Killing Spree In Bangkok, Carjacker Murders Two

[Sheryl]

This is all down to the affects of Yaba and Amphetamines. He went crazy and lost all sense of reality.

Yaa Bah, is an amphetamine, that is all it is, it helps you stay awake and that is about all it does, to really turn someone to do nasty stuff you need another agent, either alcohol or psychotic tendencies to begin with.

That is the reason that they changed the name of it from Yaa Mah.... to make it a demon and an umbrella excuse for every single problem encountered in Thai society that couldn't be blamed on Thai people in general or taxed.

//edit/spelling

Amphetamine-induced psychosis is well known,. It can be caused by both consistent heavy use or a single very large dose. It is differentiated from other forms of pyschosis by the fact that symptoms completely resolve when the drug wears off.

Innumerable studies on this.

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/289973-overview

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/528487_3

http://focus.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/long/1/2/205

in fact, "amphetamine-induced psychotic disorder" is a DSM-IV diagnosis

As to what exactly "ya baa" contains, with this as with all other illicit street drugs one cannot make assumptions. The term may be applied to a range of stimulants and street drugs are not infrequently cut with various additives and contaminants which can introduce effects of their own.

[atyclb]

This is all down to the affects of Yaba and Amphetamines. He went crazy and lost all sense of reality.

Yaa Bah, is an amphetamine, that is all it is, it helps you stay awake and that is about all it does, to really turn someone to do nasty stuff you need another agent, either alcohol or psychotic tendencies to begin with.

That is the reason that they changed the name of it from Yaa Mah.... to make it a demon and an umbrella excuse for every single problem encountered in Thai society that couldn't be blamed on Thai people in general or taxed.

//edit/spelling

Amphetamine-induced psychosis is well known,. It can be caused by both consistent heavy use or a single very large dose. It is differentiated from other forms of pyschosis by the fact that symptoms completely resolve when the drug wears off.

Innumerable studies on this.

http://emedicine.med...289973-overview

http://www.medscape....rticle/528487_3

http://focus.psychia...nt/long/1/2/205

in fact, "amphetamine-induced psychotic disorder" is a DSM-IV diagnosis

As to what exactly "ya baa" contains, with this as with all other illicit street drugs one cannot make assumptions. The term may be applied to a range of stimulants and street drugs are not infrequently cut with various additives and contaminants which can introduce effects of their own.

A very clear and well thought out post

[Thaddeus]

Thaddeus I will give you this, you are one tenacious little devil.

That, I am guilty of.

The problem you face is crying to the wrong people. Many of the folks here agree with you that everything that Thailand does is wrong and that you can do it better. So, like I said, get off your hammock (your number of posts suggest that you don't get much hammock time anyway) and go tell the Royal Thai Police how you can do it better.

I wasn't saying that everything in Thailand is bad, I was saying the same thing as Scott

The interaction between drugs and behavior is unpredictable. There are a lot of variables. Many people who use/abuse drugs (and alcohol) are self-medicating an existing psychological disorder. Other people develop psychological problems because of the drugs. This is true of illegal substances, legal substances and prescription drugs.

Plus, I truly believe that anyone that abuses drugs probably already had a deep seated problem before they started, in the same way that some start to abuse alcohol (which is a drug anyway) when their lives hit a speed bump (excuse the pun)

But, one thing that really irks me is the way that drug usage is used as a broad brush to paint over almost every problem, as it is much less work and cheaper to just say "ah, drug user eh. tick in the box. next case please"

This does not only happen in Thailand.

[atyclb]

ME - "This is all down to the affects of Yaba and Amphetamines. He went crazy and lost all sense of reality.

Other crazy side affects for men are developing breasts, shrieking in a pathetic high pitch voice and an uncontrollable urge to wear womens clothes... "

YOU - "Yaa Bah, is an amphetamine, that is all it is, it helps you stay awake and that is about all it does, to really turn someone to do nasty stuff you need another agent, either alcohol or psychotic tendencies to begin with."

you are so wrong

Other crazy side affects for men are developing breasts, shrieking in a pathetic high pitch voice and an uncontrollable urge to wear womens clothes... "

To me it looks like you got something totally wrong here.

please follow the admin advice:

"before making allegations about the effects of meth use, perhaps you should also then post medical documentation of such evidence as it could be considered inflammatory to make suppositions without any proof"

Amphetamines are implicated in the aetiology of gynecomastia and are listed as a causative factor by Glenn D Braunstein endocrinologist M.D in his 1996 paper entitled gynecomastia.

The paper is on record and held by the New England Journal of Medicine.

I dont know about wearing womens clothing or voice changes

[atyclb]

Thaddeus I will give you this, you are one tenacious little devil.

That, I am guilty of.

The problem you face is crying to the wrong people. Many of the folks here agree with you that everything that Thailand does is wrong and that you can do it better. So, like I said, get off your hammock (your number of posts suggest that you don't get much hammock time anyway) and go tell the Royal Thai Police how you can do it better.

I wasn't saying that everything in Thailand is bad, I was saying the same thing as Scott

The interaction between drugs and behavior is unpredictable. There are a lot of variables. Many people who use/abuse drugs (and alcohol) are self-medicating an existing psychological disorder. Other people develop psychological problems because of the drugs. This is true of illegal substances, legal substances and prescription drugs.

Plus, I truly believe that anyone that abuses drugs probably already had a deep seated problem before they started, in the same way that some start to abuse alcohol (which is a drug anyway) when their lives hit a speed bump (excuse the pun)

But, one thing that really irks me is the way that drug usage is used as a broad brush to paint over almost every problem, as it is much less work and cheaper to just say "ah, drug user eh. tick in the box. next case please"

This does not only happen in Thailand.

Absolutely not true. People with happy lives, great childhoods, good families, excel in school, successful, no significant emotional issues; become physiologically addicted to alcohol/drugs every day. Methamphetamine is especially addicting and because it is cheap, is tried by a broad spectrum of society. There are those who do use alcohol/drugs to medicate emotional issues, however not "anyone" as you say, but a %.

[johncat1]

Police found 35 bullet holes ???

Sounds like the police were crazy too !!!

Not a good way to handle a hostage situation. A question of shoot first ask questions later .

Don't they have any specially trained police marksmen or are they all trigger happy where the end justifies the means !!! ?

Feel so sorry for the terrified doctor alleged to be shot by " friendly fire "

Edited April 17, 2011 by johncat1

[metisdead]

An inflammatory/insulting post has been removed as well as a reply to it.

[ginjag]

Many many people who have no psychotic tendancies or mental issues or "deep seated problems" use/abuse drugs and alchohol for simple reasons such as ... celebrating fortunate events or life itself or enhancing situations or even out of pure boredom e.t.c.

Yes, they do tend to be the standard excuses given for drinking too much. The 'celebrating fortunate events' could be used every day here, someone getting married, a young boy going to the temple for a couple of weeks, a funeral, there is almost always something going on that could be used as a reason for raising a glass, guess what..... been there, done that, recognised the difference between excuse and reason, and don't do it any longer.

I haven't quoted the rest of your post as it is just plainly abusive, why do you feel the need to do that, does it give you some form of satisfaction?

I agree with you Thaddeus, My view is most people who are on these drugs, or any large alcohol intake HAVE big problems, these tend to be screens to hide behind, (take and forget your probs) a small % do try-experiment in bad company, getting carried away in said situes. Most of the takers/alcohol, have MEGA time on their hands, if they have work and a reasonable home life and are busy persons more than likely they will NOT get involved. BUT some still do I agree.

[carvets]

How can you not make this about Thailand ? This is Thai Visa not Swede Visa or Aussie Visa. This is thai news that's affects those of us who live and holiday here . It's Thai news bow can you not make it a out Thailand ?

Also of interest to me is the heavy tinting of car windows here. I can't be sure but I do think it's illegal for your winds reen to be tinted in Australia . I believe the police must be able to have some point at which they can view the occupants of the car. This would give an indication that there was someone else in the car.

[Randee]

Many many people who have no psychotic tendancies or mental issues or "deep seated problems" use/abuse drugs and alchohol for simple reasons such as ... celebrating fortunate events or life itself or enhancing situations or even out of pure boredom e.t.c.

Yes, they do tend to be the standard excuses given for drinking too much. The 'celebrating fortunate events' could be used every day here, someone getting married, a young boy going to the temple for a couple of weeks, a funeral, there is almost always something going on that could be used as a reason for raising a glass, guess what..... been there, done that, recognised the difference between excuse and reason, and don't do it any longer.

I haven't quoted the rest of your post as it is just plainly abusive, why do you feel the need to do that, does it give you some form of satisfaction?

I agree with you Thaddeus, My view is most people who are on these drugs, or any large alcohol intake HAVE big problems, these tend to be screens to hide behind, (take and forget your probs) a small % do try-experiment in bad company, getting carried away in said situes. Most of the takers/alcohol, have MEGA time on their hands, if they have work and a reasonable home life and are busy persons more than likely they will NOT get involved. BUT some still do I agree.

your "view" is from a very tiny window with heavily frosted glass.

so far nearly everything thaddeus has said has been contradicted against by other members including admin, and also proved him to be wrong with factual information.

the very first time he responded to my comment argueing with me by saying that yaba is harmless immediately showed him for what he is.

also he takes just segments of my comments and responds to them with arguements, which as i said other members pick up on and tell him he is wrong, but he refuses to accept that and continues to go on with nonsense.

to take just segments and leave out the full comment is disguising and hiding my original point. manipulating it to try to serve him better.

he argues with ridiculous and naive, silly arguements and when i show him how he is bugging me by his being so ridiculous and argumentative, he then starts crying to admin saying that he is being abused. which he is not but he is crying foul and getting away with it. i really dont like this thaddeus at all. i wont be abusive because of admin but all i will say is that i have no respect for him at all and i really really dont like him.

maybe one day you two will be able to break that small frosted glass window and squeeze your heads out to get a clearer view.

[Schooner]

My experence and the science says otherwise. We all have problems, modern living presents big challanges and people are looking for an escape. Unfortunatly substances provide that escape temporarily and people underestimate their ability to manage it. Now they do have real problems.

I can't count the people that look down on drugs while swilling huge quanties of alcohol. The double standard is a big part of the problem. Alcohol is 10 times more of a problem than all the drugs combined. The science shows that thousands of people are using powerful, addictive pain killers and still managing their lives. Back in the 20's opiates were legal and there was little crime associated with it. A few countries are looking at the science and making huge strides towards correcting the problem but they are being pressured by the US to keep drugs illegal. It is insane to create education and generate the science, but then ignore the recomendations.

Governments around the world are not using the science and thus the problem grows.

[Thaddeus]

Many many people who have no psychotic tendancies or mental issues or "deep seated problems" use/abuse drugs and alchohol for simple reasons such as ... celebrating fortunate events or life itself or enhancing situations or even out of pure boredom e.t.c.

Yes, they do tend to be the standard excuses given for drinking too much. The 'celebrating fortunate events' could be used every day here, someone getting married, a young boy going to the temple for a couple of weeks, a funeral, there is almost always something going on that could be used as a reason for raising a glass, guess what..... been there, done that, recognised the difference between excuse and reason, and don't do it any longer.

I haven't quoted the rest of your post as it is just plainly abusive, why do you feel the need to do that, does it give you some form of satisfaction?

I agree with you Thaddeus, My view is most people who are on these drugs, or any large alcohol intake HAVE big problems, these tend to be screens to hide behind, (take and forget your probs) a small % do try-experiment in bad company, getting carried away in said situes. Most of the takers/alcohol, have MEGA time on their hands, if they have work and a reasonable home life and are busy persons more than likely they will NOT get involved. BUT some still do I agree.

your "view" is from a very tiny window with heavily frosted glass.

so far nearly everything thaddeus has said has been contradicted against by other members including admin, and also proved him to be wrong with factual information.

the very first time he responded to my comment argueing with me by saying that yaba is harmless immediately showed him for what he is.

also he takes just segments of my comments and responds to them with arguements, which as i said other members pick up on and tell him he is wrong, but he refuses to accept that and continues to go on with nonsense.

to take just segments and leave out the full comment is disguising and hiding my original point. manipulating it to try to serve him better.

he argues with ridiculous and naive, silly arguements and when i show him how he is bugging me by his being so ridiculous and argumentative, he then starts crying to admin saying that he is being abused. which he is not but he is crying foul and getting away with it. i really dont like this thaddeus at all. i wont be abusive because of admin but all i will say is that i have no respect for him at all and i really really dont like him.

maybe one day you two will be able to break that small frosted glass window and squeeze your heads out to get a clearer view.

I never claimed it to be harmless, no drug is harmless, my assertion is that to become a chronic abuser of some drugs is indicative of other problems, that I still stand by.

JD pointed out that Yaa Bah is a methamphetamine and not an amphetamine as I believed, I'm still not sure if this has always been the case, but that makes it much more addictive and much more dangerous, and I held my hands up and admitted to being wrong.

I have not edited out any part of this quote, I did with previous ones as I was either only replying to part of it, or some of the content broke some rules of forum etiquette. At no time have I 'gone crying to admin' what ever happened there you brought on yourself.

If you like me or not is of course your personal choice.

[ginjag]

Randee, I was agreeing with Thad on the point that most people on over the top booze or drugs, have big life probs. (or had) hence the reason to start.

Forget the windows and frosted glass bit, I have not ganged up with Thad to sort of knock our heads together, merely agreeing on the point I mentioned.

I don't want to get into situes with pages of trying to get -or out wit posters, I dont want to come out top dog, or want to look good in the eyes of forum.

My purpose is to learn about others thoughts, add my bit, for all it's worth, and even have a laugh now and again, bringing a bit of humour into posts.

So I,m sorry if it upsets you that on a FEW points I agreed with thad-I also noted that some of your points were positive, but not all. So I'm sticking to my belief that in MOST cases exessive alcohol and drug are due to some problems people encounter, and they turn for a quick fix it to forget. you may disagree but thats what my 70 years has shown me (from frosted glasses)

[atyclb]

Many many people who have no psychotic tendancies or mental issues or "deep seated problems" use/abuse drugs and alchohol for simple reasons such as ... celebrating fortunate events or life itself or enhancing situations or even out of pure boredom e.t.c.

Yes, they do tend to be the standard excuses given for drinking too much. The 'celebrating fortunate events' could be used every day here, someone getting married, a young boy going to the temple for a couple of weeks, a funeral, there is almost always something going on that could be used as a reason for raising a glass, guess what..... been there, done that, recognised the difference between excuse and reason, and don't do it any longer.

I haven't quoted the rest of your post as it is just plainly abusive, why do you feel the need to do that, does it give you some form of satisfaction?

I agree with you Thaddeus, My view is most people who are on these drugs, or any large alcohol intake HAVE big problems, these tend to be screens to hide behind, (take and forget your probs) a small % do try-experiment in bad company, getting carried away in said situes.

Although I have academic experience in addictionology, I do not know what % is secondary (related to problems) and which is Primary addiction; physiologic addiction in the abscence of emotional problems, chronic pain, etc, but the two areas you mention certainly exist.

Most of the takers/alcohol, have MEGA time on their hands, if they have work and a reasonable home life and are busy persons more than likely they will NOT get involved. BUT some still do I agree.

If you are looking at the expat population in Thailand, I'd agree. Many have a lot of time on their hands, and it seems many of them liked drinking previously.In a more mainstream population (not the skewed one in Thailand) there is no lack of hard working, busy, successful alcoholics.

One prime example that can be used to illustrate this is the USA attorney population. Estimated 15-20% are alcoholic.

Many people with time on their hands also are not alcoholic; retirees across the world. Much of the culture for male expats in thailand involves time at venues with alcohol.

Of various studies to try to find common denominators among alcoholics, one by a very famous researcher/pioneer in treating alcoholism, Vernon Johnson, could not find such commonalities. No common emotional/psychological issues, childhoods, education, family life. The spectrum was broad and truly democratic

http://www.thecomple...ve-the-bar.html http://lawyerist.com...y-introduction/

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&safe=off&source=hp&q=lawyers+alcoholism&aq=0s&aqi=g-s1g-v1g-m1&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=71a443ecb763825d

"I'll Quit Tomorrow" Vernon E. Johnson Johnson Institute Minneapolis ISBN 0-06-250433-9

Edited April 23, 2011 by atyclb