Taking My Thai Wife To England

[Ballantyne]

And there was me thinking that this forum was supposed to be a way of gaining information in assisting to get a visa for their wife etc. Now 7x7 I am aware that the only thing that you seem to be truly interested in is character assassination and misinterpreting the average persons comments just like mine. How sad. '7by7' timestamp='1305322783' post='4422289']

Mr Ballantyne,

You say that you are a decent person and object to jumping through hoops you presume are there to deter the average person; the clear implication being that you do not consider the average person, which includes myself and probably most members here, to be as decent as yourself.

You object to having to 'suffer the indignity' of being forced to live in the UK with the average people you consider beneath you in order to take advantage of the benefits of living in the UK, i.e. free health care. Tough, if you want your wife to enjoy such benefits then you and she have to follow the same rules as the rest of us in order for her to be entitled to them.

You say that you were entirely unaware that your wife had registered with a GP, yet you said in an earlier post that your understanding was that she had been registered with a doctor! Which is the truth? It can't be both statements.

Having contradicted yourself on this point, why should anyone believe anything else you say? That would certainly be the attitude of any ECO with an application in front of them containing contradictory statements.

You boast about how much tax you pay, this boast being an indication of how much you earn. This boast, if true, clearly indicates that you could easily afford to pay for private treatment for your wife, in the UK or in Thailand, and so not be forced to 'suffer the indignity' of actually having to live in the UK amongst us average people you consider beneath you.

If the above, and my earlier comments, offend you; so be it.

[NanLaew]

No worries Ballantyne, this is just an internet forum after all. If you come across as a stuffed shirt with more money than sense, that's entirely up to the individual making that call. I think you are quite a polite chap actually. The NHS related diatribe (not yours) is hilarious. It's an 'abuse' that the system leaves itself wide-open to when any Tom, Dick and Harriet can walk in, see a doctor with the general assumption from staff and doctors that this person is entitled to NHS care. You weren't out to defraud the system but by the same token, the system doesn't have any real protection either... apart from the patients honesty.

In the meantime, regarding post #28 - "I understand if the child is born in Thailand and his/her son is born outside of the UK then he won't be entitled to a UK passport." Where did you get that misinformation? If you are indeed a UK Citizen, then your son/daughter by descent will also be entitled to UK citizenship and a passport regardless of place of birth. Now THEIR progeny does need to jump through an additional hoop due to the excesses of the Borders, Citizenship and Immigration Act 2009 wherein "the parent (by descent) is normally expected to have lived in the UK for three consecutive years and apply to register the child as a British citizen while the child is a minor." This is actually a loosening of the previous legislation wherein the child registration had to be done before his/her first birthday. However, they are not barred from holding UK citizenship or a passport... eventually.

My son was born in Thailand of a Thai mother and a Scottish father and has both British and Thai passports and nationality; his call when he gets to 21 if he wants one, the other or both (shhhhh). However, I am not letting the choices of nationality of what will be my grandchildren (if any) rent too much space in my head. You may be nurturing a dynasty though so, as they say here, 'up to you.'

Having said that, if Westminster totally takes their eye off the ball and Scotland gains independence and decrees new passports for the Jockinese diaspora, all bets are off as I reckon I will have enough sh!t on my plate.

Edited May 14, 2011 by NanLaew

[Ballantyne]

Dear NanLaew, Thanks for your comments and coming back on topic. I have had a couple of stressful days with all the vitriol that has been flying around at me for the last couple of days.

Thanks for your understanding it's put me in a better frame of mind.

As for the dynasty I think that 1 or 2 should probably be enough to keep me busy for the foreseeable future. Yes the reason that I wanted to have the child in the UK was not particularly to save money as a certain presumptuous moron has stated but rather to give my child the opportunity when they have their children to "not have to jump through all the hoops" that i am currently having to do. It is indeed their progeny that I wish to protect. As you mentioned perhaps I am looking far too long term, and should just concentrate on the matters a little closer to home.

As for your little one, I wish you all the best with raising him and "mum's the word" let's keep our fingers crossed for his nationality or should i say nationalities? ;o) Let's see what happens with our Scottish independence.

Once again thanks for your understanding i couldn't have summed up the "Diatribe" better myself!

All the Best.

Ballantyne.

No worries Ballantyne, this is just an internet forum after all. If you come across as a stuffed shirt with more money than sense, that's entirely up to the individual making that call. I think you are quite a polite chap actually. The NHS related diatribe (not yours) is hilarious. It's an 'abuse' that the system leaves itself wide-open to when any Tom, Dick and Harriet can walk in, see a doctor with the general assumption from staff and doctors that this person is entitled to NHS care. You weren't out to defraud the system but by the same token, the system doesn't have any real protection either... apart from the patients honesty.

In the meantime, regarding post #28 - "I understand if the child is born in Thailand and his/her son is born outside of the UK then he won't be entitled to a UK passport." Where did you get that misinformation? If you are indeed a UK Citizen, then your son/daughter by descent will also be entitled to UK citizenship and a passport regardless of place of birth. Now THEIR progeny does need to jump through an additional hoop due to the excesses of the Borders, Citizenship and Immigration Act 2009 wherein "the parent (by descent) is normally expected to have lived in the UK for three consecutive years and apply to register the child as a British citizen while the child is a minor." This is actually a loosening of the previous legislation wherein the child registration had to be done before his/her first birthday. However, they are not barred from holding UK citizenship or a passport... eventually.

My son was born in Thailand of a Thai mother and a Scottish father and has both British and Thai passports and nationality; his call when he gets to 21 if he wants one, the other or both (shhhhh). However, I am not letting the choices of nationality of what will be my grandchildren (if any) rent too much space in my head. You may be nurturing a dynasty though so, as they say here, 'up to you.'

Having said that, if Westminster totally takes their eye off the ball and Scotland gains independence and decrees new passports for the Jockinese diaspora, all bets are off as I reckon I will have enough sh!t on my plate.

Edited May 14, 2011 by Lite Beer
Flame removed.

[7by7]

And there was me thinking that this forum was supposed to be a way of gaining information in assisting to get a visa for their wife etc.

It is, and you were given that information but your subsequent comments indicate that you consider you and your family should be exempt from the immigration rules that apply to us ordinary folk.

Now 7x7 I am aware that the only thing that you seem to be truly interested in is character assassination and misinterpreting the average persons comments just like mine

Misinterpretation? Really? Then how do explain saying in this post "My understanding is that she has somehow already been registered at the doctors surgery from one of her previous visits" and then in this post you say "Just for the record I was entirely unaware that she has or might have been registered with the doctor."

Both statements cannot be true.

You now call yourself an average person; a bit different from here: "It is quite remarkable how many hoops they make decent individuals jump through. It is truly a minefield. Presumably to deter the average person."

You have been given various options: settlement, visits and private medical treatment, work permit (although I am nort as convinced as Bangkockney that'll work). To which I'll add a fourth; don't come to the UK at all. It is up to you which you choose.

As you will no doubt be glad to hear; that is my final word to you.

[Ballantyne]

You really do seem to have one giant chip on your shoulder 7x7. I think that it's about time that you climbed off your high horse, stop your assumptions and stick to your job which to my understanding is supposed to be moderating a web forum and not playing God.If you have nothing left positive to add to my thread then don't add anything at all.You started by being helpful and I was grateful. It is such a shame that you had to spoil it with your vitriol and character assassinations. You have ended up coming across to me as truly unpleasant piece of work. I couldn't be more pleased that I won't be hearing from you again. I just hope that you are indeed a man of your word. I truly hope that you may find some semblance of peace in your life.

And there was me thinking that this forum was supposed to be a way of gaining information in assisting to get a visa for their wife etc.

It is, and you were given that information but your subsequent comments indicate that you consider you and your family should be exempt from the immigration rules that apply to us ordinary folk.

Now 7x7 I am aware that the only thing that you seem to be truly interested in is character assassination and misinterpreting the average persons comments just like mine

Misinterpretation? Really? Then how do explain saying in this post "My understanding is that she has somehow already been registered at the doctors surgery from one of her previous visits" and then in this post you say "Just for the record I was entirely unaware that she has or might have been registered with the doctor."

Both statements cannot be true.

You now call yourself an average person; a bit different from here: "It is quite remarkable how many hoops they make decent individuals jump through. It is truly a minefield. Presumably to deter the average person."

You have been given various options: settlement, visits and private medical treatment, work permit (although I am nort as convinced as Bangkockney that'll work). To which I'll add a fourth; don't come to the UK at all. It is up to you which you choose.

As you will no doubt be glad to hear; that is my final word to you.

[NanLaew]

Certainly seems a bit out of order for 7by7 who usually gives comprehensive and accurate visa advice when he/she isn't moderating. I can see where the writing style and some of the OP's comments could be taken as if he was 'looking down his nose' at some of us but bugger me, that's just an opinion on an internet forum. Can't see why one needs to get their panties in a turmoil and would have expected a thicker skin.

PS. Ballantyne's is cack whiskey IMHO.

[transam]

Certainly seems a bit out of order for 7by7 who usually gives comprehensive and accurate visa advice when he/she isn't moderating. I can see where the writing style and some of the OP's comments could be taken as if he was 'looking down his nose' at some of us but bugger me, that's just an opinion on an internet forum. Can't see why one needs to get their panties in a turmoil and would have expected a thicker skin.

PS. Ballantyne's is cack whiskey IMHO.

Perhaps you are in the same bracket as the OP and read stuff different to us mere average folk eh.

[NanLaew]

Certainly seems a bit out of order for 7by7 who usually gives comprehensive and accurate visa advice when he/she isn't moderating. I can see where the writing style and some of the OP's comments could be taken as if he was 'looking down his nose' at some of us but bugger me, that's just an opinion on an internet forum. Can't see why one needs to get their panties in a turmoil and would have expected a thicker skin.

PS. Ballantyne's is cack whiskey IMHO.

Perhaps you are in the same bracket as the OP and read stuff different to us mere average folk eh.

Perhaps it's the natural superiority of the Scots...? That and our naturally thick skin.

[iainiain101]

Interesting thread that seems to have gone a bit off course.

I have been with my Thai wife now for over 5 years. We got married this week after following local protocol and visiting the local Amphur to sign everything off. She has been to England 3 times before on 6 months visas and has always returned in the allotted time-frame. We have always spent 6 months in the UK and 6 months in Thailand (we have a farm in Chiang Rai). When I go back for work I take her with me. She is now 2 months pregnant and I want to have our child in the UK for many obvious reasons. I have not decided where to bring up the child yet and would like to keep all of my options open. My intention is to spend at least 6 months in the UK with my wife so that she can be taken care of by her grandmother (my mother). The baby is due to be born in November and I am supposed to be returning to the UK in early June of this year.

From my reading of it, the OP and his partner have always managed to move within the framework of visitors visas, but now that a child is on the way require an extended stay in the UK 'for obvious reasons'. I for one initially thought this was a medical or financial decision, but the OP has now confirmed it is to try and guarantee his grandchildren British citizenship.

So the question I have is how are the children of a British person born abroad treated differently to those that are born in Britain? Does the mothers nationality have a bearing, and is the child treated differently if the mother is on a visitors visa rather than a 'leave to remain' visa if the child is born in Britain?

Iain

[Ballantyne]

That is an excellent question Iain and one that I would also like the answer to.

I am however quite certain that if my child was not born in the UK and my son/daughter were then to have their child abroad then their progeny would not necessarily be entitled to a British passport. This is another of the reasons that I wish my wife to give birth in the UK. I am also most keen to stop having to make temporary visas for my wife to come back to the UK for 6 months. I think that it would be far better for all of us if we were able to come and go as we please. Especially after we have surely shown that our long-term intentions are honourable.

Interesting thread that seems to have gone a bit off course.

I have been with my Thai wife now for over 5 years. We got married this week after following local protocol and visiting the local Amphur to sign everything off. She has been to England 3 times before on 6 months visas and has always returned in the allotted time-frame. We have always spent 6 months in the UK and 6 months in Thailand (we have a farm in Chiang Rai). When I go back for work I take her with me. She is now 2 months pregnant and I want to have our child in the UK for many obvious reasons. I have not decided where to bring up the child yet and would like to keep all of my options open. My intention is to spend at least 6 months in the UK with my wife so that she can be taken care of by her grandmother (my mother). The baby is due to be born in November and I am supposed to be returning to the UK in early June of this year.

From my reading of it, the OP and his partner have always managed to move within the framework of visitors visas, but now that a child is on the way require an extended stay in the UK 'for obvious reasons'. I for one initially thought this was a medical or financial decision, but the OP has now confirmed it is to try and guarantee his grandchildren British citizenship.

So the question I have is how are the children of a British person born abroad treated differently to those that are born in Britain? Does the mothers nationality have a bearing, and is the child treated differently if the mother is on a visitors visa rather than a 'leave to remain' visa if the child is born in Britain?

Iain

[NanLaew]

Interesting thread that seems to have gone a bit off course.

I have been with my Thai wife now for over 5 years. We got married this week after following local protocol and visiting the local Amphur to sign everything off. She has been to England 3 times before on 6 months visas and has always returned in the allotted time-frame. We have always spent 6 months in the UK and 6 months in Thailand (we have a farm in Chiang Rai). When I go back for work I take her with me. She is now 2 months pregnant and I want to have our child in the UK for many obvious reasons. I have not decided where to bring up the child yet and would like to keep all of my options open. My intention is to spend at least 6 months in the UK with my wife so that she can be taken care of by her grandmother (my mother). The baby is due to be born in November and I am supposed to be returning to the UK in early June of this year.

From my reading of it, the OP and his partner have always managed to move within the framework of visitors visas, but now that a child is on the way require an extended stay in the UK 'for obvious reasons'. I for one initially thought this was a medical or financial decision, but the OP has now confirmed it is to try and guarantee his grandchildren British citizenship.

So the question I have is how are the children of a British person born abroad treated differently to those that are born in Britain? Does the mothers nationality have a bearing, and is the child treated differently if the mother is on a visitors visa rather than a 'leave to remain' visa if the child is born in Britain?

Iain

That is an excellent question Iain and one that I would also like the answer to.

I am however quite certain that if my child was not born in the UK and my son/daughter were then to have their child abroad then their progeny would not necessarily be entitled to a British passport. This is another of the reasons that I wish my wife to give birth in the UK. I am also most keen to stop having to make temporary visas for my wife to come back to the UK for 6 months. I think that it would be far better for all of us if we were able to come and go as we please. Especially after we have surely shown that our long-term intentions are honourable.

I already quoted the procedure in post #32, as follows.

The UK Borders, Citizenship and Immigration Act 2009 wherein "the parent (by descent) is normally expected to have lived in the UK for three consecutive years and apply to register the child as a British citizen while the child is a minor."

Wherein the 'parent (by descent)' is the OP's soon to be offspring. Therefore, at some time in his/her life, they need to plan on living in the UK for 36 months straight after which any of his/her children can be registered as a Brit.

You have to appreciate that these laws aren't written to <deleted> with law-abiding expatriate workers or international gyspy's like the OP and myself. They are designed to prevent those of disparate ethnicity coming over and claiming that they are a second-cousin to Auntie Mary's black pig and thus obtaining Britishness. If the OP is young enough, there's a good chance that he could oversee and manipulate the children and grandchildren's lives according to his wishes. However, I would consider that planning for events 30-40 years ahead of their time based on current immigration laws and regulations, the OP may be on a hiding for nothing.

Just a thought... what if some of the blighters turned up gay?

Edited May 15, 2011 by NanLaew

[Ballantyne]

Top Drawer Sir,

Forward planning for the "international Gypsy (myself included)" may be a forlorn approach. None of us truly know exactly what our most benevolent Government have in store for us next. Based on current regs still sounds like i'm doing the right thing mind. Thanks for the pointers.

PS: Prefer a single malt myself.

Interesting thread that seems to have gone a bit off course.

I have been with my Thai wife now for over 5 years. We got married this week after following local protocol and visiting the local Amphur to sign everything off. She has been to England 3 times before on 6 months visas and has always returned in the allotted time-frame. We have always spent 6 months in the UK and 6 months in Thailand (we have a farm in Chiang Rai). When I go back for work I take her with me. She is now 2 months pregnant and I want to have our child in the UK for many obvious reasons. I have not decided where to bring up the child yet and would like to keep all of my options open. My intention is to spend at least 6 months in the UK with my wife so that she can be taken care of by her grandmother (my mother). The baby is due to be born in November and I am supposed to be returning to the UK in early June of this year.

From my reading of it, the OP and his partner have always managed to move within the framework of visitors visas, but now that a child is on the way require an extended stay in the UK 'for obvious reasons'. I for one initially thought this was a medical or financial decision, but the OP has now confirmed it is to try and guarantee his grandchildren British citizenship.

So the question I have is how are the children of a British person born abroad treated differently to those that are born in Britain? Does the mothers nationality have a bearing, and is the child treated differently if the mother is on a visitors visa rather than a 'leave to remain' visa if the child is born in Britain?

Iain

That is an excellent question Iain and one that I would also like the answer to.

I am however quite certain that if my child was not born in the UK and my son/daughter were then to have their child abroad then their progeny would not necessarily be entitled to a British passport. This is another of the reasons that I wish my wife to give birth in the UK. I am also most keen to stop having to make temporary visas for my wife to come back to the UK for 6 months. I think that it would be far better for all of us if we were able to come and go as we please. Especially after we have surely shown that our long-term intentions are honourable.

I already quoted the procedure in post #32, as follows.

The UK Borders, Citizenship and Immigration Act 2009 wherein "the parent (by descent) is normally expected to have lived in the UK for three consecutive years and apply to register the child as a British citizen while the child is a minor."

Wherein the 'parent (by descent)' is the OP's soon to be offspring. Therefore, at some time in his/her life, they need to plan on living in the UK for 36 months straight after which any of his/her children can be registered as a Brit.

You have to appreciate that these laws aren't written to <deleted> with law-abiding expatriate workers or international gyspy's like the OP and myself. They are designed to prevent those of disparate ethnicity coming over and claiming that they are a second-cousin to Auntie Mary's black pig and thus obtaining Britishness. If the OP is young enough, there's a good chance that he could oversee and manipulate the children and grandchildren's lives according to his wishes. However, I would consider that planning for events 30-40 years ahead of their time based on current immigration laws and regulations, the OP may be on a hiding for nothing.

Just a thought... what if some of the blighters turned up gay?