Too Much Free "Advise" From Locals

[Senia]

when I had my baby , my moronic husband had to work the following weeks, so I was alone with my first child.

I did have someone come in to help me the first 10 days , and now 2 x a week, also the food vendor from downstairs agreed to deliver food daily.

Problem 1. on the second day the sister ( vendor , family business) came up and spoke to me at length in Thai , motioning that someone coming up to my room , I thought she meant her parents to see my baby ( her mother had once offered to take my baby if I didn't want him when I was pregnant ) but instead her brother came. and he hung around after delivering the food, trying to "make conversation" . I had to point to the door for him to leave.

I never asked them to deliver again. 3 days later I went down to buy food and the whole family was staring at me.

not wanting any trouble or bad blood, I went over and bought food from them, when the mother asked me why I didn't deliver I said that I didn't know how to order certain foods in thai, she then asked me ( in front of son ) pointing to my crotch ................ pain ya ??? I said yes , very very pain. then the sister was clearly telling the brother to not talk to me ........... he hasn't since

But from then on , the sister (who came up to my room) , on a regular basis, would make comments on what I ate, what I ordered, basically everything !!!!!

even my baby was said to be as pretty as a girl - unlike hers !!!

sometime last week I gave her a dirty look and since then she has been nice-r

but I kinda understand them, when commenting on my son's features, she looks at her own kid (19 mths ) and says in disgust to him , what he's lacking, great mom huh ? in her defence she did bear an ugly child, takes after his mother !!!!

Problem 2. a neighbour who sometimes babysits, when I disinfect my room . noticed poop on my son's leg , suddenly I am a "bad mother" who always uses disposable diapers, never bathes her child, never swaddles the baby .

well DUH if I am sending baby to your room for an hour knowing that he has an exploding poop problem then yes, I am going to put him in disposable diapers so that there won't be any mess on your bed....... I usually send him there in his cradle too. but darn baby is too beautiful they put him on the bed

I bathe my baby in the evenings, I deal with a lot of poop , my son kicks a lot , I am not altogether too concerned about a poop smudge on his leg. his diaper rash is gone he is not in any pain or discomfort and he will get his bath and be PROPERLY cleaned in the evening , or when I notice the smudge !!!! no big deal !!!!

we are in thailand, IT IS HOT HERE !!!! my baby usually sleeps in a t shirt and diapers , he always kicks his blankets away so we don't put one over him unless it's exceptionally cold . a check with websites and they will tell you that all baby needs is what you are wearing and an extra layer............ well I am nude most of the time !!! and the doctor told me the exact same thing a t shirt and a diaper !!!

and NOT swaddled in a blanket with a towel over him

I use cloth diapers on him , not those square linens but with real diaper covers. only when the cleaners come to my room then they 'discovered' that she does use cloth on him.......... and good stuff too , and guess what , baby does get a bath everyday "shocker' !!!

and the help is no better either , the first one would charge me a flat hourly rate, but bill me for hand- washing his diapers, which I told her she didn't have to , and bill me extra for it during her hours, and I had to do most of the work myself cos all she wants to do is play with the baby !!!!

now the two girls are way better but they ask 1 million and 1 questions that is just not right ...........how much does your husband give you every month ? why doesn't he come home every night ???

and when my baby was taking his bath she dumped a whole lot of cold water in his tub,

he used to freaking love bath time !!!!! he was shivering and quiet ............... my baby happily babbles a lot usually during bath time

then proceeds to strongly recommend that I put his cradle on the bed !!!!

she obviously has not heard "rock a bye baby"

then just yesterday she picks stuff out from my grocery bags and asks me if her son could have them

( I had actually considered buying small treats for her son but thought against it , as it may be expected habitually)

and today her son was in my room, fidgeting with the mobile over the baby 's playpen , I had to tell him nicely to not touch it 2x the third time I raised my voice

and just before I write this post guessed what happened ??? good thing I was also in the playpen , mobile bounced off my head , struck my still breast feeding baby as it fell !!!!!

WHAT THE FLYING fuc_k !!!!!!!!

now they are upset that I don't take their advise, to the vendor I just ignore their advise, to the neighbour, I kinda defend myself then tell him that I got the facts online ( yes I have a fat baby ) but it's ok cos I eat more calories as required for breast feeding mommas .

I do not get the logic of a pregnant lady stuffing herself to the point that she has a c - section for an overly large fat covered baby , then starving herself after the baby is born to have a small baby afterword !!!!

I did the opposite, ate enough to have a healthy mostly blood covered baby in a very good birth weight ( 3.350kg ) eat as a breastfeeding mother should and have a fat but healthy baby ..............

I also don't get the logic of feeding the baby all the time until LO vomits , just feed on demand , when you have enough fat in you , baby will fatten up nicely , no puking at all.... even the doctor told that it's a frequent problem here

how the hell do I deal with all this shit !!!!

it's worse cos I know they mean well ........ I cannot lose the cleaners though her son nearly sent my LO to the hospital

[sbk]

Smile and say thank you and ignore it. Think water and duck. Its the only way to remain sane, sorry!

[gregb]

You made me laugh...memories. It wasn't that long ago...

Thais are nosy and love to gossip. It is cultural. Ignore it or join in, but don't get worked up over it.

Thai babies eat 20 times a day. Don't you know that is the only reason babies cry? Don't worry...there are 60+ million Thais, so the attitude clearly isn't life threatening.

Thai babies need to be completely bundled up, including their heads, even when it is 45 degrees and 90 percent humidity. Took my wife forever to understand that when she is cold, our twins are just starting to become comfortable. There is definitely an aspect of genetics at play here...

Going without a bath at least once, but preferably twice a day is the sign of the devil. And despite the fact that Thai babies need to be bundled up in a heavy parka during the blistering heat of the day, once in a bath anything above freezing is considered too hot. Be thankful your assistants weren't adding ice to the water.

By the way...Thai babies do not sleep in a cradle. They don't even sleep separately in their own beds. They sleep with you, the mother, until well after puberty. Just accept you will be branded an evil mother for the mere thought of putting your baby in a cradle.

And you clearly haven't gotten to the solid foods part yet. Buy a high chair? Have you lost your mind? Why, Thai parents simply squat down and feed their children on the floor. And forget about waiting until they can sit up before introducing them to solid foods. They'll be force fed pumpkin and bananas while lying on their backs in your lap, their screaming prohibited by the spoonfuls of mush choking them whenever they dare to open their mouths. "Look, doesn't he love his breakfast?" He cries when you don't feed him fast enough...

Just remember, this too will pass, and in several months as you are chasing your little one around the house trying to prevent him from sticking his finger in the fan, verifying the electrical continuity of your inside wiring with various appendages, and eating the dead insect carcasses off the floor, you will be thinking "ahh...memories" and chuckling about posts on Thai Visa reminding you how pleasant those times were.

Laugh about it. It's therapeutic.

[Senia]

Greg I will laugh about it when it's OVER !!!!!

my baby sleeps in a playpen that we traded the crib for cos baby likes to kick .......also papa gets freaked out to sleep on the bed with the baby on it , too scared that he would roll over Little One

cradle is too hot , I use it during the day so he knows the difference between night and day , my only consolation is that my husband has "gone over to the other side" trusting baby sites more than tradition, especially after doctor told him exactly the same thing as I did .

OMG i can't imagine poor babies puking all the time, my LO puked 3 times in his whole 61 days, only when I had to clean the yeast infection on his neck ( yes really fat baby ) and it killed me to see him uncomfortable and smelly.

Childhood must be a nightmare here !!!! force -feeding while lying down ????

ahead of you there, I hope, I got LO a big ass playpen to sleep in , and play in when he is older, I am already ( having given up all hope for a full time nanny ) scouting out nurserys in the area.

you got twins ???????? if you need any advise about your kids PM me, I know how a twin feels, identical ?

do you also get people offering to adopt your baby/s ? I got 1 at the supermarket the other day and yes the vendor again, this time it was the father ............... what gives???? my baby is all asian , cute as a button , they keep calling him "nallaa" ( supposed to mean like really pretty for a boy ....... i think ) and I very much would like to keep the little guy

[Forethat]

do you also get people offering to adopt your baby/s ? I got 1 at the supermarket the other day and yes the vendor again, this time it was the father ............... what gives???? my baby is all asian , cute as a button , they keep calling him "nallaa" ( supposed to mean like really pretty for a boy ....... i think ) and I very much would like to keep the little guy

Senia, I really enjoyed reading your first post in this thread, I know exactly what you're going through (well, I'm not the mother and I think this is related to female hormones and similar, so maybe not exactly...).

One thing you should know is that it is Thai tradition to help the mother the first month or two after birth. This usually means that a sister or other female relative moves in and takes care of the baby for a month or two until the mother has had time to recover from birth. For me as a westerners this is ludicrous - I believe the first month at home with an an infant is the single most emotional and private moment you can possibly imagine and no outsider is getting access to my family during this crucial moment in an infants life - this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father. I cant speak for the mothers, but as a father I would feel both dumped and worried if a stranger took care of my baby - not to mention the feeling that someone else might do something to my baby that I knew wasn't right - like bathing the baby in water to cold. My daughter has only screamed ONCE during bathing, and that was when the hospital had to "show us" how to bathe her before we brought her home. Every time WE bathed her she smiled and laughed and really enjoyed having her bath (go figure...). But this is probably WHY you got so many unwanted advices and offers to help, and even proposals to adopt your son - they simply felt sorry for you that you were on your own without getting much help.

Stop paying attention to all advices you get from strangers - female intuition is strong and in combination with common sense and modern information channels like Internet and similar I'm confident you're the most qualified to know how your son is doing, and should be cared for. So stop paying attention to strangers who "knows better", because they dont. Period.

And by the way, its not "nallaa" but "naarak", meaning "cute" (น่ารัก), and the only thing you have to worry about is when the Thais eventually start napping your son out of his stroller, because he's so cute they simple HAVE to cuddle with him...

Get used to it.

[Senia]

do you also get people offering to adopt your baby/s ? I got 1 at the supermarket the other day and yes the vendor again, this time it was the father ............... what gives???? my baby is all asian , cute as a button , they keep calling him "nallaa" ( supposed to mean like really pretty for a boy ....... i think ) and I very much would like to keep the little guy

Senia, I really enjoyed reading your first post in this thread, I know exactly what you're going through (well, I'm not the mother and I think this is related to female hormones and similar, so maybe not exactly...).

One thing you should know is that it is Thai tradition to help the mother the first month or two after birth. This usually means that a sister or other female relative moves in and takes care of the baby for a month or two until the mother has had time to recover from birth. For me as a westerners this is ludicrous - I believe the first month at home with an an infant is the single most emotional and private moment you can possibly imagine and no outsider is getting access to my family during this crucial moment in an infants life - this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father. I cant speak for the mothers, but as a father I would feel both dumped and worried if a stranger took care of my baby - not to mention the feeling that someone else might do something to my baby that I knew wasn't right - like bathing the baby in water to cold. My daughter has only screamed ONCE during bathing, and that was when the hospital had to "show us" how to bathe her before we brought her home. Every time WE bathed her she smiled and laughed and really enjoyed having her bath (go figure...). But this is probably WHY you got so many unwanted advices and offers to help, and even proposals to adopt your son - they simply felt sorry for you that you were on your own without getting much help.

Stop paying attention to all advices you get from strangers - female intuition is strong and in combination with common sense and modern information channels like Internet and similar I'm confident you're the most qualified to know how your son is doing, and should be cared for. So stop paying attention to strangers who "knows better", because they dont. Period.

It's gotten a little bit better now they see him at 2 months and he is ( ok bragging here ) already achieving milestones much sooner than expected , like focusing on faces, babbling non - stop and better than average head control , of course they are most impressed by his size, he is big even by farang standards ( dad is 6'2") . They are however still baffled by the concept of pumped milk and frequent outings .

And by the way, its not "nallaa" but "naarak", meaning "cute" (น่ารัก), and the only thing you have to worry about is when the Thais eventually start napping your son out of his stroller, because he's so cute they simple HAVE to cuddle with him...

Get used to it.

already there they passed him around for photo op with handphones I don't really mind that . It's just the adopting part that makes me wonder if they are questioning my mothering skills.

[Senia]

It's gotten a little bit better now they see him at 2 months and he is ( ok bragging here ) already achieving milestones much sooner than expected , like focusing on faces, babbling non - stop and better than average head control , of course they are most impressed by his size, he is big even by farang standards ( dad is 6'2") . They are however still baffled by the concept of pumped milk and frequent outings .

lol sorry trying out multi - quote

[vont]

do you also get people offering to adopt your baby/s ? I got 1 at the supermarket the other day and yes the vendor again, this time it was the father ............... what gives???? my baby is all asian , cute as a button , they keep calling him "nallaa" ( supposed to mean like really pretty for a boy ....... i think ) and I very much would like to keep the little guy

Senia, I really enjoyed reading your first post in this thread, I know exactly what you're going through (well, I'm not the mother and I think this is related to female hormones and similar, so maybe not exactly...).

One thing you should know is that it is Thai tradition to help the mother the first month or two after birth. This usually means that a sister or other female relative moves in and takes care of the baby for a month or two until the mother has had time to recover from birth. For me as a westerners this is ludicrous - I believe the first month at home with an an infant is the single most emotional and private moment you can possibly imagine and no outsider is getting access to my family during this crucial moment in an infants life - this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father. I cant speak for the mothers, but as a father I would feel both dumped and worried if a stranger took care of my baby - not to mention the feeling that someone else might do something to my baby that I knew wasn't right - like bathing the baby in water to cold. My daughter has only screamed ONCE during bathing, and that was when the hospital had to "show us" how to bathe her before we brought her home. Every time WE bathed her she smiled and laughed and really enjoyed having her bath (go figure...). But this is probably WHY you got so many unwanted advices and offers to help, and even proposals to adopt your son - they simply felt sorry for you that you were on your own without getting much help.

Stop paying attention to all advices you get from strangers - female intuition is strong and in combination with common sense and modern information channels like Internet and similar I'm confident you're the most qualified to know how your son is doing, and should be cared for. So stop paying attention to strangers who "knows better", because they dont. Period.

And by the way, its not "nallaa" but "naarak", meaning "cute" (น่ารัก), and the only thing you have to worry about is when the Thais eventually start napping your son out of his stroller, because he's so cute they simple HAVE to cuddle with him...

Get used to it.

I believe the first month at home with an an infant is the single most emotional and private moment you can possibly imagine and no outsider is getting access to my family during this crucial moment in an infants life - this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father.

Sorry to disagree somewhat....

Are you saying that the newborn also feels the same way as the parents do at that stage of the game?

You are correct, the biological father and mother want the most and closest intimacy to bond with their newborn child, but are you saying the newborn feels the same way as biological parents do at that time period?

I seriously doubt if the feeling is mutual.

As mature adults, the more we love and care about someone or something, the more we wish to be closer to that entity, and that is universally understandable.

Just like you and other parents feel that it is best that you are closest to your newborn.

But the newborn does not possess all the feelings and senses as parents do now, do they?

And it is perfectly alright for parents to feel and say that....

....this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father.

But in terms of reality, the baby just has not developed such high and advanced senses of love and reciprocity as yet.... is my humble one man opinion.

Regardless of what I said, it is mighty good to feel the way you did. Yes, particularly infants they do need the most caring and loving from loving and appreciating parents. But the infant is incapable to feel the same way parents do at that point in time.

Congrats. :jap:

Edited May 6, 2011 by vont

[Senia]

....this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father.

But in terms of reality, the baby just has not developed such high and advanced senses of love and reciprocity as yet.... is my humble one man opinion.

Regardless of what I said, it is mighty good to feel the way you did. Yes, particularly infants they do need the most caring and loving from loving and appreciating parents. But the infant is incapable to feel the same way parents do at that point in time.

Congrats. :jap:

maybe not, most likely no .............. but what I can say for sure is, when there are 3 people looking at my baby, he is only looking at me !!!

when he cries, or is fussy , just the sound of my voice from the other side of the apartment, quietens him . I am his "go to " guy when it comes to soiled diapers, food, comforting ( when a flying mobile whacks him on the head ) .

it doesn't have to be the child's natural parents, anyone can play the role of an infants caretaker , but it's best when it is. Because that's when the bond starts and develops.

I was raised by my paternal grandmother for my first two years, even now as an adult she is my "go to " guy

One of the many things I have learnt by raising my own baby is that I have learnt to listen , I have had this discussion with several cousins of mine and we all agree that our parents don't really know us. My grandmother knows me better than I know myself !!!

DO you know that a "crying baby" and "sleeping like a baby" are myths ???? Most regular healthy babies hardly ever cry and although they sleep a lot , it's seldom over 5 hours at best , and it's not quiet deep sleep at all .

I am learning from listening to the sounds that my infant makes and his actions, to take appropriate action. If I am not his primary caregiver , how will I know ?

[Cuban]

From the way you write I assume you are non-Thai, I assume your husband is. Thais will often (always?) comment about luk kreung, usually in the positive and made in the best intentions. The issue about making negative comments about their own baby/child is however often a superstitious gesture to discourage evil-spirits from taking the child, their soul or some-such.

The other comments might also be well meaning as often in Thai families when a child is born the family members flock together to help stay with the new mother and take an active role in the work involved. When you are seen in what seems to be isolation (?) that is probably stirring a feeling of empathy in at least the other Thai Mothers, hence their desire to help you as to their eyes you appear without a support network.

The issues you have with helpers, this is staff management. If their kids are dicking around inside I might suggest that you tell them that you have a headache and the child needs to stay outside, every time. You pay them you should feel strong enough to call the tune. The washing etc. have the list of tasks they have to do while you are playing with your child.

I get the impression you are baby savvy with regards to baby health etc and maybe you might find some more detailed support at http://www.mumsnet.com/ rather than ThaiVisa.

HTH

[MikeyIdea]

Wonderful post Greg, nothing like refreshing old memories. Helps to realise that problems related to how to bring up kids actually do get smaller once they get older. Easy to forget that

20 times? My daughter was fed 24 times per day. She was screaming and throwing up every evening and I took both the grand mother (the source of the problem) and the mother to the doctors and she told both of them that the child is NOT screaming because she is hungry but of a totally opposite reason. The doctor patiently explained to the grand mother and the mother that they should look at the clock and not use their ears when deciding if it was time for food or not...

And the poor child was again fed before we even got the medicine and got out of the hospital.

Key Takeaway: Idea is 6 years old now and turned out just fine anyway

About the cradle and what's right and wrong when it comes to where the child should sleep.

A while back, my daughter was watching a family film on TV with me and she asked me why the 5-6 year old kid in the movie didn't sleep with her parents.

I asked what my daughter thought about what she saw and she answered me - Feel so sorry for him, naa song saan maak

There is something very wrong with the way WESTERN parents give their children their own beds and own rooms as early as possible so that the parants themselves can sleep well

Hiding behind that it is a need for the child or better for the child. Bullshit. The child will tell us parents when she is ready for it, if we just care to listen

Not everything the Thais are doing is wrong Senia, just most of it

Edited May 9, 2011 by MikeyIdea

[vont]

Wonderful post Greg, nothing like refreshing old memories. Helps to realise that problems related to how to bring up kids actually do get smaller once they get older. Easy to forget that

20 times? My daughter was fed 24 times per day. She was screaming and throwing up every evening and I took both the grand mother (the source of the problem) and the mother to the doctors and she told both of them that the child is NOT screaming because she is hungry but of a totally opposite reason. The doctor patiently explained to the grand mother and the mother that they should look at the clock and not use their ears when deciding if it was time for food or not...

And the poor child was again fed before we even got the medicine and got out of the hospital.

Key Takeaway: Idea is 6 years old now and turned out just fine anyway

About the cradle and what's right and wrong when it comes to where the child should sleep.

A while back, my daughter was watching a family film on TV with me and she asked me why the 5-6 year old kid in the movie didn't sleep with her parents.

I asked what my daughter thought about what she saw and she answered me - Feel so sorry for him, naa song saan maak

Ther99e is something very wrong with the way WESTERN parents give their children their own beds and own rooms as early as possible so that the parants themselves can sleep well

Hiding behind that it is a need for the child or better for the child. Bullshit. The child will tell us parents when she is ready for it, if we just care to listen

Not everything the Thais are doing is wrong Senia, just most of it

MikeyIdea

Are you very sure of what you said here....

....Not everything the Thais are doing is wrong Senia, just most of it ....

What criteria do we use to judge or decide that most of what Thais do is WRONG or INCORRECT.... pls?

We think they are wrong because they are not doing it our westernized ways....? or

We think they are wrong because they are not doing it the way we were brought up....? or

We regard what they do as incorrect because they do it so differently or so presumably backward and antiquated....?

If we were to ask those Thais about what we did.... the answers would be a shocker to most of us as well.... that

they also regard what most of us westerners do as incorrect and wrong.... as well....

Just because the westerners and Thais and/or Chinese do so many things so drastically different....

it does not mean that the others are wrong now.... does it? :jap:

[MikeyIdea]

*************

About the cradle and what's right and wrong when it comes to where the child should sleep.

A while back, my daughter was watching a family film on TV with me and she asked me why the 5-6 year old kid in the movie didn't sleep with her parents.

I asked what my daughter thought about what she saw and she answered me - Feel so sorry for him, naa song saan maak

There is something very wrong with the way WESTERN parents give their children their own beds and own rooms as early as possible so that the parants themselves can sleep well

Hiding behind that it is a need for the child or better for the child. Bullshit. The child will tell us parents when she is ready for it, if we just care to listen

Not everything the Thais are doing is wrong Senia, just most of it

MikeyIdea

Are you very sure of what you said here....

....Not everything the Thais are doing is wrong Senia, just most of it ....

What criteria do we use to judge or decide that most of what Thais do is WRONG or INCORRECT.... pls?

We think they are wrong because they are not doing it our westernized ways....? or

We think they are wrong because they are not doing it the way we were brought up....? or

We regard what they do as incorrect because they do it so differently or so presumably backward and antiquated....?

If we were to ask those Thais about what we did.... the answers would be a shocker to most of us as well.... that

they also regard what most of us westerners do as incorrect and wrong.... as well....

Just because the westerners and Thais and/or Chinese do so many things so drastically different....

it does not mean that the others are wrong now.... does it? :jap:

I do most things in my life the Thai way after 20 years here, more than 10 of them speaking more Thai than English

It was meant as a joke to the OP who obvoiusly hasn't been here as long as we have vont. The longer we stay in Asia, the more we appreciate the way things are done here. The process takes years and years

Feeding babies 24 times per day and teaching them to be afraid of water to protect them from drowning, like most poor Thais do thinking they are doing the right thing, is not beneficial for children

Giving children their own beds and their own rooms before they are ready for it, like most westerners do thinking they are doing the right thing, is not beneficial for children

In fact, feeding a baby 24 times per day doesn't kill her at all, she just screams of pain every evening between 8 and 10 PM for 2 months

In fact, giving a too small child a room of her own and turn off the light when it's time to sleep doesn't kill her, it just makes her lie there all alone and afraid until she falls asleep every night for 2 years

Just a couple of extreme facts, funny facts emphasising the very interesting differences between the East and the West

:jap:

[Boo]

There is something very wrong with the way WESTERN parents give their children their own beds and own rooms as early as possible so that the parants themselves can sleep well

Giving children their own beds and their own rooms before they are ready for it, like most westerners do thinking they are doing the right thing, is not beneficial for children

In fact, giving a too small child a room of her own and turn off the light when it's time to sleep doesn't kill her, it just makes her lie there all alone and afraid until she falls asleep every night for 2 years

Do you have any proof to this claim? I think you will find that the above is your opinion only. There are studies for & against either method but not all children are afraid of the dark or have issues sleeping alone nor feel traumatised by sleeping by themselves. Just because you do it doesn't make you right & anyone else wrong.

[sarahsbloke]

now the two girls are way better but they ask 1 million and 1 questions that is just not right ...........how much does your husband give you every month ? why doesn't he come home every night ???

After establishing ages (so they know to use 'nong' or 'pee') the next two questions every woman exchanges in Thailand would be those.

Congratulations you have been accepted by a Thai community.

PS

Advise is knowledge you give away

Advice is knowledge given to you

Oh

And congrats on the baby (5 months until mine arrives)

Edited May 9, 2011 by sarahsbloke

[Carry]

Oh the addopting part has nothing to do with your motherhood skills, my husbands family offered to take my baby until our next visit [3 months later] so I could have some time for myself and all.....?!?!?!?! At this stage my baby was 4 months old and I thought they were making a joke but they didnt.

It had been a long time since there had been a baby in the family and us only staying 3 days was waaaaay to short so why not?

My baby is seriously afraid of water since our last visit because the whole family would gather and put her in ice cold water at least 3 times a day, poor kid.

And yes my baby got 4 bottles of milk in 24 hours at the age of 4 months and slept through the night from 8 in the evening till 7 in the morning, my husband wasnt sure about this because there's different ways in Thailand but seeing her being all chubby and happy and well not having to get up 4 times a night or walking around with a bottle of milk all day made him realize it wasnt too bad...

To be honest the most moms around here are nice young women and I learned some stuff from them and the other way around...luckily we dont live to close to the thai family, great people but I think I would go nuts having them around day and night, good luck with that one...follow your own path

[MikeyIdea]

*quote*There is something very wrong with the way WESTERN parents give their children their own beds and own rooms as early as possible so that the parents themselves can sleep well*/quote*

Giving children their own beds and their own rooms before they are ready for it, like most westerners do thinking they are doing the right thing, is not beneficial for children

In fact, giving a too small child a room of her own and turn off the light when it's time to sleep doesn't kill her, it just makes her lie there all alone and afraid until she falls asleep every night for 2 years

Do you have any proof to this claim? I think you will find that the above is your opinion only. There are studies for & against either method but not all children are afraid of the dark or have issues sleeping alone nor feel traumatised by sleeping by themselves. Just because you do it doesn't make you right & anyone else wrong.

Boo, I'm not one of those who think that you need a Ph.D to know that the vast majority of young children are afraid of the dark. That any parent can see for themselves by studying their children

I have of course no idea if the average child in average is afraid for 6 months or 2 years. The number was given jokingly to emphasise to the OP that we should not automatically assume that the way one culture is doing it is right and another wrong

Just because you do it doesn't make you right & anyone else wrong.

Hear, hear. A moderator at ThaiVisa who takes to personal attack. Anyone else who is not surprised?

Edited May 10, 2011 by MikeyIdea

[sbk]

I don't see a personal attack, I see someone who disagrees with you. The ability to express ones own opinion is certainly allowed. You expressed yours, so I would suggest you offer others that same courtesy.

[MikeyIdea]

I don't see a personal attack, I see someone who disagrees with you. The ability to express ones own opinion is certainly allowed. You expressed yours, so I would suggest you offer others that same courtesy.

Please explain how this friendly not personally attacking moderator did not use personal attack by insinuating that I feel traumatised and am afraid of sleeping alone

[nocturn]

....this is the time when the baby needs to feel the physical presence of the mother and father.

But in terms of reality, the baby just has not developed such high and advanced senses of love and reciprocity as yet.... is my humble one man opinion.

Regardless of what I said, it is mighty good to feel the way you did. Yes, particularly infants they do need the most caring and loving from loving and appreciating parents. But the infant is incapable to feel the same way parents do at that point in time.

Congrats. :jap:

maybe not, most likely no .............. but what I can say for sure is, when there are 3 people looking at my baby, he is only looking at me !!!

when he cries, or is fussy , just the sound of my voice from the other side of the apartment, quietens him . I am his "go to " guy when it comes to soiled diapers, food, comforting ( when a flying mobile whacks him on the head ) .

it doesn't have to be the child's natural parents, anyone can play the role of an infants caretaker , but it's best when it is. Because that's when the bond starts and develops.

I was raised by my paternal grandmother for my first two years, even now as an adult she is my "go to " guy

One of the many things I have learnt by raising my own baby is that I have learnt to listen , I have had this discussion with several cousins of mine and we all agree that our parents don't really know us. My grandmother knows me better than I know myself !!!

DO you know that a "crying baby" and "sleeping like a baby" are myths ???? Most regular healthy babies hardly ever cry and although they sleep a lot , it's seldom over 5 hours at best , and it's not quiet deep sleep at all .

I am learning from listening to the sounds that my infant makes and his actions, to take appropriate action. If I am not his primary caregiver , how will I know ?

this stands to reason, you possess the breasts. my kid didn't care for me until she was a year old. now i am preferred.

sounds like you were "adjusting" to motherhood and culture at the same time. generally it is the other way around here, as the father i received nothing but congratulations for my part in the whole process which was simply to pay for medical care and inseminate.

it was also much easier for me to tell interlopers to bugger off.

[nocturn]

I don't see a personal attack, I see someone who disagrees with you. The ability to express ones own opinion is certainly allowed. You expressed yours, so I would suggest you offer others that same courtesy.

Please explain how this friendly not personally attacking moderator did not use personal attack by insinuating that I feel traumatised and am afraid of sleeping alone

[

Just because you do it doesn't make you right & anyone else wrong.

because you are hypersensitive and misread her post. she was CLEARLY referring to your preferred method of keeping the child with you at night, not implying you have suffered any sort of trauma.

May I add though that your knee jerk reaction may suggest that had boo's intention been to claim you had issues yourself, she may well have hit the target.

While i generally find boo quite irritating, i have to go with her on this one.

Edited May 10, 2011 by nocturn

[MikeyIdea]

I don't see a personal attack, I see someone who disagrees with you. The ability to express ones own opinion is certainly allowed. You expressed yours, so I would suggest you offer others that same courtesy.

Please explain how this friendly not personally attacking moderator did not use personal attack by insinuating that I feel traumatised and am afraid of sleeping alone

[

Just because you do it doesn't make you right & anyone else wrong.

because you are hypersensitive and misread her post. she was CLEARLY referring to your preferred method of keeping the child with you at night, not implying you have suffered any sort of trauma.

May I add though that your knee jerk reaction may suggest that had boo's intention been to claim you had issues yourself, she may well have hit the target.

While i generally find boo quite irritating, i have to go with her on this one.

It would be better if a moderator meant what she wrote and not write one thing and then clearly mean something slightly different that changes the whole meaning

Boo, if this is the case, then I of course apologise for misunderstanding your intention

nocturn, I find Boo good, it's sbk that I generally find irritating

Edited May 10, 2011 by MikeyIdea

[sbk]

Yes, well, good to know. And I would suggest to you that if a moderator appears to be posting in a non-moderator manner that you take it that way.

Which, by the way, is not what I am doing here. So, perhaps best to drop whatever your issues are and get back to the topic at hand

[MikeyIdea]

Senia, most of us here have felt the need to vent and add exclamation marks just like you did. You can read a few of my experiences and laugh at them to cheer you up if you want. Maybe it can help to prepare you a bit for some other strange things that is likely to surprise or upset you

http://www.thaivisa....24#entry3086624

http://www.thaivisa....88#entry3098888

The most important message is that it doesn't matter at the end of the day. The differences go on and on and, they just change in shape and colour. Just wait until your child turns 3 and trained Thai teachers in an expensive kindergarten put a pencil in her hand and try to teach her to write A, B C

Not even that matters really, it's just a complete waste of time

Here's another interesting thread for when school comes closer in a few years time. Time flies so fast with kids

http://www.thaivisa....-and-tradition/

Cultural differences don't go away, we just learn to appreciate them

Smile when you encounter them

Edited May 10, 2011 by MikeyIdea

[IMA_FARANG]

I'm just guessing (and I'm a male, to boot) but this is your first child, right?

The point is...don't worry so much...your baby will survive all the "attention" it gets.

But if you want you have the right to insist that they don't feed your baby without your approval. I'm sure your Thai neighbors...especially those who have children...will agree when they hear apout it.

Just be polite in asking that they don't feed your baby without you approving it.

Or you cn just politely request they leave because you have to breast feed the baby...whether you do or not.

If they ask why, just tell them because breast feeding is "healthy" for the baby.

They may think you're just another "farang baa", but they will get used to it.

[Senia]

From the way you write I assume you are non-Thai, I assume your husband is. Thais will often (always?) comment about luk kreung, usually in the positive and made in the best intentions. The issue about making negative comments about their own baby/child is however often a superstitious gesture to discourage evil-spirits from taking the child, their soul or some-such.

The other comments might also be well meaning as often in Thai families when a child is born the family members flock together to help stay with the new mother and take an active role in the work involved. When you are seen in what seems to be isolation (?) that is probably stirring a feeling of empathy in at least the other Thai Mothers, hence their desire to help you as to their eyes you appear without a support network.

The issues you have with helpers, this is staff management. If their kids are dicking around inside I might suggest that you tell them that you have a headache and the child needs to stay outside, every time. You pay them you should feel strong enough to call the tune. The washing etc. have the list of tasks they have to do while you are playing with your child.

I get the impression you are baby savvy with regards to baby health etc and maybe you might find some more detailed support at http://www.mumsnet.com/ rather than ThaiVisa.

HTH

it's not about baby support , thanks for the tip though

it's about dealing with meddling locals

[RueFang]

Oh the addopting part has nothing to do with your motherhood skills, my husbands family offered to take my baby until our next visit [3 months later] so I could have some time for myself and all.....?!?!?!?! At this stage my baby was 4 months old and I thought they were making a joke but they didnt.

This whole thread cracks me up as my Thai husband and I are considering moving back to Thailand when bub is 7 or 8 mths old and I know this is what I'm in for if we do it!

I am only 5 months pregnant and my mother-in-law has already told my husband that she wants to take care of the baby if I don't want it!! Just have to see the funny side, although can be hard when you're living with it 24/7.

[Senia]

Rue Fang / Forethat : It's really hard because they are disecting my "motherhood" skills, which I will be the first to admit is none, but I rely on baby sites and pediatric sites and my grandma ( over the phone ) for help. But it's hard because they are bent on tradition . Like Gregb describes it "they cry if you don't feed them fast enough ", she probably knows that something is wrong but she does not know what else to do and how to do it differently.

it's gotten worse now, neighbour has been bitching to everyone that I am "keng leng " ( talk too much ) when I counter his stupid advice with actual facts, he can't get it through his thick head that mothers use the internet to raise a child !!!!! and his stay at home wife gossips to EVERYONE!!!!

IMAFARANG : please re-read thread

MikeyIdea : my baby actually likes the dark, I always thought that he is too young to care, he is however fussy when left alone for too long in his own bed so he sleeps with me almost every night, but I would prefer him to eventually be independent

GregB : you spoke too soon, just last Friday, cleaner comes in and declares that my boo is big enough , next month I should be starting solids .................. at 3 mths I think not !!!

I have to go with recommended criterias ( I let him lick stuff though - applesauce and a raisin bun ........ shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh don't tell )

Vont : ....Not everything the Thais are doing is wrong Senia, just most of it ....

What criteria do we use to judge or decide that most of what Thais do is WRONG or INCORRECT.... pls?

modern pediatric care vont - even Thai doctors agree with what I am doing. Thai doctors know of the problems with overfeeding, swaddling , not sending baby for necessary treatments etc. I am with Mikey on this.

my baby has a yeast infection on his neck, they keep gossiping on how I don't bathe the baby because he stinks, I do ....... everyday, with warm water. But a YEAST INFECTION STINKS and water makes it stink even more !!! produce more yeast !!!! I don't speak enough Thai for me to get the message through to them , instead, I just don't take him out where they can smell him ............. poor boo has been in the room most of this week

Sarahsbloke : I realised my mistake when I came back , must have had a concussion when the mobile struck me on my head !!!!!!!

also I can't spell

congrats on baby

sbk : as a moderator ................... you rawk !!!

[vont]

"keng leng " ( talk too much )

probably, keng leng, more likely means healthy or strong.... not talk too much;

if my Thai serves me correctly.

But then again, who knows? LOL

[Mirth]

Somewhere around the globe a thai woman is going through the same thing. Unable to converse clearly other than thai, she finds it hard to explain to her in laws and neighbours that she was brought up wrapped, bathed 2 or 3 times a day, allowed to sit bare buttocks or even walk around bare. She have no idea what is BCG, measles or chicken pox innoculation cos back in the woods, mama and granny boil roots and chicken when kid is sick, and sometimes, even burn a piece of paper in a glass, fill it with water and give it to the kid to drink.

Sometimes, we have to just tolerate cos we are not in our homeland where health care is first rate and baby mortality are low. When no harm is done, no foul but have to admit, some things are overboard like drinking the paper thing.

With my 1st born, i simply tolerate but if it's too much like wrapping till my kid is red and sweaty, i will just remove the wrappings infront of everyone and wipe her sweat. It took me only once and everyone understood that my kid don't like it, not the father.

With my 2nd born, they know and understand that things i do for my kids are proven, safe and best for the child. They don't force their ways anymore and occasionally will come and ask advice for their own, relative's or neighbour's kid.

What am trying to say is, just be more patient, be a bit more tolerant. Know it's hard just giving birth and hubby runs off to work leaving you alone with the kid, family and neighbour. To make things worse, language barrier.

Having children are the best things in life as most parents would agree. Learning to be more patient, diplomatic, tolerant and forgiving is the next. In the long run, no man or woman is an island and as another contributor stated in another thread, smart people work their way around obstacles, not fight or challenge them.