Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) Before or after the father of the children that they murdered? You're a well read man UG so I assume you know what a specious argument is. Blaming the victim for being murdered might fit in there somewhere. Edited March 13, 2011 by Ulysses G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 I notice how some try to shift the the blame from some "terrorists" to all Arabs. Why don't you point out where someone has done this, so we do not think that you are just making it up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckd Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Anybody notice how the blame has now been shifted from the Palestinians to the parents? The discussion now centers on the actions of the parents rather than the actions of the terrorist murderers. Strange philosophy, indeed. I notice how some try to shift the the blame from some "terrorists" to all Arabs. All we know about there terrorists responsibility is some anonymous telephone call. Please carefully read my post which you quoted and then commented on. Perhaps you have an explanation for what you claim is my attempt to shift the blame from some "terrorists" to all Arabs. I await your explanation and enlightenment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siampolee Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 It's all down to that dubious real estate agent god That thing god invented as a mythical being by some passing goat herder told a couple of Jewish boys, '' this land is yours no matter what happens." Trouble is that the title deeds were written in blood, religious and racial bigotry. The taking of lives on all sides in the based on bigotry, the name of a religion and racial basis is all wrong. The urban myth religion is the inheritance that has resulted in the hate we see in the world today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) There is no justification for murdering children. Just as I can see no possible justification for parents to put their children at risk by moving them into legitimately disputed territories. Logic has no place in these Israeli/Palestinian discussions You will be labeled an antisemitic don't ya know ? Wrong! There is nothing antisemitic about Lannebirth's statement. Not all criticism of Israel is antisemitic. Some is, some isn't. The territories in question are disputed. That's a fact. The statement about the parents might be said about any parents doing a similar thing anywhere, so it is not specified to Jews, so ipso facto, not antisemitic. I also detect a tone of "blame the victims" in his text, but again that is a common thing sometimes done in all kinds of situations everywhere. We get it here in Thailand when foreigners are victims of crimes. Edited March 13, 2011 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lannarebirth Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 There is no justification for murdering children. Just as I can see no possible justification for parents to put their children at risk by moving them into legitimately disputed territories. Logic has no place in these Israeli/Palestinian discussions You will be labeled an antisemitic don't ya know ? Wrong! There is nothing antisemitic about Lannebirth's statement. Not all criticism of Israel is antisemitic. Some is, some isn't. The territories in question are disputed. That's a fact. The statement about the parents might be said about any parents doing a similar thing anywhere, so it is not specified to Jews, so ipso facto, not antisemitic. I also detect a tone of "blame the victims" in his text, but again that is a common thing sometimes done in all kinds of situations everywhere. We get it here in Thailand when foreigners are victims of crimes. Maybe I'm an internet weakling rather than an internet warrior, but I'll not "do battle" with people who are either so intellectually crippled or so partisan that they cannot allow for the possibility that the country, party, people they support could possibly be making grave errors. I don't buy it from the "America right or wrongers" or the "whatever Israel does must be righters". Interestingingly, ( at least to me) is that I am pro Israel, but I certainly recognize they've made several mistakes over these past decades. If I weren't pro Israel I would be almost certain that Israel's aim is to steal all disputed territories and claim them as their own. My "pro" stance refuses to let me believe that is true, but it is getting to be a harder case to make with each passing year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) One can be pro-Israel, in the sense of supporting the right of Israel to exist as a Jewish state with some borders, and at the very same time, be very much against some of the current policies and actions of the Israeli government. I don't see any difference from being pro American but anti-Bush, anti-Iraq war, etc. One thing is a country, the other is current politics and policies. Which can and probably will change. This isn't a trivial or inevitable thing to support, as the majority opinion on the Palestinian side is not for a two state solution, but rather for a victory some day against Jewish Israel, ending the state of Israel. Another example. I detest the leadership in Iran, but I am fine with Iran existing as a country, and even as a fundamentalist Islamic state if that's what the majority really wants (which I do doubt). Edited March 13, 2011 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) I think Israel is overreacting since nobody knows yet who the murderer(s) is/are and if it was political motivated or for some other unknown reason; not exactly a wise step in the direction of Peace NOT knowing WHO did it and IF it was a Palestinian/Arab/Israeli...an eye for an eye and a very uncontrolled decision... Israel approves 500 new homes in West Bank settlements in response to Itamar attack Ministerial committee on settlements with participation of Netanyahu and Barak approve further settlement building as response to the fatal stabbing in West Bank settlement in which family of five were slain. http://www.haaretz.c...attack-1.348864 LaoPo Edited March 13, 2011 by LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 A poster who bashes Israel at every opportunity is the one who asserted that lannabirth might be labeled "anti-Semitic" in order to suggest that there is no such thing. This is a common tactic among Israel-haters on the Internet. and none of the pro-Israel posters suggested it. I do not think that lannabirth is anti-Semitic in any way. I do think that he is very misguided about some of his views, but I feel that way about most of the far-left these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Israel's Interior Minister is going "nuts" even further and wants to build 5,000 new units; 1,000 for every murder. How insane. Israel already killed more than 10-fold Palestinian civilians versus the way around and how many more innocent people -including the family of 5- have to be killed/murdered/slaughtered before peace can be installed ? Yishai: Israel must build 1,000 new units in settlements for every person murdered http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/yishai-israel-must-build-1-000-new-units-in-settlements-for-every-person-murdered-1.348879 LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lannarebirth Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 A poster who bashes Israel at every opportunity is the one who asserted that lannabirth might be labeled "anti-Semitic" in order to suggest that there is no such thing. This is a common tactic among Israel-haters on the Internet. and none of the pro-Israel posters suggested it. I do not think that lannabirth is anti-Semitic in any way. I do think that he is very misguided about some of his views, but I feel that way about most of the far-left these days. Far left. I'm pretty conservative and most of the people that know me think I'm waaay conservative. Of course they're a bunch of lefties, so <deleted> do they know? If only a Republican was still a Republican, I'd most likely be a Republican. Sadly they're they lapdogs of various commercial and political interest, same as the Democrats (some of which are the same in the case of Israel and bankers). Probably time to start over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pampal Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Edited March 13, 2011 by pampal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) Far left. I'm pretty conservative and most of the people that know me think I'm waaay conservative. Yes, I've read all your posts. You and Jingthing are staunch Conservatives. Sorry that reading them got me all confused. How are Nancy Polosi and Michael Moore doing by the way (since that must be who you are hanging out with)? Edited March 13, 2011 by Ulysses G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Maybe the terrorists waited until they were asleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuffki Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Have you got a link or a photo of Israeli settlers walking around armed to the teeth? and what exactly are they armed with? or you just like to post rubbish? Do you have a link that in Israel civilians have the right to bear arms? or again you just like to post rubbish? And Finally which part of the whole family being asleep on the night of Sabbath did you not understand? or again you just like to post rubbish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pampal Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Maybe the terrorists waited until they were asleep. Then they should start posting guards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuffki Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Maybe the terrorists waited until they were asleep. Then they should start posting guards LOL, or may be killers should not be going inside people's home and stab them to death including all the kids. but of course its not their fault its Israel's fault for not having guards. Then if guards were to shot them, then again it would be Israel's fault for killing innocent people. Edited March 13, 2011 by kuffki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 The if guards were to shot them, then again it would be Israel's fault for killing innocent people. After all, it is really the murdered family's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) If this is getting into a who was there first in ancient times type of discussion to determine which group "deserves" the land, I really don't see the point at this stage in history. Now Arabs and Jews are mostly in the region and they need to work it out somehow. The USA isn't about to give back their land to the Indians, Mexicans, etc. Edited March 13, 2011 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pampal Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Maybe the terrorists waited until they were asleep. Then they should start posting guards LOL, or may be killers should not be going inside people's home and stab them to death including all the kids. but of course its not their fault its Israel's fault for not having guards. Then if guards were to shot them, then again it would be Israel's fault for killing innocent people. Who said Israel is to blame? Oh yeah, that's right, you did. Why are you blaming Israel? I never assigned blame to anyone in my posts. but you have. So tell me, Why are you blaming Israel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pampal Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 The if guards were to shot them, then again it would be Israel's fault for killing innocent people. After all, it is really the murdered family's fault. The mother and father are definitely to blame for not protecting their kids and also for putting them in harms way. Child Protective Services should have taken the children away from these parents. Supplying security is one of the parents priorities, oh well most parents anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naam Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 ساميّ is pronounced Sami Shami is written like this شامی i hang my head in sham[e] Pampal you are indeed right. but please bear in mind that i speak Hejazi dialect were we say "shami" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuffki Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Really??? thats funny considering that there is already evidence that Torah is at least 3313 years old it does not matter how old the Torah is. nowhere in the Torah is mentioned that Arabs did not exist when the scrolls were written. keep up the good job of ridiculing yourself with your arguments. as far as i know there is no forum rule which prohibits that. LOL, are you joking? or simply trolling? Torah is the core of Judaism and it does not matter how old it is???? I am sure there is a rule about trolling, so please stop doing just that-TROLLING! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 However knowing your logic and past dealings, i doubt it will sink in and you will come up with some more nonsense to post. and by the look of things you already have in your post 59. This does seem to fit the pattern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) Not sure where people are going with this. Anthropologically, there are no races. Arabs and Jews did it seems originate from the same general area of the world, so many have similar superficial external features, in the same way that neighboring African tribes might. Does that make Jews the same as Arabs as a cultural group, as a people. Nope. Also my understanding is that in the ancient origin times of the Jewish people, there were a number of other small distinct cultural tribal groups existing alongside the Jews. I recall reading (all or most?) that these other small ancient cultures don't exist today. Small as in numbers of people. Edited March 13, 2011 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 (edited) This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Maybe the terrorists waited until they were asleep. I agree with Pampal; very fishy story. The murders happened at 01.30AM and the Grandfather was warned about the murders at 03.00AM. How come "they/neighbors/security" found out about the murders right after the murders happened and how do you know (and the newspapers as well) that the murderers were terrorists? LaoPo Edited March 13, 2011 by LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuffki Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 This story is very fishy. Israeli settlers are armed to the teeth and most if not all have served in the IDF. How can anyone go into their homes and stab them to death? Maybe the terrorists waited until they were asleep. I agree with Pampal; very fishy story. The murders happened at 01.30AM and the Grandfather was warned about the murders at 03.00AM. How come "they/neighbors/security" found out about the murders right after the murders happened and how do you know (and the newspapers as well) that the murderers were terrorists? LaoPo Ever Considered to RE-READ the article and this time slowly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Like the part where Fatah claim credit for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 Yeah, they have a voluntary confession. What more do you want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuffki Posted March 13, 2011 Share Posted March 13, 2011 The if guards were to shot them, then again it would be Israel's fault for killing innocent people. After all, it is really the murdered family's fault. The mother and father are definitely to blame for not protecting their kids and also for putting them in harms way. Child Protective Services should have taken the children away from these parents. Supplying security is one of the parents priorities, oh well most parents anyway. Yeah, i hear the good parents strap bombs on their kids and send them in, to be suicide bombers, but the even better ones put their kids on the front lines in the gun fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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