why I turned the argument on its head, trying to compute the land / crop requirements to generate X income. I don't want people having a dig at each other but that appears where some want to drag this thread.

Perhaps my ideas don't work in agriculture, that's fine.

Sorry mate please don't presume I was "digging"..Thailand is different... many people come here and set themselves up for different reasons..you may or may not be able to realise your ROI...it's just that some people (farangs in Thailand) have gone beyond the "rat race" if you will and perhaps find it hard to understand a a westerner who wishes to develop a business which will equal or better many western annual incomes....to many life is home, family and food on the table and maybe a few beers...ie contentment.............others ...well...?

[IsaanAussie]

Let me ask a question given we all enter and exit this world with nought. Where and how exactly does one acquire expertise without already having it? Life is a continual learning experience and with absolutely no apologies, all that expertise pifal is "well read" rubbish! At best it doesnt belong on a forum focused on farming. Get onto some sort of blood sucking, no risk profession forum instead.

To get back to a more positive note, let me add this, the other day I referred to approaching "the corner", that point where you have to borrow money against invested assets to keep the wheels turning. Well it seems that you Jim, me Ol' China Plate have just turned it. Well done son! The road to dream fullfilment lays ahead with the sun shining. For me I can see the glow but not the Sun yet. Even if we both crash and burn, at least the questions will have been asked and answered.

Fear of Failure or Thrill of Success? I know which life I want.

Isaan Aussie

You really sound like my old Grand Pa, and, like him, it seems they may be snow on the roof but there is still fire in the chimney

More seriously, I come for an old family of farmer, the name of one my ancestor is engraved on the bell of our village, but times have changed. All of of my relatives that are still in farming, or related fields, have all post high school diplomas. Look at the profit (that's howI understand it anyway) the OP wants to generate, this is not small scale gardening ...

Well my friend I am sure your are as rightfully proud of your family as I am of mine. But sorry, I'm not your grandpa and you arent making my bell ring.

Regardless of the size of any enterprise, somewhere the buck stops, and I'm afraid you fail to see that most people at the top of all size trees take the position they sit in very seriously. The guy at the top gets all the blame, abuse, and advice from the inexperienced wannabes. Plenty of them around to knock the big parrot off the perch. Whether its's 10% profit of 87 Billion Baht like the former PM controlled or 10% of the five eights of the square root of bugger all, like I have, the pressure, passion and drive are the same for all that have worked hard for their position. For the silver tails born to a life of wealth and position, well I wouldn't know. But in that position, I imagine my life would be considerable easier, not having to account for each baht so meticulously. Would it make me happier? Who knows?

So I would suggest that you add a few extra subjects to your impressive silver spoon educational listing. Perhaps humanity, or compassion, my opinion doesnt matter to you but you might find a more understanding approach will benefit you greatly with the locals here in the Land of Rural Smiles.

Isaan Aussie

[IsaanAussie]

SGD,

I have just been reviewing this, your thread, and find that I am guilty of diverting your intent. You have my apologies for appearing a time waster and a fool with an axe to grind. There are few things I dislike more. Sorry guys back to advising SGD. I'm out.

Isaan Aussie

[JurgenG]

^^ I don't really get your point regarding humanity, compassion and people at the top, ...

Anyway, what I'm saying is if you're a good cook, it makes more sense to open a restaurant than to grow rubber or cassava, even if some people make a lot of money with rubber or cassava.

Beside that farm work if not done in a industrial way, is not easy and doesn't bring much money. If you like it, good for you ! But if you're looking for a land business to generate 3-4 M per year (the tittle of this thread) maybe you should explore other options ....

^ Sorry IA, I understand now the misunderstanding. I just want to let you know I always appreciate your posts and it was never my intend to offend you in any way, I'm happy the matter is now cleared.

Edited March 14, 2011 by JurgenG

[slapout]

Is it me, or have TV members become a tad more argumentative/testy in the past few days? If correct, I am blaming the disaster in Japan and the potential fallout which may be affecting our sense of humor and reading something into some posts which were not the intention of the originator.

It seems what are normally accepted as tongue in cheek, dry humor, personal opinions/thoughts. etc are bring out some almost personal feeling of attack. This is NOT directed at the farming sector but the other forums where the attack mode seems to be the flavor of the week.

It is pleasant to see members clarify their intent on this forum, whereas some of the other forums seem like a pis.ing contest.

I know this is off topic, but I felt someone who frequents our farming discussions could offer some logical thoughts.

[Foreverford]

SGD,

I have just been reviewing this, your thread, and find that I am guilty of diverting your intent. You have my apologies for appearing a time waster and a fool with an axe to grind. There are few things I dislike more. Sorry guys back to advising SGD. I'm out.

Isaan Aussie

At the crease for two days and you play the wrong ball the wrong way and your out, you can't take that last edge back. Nobody boos a batsman like that! Hey good buddy hold your bat high in the air and walk off the pitch and look at all the fans (for and against) in the eye. You deserve their respect and they deserve the same from you. Ford and Proud Forever

Edited March 14, 2011 by Foreverford

[jamescollister]

Hi all

I will take a bit of a punt here just encase there is someone out there that is really interested in investing in a business with the potential not only to make a few million Baht a year, but maybe a few million dollars. We have a small rubber processing factory, it makes a small profit. My dilemma is this, I have been approached by company's in Italy, UK, OZ and China to supply rubber of various types and by the large Thai rubber house to supply them. At the end of last year I started getting offers to buy the place and these offers are getting so big I will not be able to say no much longer. Seems that in my ignorance of how it all works and being at the right place and time, that when the Limited Partnership was set up we gained the only Rubber licence to be issued for this district. Now when we started the company this was the end of known Thailand and not much rubber was being produced. How things have changed, now millions of dollars of rubber a week is flowing out. So in short if there is someone out there with the ability, capital and the go to do something like this PM me. I won't whole my breath, but it would be nice not to be swallowed up by the big players and look back in years to come and think what could have been. Jim

PS don't think I haven't looked a bank loans etc just not going to happen for thi kind of money.

[IsaanAussie]

Jim,

I have read your struggle town stories of the past and it warms my heart to see these opportunities present themselves to someone of vision and resolve. Champion, my hero!

I post again on this thread only because there are some true players whose support helps me enormously every day. Thanks guys, today has been great.

For the Jerking the Gerkin Trolls, well they they can go do something to their own leftboot! Get a life F'Wits!

[Foreverford]

Hi all

I will take a bit of a punt here just encase there is someone out there that is really interested in investing in a business with the potential not only to make a few million Baht a year, but maybe a few million dollars. We have a small rubber processing factory, it makes a small profit. My dilemma is this, I have been approached by company's in Italy, UK, OZ and China to supply rubber of various types and by the large Thai rubber house to supply them. At the end of last year I started getting offers to buy the place and these offers are getting so big I will not be able to say no much longer. Seems that in my ignorance of how it all works and being at the right place and time, that when the Limited Partnership was set up we gained the only Rubber licence to be issued for this district. Now when we started the company this was the end of known Thailand and not much rubber was being produced. How things have changed, now millions of dollars of rubber a week is flowing out. So in short if there is someone out there with the ability, capital and the go to do something like this PM me. I won't whole my breath, but it would be nice not to be swallowed up by the big players and look back in years to come and think what could have been. Jim

PS don't think I haven't looked a bank loans etc just not going to happen for thi kind of money.

Why james old boy it appears you found a huge niche to bounce into. Boing a boing a boing big guy. Now hot dog dats what I'm talkin' about. from getting coconut shells cut in half to having cameras mounted to assure your production. Some would sing "What a long strange trip it's been". Bouncing a Boing Boing on a Ford Forever

Edited March 15, 2011 by Foreverford

[SGD]

Hi all

I will take a bit of a punt here just encase there is someone out there that is really interested in investing in a business with the potential not only to make a few million Baht a year, but maybe a few million dollars. We have a small rubber processing factory, it makes a small profit. My dilemma is this, I have been approached by company's in Italy, UK, OZ and China to supply rubber of various types and by the large Thai rubber house to supply them. At the end of last year I started getting offers to buy the place and these offers are getting so big I will not be able to say no much longer. Seems that in my ignorance of how it all works and being at the right place and time, that when the Limited Partnership was set up we gained the only Rubber licence to be issued for this district. Now when we started the company this was the end of known Thailand and not much rubber was being produced. How things have changed, now millions of dollars of rubber a week is flowing out. So in short if there is someone out there with the ability, capital and the go to do something like this PM me. I won't whole my breath, but it would be nice not to be swallowed up by the big players and look back in years to come and think what could have been. Jim

PS don't think I haven't looked a bank loans etc just not going to happen for thi kind of money.

The critical test is whether you would be more upset to lose the offer on the table or see someone else make good on the potential which is there. Only the truly wealthy have "<deleted> OFF" money and the rest of us have their price. From your words, "these offers are getting so big I will not be able to say no much longer" I'd say you are already there.

[rice555]

Hello JC, could something like this change your mind about selling?

rice555

Suthep halts rubber exports

Published: 16/03/2011 at 01:47 PM

Online news:

Tweet

Deputy Prime Minister and chairman of the National Rubber Policy Committee Suthep Thaugsuban said he has ordered a temporary halt to rubber exports until the price improves.

Mr Suthep said on Wednesday the current decline in the rubber price was not in line with its trading nature.

The price of rubber is down from a record high of 187 baht a kilogram to 95 baht. The decline has been attributed to weak demand from China, a major rubber importer, and the massive quake and deadly tsunami in Japan.

Mr Suthep said he will call a meeting of agencies on Monday to discuss the matter.

“Rubber is one of the country’s major sources of foreign exchange and therefore the government must give it special attention,” he said.

Asked about rubber farmers' call for the government to provide a price guarantee of 100 baht per kilogram, Mr Suthep said when the government first stepped in to settle problem of low rubber prices the targeted price was set at 80 baht.

The current price is still higher than the set target, but a suitable market price was about 120 baht a kilogram, he added.

The deputy premier believed the rubber price would gradually improve. Rubber traders had now received additional loans from commercial banks and could start to buy rubber from farmers.

[jamescollister]

Hello JC, could something like this change your mind about selling?

rice555

Suthep halts rubber exports

Published: 16/03/2011 at 01:47 PM

Online news:

Tweet

Deputy Prime Minister and chairman of the National Rubber Policy Committee Suthep Thaugsuban said he has ordered a temporary halt to rubber exports until the price improves.

Mr Suthep said on Wednesday the current decline in the rubber price was not in line with its trading nature.

The price of rubber is down from a record high of 187 baht a kilogram to 95 baht. The decline has been attributed to weak demand from China, a major rubber importer, and the massive quake and deadly tsunami in Japan.

Mr Suthep said he will call a meeting of agencies on Monday to discuss the matter.

“Rubber is one of the country’s major sources of foreign exchange and therefore the government must give it special attention,” he said.

Asked about rubber farmers' call for the government to provide a price guarantee of 100 baht per kilogram, Mr Suthep said when the government first stepped in to settle problem of low rubber prices the targeted price was set at 80 baht.

The current price is still higher than the set target, but a suitable market price was about 120 baht a kilogram, he added.

The deputy premier believed the rubber price would gradually improve. Rubber traders had now received additional loans from commercial banks and could start to buy rubber from farmers.

Nothing really new there, just the usual political waffle and no I have not decided to sell [yet ] while I pay the company taxes the licence stays. If there us no change in Government policy re Licence issue, then the value to a big trader remains. There are other options to try, such as gear up slowly over the years [money permitting ] but everyone has his price and how much unknown buyers are will to pay. That may be my price. Jim

[Nawtier]

I've registered 'tasty trotters' for my pickled pigs feet biz......tis gunna be good.