Thaksin - Exiled In Dubai – But Still He Dreams Of Thailand

[yoshiwara]

Good article - outlines the duplicitous nature of K Thaksin. He doesnt want an amnesty - he wants his crimes expunged so that he can carry on his reign of terror. "What reign of terror?" the one which murdered 2700 people in his war on drugs and opponents. Not to mention being the mastermind behind the terrorism in Bangkok last year from the blackshirts to the idea of moving to Rachaprasong. There are enough charges and there is enough evidence against K Thaksin to convict him in any forward thinking western country. THAT is why he wants an amnesty!! "amnesty, amnesty forgive everybody - but ME first"!! The biggest step backwards would be for him to return to Thailand as its leader!!

Too bad there isn't a stronger libel law to protect former PM Thaksin, who was illegally removed from office and who was previously elected by the largest and widest margins in free Democratic elections in Thai history, from your baseless, unprovable, inaccurate and mendacious statements.

Actually what annoys me most is all these arrogant, derogatory comments regarding Thaksin supporters.

Buffalos, illiterates, ... But who these posters think they are ? Are they all Bill Gates or Steve Jobs ? Do they really all have a PhD in nuclear engineering ?

Do we have someone with a major in psychology here ? What in Thaksin success hurt them so much that they feel compelled to write such outrageous comments ?

Why siding with an "elite" to which they obviously don't belong ?

Mostly responding to the repeated lies of the Thaksin apologists re Thaksin being in 'elected' office when he was removed. He wasn't. His term of office had expired. The cheerleaders never, ever respond to this point. Just throw a strop. And obfuscate any understanding of class politics. As if Thaksin isn't a bourgeois? And allied with North Eastern ruling class interests. Inconvenient and ignored.

Edited May 31, 2011 by yoshiwara

[wolfmanjack]

All these moronic, uneducated, whisky swilling, bribe taking country folk still in spite of everything persist in voting for Thaksin. Could it be that they understand something about the nature of Thailand which is far too basic for all the erudite farangs here to comprehend? Could it be that they understand who are the real opponents of progress and equality in Thailand, could it be they understand that Abhisit is simply a pretty puppet for these powers?

Thaksin, knowingly or otherwise, showed these people their collective power, I don't think they will relinquish it, no matter what the army does.

Have any of you actually asked a red why they are voting for Thaksin ? My wife's family likes Thaksin because he killed so many "drug dealers" and they think it is ok that a "few" innocents got caught up in the crossfire. I try to explain to them they would not feel it was ok if their family were among the innocents that got killed but they just shrug that off. This is how they have thought ever since Thaksin was removed from office. He got rid of the drug problem in their little village so everything else he does is ok.

Now that they are part of the red machine and they are listening to the red propaganda blaming the democrats and the powers behind the scenes for the increase in food costs and fuel they have all kinds of reasons to quote for wanting thaksin back. None of their reasons make sense and when they ask me what i think i try to explain to them how illogical their accusations are they think i just do not understand.

[Thai at Heart]

I saw an interview with him on Australia network yesterday.

I couldn't help but smile when he talked about double standards in the law being applied to him. In other words, I did wrong, but so does everyone else. It doesn't make him innocent, but does sum up Thai business culture quite succinctly.

[wolfmanjack]

"but still he dreams of Thailand..."

Dream on...

Going by all the extreeme hatred of Thaskin here he must have really done some bad things to all the farangs. Personally he has not effected my life at all and I don't care if he becomes p.m. again. I really don't understand what farangs are so worried about. The election will come and go and life will go on.

and thats exactly what most Farrang on Thai visa fail to understand, he is very popular here in Thailand, he won 2 elections the only Prime minister to achieve that in recent history he was taken out by a military coup, hardly democratic. Whatever his faults may be he doesnt suffer from being unpopular with huge number of Thais. Are all the anti Thaksin Farrangs on here right and all the Thais that vote for him wrong? I doubt it. In any case his sister will be in power soon (that wouldnt happen if he was hated) I found life to be just the same here when Thaksin was in power so I also don't understand what the Thaksin haters are so bothered about.

I agree. I can't understand the thaskin bashing by farangs either. Life as expats know it will go on in this beautiful country regardless of who is P.M If all the Thaskin bashers were citizens and had a vote maybe I could understand it to a degree. It appears that many are self appointed voices of the Thai people and think that they know what is best for the majority. It is nice sitting on the fence.

Some of us pay income Taxes in thailand and have kids that are thai citizens. My kids go to a public school and i have seen a vast improvement in their school in the last two years with more improvements in the works. Therefore i would not like to see Thaksin get back in to resume stealing all of the money that pays for these improvements.

[whybother]

I saw an interview with him on Australia network yesterday.

I couldn't help but smile when he talked about double standards in the law being applied to him. In other words, I did wrong, but so does everyone else. It doesn't make him innocent, but does sum up Thai business culture quite succinctly.

Interview on ABC here: http://www.abc.net.au/news/video/2011/05/30/3231144.htm

[FOODLOVER]

Good article - outlines the duplicitous nature of K Thaksin. He doesnt want an amnesty - he wants his crimes expunged so that he can carry on his reign of terror. "What reign of terror?" the one which murdered 2700 people in his war on drugs and opponents. Not to mention being the mastermind behind the terrorism in Bangkok last year from the blackshirts to the idea of moving to Rachaprasong. There are enough charges and there is enough evidence against K Thaksin to convict him in any forward thinking western country. THAT is why he wants an amnesty!! "amnesty, amnesty forgive everybody - but ME first"!! The biggest step backwards would be for him to return to Thailand as its leader!!

Too bad there isn't a stronger libel law to protect former PM Thaksin, who was illegally removed from office and who was previously elected by the largest and widest margins in free Democratic elections in Thai history, from your baseless, unprovable, inaccurate and mendacious statements.

Yes that is what you really need is more libel laws. Funny true story: A Farang man calls his neighbor a " Fat Whore". The Fat whore in question then notified the police as apparently this is illegal here. Lawyer has to get involved to settle the matter. The fat whore lady then tells the lawyer and police officer that she is no longer a whore and she has put on weight because of her beer consumption so he is libelous. After getting up off the ground from laughter all things were settled for 500 baht. This all took about three days to accomplish. Legal fees were much higher.

I think there is a moral in this story.

Edited May 31, 2011 by FOODLOVER

[fatfather]

All these moronic, uneducated, whisky swilling, bribe taking country folk still in spite of everything persist in voting for Thaksin. Could it be that they understand something about the nature of Thailand which is far too basic for all the erudite farangs here to comprehend? Could it be that they understand who are the real opponents of progress and equality in Thailand, could it be they understand that Abhisit is simply a pretty puppet for these powers?

Thaksin, knowingly or otherwise, showed these people their collective power, I don't think they will relinquish it, no matter what the army does.

Have any of you actually asked a red why they are voting for Thaksin ? My wife's family likes Thaksin because he killed so many "drug dealers" and they think it is ok that a "few" innocents got caught up in the crossfire. I try to explain to them they would not feel it was ok if their family were among the innocents that got killed but they just shrug that off. This is how they have thought ever since Thaksin was removed from office. He got rid of the drug problem in their little village so everything else he does is ok.

Now that they are part of the red machine and they are listening to the red propaganda blaming the democrats and the powers behind the scenes for the increase in food costs and fuel they have all kinds of reasons to quote for wanting thaksin back. None of their reasons make sense and when they ask me what i think i try to explain to them how illogical their accusations are they think i just do not understand.

It's true, the rural Thais remember the benefits they received. 500baht for a vote or to go rally in Bangkok (one time payment), cheap hospital treatment (treatment is crap), easy 10,000baht credit (most didn't pay back yet). Under the new government they get a pension of 500baht/month from 60 years upwards but this is not remembered because 500baht/month is only little money per month. Thais prefer 10,000 once to 500/month , which is much more than 10,000 once. TIT

fatfather

[Buchholz]

I saw an interview with him on Australia network yesterday.

I couldn't help but smile when he talked about double standards in the law being applied to him. In other words, I did wrong, but so does everyone else. It doesn't make him innocent, but does sum up Thai business culture quite succinctly.

Did he repeat the below comments from his interview on Australia network ABC on 13/02/2007?

VATSIKOPOULOS: It must get a bit tedious getting from hotel to hotel, are you looking at making one place your base?

THAKSIN: Yes. I think.... I like to buy houses in different countries - for example I ask my friend to look for a house in Sydney, especially in the Eastern Suburbs.

VATSIKOPOULOS: Ultimately though would you like to go back to Thailand and live there?

THAKSIN: Oh yes, definitely. I love my family, I love my homeland, I want to be there. I want to do some charitable activities.

VATSIKOPOULOS: You’re not planning to re-enter politics at any time in the future?

THAKSIN: You will not see me in politics, not just in the next election, but for life.

http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/content/2007/s1847557.htm

[RayJrBKK]

"but still he dreams of Thailand..."

Dream on...

Going by all the extreeme hatred of Thaskin here he must have really done some bad things to all the farangs. Personally he has not effected my life at all and I don't care if he becomes p.m. again. I really don't understand what farangs are so worried about. The election will come and go and life will go on.

I don't think he has affected the lives of any foreigners in Thailand but it is just rather common sense that makes people dislike the guy, I don't think you need any examples...

Personally what disturbs me is that I think he doesn't care about the people (and I am not saying he is the only one) but he is very good at making them believe he does, basically everyone who gives him - or PT - a vote will most likely be disappointed (in terms of he is going to make our lives so much better). As someone pointed it out before he just throws cash around to make the poor believe he is helping them which he is in a way, unfortunately that "help" isn't sustainable and will not lead to long term development. The example of the 30 baht medical examination is a good example, yes people can find out if they have a problem but in case they do they still don't have the money for treatment and i don't think this measure he introduced covers the cost of it.

The reds say it is time for change, but the change they want is for the former PM to come back... what a change!

Why many foreigners hate the guy? Maybe because where most of us come from it would be impossible for a convicted former PM in exile to come back to power...

[Buchholz]

I saw an interview with him on Australia network yesterday.

I couldn't help but smile when he talked about double standards in the law being applied to him. In other words, I did wrong, but so does everyone else. It doesn't make him innocent, but does sum up Thai business culture quite succinctly.

Did he repeat the below comments from his interview on Australia network ABC on 13/02/2007?

VATSIKOPOULOS: It must get a bit tedious getting from hotel to hotel, are you looking at making one place your base?

THAKSIN: Yes. I think.... I like to buy houses in different countries - for example I ask my friend to look for a house in Sydney, especially in the Eastern Suburbs.

VATSIKOPOULOS: Ultimately though would you like to go back to Thailand and live there?

THAKSIN: Oh yes, definitely. I love my family, I love my homeland, I want to be there. I want to do some charitable activities.

VATSIKOPOULOS: You’re not planning to re-enter politics at any time in the future?

THAKSIN: You will not see me in politics, not just in the next election, but for life.

http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/content/2007/s1847557.htm

Interview on ABC here: http://www.abc.net.au/news/video/2011/05/30/3231144.htm

wow... guess he didn't repeat any of the same message.

He went from "you will not see me in politics" to talking about nothing but his involvement in politics.

Oh well, so much for his involvement in "charitable activities."

Can't say he does much for his "clone" in his latest version.

Also, his stumbling babbling over amnesty is very revealing.

.

Edited May 31, 2011 by Buchholz

[Thaddeus]

All these moronic, uneducated, whisky swilling, bribe taking country folk still in spite of everything persist in voting for Thaksin. Could it be that they understand something about the nature of Thailand which is far too basic for all the erudite farangs here to comprehend? Could it be that they understand who are the real opponents of progress and equality in Thailand, could it be they understand that Abhisit is simply a pretty puppet for these powers?

Thaksin, knowingly or otherwise, showed these people their collective power, I don't think they will relinquish it, no matter what the army does.

Have any of you actually asked a red why they are voting for Thaksin ? My wife's family likes Thaksin because he killed so many "drug dealers" and they think it is ok that a "few" innocents got caught up in the crossfire. I try to explain to them they would not feel it was ok if their family were among the innocents that got killed but they just shrug that off. This is how they have thought ever since Thaksin was removed from office. He got rid of the drug problem in their little village so everything else he does is ok.

Now that they are part of the red machine and they are listening to the red propaganda blaming the democrats and the powers behind the scenes for the increase in food costs and fuel they have all kinds of reasons to quote for wanting thaksin back. None of their reasons make sense and when they ask me what i think i try to explain to them how illogical their accusations are they think i just do not understand.

It's true, the rural Thais remember the benefits they received. 500baht for a vote or to go rally in Bangkok (one time payment), cheap hospital treatment (treatment is crap), easy 10,000baht credit (most didn't pay back yet). Under the new government they get a pension of 500baht/month from 60 years upwards but this is not remembered because 500baht/month is only little money per month. Thais prefer 10,000 once to 500/month , which is much more than 10,000 once. TIT

fatfather

Make a child an offer, tell them they can have one sweet now, but if they wait a couple of hours they can have three.... almost every child will take the one sweet now and then get upset when they don't get the three sweets later.

Thailand is a nation of children.

[Tanaka]

"There has to be a reason. They cannot just say we don't want you to become the government," he tells The Independent and another international newspaper. "If [our opponents] were to do something unethical, unlawful, it's not good for them, not good for the country, not good for the people... I really urge them to let things go according to what we call... democracy."

It really is a joke when this man talks about things unethical and unlawful. And I wonder what he means with "we call.. democracy". He has clearly stated that "democracy is not on my agenda"!

[idmilla]

"but still he dreams of Thailand..."

Dream on...

Going by all the extreeme hatred of Thaskin here he must have really done some bad things to all the farangs. Personally he has not effected my life at all and I don't care if he becomes p.m. again. I really don't understand what farangs are so worried about. The election will come and go and life will go on.

Speaking from my own experience I think my dislike stems from being suckered by him in 2001 when he came to power and truly believing that he was the man to sort Thailand out, there was a tremendous amount of optimism during the early days of his leadership and most Farangs I knew were fully behind him only to then discover he was not only as bad as those before him but actually much worse as he appeared to be blatant and arrogant about his abuses of power. Paying tax year after year and seeing this wasted through greed and corruption ate away at me over time and is without doubt no small part of my feeling towards the man.

[chooka]

"but still he dreams of Thailand..."

Dream on...

Going by all the extreeme hatred of Thaskin here he must have really done some bad things to all the farangs. Personally he has not effected my life at all and I don't care if he becomes p.m. again. I really don't understand what farangs are so worried about. The election will come and go and life will go on.

Speaking from my own experience I think my dislike stems from being suckered by him in 2001 when he came to power and truly believing that he was the man to sort Thailand out, there was a tremendous amount of optimism during the early days of his leadership and most Farangs I knew were fully behind him only to then discover he was not only as bad as those before him but actually much worse as he appeared to be blatant and arrogant about his abuses of power. Paying tax year after year and seeing this wasted through greed and corruption ate away at me over time and is without doubt no small part of my feeling towards the man.

Do you really think one thai politician is any different from another thai politician? Are any of them in politics for the good of the people and the the nation or are they simply there for thier own self gratification? These are the rich elite who have built thier family fortunes through corruption and the sweat of the common man. Are any of them going to give that away and dedicate thier lives to helping the rice farmers get a decent education so they to can share in the wealth? I think not because an educated peasant will be taking from thier wealth. Will any politican help out the poor hilltribe who eat what they can scrounge from the forests and provide them with recognised citizenship (I.D cards) health care etc I think not. Be it thaskin or whoever life will never change for millions of Thais. JJ and his jetskis, the tuk tuk, taxi drivers and National Parks will still be scamming farangs. The election will come and go and life as it is in Thailand will go on as it always has.

[bf2002]

Nice copy from the Thai English press, as usual.

The reality of T's statements makes it clear it's Abhisit vs. Thaksin. Classic yellow vs. red all over again.

And the yellows are desperate and are basically trying to create a "kinder, gentler" copy of the red's platform of tough on crime, money to the masses populist politics, and when it all goes awry, they will try the old election courts to stay in power.

Sell the country into debt (hmmm....what "developed" Western nations have tried that and are now in economical turmoil?), attack crime (good or bad, the crime is a symptom of the bigger issue of the economic mess Thailand is in) while never seeming to be able to end corruption among the crime fighters themselves, and then there is the matter of the press, the judicial system, and things we must not speak or write of.

There is only one bright side, and that isn't for the poor Thai masses....watch this cause the Siamese economy to at best grow slowly, and at worst go negative.....either way, whatever your home currency, watch this slow down the drop in your exchange rate or improve it or make it stay where it's at (depending on how badly your own part of farangland is doing), when in reality if politics were more stable here, odds are your developed nation currency would be worth less after the election.....somehow I don't think that will happen (exchange rates will only get worst compared to the Baht because the other country is in even worst trouble!!!!)

Then again, you might also offset this with your condo being worth less and/or your business making less income (or losing more money like so many tourist venues already are).

Maybe it'll finally end when they get so bad, the street lights are almost all off on sukumvit in BKK, like right after the Asian financial crisis and Thailand's massive collapse......maybe they just need to start back at that level (zero) to finally put their "personality wars" behind them....or until the masses, the middle class, and even the upper classes all come to realize it just ain't worth "winning" anymore.

As for Thaksin, I personally don't agree with what happened, but he really can't ever come back with amnesty, if this is going to ever end....unless maybe at "zero", his opposition just decides it ain't worth fighting for a piece of dirt and THEY all leave Siam with all their money.....then Thaksin can have his piece of dirt, because that's all there will be left.

[whybother]

Nice copy from the Thai English press, as usual.

The reality of T's statements makes it clear it's Abhisit vs. Thaksin. Classic yellow vs. red all over again.

And the yellows are desperate and are basically trying to create a "kinder, gentler" copy of the red's platform of tough on crime, money to the masses populist politics, and when it all goes awry, they will try the old election courts to stay in power.

Sell the country into debt (hmmm....what "developed" Western nations have tried that and are now in economical turmoil?), attack crime (good or bad, the crime is a symptom of the bigger issue of the economic mess Thailand is in) while never seeming to be able to end corruption among the crime fighters themselves, and then there is the matter of the press, the judicial system, and things we must not speak or write of.

<snip>

PTP policies ... reduce taxes, mega projects, credit cards, farmers subsidies, large increases in minimum wages, 1 billion baht for each university, 1 million baht for each village.

Who's selling the country into debt?

edit: Not quite classic yellow vs red, when the yellows party isn't even running.

Edited June 1, 2011 by whybother

[idmilla]

"but still he dreams of Thailand..."

Dream on...

Going by all the extreeme hatred of Thaskin here he must have really done some bad things to all the farangs. Personally he has not effected my life at all and I don't care if he becomes p.m. again. I really don't understand what farangs are so worried about. The election will come and go and life will go on.

Speaking from my own experience I think my dislike stems from being suckered by him in 2001 when he came to power and truly believing that he was the man to sort Thailand out, there was a tremendous amount of optimism during the early days of his leadership and most Farangs I knew were fully behind him only to then discover he was not only as bad as those before him but actually much worse as he appeared to be blatant and arrogant about his abuses of power. Paying tax year after year and seeing this wasted through greed and corruption ate away at me over time and is without doubt no small part of my feeling towards the man.

Do you really think one thai politician is any different from another thai politician? Are any of them in politics for the good of the people and the the nation or are they simply there for thier own self gratification? These are the rich elite who have built thier family fortunes through corruption and the sweat of the common man. Are any of them going to give that away and dedicate thier lives to helping the rice farmers get a decent education so they to can share in the wealth? I think not because an educated peasant will be taking from thier wealth. Will any politican help out the poor hilltribe who eat what they can scrounge from the forests and provide them with recognised citizenship (I.D cards) health care etc I think not. Be it thaskin or whoever life will never change for millions of Thais. JJ and his jetskis, the tuk tuk, taxi drivers and National Parks will still be scamming farangs. The election will come and go and life as it is in Thailand will go on as it always has.

This is my point many of us actually did think he was different probably because he was super rich when coming to power (and didn't need the money!) and a 'different' type of politician and therefore feel embarrassed that we were suckered into this thinking and ultimately disappointed in ourselves for being so foolish to believe him, going back to the first comment of must of done some bad things to all the Farangs this is my reason for disliking him disproportionally to other Thai politicians, ie foolish hope dashed.

[yeeowww]

Really bizarre in that the sister of a man that was happy to sponsor and burn down, destroy, loot, incite violence, can be so popular. There very well may be no other country on planet earth where something like this could happen. Truly amazing, but in the end the people will get the leadership they deserve.

if you happen to be at Central World, ask the security guards "Who set the fire?"

you will be very surprised by the answers you received.

None of todays security guards were there when the fires broke out, and take it that most of these low paid workers are themselves Red Shirts, and some were involved in the demonstration..... I dont think anyone with half a brain would be surprised with whatever answers were given... none will be the whole truth or anything like the whole truth. Just ask a certain Australian Red Shirt... or maybe that idiot was also a spy .... Get a life.. what is it they say, better to keep your mouth shut and let people think you are an idiot, that to open it and confirm the fact..!!!!!

You've gotta be kidding or extremely obtuse theo bag...

this pretty much spells it all out...