Coffee Growing

[MZurf]

Did a search for coffee but got no hits. Anyone got any experience with this crop? I know they grow a lot of it in Chumpon province and though to give it a try in Sakaew province where the earth is very fertile but all everyone grows is cassava and corn.

[WatersEdge]

There is Arabica coffee grown in the North,

with emphasis on organic coffee.

Good friends / former business Associates manage coffee contract growers

operating their own nursery, all the way through to roasting and grinding for retail sale.

They have respectable results, although at a relatively small scale,

because their requirements are properly stringent.

They are based in Chiang Mai with growers in Mae Hong Son and Chiang Mai provinces.

For good coffee you need high elevation and shade

You then must pick the cherry only when fully ripe,

which means picking individuals rather than stripping the twig

That's careful finger work every day

At every step there is attention to detail required,

all the way through roasting.

Thailand Coffee is typically terrible, with the best products being marginally drinkable.

It is therefore limited to the domestic market,

where drinkers don't know that coffee can be smooth.

Consulting a Growers Co-Op in Nan province a few years ago,

my best advice to them was

Realize that you are up against all of Africa and South America.

When you understand that those guys are willing to work extremely hard,

then you will know that short cuts cannot succeed in the world market.

They conceded that they didn't have good quality control over all members of their Co-Op.

Some bad coffee was probably slipping into the blend here and there.

They haven't called to say they have the problem fixed and want to have another try.

They had one hundred tons of green bean per year available...all junk.

The coffee expert in the US gave a favorable review on appearance of green beans.

He said, "They look like a good Uganda.

"However, upon roasting it became evident that they were completely non uniform.

The cup is undrinkable."

He recommended that we contact Proctor & Gamble prepared to sell very cheaply.

The summary then is that Thailand has fine growing potential,

but the workers are not willing to produce an end product.

Low elevation coffee is Robusta, an entirely different plant,

and an entirely different end product, it is the raw material for instant coffee.

Robusta as a ground coffee will give you the jitters all day, extremely high in caffeine

I drank it in Honduras, Cafe el Indio Extra Fuerte, and WOW, the Extra Fuerte part was true.

Fuerte => STRONG

Best cup I've had in Thailand was Arabica from Burma.

It was available in commercial quantity, both green beans and already roasted.

I paid B300/kg in a clear plastic bag with no label or any markings,

just a kilo of the best coffee I've had in seven years.

[MZurf]

There is Arabica coffee grown in the North,

with emphasis on organic coffee.

Good friends / former business Associates manage coffee contract growers

operating their own nursery, all the way through to roasting and grinding for retail sale.

They have respectable results, although at a relatively small scale,

because their requirements are properly stringent.

They are based in Chiang Mai with growers in Mae Hong Son and Chiang Mai provinces.

For good coffee you need high elevation and shade

You then must pick the cherry only when fully ripe,

which means picking individuals rather than stripping the twig

That's careful finger work every day

At every step there is attention to detail required,

all the way through roasting.

Thailand Coffee is typically terrible, with the best products being marginally drinkable.

It is therefore limited to the domestic market,

where drinkers don't know that coffee can be smooth.

Consulting a Growers Co-Op in Nan province a few years ago,

my best advice to them was

Realize that you are up against all of Africa and South America.

When you understand that those guys are willing to work extremely hard,

then you will know that short cuts cannot succeed in the world market.

They conceded that they didn't have good quality control over all members of their Co-Op.

Some bad coffee was probably slipping into the blend here and there.

They haven't called to say they have the problem fixed and want to have another try.

They had one hundred tons of green bean per year available...all junk.

The coffee expert in the US gave a favorable review on appearance of green beans.

He said, "They look like a good Uganda.

"However, upon roasting it became evident that they were completely non uniform.

The cup is undrinkable."

He recommended that we contact Proctor & Gamble prepared to sell very cheaply.

The summary then is that Thailand has fine growing potential,

but the workers are not willing to produce an end product.

Low elevation coffee is Robusta, an entirely different plant,

and an entirely different end product, it is the raw material for instant coffee.

Robusta as a ground coffee will give you the jitters all day, extremely high in caffeine

I drank it in Honduras, Cafe el Indio Extra Fuerte, and WOW, the Extra Fuerte part was true.

Fuerte => STRONG

Best cup I've had in Thailand was Arabica from Burma.

It was available in commercial quantity, both green beans and already roasted.

I paid B300/kg in a clear plastic bag with no label or any markings,

just a kilo of the best coffee I've had in seven years.

Thank you for the extensive reply. Think we will stick to traditional products!

[tim armstrong]

With a few others, I once thought about it in sub tropical Australia, where we all lived. None of us had ever seen a coffee bush, so when the local Ag. Dept out on a trip to a new and much subsidised farm, we all went along, with dreams of much money from our 5 acre blocks. All that Waters Edge has said applied. 'Ah, you have to pick each cherry'?? - It was a much quieter trip home.

[Iamemjay]

The advice that WatersEdge is so, if you stick to the conventional way of thinking re coffee. Problem is many of these factors have recently been tested and found to be untrue.

Firstly let me say that my wife and I have a small (approx. 10,000 arabica trees near Fang, Chiangmai. Elevation 500M, no shade coverage thus far - the conventional point which WatersEdge forgot to mention.)

Australia is nowhere near a world force in coffee growing - far from it - but in the same way that growers there challenged the traditions of wine-growing and making, and eventually succeeded on the world stage, they have recently taken on coffee. They are not attempting to challenging on quantity, but rather, quality.

Arabica coffee is grown at many elevations in Australia (examples: Atherton Tableland - 500m - huge and successful plantations with no shade cover whatsoever; Caboolture, near Brisbane, a boutique operation with a plantation of arabica, self roasted and marketed - also successful - at 14m above sea level. Again no shade coverage.

It is true that fully ripe cherries produce quality coffee. This is not to say the green ones cannot be used - they typically find their way into Nescafe etc instant blends.

It is true that rich soils produce the best coffee, but like other crops this simply means attention to soil management where the farmer is not blessed with the good stuff naturally (most are not). This means extra attention when growing organic coffee such as is in demand in Thailand. The choice is to grow it organically and get a reasonable price or use chemical fertilisers etc and leave yourself open to be screwed by Nestles who don't care about the chemicals.

It is true that to make sure only he best cherries are taken, they need to be picked by hand, although mechanical pickers are available.... but hey! Labour is cheap in Thailand.

As mentioned above, conventional thinking is that dappled shade is necessary. Sun gives quick growth and high productivity; shade gives higher quality. This is being severely challenged in the Aussie experiences, but my answer is to have the best of both. Delay planting of shade cover trees for a couple of years, to allow quick early growth of the coffee trees. But by the time it matures and is fully productive it should have the benefit of part-shade.

Thailand does not have to bother with export markets at this stage because of the severe shortage domestically. As production volumes increase over time more focus will inevitably come onto the quality issue. It is nevertheless a good starting point that much Thai coffee is grown organically. Marketing it this way is so far avoiding the trap that most other coffee producing countries have fallen into - coming under the might and power of the cartel of 5 multi-nationals that control the world market in coffee. (Question: Why is Thai coffee so expensive? The above is the answer - farmers are not screwed by those companies and if they work on it, can receive a fair price for a quality product.)

... and yes, I agree that a lot of Thai coffee is very poor quality (be daring and try the Hilltribe brand coffee from the supermarket!!). However if you take the trouble to seek out and be willing to pay for the better roasts, good quality blends ARE available.

Cheers

[wdrk7]

I am now growing alot of coffee in Chiangrai area . Any one interested in coffe beans ? Harvesting season now . Pm Me .

[jts-khorat]

There is an old Chinese tin-baron villa here in Phuket Town (Ban Chinpracha, right besides the Governors Mansion) with a few coffee trees. As I last visited, they carried beans and to my untrained eye, the trees looked healthy enough. This means at least, they will grow here in Thailand even at around sea level.

Would it be possible to make a commercial enterprise out of it? That is indeed a totally different question.

Edited November 8, 2011 by jts-khorat

[oldestswinger]

In Korat I've got a good coffee bush. Tons of flowers each year, followed by the beans. Sadly, that's followed by the hot season and the beans simply don't mature.