Thailand To Review Nuclear Power Plan: Minister

[webfact]

N-CRISIS

Thailand to review nuclear power plan : minister

By Thai News Agency

The study on building nuclear power plants will be thoroughly reviewed amid the unfolding nuclear crisis in Japan which will be a study case for Thailand, Energy Minister Wannarat Channukul on Thursday said Thursday.

His statement came as Japan faced nuclear crisis at the Fukushma nuclear power plant after the country after being hit by huge earthquake and tsunami last week.

He said the study as well as the country's 20-year Power Development Plan (PDP 2010) will be carefully reviewed,

Initially, five 1,000-megawatt nuclear power plants are to be be built on 2020, but if the plan is disrupted, it must be replaced with another form of alternative energy. In this case 13 coal-fired power plants and one natural gas plant will be built, according to the minister.

Wannarat said that local residents in upcountry Thailand also oppose the planned coal-fired plants, a move which he described as leaving the country with no other choices.

"Cancellation of the nuclear power plant construction is not a problem as we have not yet reached the decision-making process whether to build it or not," said Dr Wannarat. "Thailand is like many other countries that [now] must consider Japan's radiation leaks as a case study."

Permanent Secretary for Energy Norkhun Sitthipong said on Thursday that Thailand is awaiting a letter from the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) certifying its preparation on feasibility study of Thailand's nuclear power plant construction in line with 19-item requirement by the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) .

Norkhun said the letter is expected to arrive at the ministry March 31 but this may be delayed due to the radiation crisis in Japan.

In earlier discussions with the IAEA, Norkhun said, the agency concluded that Thailand was not yet ready for nuclear plants, citing concerns over legal issues, public understanding and acceptance, as well as the competency and level of development of human resources in this field.

The permanent secretary said that Thailand's national power plan 2010 will be reviewed soon to study other alternative energy such as purchasing electric power from Small Power Producers (SPP) and using more natural gas.

-- The Nation 2011-03-17

[Chang_paarp]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

[gotlost]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

Not yet..Only when they announce that Thailand has scraped the idea.

[Dellboy218]

I wonder if there is any reason why they do not consider building solar power stations that Spain appears to have done so successfully. It will take up more space and will take a number to replace a Nuke but it is certainly a lot safer. There are new plastic much cheaper versions of the traditional expensive solar cells coming onto the market. There has also been a solar power paint developed. Just clip a wire each end of your house! Maybe it is time for the Thai government to take the suns energy seriously! Making it economically effective would also help.

[Tywais]

I wonder if there is any reason why they do not consider building solar power stations that Spain appears to have done so successfully.

The Waldpolenz Solar Park generates 40MW and occupies a little over 1 square kilometer (1km x 1km). So for 1GW (nuclear power output) we are talking 25 times that area. Lot of space indeed. Of course there is the issue of rainy seasons where it may not see sun for months. This would limit it to islands in the south I would think.

[scotinsiam]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

No, Thai Engineers are far superior to ones from other Nations so there should be no issues. They will evaluate the risks consider the options and build a safe cutting edge facility .....

[Soutpeel]

I personally think they are using the problems in Japan as a face saving exercise tactic, pending the "decision" from the IAEA, who have already stated they dont believe Thailand is ready for commerical nuclear.

Therefore await the next statement which will say in light of the problems in Japan, Thailand has decided not to persue a commerical nuclear program, but in reality the IAEA has not supported the program...

No IAEA support for the program....No commerical nuclears for Thailand...so I wouldnt be worried about what the "thai engineers" will get up to

[Dellboy218]

The Waldpolenz Solar Park generates 40MW and occupies a little over 1 square kilometer (1km x 1km). So for 1GW (nuclear power output) we are talking 25 times that area. Lot of space indeed. Of course there is the issue of rainy seasons where it may not see sun for months. This would limit it to islands in the south I would think.

It certainly wouldnt do too much in the north at the moment its true. The Spanish power stations use heliostats as the American stations do, not solar cells and able to provide power at night.. Either system would take a lot of room but technology is improving all the time and hopefully it will reach a point where the Thai government might take a look. With the differentt technologies emerging energy use should become more efficient as long as it is priced effectively. No harm in wishing but hopefully it will not be necessary to build 5 x 1GW stations.

Edited March 17, 2011 by Tywais
Fixed quote

[TimeBandit2]

If the Thais were to build nuclear power plants some clowns involved would see it as yet another opportunity for graft.

This time however, they'd be playing with fire.

It's such a bad idea...I don't think it is defensible in any way at all.

[RickBradford]

I wonder if there is any reason why they do not consider building solar power stations that Spain appears to have done so successfully.

Spain has used solar power extremely unsuccessfully, as recent reports have showed:

Only two years ago, Spanish solar energy companies feasting on generous government subsidies expanded at a feverish pace, investing €18 billion (then worth roughly $28 billion) to blanket rooftops and fields with photovoltaic panels. They briefly turned the country into the top solar market in the world.

Then came a monumental case of sunburn. The market crashed under a wave of subsidy cuts, fears of possible forced tariff paybacks and allegations of fraud involving energy produced at night being sold as solar power to collect super-premium prices. [People were shining arc-lights onto solar panels to simulate sunlight, making a good profit - Ed]

Spain’s subsidies for solar were four to six times higher than those for wind. Prices charged for solar power were 12 times higher than those for fossil fuel electricity.

Australia hasn't done any better:

MORE than $1 billion of taxpayers' money was wasted on subsidies for household solar roof panels that favoured the rich and did little to reduce Australia's greenhouse gas emissions, a scathing review has found.

The review of the now scrapped federal government solar rebate scheme, conducted by ANU researchers Andrew Macintosh and Deb Wilkinson, also found the rebates did little to generate a solar manufacturing industry in Australia, instead sending hundreds of millions of taxpayers' dollars offshore.

Mr Macintosh, deputy head of ANU's Centre for Climate Law and Policy, told The Age yesterday the rebate had been ''beautiful politics, terrible policy''.

[tomyummer]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

No, Thai Engineers are far superior to ones from other Nations so there should be no issues. They will evaluate the risks consider the options and build a safe cutting edge facility .....

...and Thai Engineers, being of a brave sort, would also stick around after natural disasters to make sure the job is done to safely shut down a nuclear power plant for the sake of the public and fellow country Thai citizens (just like the Japanese). And the Thais would wait patiently in line for their turn in the bread and water line (just as seen during the recent palm oil delivery at Tesco Lotus), help out others get out of harm's way before saving themselves and....

[aussiebebe]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

No, Thai Engineers are far superior to ones from other Nations so there should be no issues. They will evaluate the risks consider the options and build a safe cutting edge facility .....

...and Thai Engineers, being of a brave sort, would also stick around after natural disasters to make sure the job is done to safely shut down a nuclear power plant for the sake of the public and fellow country Thai citizens (just like the Japanese). And the Thais would wait patiently in line for their turn in the bread and water line (just as seen during the recent palm oil delivery at Tesco Lotus), help out others get out of harm's way before saving themselves and....

...remember the mythical Thai Canal Project could be dedged up again to provide the next limitless 'opportunity' for their tax revenues.

[sirchai]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

Not yet..Only when they announce that Thailand has scraped the idea.

Initially, five 1,000-megawatt nuclear power plants are to be be built on 2020, but if the plan is disrupted, it must be replaced with another form of alternative energy.

Finally, when my son doesn't go to school, I don't have to buy Somtham for him. Very similar.

:jap: What about the sun? Isn't there enough energy?

Edited March 17, 2011 by sirchai

[sirchai]

I wonder if there is any reason why they do not consider building solar power stations that Spain appears to have done so successfully.

The Waldpolenz Solar Park generates 40MW and occupies a little over 1 square kilometer (1km x 1km). So for 1GW (nuclear power output) we are talking 25 times that area. Lot of space indeed. Of course there is the issue of rainy seasons where it may not see sun for months. This would limit it to islands in the south I would think.

Isn't there enough space?:jap:

[SantiSuk]

I wonder if there is any reason why they do not consider building solar power stations that Spain appears to have done so successfully.

The Waldpolenz Solar Park generates 40MW and occupies a little over 1 square kilometer (1km x 1km). So for 1GW (nuclear power output) we are talking 25 times that area. Lot of space indeed. Of course there is the issue of rainy seasons where it may not see sun for months. This would limit it to islands in the south I would think.

"Of course there is the issue of rainy seasons where it may not see sun for months."

Do you live in Thailand or are you just imagining it from afar?

If that is the type of rainy season you get in your neck of the Thai woods you need to move to Issaan. More days have a few hours sunshine than not during the rainy season by my reckoning.

[MaiChai]

I personally think they are using the problems in Japan as a face saving exercise tactic, pending the "decision" from the IAEA, who have already stated they dont believe Thailand is ready for commerical nuclear.

Therefore await the next statement which will say in light of the problems in Japan, Thailand has decided not to persue a commerical nuclear program, but in reality the IAEA has not supported the program...

No IAEA support for the program....No commerical nuclears for Thailand...so I wouldnt be worried about what the "thai engineers" will get up to

Although Thailand feels pretty modern and developed, its still a developing country and will remain so for quite some years to come. One of the reasons for this is the majority of the population is quite poorly educated and the education system is not on a par with more developed Asian countries such as Korea or Japan. Government are quite corrupt and there are some concerns over ethics and honesty in society, as well as safety in the workplace and keeping the environment clean from industrial waste and toxins. All these would lead to concerns over safety on running something as important as a nuclear power plant. Thus I dont expect Thailand t be allowed to operate nucleur plants!

I am quite in favour of nuclear power. This article makes the point that what is happening in Japan is not as bad as what the media would have us believe: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1367289/Japan-truly-disaster-biblical-scale-right-worry-nuclear-angle.html

Edited March 17, 2011 by MaiChai

[vont]

I wonder if there is any reason why they do not consider building solar power stations that Spain appears to have done so successfully. It will take up more space and will take a number to replace a Nuke but it is certainly a lot safer. There are new plastic much cheaper versions of the traditional expensive solar cells coming onto the market. There has also been a solar power paint developed. Just clip a wire each end of your house! Maybe it is time for the Thai government to take the suns energy seriously! Making it economically effective would also help.

There are only very small margins of commission available.

Is there any company out there offering a 30% com....?

[vont]

I personally think they are using the problems in Japan as a face saving exercise tactic, pending the "decision" from the IAEA, who have already stated they dont believe Thailand is ready for commerical nuclear.

Therefore await the next statement which will say in light of the problems in Japan, Thailand has decided not to persue a commerical nuclear program, but in reality the IAEA has not supported the program...

No IAEA support for the program....No commerical nuclears for Thailand...so I wouldnt be worried about what the "thai engineers" will get up to

Although Thailand feels pretty modern and developed, its still a developing country and will remain so for quite some years to come. One of the reasons for this is the majority of the population is quite poorly educated and the education system is not on a par with more developed Asian countries such as Korea or Japan. Government are quite corrupt and there are some concerns over ethics and honesty in society, as well as safety in the workplace and keeping the environment clean from industrial waste and toxins. All these would lead to concerns over safety on running something as important as a nuclear power plant. Thus I dont expect Thailand t be allowed to operate nucleur plants!

I am quite in favour of nuclear power. This article makes the point that what is happening in Japan is not as bad as what the media would have us believe: http://www.dailymail...lear-angle.html

The situation is getting potentially from worse to worst.

You are in the minority I am afraid.

[vont]

I personally think they are using the problems in Japan as a face saving exercise tactic, pending the "decision" from the IAEA, who have already stated they dont believe Thailand is ready for commerical nuclear.

Therefore await the next statement which will say in light of the problems in Japan, Thailand has decided not to persue a commerical nuclear program, but in reality the IAEA has not supported the program...

No IAEA support for the program....No commerical nuclears for Thailand...so I wouldnt be worried about what the "thai engineers" will get up to

Although Thailand feels pretty modern and developed, its still a developing country and will remain so for quite some years to come. One of the reasons for this is the majority of the population is quite poorly educated and the education system is not on a par with more developed Asian countries such as Korea or Japan. Government are quite corrupt and there are some concerns over ethics and honesty in society, as well as safety in the workplace and keeping the environment clean from industrial waste and toxins. All these would lead to concerns over safety on running something as important as a nuclear power plant. Thus I dont expect Thailand t be allowed to operate nucleur plants!

I am quite in favour of nuclear power. This article makes the point that what is happening in Japan is not as bad as what the media would have us believe: http://www.dailymail...lear-angle.html

Hee is also another reference that perhaps provides some depth to the current problem of fallouts and radiation et al.

http://www.thetradingreport.com/2011/03/16/27-signs-that-the-nuclear-crisis-in-japan-is-much-worse-than-either-the-mainstream-media-or-the-japanese-government-have-been-telling-us/

[Dellboy218]

Do you live in Thailand or are you just imagining it from afar?

If that is the type of rainy season you get in your neck of the Thai woods you need to move to Issaan. More days have a few hours sunshine than not during the rainy season by my reckoning.

I have lived here for over 20 years and been in the electrical industry for 40. I try not to dismiss things out of hand and I still wonder whether they have considered alternatives. It may requrie Nukes in the future to provide the mainstay but hopefully not so many.

[Tywais]

"Of course there is the issue of rainy seasons where it may not see sun for months."

Do you live in Thailand or are you just imagining it from afar?

Not sure which of us you are referring to. I've been working here for 20 years and visiting for 40. However, my perspective may be skewed living in Chiang Mai where 1-2 months of smog prevents us from seeing the sun.

[Payboy]

Do I hear a collective sigh of relief? :jap:

No, Thai Engineers are far superior to ones from other Nations so there should be no issues. They will evaluate the risks consider the options and build a safe cutting edge facility .....

And considering that the Thai's invented solar energy in the first place (there must be a patent somewhere), who else would be better qualified to do this?

[MaiChai]

Just watchinh Japanese TV. They have brought many fire trucks to the city just south of the plants. They will use these to cool the plants until power is restored to use electrical pumps. Helicopter cooling will not be used on Friday. They are currently using 7 fire trucks in rotation for cooling. Small amounts of stream/white smoke indicates the dowsing from the fire trucks is working. 1pm Friday.

These reactors are 40 years old and are old design. Newer design reactors use convention cooling. This means they dont need any machinery to cool the rods. These old reactors dont have convection cooling.

[frenchfarangjomtien]

Please no nuclear plant in Thailand ! At least until we are sure that spitting on the fire to stop it as are doing the Japanese can help in case of disaster...

[Honolulu]

Possibly,Thailand could arrange for another entity to build, operate, and maintain a nuclear plant here. Just take the Thai people out of the equation. I'm sure Toshiba, GE, and other nuclear plant builders/operators would be able to arrange such a deal. After they rewrite the nuclear power plant playbook, of course( in light of this current plant failure in Japan). Nuclear power is part of the worlds energy future, and that includes Thailand. No reasonable way around it.

There's more than one way to skin a cat. Just sometimes, you should not try to do it yourself!

[Soutpeel]

Possibly,Thailand could arrange for another entity to build, operate, and maintain a nuclear plant here. Just take the Thai people out of the equation. I'm sure Toshiba, GE, and other nuclear plant builders/operators would be able to arrange such a deal. After they rewrite the nuclear power plant playbook, of course( in light of this current plant failure in Japan). Nuclear power is part of the worlds energy future, and that includes Thailand. No reasonable way around it.

There's more than one way to skin a cat. Just sometimes, you should not try to do it yourself!

I think you misunderstand how commerical nuclear works, What you are taking about above does in fact happen in commerical programs

1. IAEA has to give their blessing to a commerical nuclear program otherwise other signatory countries will not provide technical assistance

2. Thailand would then go out on bid for a company to design/build and initally operate the plant.

3. Before being allowed to operate a plant on their own, they need personnel with "licenses" to operate, this is an international exam, no pass no operate, typically guys need anywhere from 3 years to 6 years to obtain their licenses.

4. Scheduled maintenance is carried out by the primary contractor for typically at least 5 years.

5. Thailand has to operate the plants within the guidelines of IAEA regulations...if not licenses can get pulled and international instruction given to shut down the units, other measures include not providing technical support right up to refusal to supply fuel rods.

A lot of people believe is a case of a company walking in building a plant and walking away and leaving Thailand to it....its not the the case, there is a lot of international oversight and governace.

Based on the comments by the IAEA in the original article, I dont beleive the IAEA will give their blessing to proceed, therefore will be no international support for the progam and will not happen

[bkk_mike]

There would be a very quick, and very cheap way (for EGAT) to increase the amount of solar power generated here.

Simply allow homeowners to sell their power back to the grid (i.e. their meter runs in reverse if generating more than they use).

This is how home solar works in most other countries as it means that the householder doesn't need to store the generated electricity in expensive and inefficient batteries for use at night, or when drawing more power than they're generating. They simply sell units to the grid during the day, and buy them back at night.

This simple step would greatly improve the economics of small-scale rooftop solar power.

I'm not saying that it's actually a cheap option, as photovoltaics are still not cheap enough. But there are people who currently look at using solar, but rule it out because, unless you're completely off-grid, the expense usually isn't worth it.

[jpolten]

Google "thorium"

Safer,less waste,more abundent than uranium,cannot be weaponised......

I think the only country looking at this is china