Farmers Sob Stories

[IsaanAussie]

Yesterday the bil lost the key to our second bike, his brother had come from bkk to pick him up and they were waiting to leave.

I made them search for 2hrs but to no avail. My suggestion that they stay the night and search again in the morning shocked everyone.

Eventually they left, but will be back in few days and he'll have to load the bike in his brothers truck to get a new key. This is the least they can do, but they will see it as a great injustice.

It's not as if they single farang out for special treatment, it's just that we take care to be organized with tools etc. in good working order. So we are vulnerable.

I really hate this side of Thailand. Its bad enough they use the wrong tools for the job but they never put anything back and cant remember where they left stuff. The only form of organisation they know is to half fill a small bucket with a handful of everything your have arranged in containers, nails, screws etc.. just in case they might need them. The stuff ends up a pile of rubbish when they need need the bucket to water the cows so the contents are all emptied into a plastic bag. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

[capmata]

Hi I am exporter of Oil palm harvest knive , chisel , sharpening stone ,

Rubber Tapping knive , sharpening stone , latex cup , latex soputs . etc

from malaysia

www.capmata.com

[RedBullHorn]

Hey capmata...what a "great" business you have there but you're in the wrong section of the forum pal

Edited April 14, 2011 by RedBullHorn

[transam]

Hi I am exporter of Oil palm harvest knive , chisel , sharpening stone ,

Rubber Tapping knive , sharpening stone , latex cup , latex soputs . etc

from malaysia

www.capmata.com

Good for you.

Contact admin, oooooops sorry, perhaps you are a sponsor .

[Tod Daniels]

This may not fit into the 'Farmer Sob Stories" thread but...

"IsaanAussie" made a good point about hand tools & misc. screws, nails, nutz-n-boltz, etc.

When I was in America I had a normal toolbox like almost everyone in the US has for basic around the house repairs. When I moved here I shipped in close to quarter container of my own stuff so I threw the toolbox in and brought it over too. (While not the point of the story, it's been the MOST valuable thing I brought over here!)

It contained your normal run-o'-the-mill hand tools. Really just the basic things like; a set of various sized screwdrivers, set of various types of pliers, coupla different sized crescent wrenches, sets of vice-grips, box & open end wrench set, basic socket set w/extensions, concrete and regular bit sets for a power drill, as well as several boxes of miscellaneous fasteners, packs of zip-ties, wire nuts, screws, nails, etc.

Anyway, the guy who does maintenance on the apartment complex I live in hasta be 70+ years old and worked for a hotel doing general maintenance almost his entire adult life before he became our maintenance man. He carries his "tools" in an ancient leather shaving kit dealy, but it is a sad collection of stuff. Still he gets the job done, and done well.

He was working on my apartment one day doing something or other. I was out when he started, but when I got back I saw he was struggling to accomplish the job with the tools he had. Now this is one meticulous maintenance man and he'd rather take an hour getting the job done right than rig it so it works for a while.

I went and got my toolbox outta the closet and said to him in Thai, "I think using these hand tools would be better, really its okay, use them." When he opened that tool box I can only liken his expression to someone who saw the Holy Grail! I mean he just stared at it. Then he took it with him, used what he needed, replaced EVERYTHING back like it was, and thanked me. As he was leaving I told him anytime he works here in my building or on any of the property owned by my landlord he should feel free to come get my tools and use them like they're his own tools.

He's borrowed them on numerous occasions, He even calls me ahead of time to make sure Im home or ask me to put the toolbox in a secret location outside so he can pick it up. Not even a single time has he lost or broken a tool ever. Hes brought em back intact and in perfect condition every single time over the last 5 years. As all the fasteners, etc, are in that tool box, too; one time he used all I had of some plastic wire nut. He actually went and bought another box of them for me (us) so the toolbox was 'correctly stocked'. He borrowed the tool box last week, and when he brought it back I saw that hed taken everything out of the toolbox, washed it out and put it all back. I think he even wiped down the outside with silicon as the plastic is way more shiny than I remember.

I am FAR from an emotional person, but just typing this story and thinking back on his expression as he looked at those tools the first time and the care and responsibility he's shown when borrowing them, almost chokes me up, really.

He is truly an outstanding example of what Thais ARE capable of IF they so choose.

Anyway, thought you guys could use a good heartwarming story to switch things up..

Sorry for the long post. ..

Edited April 14, 2011 by tod-daniels

[IsaanAussie]

Tod,

You're right, there are some very skilled trades and craftsmen here in Thailand. Unfortunately most farmers, globally, don't have or should I say make, the time to be as careful with the gear.

There are a few that I will lend tools to, but I'm always fearful that the onlookers will help out and break something. Some of my most precious tools belonged to my father, priceless sentimental value and some difficult to replace. I found my BIL using the handle of a spoke shave as a tyre lever a few weeks ago. I suggested another alternate use for it to him which he didnt fancy at all.

Regardless of tool ownership it is always a pleasure to watch good hand skills in action.

Isaan Aussie

[rideswings]

I have a small contribution to this thread, although Im a relative newcomer. Last week, I made a post here thinking about buying my FIL a Kubota 3600 tractor. I decided it was too much money, thanks to the advice of some of you fellows, so I bought him a new Kubota iron buffalo and 90hp engine which ran me around 70,000 baht. It got delivered, he started it up and off to the farm he went. Yesterday we went to visit them and I see the new machine sitting covered up on the other side of the house with the trailer placed back on his old machine. I didnt say a word, but I knew if he wasnt using it, something had gone wrong. So I went over to look at it and my wife intercepted me and told me there was a problem. Her dad could not get the hang of the clutch being on the left side, and the day before he fumbled the clutch and almost put a hole in the side of the house with the tractor before he could get it to stop. The front of the new tractor was smashed, but he was ok. I had told them at the dealer that the placement of the clutch on the left side was not a good place and that it would be difficult to use but they didnt listen to me, and now he has a broken buffalo, But thats not the end of the story...

As we were leaving my wife told me that her dad kept dreaming a the 3600 he saw at the dealer and that he really wanted one, which meant they wanted me to buy him one. She told me how much easier it would be for him to use, and I thought to myself, "Sure it would be easier for him to use, but since he just destroyed a 2 day old buffalo, he aint getting a new 500,000 baht tractor because he will either push his whole house over, or fall off of it and kill himself. So i decided it will be better for him to keep dreaming of the 3600 and stay alive than to get one and kill himself. I told her that I will be willing to pay for the first 2 plowings this year which will alleviate the need for a new tractor.

And to those kind farangs who are considering buying their inlaws a new tractor, think again. Unless they are very handy and coordinated, they will surely destroy it and then it will be worth nothing or they will hurt themselves.

[Atmos]

re a tractor purchase - I'm at a loss to see how buying one for your own farm could ever be profitable?

My partner's b-in-law manages the family property, 180rai all up plus more they lease, he has a big blue tractor (sorry to get so technical) Fordson with five different sets of attachments for ploughing; he owns it debt-free, it's his 'baby' and no one else is ever permitted to use it; as he works three full days a week for the Orbortor that leaves (clever!) four days for the farm, and he contracts out with him as driver to surrounding properties; he makes money on it this way, but if it was just for their own property - would be a permanent drain on farm income.

[Smithson]

^ I think someone else paying for your own tractor would be very profitable.

[Lickey]

There is another angle that hasnt been covered yet, weve had the family stories, drunks,money grabbers, machinery wreckers ect, i suppose fortunatley i havent had that, just been mis-informed or lost in translation, call it what you will,

When the banana plantation was producing really good, we would be selling a pick-up load every 10 days or so, 5bht a hand, one day the buyer said, will give you 3 bht a hand or i go another place, mrs told me, i said, let her go, some hands had 17 bananas on, 3bht??? bugger off!! so then we were selling outside salon, 25bht down to 10bht a hand, 35 hands gone in under 2 days, now the original buyer did buy some for 3bht a hand, but had to do a round trip of 180ks to do it,, and pick the bananas as well, gone for 12 or so hours, but they made money on the selling,, really??????

Another case was with the tamarind trees, Mrs got a gang in, picked 2 times in a month gave her 10,000bht, the next year, we did it ourselves, with a bit of schoolboy labour, sold outside the salon and made clear, 31,000bht,

Yes, i understand that the tamarind picker boss has to pay his gang of 20 or so, buy them food and drink for the day, but in the first case with the bananas, 180ks to save 2 bht a hand???? now there is Thai logic for you, it dont matter what they spend as long as some comes back, unbeliveable!!

[RedBullHorn]

Yup ! T.I.T ~ One villager told me he has be seaching for Dog brand 84" drive belt for his Walk-Behide-Tractor, he was searching and comparing the prices of other shops along the way and he bought it from my shop, the price tag was

฿105. From the name of his village that he had told me, he'd rode 18km to my shop just because the nearest shop in his village was selling at ฿109....and very happily rode another 18km back the way he came from.

We got a winner here...

Edited April 17, 2011 by RedBullHorn

[thunder30101]

Lets see for 4 baht he prob didnt have to work that day visited many friends-family he doesnt get to see that often, got at least two free meals from them and also some free lao kao to boot, sounds like he had a good day lol.

[jamescollister]

This kind of stuff goes on not only where a Farang is involved. Wifes Aunt has to stay in BKK for medical reasons, Son moves up to take care of her rubber. Son never lifts a finger, hires a guy to do the work then takes off with all the money and never even paid the worker.

End of last year I nearly lost it, we have 12 Rai [ charnot] that the MIL gave us as a wedding present. It now is covered in rubber, up rocks the MILs brother allegedly claiming the lands was ment for him or so the wife told me. and he wants some money. Well I was not in one of my better moods that day and told the wife to tell him to come round and I would give him a few hundred Bahts worth of 9 mil slugs in his head.

Now after a week or so and the fear of a mad farang going on a killing spree had deminised the real story comes out. Seems that the Uncle never made a claim on the land, he had had a barny with another sister who he worked for on her rubber. She had told him to sling his hook and get out. Now poor old Uncle with 4 young kids and motor bike TV etc payments found himself on the street so to speak. Like any good Thai he turns to family and comes to see my MIL. She then asks FIL to help. FIL offers him 500 Baht bus fare to BKK so he can get a job. FIL does not get on with MILs family. Next step MIL speaks to my wife to see if we can help. Now my wife controls all the money and does as she sees fit, but knowing that I may take her giving money to Uncle less than favourably she comes up with a story to justify giving him money. Often what you are told is not what is really going on.

End of story, Uncle makes up with his sister and is back tapping her rubber. Uncle has not shown his face here in fear that the crazy farang shoots him. Jim

Here is an update on my original post, how things can happen in an instant and everything can go to shit. Well seems that Mils Uncle really believes the land is his .along with the 1200 rubber trees on it. Another sister from Bkk rocks up and starts agitating and stirring everything up.

As I said the land is in the MILs name and I never bothered to get it changed as she is a lovely woman [if a bit dim] and lives with us.

Now last week MIL is away, which is not usual. She comes back that evening and I note some tension in the air. Next morning I find out that MILs brother has taken her to Ubon and got her to sign the land over to him. Now I flip out and am in a mood for murder. Tell the wife that we are selling up and her family can go to hell. Everyone is looking at me as if I have lost my mind and I say you just gave away 2 or 3 Mil Baht. No No No he have land , but our trees 20 30 year he have land back. I'm thinking you people are retards, but the realisation hits me. This place is so far out that village law is still in use. By that I mean that the police etc have only recently been seen and everything has previously been decided by the village, from beatings to being sent away or if neseccary a walk into the jungle never to be see again. Then I said he hasn't gone to the village headman, but to the National Governent land office and he owns the land and trees, he can sell them, tap them what every he wants. Evil Aunt from BKK knew this and tricked her sister in to signing. Then it dawns on them whats happened and I'm beyond any self control and have to get away so jump in the car and head for the peace of the Cambodia disputed border.

Come home 2 days later, just as the Thais and Cambodians start shooting again. Somewhat less set on spending my remaining days in a Thai prison. Find Fil living on plantation and loaded for bear, BILs out looking for said Uncle to speak up close and personal and evil Aunt told that her presents is no longer welcome in the village. MIL is talking about becoming a Nun.

Now don't think this is a Farang rip off,although I fronted the money to plant etc it was the Muns land and we FIL and MIL had made a sort of deal that when we[wife kids and I]were financial secure the landless son could have 1000 trees for himself.

Not one to give up so easy today {Monday] off to Ubon land office to see what if anything can be done. Well it seems this is not an isolated case . There is a grace period where people can come and counter claim land, which we have done, but in the usual Thai way a lot of local Officals have to try and sort it out before the National boys will hear the case. Knowing the distrust of the locals for the BKK Government and the Thai mentality about being seen to lose, money will have to change hands. As I write this wife FIL and MIL has gone to see Uncle to try and get a deal, only problem is FIL is carrying and he is mad as hell.

Just goes to show when you think you have a handle on how it all works Thailand can throw in a new twist. Jim

[Lickey]

Well Jim, i would think you have posted the biggest Sob Story so far, and yes, it seems MIL is a bit do lalley, if this was a wedding gift to you mrs & kids, the land, and of course put it to best use to support you and family, and now they are saying, the trees are still yours but its their land?which of course wasnt the initial agreement,

There is a good lesson to Newbies, if you are gifted land, get it signed up in your partners name, Seems like Jim has been a victim of circumstances and loved his MIL enough to trust her, but she was turned round by family,

The more i see of posts on hear, my original OP seems pale in comparision, I didnt loose a lot of money, and BIL says i can do what i want on his 4 rai for 6 years, but im thinking, Ive got enough to do at home really, my bike XJR 1200 Yamaha needs some work, so does the back garden, and many various jobs round the house, i even have enough room on the open-air roofed top floor to start a small hydroponics opo, for personal use, and grow flowers ect for front door sales outside Salon, so if my "keep myself to myself" mentallity gets the better of me, Sod the Farm !!

[tothemark]

Not one to give up so easy today {Monday] off to Ubon land office to see what if anything can be done. Well it seems this is not an isolated case . There is a grace period where people can come and counter claim land, which we have done, but in the usual Thai way a lot of local Officals have to try and sort it out before the National boys will hear the case. Knowing the distrust of the locals for the BKK Government and the Thai mentality about being seen to lose, money will have to change hands. As I write this wife FIL and MIL has gone to see Uncle to try and get a deal, only problem is FIL is carrying and he is mad as hell.

Just goes to show when you think you have a handle on how it all works Thailand can throw in a new twist. Jim

[/quot

Jim,

My advice would be is to get yourself a good land lawyer, not one of these fancy "can do everything" types tho.

I used a friend of my wifes who is a land lawyer in Udon, bit far i know, but good advice from someone who knows land title registration is paramount, PM me if you need a contact number.

[IsaanAussie]

Jim and fellow sobbers,

Yesterday I met with a local land official who is western educated and has very good english skills. He put a different perspective on the issue of trust between locals and regional/BKK governments. The usual reason to avoid talking to the "big people" is simply to avoid having to pay fees and charges levied against medium and larger enterprises. The locals simply do not know the rules as they do not dare ask for fear of being charged, the local knowledge base becomes heresay and guesswork.

Some time ago we were targeted by the jealousy brigade and were visited by the VAT police. I simply made the annual fee and they went away happy. The locals all smiling because the farang had been lumped with a bill in the thousands. But it was me with the biggest smile, the yearly fee is 49 baht. No back handers involved. The fine is 1,000 baht. The point is most Thais will scheme and plot to do whatever they can without disturbing the moths in their pockets.

I was told yesterday that the Amphur officials have been instructed to get more of the farming community out of the black economy and promote the growth of small to medium business. Further that locally they base a lot of emphasis on attracting farang investment because it is not usually debt based. If you are contributing to the local economy you will get the support of the local authorities. I have never met this guy until yesterday but he knew more about me and what I have been doing than I could have imagined possible.

For you Jim, if it goes above village and OorBatTor level think about the business angle here and get the story together about how that wraps into the family situation. Get copies of the business documentation and write a history of how the business has developed and your future plans including plantation development and investment. What family members are involved, where they live and work and more importantly what part they have played in your business development. A dispassionate history of any underlaying disputes without "talking bad" will help enormously.

If there is a takeout here, it is simply if you are going to do it, then do it right. I am hoping that my current issues will be resolved quickly now I have finally found the mechanism to do it.

[Mosha]

Not a sob story, but an example of what a pain in the arse they can be. My SIL's now ex husband was Kamnam at the time. He bought the 10 Rai next to my wife's land. ( I had been pestering her to buy it, but she didn't want it ) He cleared it and sold it on at 500% profit. The next owners still needed to do some work, and burn't off the scrub and our trees that were 2 m from the border. Sopha went to see him, and was told "Leave it with me". A month went by and nothing, so she went back. He claimed to be busy. So in the end she went to the police. He hit the roof, it turned out the people had payed off the Kamnam. So the upshot was they gave us some of there trees.

While waiting to plant out their trees, they stored them on the land by our house. Didn't ask, just plonked them there, some 750-800 saplings. I asked my wife about it, and got the "Up to them" response. Within a week someone stole them. Our Burma heard someone turn up in a pick up, but wisely stayed in doors. They came with the police a few days later making a lot of noise, but Sopha just said she knew the rubber was there, but had no idea whose it was.

[jamescollister]

Just a PS to my post There is no real problem getting the land back, Village headman is happy to come to the land office as is the District Governor. The whole village is on our side and on thinking back I didn;t even pay for the trees they were granted to MIL to plant on that land. So I would really not lose much money only 7 years of fertiliser that I paid for, FIL and BIL did all the work so I didn't even pay for much labour. They knew in the future it would be theres. The whole thing is more a loss of trust. Wife has been going through all our papers just to make sure there are no other surprises in the future and as good things come from bad situations. When checking the company and factory paper work, find that not only do we have a licence to buy rubber, but it also includes cassava, rice etc.

After big family talk we have decided to sell the land and use the money for expanding he factory, but much to my dislike Uncle has to get a golden handshake. Such is life adapt or die. Jim

[tim armstrong]

OMG I cant read anymore! The tool box story however was great. I've totally given up with mine, thinking of putting a small cobra in it, as most of the good tools have gone. The BIL has now decided to farm his fathers rice land which previously returned a modest rent to FIL. The first thing he did was to buy/rent the tractor and gear. My wife is unclear about the source of finance as BIL has not a bean to his name. Has he worked out how much he can expect to make I asked? No he just wants to do it. Like others on this thread Tim's ATM has now also shut. Fortunately the wife appears to agree - I think.

[customcurb]

Whew! Just read the thread and it all sounds so familiar, and I haven't moved there yet. Spent 6 weeks in Jan and Feb there checking the rubber farm and hopefully setting up processing rss. Simple building stuff, or what I wished was simple, was a slow motion mess. Wifee tends to be the belligerent type at times which added to the angst rather than sooth the fuming husband. Now when SHE got ripped for 200 baht by BIL and local punk worker, sparks flew.

I'd written to a couple people about this recent adventure and my emails were rather dark and negative, to the point that I wondered if it was me being a downer. Well after reading this thread, at least I know I wasn't in the wrong. I've read and heard directly about the 'jungle law', the 'upcountry village law' such as what Jim referred to, and have wondered if I ever will have to apply it.

glennb6

[IsaanAussie]

Whew! Just read the thread and it all sounds so familiar, and I haven't moved there yet. Spent 6 weeks in Jan and Feb there checking the rubber farm and hopefully setting up processing rss. Simple building stuff, or what I wished was simple, was a slow motion mess. Wifee tends to be the belligerent type at times which added to the angst rather than sooth the fuming husband. Now when SHE got ripped for 200 baht by BIL and local punk worker, sparks flew.

I'd written to a couple people about this recent adventure and my emails were rather dark and negative, to the point that I wondered if it was me being a downer. Well after reading this thread, at least I know I wasn't in the wrong. I've read and heard directly about the 'jungle law', the 'upcountry village law' such as what Jim referred to, and have wondered if I ever will have to apply it.

glennb6

Dont even think about it my friend. Remember the old saying "Get mad you loose!", never truer than here. (I wish I had it in my nature to observe those words always, but I'm only human).

After 12 years here I should know better but Liars, Theives and Suck Holes always seem to light my fuse, especially in the evening when I am trying to relax with a few beers. Strange they dont seem to want anything when there is work to be done during the day. The requests always seem to come as soon as I sit down. So I can sympathise with you, I know I am my own worst enemy when it comes to dealing with the lay abouts.

As an update to my position I have been sent to Coventry this week by the entire village. Not a word, a smile or even any eye contact. It has been heaven. It seems that my main protaganist, the jealous neighbour may have shot himself in the foot. When he complained to the OorBatTor they inspected the pigsty yet again and still could not find fault so he moved up to Amphur level. So did I as I said in my previous post but we also rang the Nayoke and told him that the Amphur people were coming. He was furious that chummy had gone over his head without telling him. So the bamboo telegraph got active and the BS started to fly that I had insisted that the Amphur come and inspect the entire village for any and all issues and that everyone was going to get fined. Hence I got the silent treatment.

Amazing Thailand!

[kwonitoy]

I have lived and worked in Thailand for 16 years now and was told from the start at work on contruction sites never never loose your temper or show your anger. I did this for the first year and got walked over by everyone. I did notice that thai on thai that there was a lot of yelling and people jumped to it but for a Falang supervisor they just ignored you or I got a smile and Mai go chai. One day I came unglued over some very expensive and very broken equipment that I'm resposible for. I was taken to the side by the head Thai construction manager and he explained to me that I can't get angry but HE can. He proceeded to chew ass with me present and things fell into place.

If something is wrong stand your ground, if you get mad so be it, your got to mark your territory so to speak.

That being said up north here I've been working for years and never lost it untill last week.

We had a local backhoe come in to clear some land for us and I've found the local operator's to be quite good. These guys were terrible. Trying to clear ecu you have to get the roots out, they were just knocking the trees over leaving lots of stumps, and where stumps were taken out there were holes that I could and did get my tractor stuck in.

I went and got the wife and told her these guys are doing a terrible job please tell them I'm not happy, fix up what they've messed up and do a better job. She proceded to chew ass and everyone looked down at the ground and the boss said they bid the job too cheap, the backhoe is too small and old, the operator is no good, but they'll do better.

Next day I went back out, no change in the work quality. Phoned the wife explained what's going on and handed the phone to the boss, another chewing from the wife.

The next day I went with the tractor to start piling up ecu to burn, I put the blade down and BANG stopped cold with a big stump covered up with trees, backed up took another approch and BANG into another stump, called the boss over and said this is no good. He said they'll finish the clearing and come back later if I think the job is no good. I walked over and pointed to a row of stumps that had been covered with debris and he smiled and said Later,

For the first time in the years I've lived up north I came unglued, I wanted them to start over and do it right, he said later,I went purple faced and let the words fly. Everyone got offended, they loaded up there piece of junk backhoe onto there piece of junk truck and left. My phone rings, the wife, What's going on??? come home.

Drove back home, the wife saying you can't loose your temper, you've never done that before etc. I told her that there is a limit and they crossed it.

The next day the owner of the backhoe, who has done very good plowing work for us came and said if it was his land he would have gotten mad too, he wasn't aware that this operator was useless, he'd just hired him, and the guy that was supposed to be supervising didn't know which end of the backhoe was used to dig with.

I had paid some money up front for them to get started but still owed for the 13 rai they had cleared, when he asked for final payment I smiled and said no problem, the original agreement was that the land be left ready for plowing and if they wanted to go back out and clean up the 13 rai to my satisfaction I would pay them. He didn't say anything, just left and hasn't been back.

[IsaanAussie]

Incredible how they will just walk off and forget everything. Your guy is prepared to just write off the income rather than come back purely based on the loss of face. I had a similar incident of a reliable source who just walked off but in my case he was holding my money.

I thought some time ago I had a reliable vet at my call. But he managed to mess up a hormone injection program and just disappeared. The unfortunate part was he had already paid for some AI materials for four of my pigs, my money of course. So I was left with a completely messed up batch of season timing for 4 pigs, no semen and no vet. Havent seen him since.

So it appears that dear departed Fruity was right after all. Learn the vet skills and DIY.

[IsaanAussie]

More on my running sob story. I have just had my wife come running in to tell me, "They close pig sty soon". I asked who. She didnt know. Nearest I can figure is since I have restarted construction on the sty, the locals have noticed and my "enemy" has stated that he knows there will be a meeting soon and we will get shut. Therefore it is assumed to be fact. As tiring as this lot is proving to be, I will get on the phone and check, but I'll bet a penny to a pound that it is all just more jealous chatter.

The news came via the wife of a guy who is helping me with the welding work. I told my wife they are just trying to scare him off as they are jealous of the money he is making working for me.

I find it amazing that the wife is so ready to believe this stuff, even though she knows we have covered all the bases. On the other hand this is one ocassion I hope she is wrong. I must be becoming more Thai, as I am a little concerned....... good God

[surayu]

The requests always seem to come as soon as I sit down.

That's right, exactly the same situation here. People are always making all sort of excuses if there is a need for some help, the only ones available are the ones expecting at least a full day (or two) wage for a 5 minute effort, if however they are the ones needing help, then you are lucky if they don't ask you at least for a drink as soon as they have been helped, no way they will even try a gesture of giving you what they would have expected from you.

I remember the first days i moved into the village, their conversations between them were all about what vices the farang might have, like "he's a farang then he's an alcoholic" and they were going around it and adding anything could pass in their sevaged minds, only to stop as soon as wifey was around and then they would ask her for a confirmation, as i am almost complitely alcohol free (perhaps a beer or 2 each year, but is an habit i am giving up as in this country is very advisable to have a clear mind 24/7), this visibly created in them some great disorientation and almost shut all conversations, starting to just kind of whisper between them, bear in mind, these people were not 10 years old kids, we are talking of a group of males between 20 and 45 y.o.

The day i openly told the lot of free loaders to <deleted> 'o, about a year ago, it's one of the better choices i have ever made, definetely not even the slightest regret about it, in certain occasions, expressing yourself in more vague terms doesn't seem to achieve the same results and can create misunderstands, they see politeness as a sort of weakness, so better to keep the good manners for the people who can still understand them, otherways is a bit like asking a mosquito to not to suck your blood....

[kwonitoy]

Incredible how they will just walk off and forget everything. Your guy is prepared to just write off the income rather than come back purely based on the loss of face

Actually quite sensible for him to walk off. He said he badly underestimeted the price and was losing money.

Now I have to spend more money and hire a decent backhoe to finish the job and clean up the mess he made. Maybe I should try backchargeing it to him?

As for the wife beleiving the village rumors. After all the years here I still can't get my head around it. The wife will believe ANYTHING she hears for ANYONE no matter how unreliable. After she calms down and I tell her most of these people are uneducated drunken idiots she agrees. Then the next rumor/fact comes down the lane and gets her fired up again.

You can't take the village out of the girl..............

[Lickey]

Mrs employed the farmer opposite our farm to help out with various things like early morning salad & fruit picking, and weeding jobs ect, he would do a good job and we were always well pleased with his efforts, he came to the house every night, have a tin of Leo with me, collect his pay and go home, great bloke,

It came the time to buy the fert for our first try at cassava, so i bought the fert next day, delivered it to the farm, told him what to do, ect, then went home to do some other jobs, later in the afternoon, i took the Mrs Wave to the farm instead of my 1200Yamaha, i saw him spreading our fert on his plants, had i been on my big bike he would heard it and ducked down and hid, he didnt see me atall, so i phoned the mrs, she came along and he was caught red-handed, the poor sod nearly cried after the mrs onslaught, and he promised to pay for the 2 bags he nicked when he harvested his cassava,

We harvested the cassava at a great loss, mainly because of the wall street crash ect, and our man was trying to get back in favour with us, he sprayed the salad beds and overdone the mix, nothing would grow for 18months, so we went organic.

I really pity you fellas farming from afar, even with your mrs keeping an eye on things, she has got to know farming, whats needed,when, how much ect, and make sure its done,

Reading all the posts as they arrive, im a very glad i didnt do it from afar, and now im more or less out of it, im not unhappy, its closed a bottomless pit,

[Smithson]

I'm curious to know whether anyone has considered foreign labor, particularly Burmese? Many Thais will criticize the idea, citing the urban legend that they'll kill you, rob you and run away, however I'm yet to read of such, but here of Thais murdering each other everyday.

There are several farang I know who have switched and are extremely happy, saying they are hardworking and honest. If you found a couple with a kid you and treated them well, you would be giving them a secure environment, which they would probably appreciate.

Personally I dread having to employ Thai men. One worked for me the other day, he worked well but kept saying "I know that", as if I would think he was an idiot if he didn't tell me. I find this all the time.

In areas close to Bangkok, labor is very scarce. Many Thais are employing Burmese because they cannot find locals to do the work. With jobs so freely available, it's understandable why Thais shy from anything difficult.

Edited May 6, 2011 by Smithson

[Mosha]

When we had the rubber trees planted, half of them died, thay were planted by Thais. The replacements were planted by a Burmese. We've had Thais coming to ask to tap the trees. My wife always says no. She says they're unreliable, and we use Burmese. The Thais who came to ask to tap were family lol. We know has soon as they had money fror drinks, that would be it.

[slapout]

A lot of the long term labor in the north (Fang area) are Burmese. The local Thais are hired for short term work where numbers are required. The women are the preferred labor force as they get the work done and get the pay directly whereas their husbands seem to lose a large part of it on the way home.

Some of the Burmese have been working on the same property for several years. They are blamed by the locals for theft in many cases, but I think this is more the Thai class mentality, as I have not heard of any going to jail or being deported.

If I ever decide to hire year round help, I would look for a Burmese family first and if unable to locate one, would probably fore go hiring anyone.