Planning For Our First Baby (Both Expats)

[CMExpat79]

Myself and my partner (both from the uk) are trying to conceive our first child. At the moment we are 99.9% decided that we would like to remain here in Chiang Mai for the birth. (If however, when our time comes that we foresee any complications I would go back to the UK)

However I do have many questions, which will help me decide 100% if this is the right choice for us.

1.We live closest to McCormick hospital so I was wondering if anyone has had a baby here and what was your experience? I have contacted them for a rough cost of a natural birth, which they came back with saying 25,000bt, which include 3 nights.

Silly questions but how do I go about deciding on the best hospital, should I just ask everyone what packages they offer for a natural birth?

2. Besides the actual delivery of a baby, what extra costs should we budget for? for instance, will they give the baby vaccines when Im there, do they need to?? I would prefer no drugs to be given to me whilst delivering, but what should I expect them to add onto the bill. Would it be safe to budget double or three times what we think the birth would cost - just incase? I do know that if there are complications it will cost more but say for instance IF we were lucky enough for everything to be smooth-ish

3. From what I gather most hospitals include a 3 night stay in the hospital once you deliver...do I have to do this? IF all is ok with the birth, is there any way I can reduce the time I need to stay in there. For instance, in the UK if everything is fine you can usually go home in 24 hours! and 3 nights is not usually required?

I know this post seems a bit clueless, but like I say we are still at the stage of trying to concieve so it might be a long time away yet! so I am literally learning and gathering all the information I need. Cost is not our main concern, however it is of course a factor ie we dont want to pay 100k if we could have delivered a baby for half that if you know what I mean.

Thanks in advance

[BuddhistDruid]

Congratulations on your decision to have a child. It is a great experience.

One thing I would caution you about having your child in Thailand is what to do if the child is premature? While many people look at the costs advertised by the hospital and think it is reasonable, they do not plan for the 40,000 baht per day charges that can come if your child requires an NICU. A baby born 8 weeks early with only minor complications can cost well over 2 million baht. This service would be free for you in the UK. Here, it can bankrupt you. And I have never found an insurance plan that covers this.

So when you consider whether you want to stay here in Thailand or return to the UK, do be honest with yourself. If you have 2 - 3 million baht to cover the costs should a complication develop, then I think you can find medical care every bit as good as the West while remaining here. If this kind of a figure puts you off however, you may wish to reconsider your decision to stay. There is a good chance nothing will go wrong, and you will get that 60,000 baht baby. But what is your plan if you are one of the unlucky ones?

You need to answer that question before making a final decision. Government hospitals can lower your price somewhat, but you won't be able to transfer to one if you check into a private hospital when the emergency starts.

P.S. For our birth the mother was in the hospital with severe preeclampsia for 6 weeks before the babies came at 32 weeks. I am extremely thankful we had the foresight to go to the government hospital, and that she was Thai so eventually we got the government universal care scheme to pick up most of the charges. I would be destitute if that wasn't the case. As we had twins, my medical bills for a private hospital would have been in excess of 6 million baht.

Edited April 29, 2011 by BuddhistDruid

[samran]

I'd take into serious consideration the post above. You might be OK, but there may be complications post birth.

Recommend that you get an insurance policy which covers birth costs as well as the new born child. Most have a 12 month waiting period, but effectively, you wait till month four of coverage to start conceiving and the child will be born post month 12, and hence be covered.

Edited April 29, 2011 by samran

[chris5346]

hello,

we had a baby last year at the sriphat hospital which is one of the cheaper places , we did have some extra charges for drugs/pain killers and supplies but i queried it and came to a compromise.

the after birth few days were important and well worth staying for, my partner (thai) had a cezarian so we couldn't have left early anyway, our baby was strong and i wasn't worried about her one bit.

at birth you do have the option of vaccinations etc for the baby, i was like you and wanted minimal - i chose for vitamin K only and had the TB etc done couple of weeks later also in thailand they wanted to put some cream or gel stuff in babies eyes incase of infection but i said no thanks to reduce any extra stress on the baby, to be honest i didn't really know i was doing and maybe i just got lucky with no eye infections ?

we started off at the RAM for all the scans etc but we changed to the sriphat for the birth to try and save some money , we were worried about high birth costs and extras - the RAM didn't want to talk to us about what if's.

the sriphat is more for thais i'd say , i had to keep leaving the room during the birth and there's long queues and many people with fewer doctors,

i'd recommend the RAM or there's a similar one on the start of the san sai road.

you'll want to find a doctor asap that your comfortable with and start scans etc , check out the delivery rooms - in thailand doctors deliver the babies i think in u.k it's more mid wifes and nurses ?

we paid maybe 5000 baht at the RAM initially which was very good and at the sriphat 33,500 for the birth, if we stayed at the RAM then i guess we would have paid 45-50K ?

some friends had there baby i think was 12 weeks early and required 2 weeks in hospital - they paid around 80k

any questions please ask,

chris

[Carry]

I know my healthcare insurance I have in europe would cover the NICU in case I deliver a baby abroad....but that is up to your insurance...it is a good thing to figure out before hand!

[CMExpat79]

Thank you so much for all of your replies, they will help us greatly in coming to a decision.

I am armed with baby books, birth books, signed up to baby forums the lot! There is certainly a tonne of stuff I need to learn..but I suppose we are very lucky that we are in a position to plan, and not faced with a suprise pregnancy!

I know this is a silly question, but you know how in the Uk for instance, you will be allocated a midwife...I take it that doesnt happen here, and we basically work directly with the hospital and the doctors there?

At present I am not pregnant, and not sure that it will happen anytime soon - which is a good thing as it gives us the time to be a prepared as we can. I have also heard about the Raintree Resource Centre in Chiang Mai, which has a publication named giving birth in chiang mai, so I think I will pop down there and pickup a copy and see if it is helpfull.

Think I will also continuing contacting some insurance companies too. There is an AXA office nearby so might nip in and see what they say. Any reccomdations would be appreciated, allthough I will do a quick forum search too

Thanks again for taking the time to reply...right back to the books and researching!

[chris5346]

hi,

we didn't have a midwife or any antinatal classes / birth plans etc all we had was a doctor and different nurses coming in and out,

basically you need to find a doctor you can communicate well with - also you need to see which doctors are working around the time of birth.

my girlfriend is thai so almost all the talking i couldn't understand so i'm not sure of all facts but basically the natural birth was only tried for about one hour before choosing cezarian,

i think the hospital we went too was too busy the delivery room was full and also we had to wait for an emergency cezarian - that's why i was recommending the ram etc because they are better equipped.

there's many different things that can happen so i can't see how you can decide.

if you choose to have a cezarian then goto same hospital we went to and will be fine .

maybe you should try and find a mid wife etc and to be present at the birth ? i'm not sure the difference between english and thai delivery techniques ?

my thai gf didn't really know about the pushing , breathing and waiting contraction timings, there wasn't really much help at the birth.

i'm no expert my first time.

ours didn't go too well but i think it would have been much the same what ever hospital we chose.

are you settling in chiang mai for a long time ?

[WarpSpeed]

I only skimmed through the posts here so if this was mentioned I apologize but if it's important to your partner to be present during delivery as it was for me be certain you scope out that option thoroughly too as though we went to the same hospital for the birth of both our children between the 1st and 2nd births a little over a year later they arbitrarily took a step backwards in progress and would no longer allow me to be present in the delivery room but waited until my wife was in labor to notify us of the policy change even though we had 9 months of potential notice.

This policy varies between hospitals here, it's not a blanket policy but we had already had one child the year previously so naturally took it for granted the second time, it was promary reason we choose that hospital the first time as was location to our home.

I was livid to say the least but was torn between trying to maintain my composure for my wife's sake and my immense anger and disappointment we had both expected me to be by her side again during the delivery and I was so tempted to leave to another hospital and probably should have as there was time but really had no idea which one and it was too last minute. We spent the previous months building a trustful relationship with her OB/GYN and obviously it became very convoluted on short notice..

I can never get back those irreplaceable moments they deprived us of, and at a time when all should be happiness they really poured ice water all over our special occasion. The upside is my boys are healthy but I have my first boys delivery on video for posterity and nothing for my second and that breaks my heart and is very difficult for the boys to understand as well, it's not a trivial matter..

[CMExpat79]

Thanks again for your replies. We don not plan on staying in Thailand for too much longer, maybe another year or so not 100% sure yet - however we do know that when the day comes to put our child into school we will mostly likely prefer to move back home - just our preferance.

Having my partner there at the birth would be important so this is something we would need to keep in mind too.

Thanks again!

[Carry]

I gave birth to my daughter last year and considered all option, I live in Thailand with my Thai bf so considered any hospital close to out home and in Bangkok, in the end I decided to go back home...

Home, my insurance would cover everything, I would have a midwife of my choice and not for the least if I ended up in hospital all doctors would speak my language.

I could choose what kind of birth I wanted [water, home, hospital...I delivered at home] and the presents of my partner was no question of course he would be there, also baby products, lamaze classes [pregnancy yoga or whatever classes you would like to take] and in our case family [and than espec those who are not able or going to fly to Thailand to come and see your kid]

I dont know if thats an issue in your case of course.

When my baby was 3 months old we flew back but I guess this can be sooner.

Now Im raising my child here, I notice all the differences in upbringing between Thai and western culture, some good things some bad, looking back Im glad I gave birth at home and spent some time there to get more confident with my baby before coming out here again!

Good luck with conceiving and planning

[CMExpat79]

Cheers for your replies

There are so many things for us to think about regarding having a child here, hence the point of this post....as of yet we are not even at the stage of pregnancy, therefore I feel it is a wise thing to do to ask questions and really research having a child here. It may be 'bonkers' to some , and I suppose if all we heard was horror stories about expats delivering here, and no-one ever done it that our choice would be 10 times easier, once we have looks at all of the pros and cons we may well agree that Thailand is not best suited for us, but we really do need to do what is personally best for us and a child.

However - going off costs alone, going back to the UK is not cheap either, especially if you look at all of the costs involved, ie finding a property, flights, living costs for the duration we would be back there - all of which have rocketed in the uk since we moved out here. If it did look like there was to be complications, or I simply did not feel comfortable at the idea of giving birth here I would of course simply go back home.

IF we did come to the final decision to have a child here, my family is very small, so I know there would only be my partner and a select few around at that time, and some for personal reasons would not be involved. But I understand what you mean Carry

BTW Carry, may I ask how many months into your pregnancy did you fly back home?

I do think that we have a great thing going with the NHS, some people do actually dislike it but I personally think its a great thing about the UK, and of course I would be silly to ignore the fact that healthcare over there is free.

Thanks again for all input

[BlueScouse]

Don't forget about the future nationality problems.

Your child,if born in Thailand,would not have Thai nationality,but would only have

British nationality.

If your child then has a child when outside UK,the child-your grandchild-would not be

able to take British nationality.

[CMExpat79]

Thanks Bluescouse, we would not want them to have Thai Nationality, the plan is to move back to the UK in the future, especially when it comes to placing a child into school - that is one thing we are certain of

Although I didn't know about the grandchildren thing, that is interesting.

[Carry]

I flew back pretty early in pregnancy about 4 months.

Good point having to live in uk must be pretty expensive...lots of things to take into consideration, not easy!

[Phuketscooter]

Don't forget about the future nationality problems.

Your child,if born in Thailand,would not have Thai nationality,but would only have

British nationality.

If your child then has a child when outside UK,the child-your grandchild-would not be

able to take British nationality.

My little girl have two nationalities as mother is Thai and father is from Norway and born here in Thailand. Today she has two passport. She can never loos her Thai citizenship, even if she choose to use only the Norwegian passport. The Thai passport she can back when she want. If she choose to use the only the Thai passport, she will never get the Norwegian passport back.

A friend got his little boy in Norway. That boy can only have the Norwegian passport.

You can like it or not, but this is so, as these thing is decided by the fathers home-county.

I think this must be the most fantastic country to rice a baby.

[Senia]

no pain killers ?????

first child ............................ keep an open mind. 12 th hour of labour I was begging for a C-section, while they were "preparing for my C " I dialated and had a "natural" childbirth .

LOL if you include the two fat nurses who jumped on my belly to get him out

[Mario2008]

Thanks Bluescouse, we would not want them to have Thai Nationality, the plan is to move back to the UK in the future, especially when it comes to placing a child into school - that is one thing we are certain of

Although I didn't know about the grandchildren thing, that is interesting.

The child would only have Thai nationality if one of the parents is Thai.

[Ashmanator]

We had our first daughter 4 months ago at The Phuket International hospital. My wife is Thai, I am English. The whole process from start to finish was great. We first visited Phuket bangkok hospital, but my wife did not feel comfortable with the doctor. So we ended up at the International hospital. The doctor was great, at each scan, he explained everything in Thai and perfect English. We were keen to have a natural birth, the doctor would not commit to either until that last moment. Yep, the day came, I witnessed the whole thing, I was almost forced to attend. Natural it was ( I have to laugh with Senia, two nurses were also almost sitting on my wife to help the baby out), popped out relatively easy ( for me at least haha), no complications. 3 nights in hospital that were good for coming down from the emotional high of birth and exhaustion for my wife. We also used that time to learn from the nurses, some of the basics. They did have pre and post natal classes, but they were rubbish, we learnt more from the actual nurses in those 3 days. Final cost was 30,000 baht, no extras. I have since paid extra 7,000 for a full program of shots. My experience could not have been better. I was lucky and did not have any complications, but I can only assume if there had been, they would have been managed as well as the standard procedure. I would fully recommend having a baby in Thailand. I have many friends that have had equally good experiences, it's not all bad!!!!!!! Each to their own though. Good Luck

[CMwanderer]

A great thread that I will be watching as I'm in the same boat

[ExpatJ]

Thanks Bluescouse, we would not want them to have Thai Nationality, the plan is to move back to the UK in the future, especially when it comes to placing a child into school - that is one thing we are certain of

Although I didn't know about the grandchildren thing, that is interesting.

Actually the being born outside of the UK is a big deal nationality wise- by having your child outside of UK, it forces him/her to give birth in UK assuming he/she wants your grand kid to be British!

For standard births there is no problem in Thailand but bear in mind that if there are serious/urgent complications the hospital staff here may not be able to deal with it as well as in UK (preventive care is strong in thailand as is treatment care- but accident and emergency care is relatively weak). We had a complication during my sons birth in the US (umbilical cord wrapped around his throat) that required a 'code blue' emergency- the midwife pressed a button and within seconds a half dozen nurses & doctors rushed in a whipped the son away to apply emergency treatment- everything turned out 100% fine ,but i doubt that would happen in a thai hospital. (FYI it costs 16,000 US$ for a 2 day standard maternity stay in hospital in US!!!).

Other things we learn't:

Don't buy more than one baby book its a waste of time and money- "what to expect when your expecting' covers it all.

Oh, and dont bother attending birthing/lahmas (?) classes also waste of time and money- when you are actually giving birth a competent midwife will be able to give you all the help you need and the rest is just nature.

Don't bother with the 'natural birth' issue- this is 100% pure female machismo bs - just get epidural in good time and make everyone's life easier, not least your own:) If you great grand mother had access to epid., believe me she wouldn't have wanted a natural birth !

Edited July 4, 2011 by ExpatJ