Thai Democrats Go For Broke

[webfact]

ANALYSIS

Democrats go for broke

By Somroutai Sapsomboon,

Tulsathit Taptim

The Nation

By reviving memories of May 19 mayhem, party is using an old tactic 'to woo undecided voters'

Almost two decades ago, a similar strategy stunned Chamlong Srimuang. It was a home-stretch election offensive that continues to fuel the long-held belief that the Democrats are the masters of character assassination. Accusing Chamlong of "leading people to their deaths" was not a noble tactic, but it worked quite well.

Can Yingluck Shinawatra and the Pheu Thai Party escape such a Democrat assault? After leading the 1992 anti-military uprising, which was followed by a brief interim-government break, Chamlong was poised to sweep Bangkok yet again in a general election, only for the Democrats to turn things around just a few weeks before votes were cast.

Whether Chamlong had seen it coming or not, Yingluck and Pheu Thai must have. Abhisit Vejjajiva's controversial plea on Thursday - that state power should not be given to those who burned the city - was a hard punch, but it had surely been expected. The question for his rivals is how they will respond to it, now that the Democrats have decided to go for broke.

The differences between then and now are obvious. Chamlong's popularity barely reached out of Bangkok, while Yingluck is gunning for a national landslide. More importantly, however, is the fact that while the Democrats had nothing to do with Chamlong "leading people to their deaths", the city burning was considered by the red shirts to be a direct response to the Abhisit government's "massacre" of protesters.

At that time, you either loved Chamlong or hated him, while the Democrats were an innocent neutral party campaigning on a "we respect parliamentary rules" platform. Now, you either love Yingluck and her brother Thaksin or hate them, but the same also goes for Abhisit. At that time, it was not a national divide; only a confused populace unsure if Chamlong was a hero or a selfish activist willing to see blood to achieve his purpose. This time, at least half the country doesn't care much, if at all, about the arson spree on May 19 last year.

There is a crucial similarity, the Democrats insist. A high-ranking source pointed out that there are a large number of "undecided" voters out there, especially in Bangkok. They can't measure the Democrats' shortcomings against the uncertainties accompanying the resurgence of Pheu Thai and possible return of Thaksin Shinawatra. It's these roughly 1 million voters to whom Abhisit wants to convey his "city burning" message.

"We are not trying to sway Pheu Thai supporters. Everyone knows we can't," said the source. "Our target is those who have not made up their minds." He stopped short of saying whether the strategy was also aimed at people leaning toward the "Vote No" campaign, which was initiated by the Democrats' estranged ally, the People's Alliance for Democracy.

The Democrats' strategy confirms that the ruling party won't surrender Bangkok without a fight. It won 26 seats against its bitter rival's 10 in the last election. But most polls are pointing to a major reversal of fortunes this time, with 33 seats at stake. Reinforcing the images of the city burning is the Democrats' only hope with a little more than two weeks to go, no matter how risky the tactic is.

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?" he posed.

The Democrats, however, believe that the accusation of burning the city doesn't need proof, just as rural red shirts need no convincing that soldiers killed protesters in an elaborate plot. Undecided Bangkok voters are hesitating not because they suspect a government hand in the torching of CentralWorld, among other places, but because they are unhappy with other issues where the government is concerned.

Bangkok voters will continue to get vivid reminders of what happened last year as both the rival camps have taken off their gloves. With that, "reconciliation" will remain just a beautiful word that means nothing.

-- The Nation 2011-06-18

[KKvampire]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

[myozaw]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

[maewrocks]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

[h90]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows but for 500 Baht many will see something different.

[somo]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

Spot on.

Democrats are now blaming PTP for the 91 deaths which is perverse.

"if you hadn't demonstrated so strongly we wouldn't have needed to shoot you'

[animatic]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

Spot on.

Democrats are now blaming PTP for the 91 deaths which is perverse.

"if you hadn't demonstrated so strongly we wouldn't have needed to shoot you'

If they had demonstrated legally there would have been no need of any violence. OF COURSE the Red Sides ringers in Black attacked FIRST.

Red logic:

It is reasonable to shoot at security forces,

and not the other way round.

It is obvious then and now,

that the violence was caused by a chain of Red Leader Decisions

and that the PTP was closely tied to the Red Leaders,

when they weren't actually within the same person like Jaturporn.

Many groups protest in Bangkok, and little or no violence happens,

but few ever push the social order to the breaking point as the red rallies so clearly did, as a clear aim of their very existence.

This needs to be loudly trumpeted and shown on all media,

the facts can speak fro themselves, no need to exaggerate.

The forces of good must show the forces of evil for what they are,

and then show how they plan to help those desperate enough to believe the evil ones lies.

Edited June 18, 2011 by animatic

[RogueExpat]

Red logic:

It is reasonable to shoot at security forces,

and not the other way round.

It is obvious then and now,

that the violence was caused by a chain of Red Leader Decisions

and that the PTP was closely tied to the Red Leaders,

when they weren't actually within the same person like Jaturporn.

Many groups protest in Bangkok, and little or no violence happens,

but few ever push the social order to the breaking point as the red rallies so clearly did, as a clear aim of their very existence.

This needs to be loudly trumpeted and shown on all media,

the facts can speak fro themselves, no need to exaggerate.

The forces of good must show the forces of evil for what they are,

and then show how they plan to help those desperate enough to believe the evil ones lies.

Yes, it is absolutley inexcusable how Jaturporn et al., condoned/sanctioned Red shirts blindly firing over the top of barricades at security forces, journalists and civilians, whilst they positioned women and children on the ground in front of the barricades to discourage return fire.

This needs to be trumpeted in the media long and hard.

This is the leadership you will get (and deserve) if you vote red.

[rubl]

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

This post suggest that a single largest portion of the electorate burned some buildings. No names named, but it probably that portion that listened to k. Arisman and brought a bottle along.

[animatic]

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

This post suggest that a single largest portion of the electorate burned some buildings. No names named, but it probably that portion that listened to k. Arisman and brought a bottle along.

that portion that listened to k. Arisman and brought a bottle along.

Which clearly wasn't close to ANY kind of electoral majority even at the largest rally point.

[OzMick]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

Spot on.

Democrats are now blaming PTP for the 91 deaths which is perverse.

"if you hadn't demonstrated so strongly we wouldn't have needed to shoot you'

What he is saying is that the protesters asked for an early election, they were offered one and accepted until the mystery call, then continued their protest accompanied by random acts of violence, until patience was exhausted. He is laying the blame squarely on Thaksin and his puppets.

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings and other acts of deadly violence are a reasonable means to achieve political goals. Is that also your view?

You might also remember that the initial attempt to clear protesters saw a large number of RTA killed including their commander. Would you expect security forces to show up with riot shields and batons for their next attempt?

[Phuket Stan]

A report by Bloomberg in todays Sydney Morning Herald.For those of you who don't know who Bloomberg are they are one of the top Financial Reporting Agencies in the world...no financial institution or big investor does not move until they have read/researched Bloomberg...Abhisit does not smell of roses in the report but he is a mile ahead of Thaksin

http://www.smh.com.au/business/sister-act-means-thailand-risks-a-return-to-dark-days-of-thaksinomics-20110617-1g7p3.html

[geriatrickid]

To quote Albert of Pogo fame; Dey iz already broke

[maewrocks]

By reviving memories of May 19 mayhem, party is using an old tactic 'to woo undecided voters'

I hope they will also revive memories of the Foreign Minister saying the PAD/Democrat airport armed seizure and consequent armed occupation behind barbed wire was "fun", & that if the army had moved in on that armed occupation the PAD/Democrats would have destroyed public property in the same manner as any group of people being shot at with military weapons.

[whybother]

By reviving memories of May 19 mayhem, party is using an old tactic 'to woo undecided voters'

I hope they will also revive memories of the Foreign Minister saying the PAD/Democrat airport armed seizure and consequent armed occupation behind barbed wire was "fun", & that if the army had moved in on that armed occupation the PAD/Democrats would have destroyed public property in the same manner as any group of people being shot at with military weapons.

Wouldn't it be the job of the PTP to revive memories of the PAD?

[tragickingdom]

Wishful thinking from the Nation again. The Nation does not know Thailand' history very well. What is understandable when you are cheering an army who rewrites history every now and than and when you run a newspaper that is in the white wash business.

Where Chamlong formed a government after the 1992 uprising that he organized with the likes of Chavalit who in a matter of fact wanted to have Suchinda's position the people were quite sick about the army, but there is quite a difference between Chamlong and Yingluck. Even 20 years ago Chamlong was an old bad looking former torturer who learned his trade as a communication officer from the CIA in Vietnam, there was hardly any interent (in Thailand non existing) and the newspapers could be controlled by the old dogs that were associated with politicians and rich people.

The media landscape has turned. In the Chamlong/Chuan times we would never have learned from crooked courts, we would not have seen pictures in blogs and youtube assassinations of protestors, instead the nation was letting the censor do its job. All it took for the democrats or for any other party with spin doctors was good contacts within the press and the TV media to get a message across. Now rural people are probably better educated than the city folks, computer literacy is close to 100% with young people and Yingluck is hot. Just read the comments in the economist from yesterday. By the time that the Democrat Party gets a finger behind Yingluck they long have lost the elections big time. And so justice will prevail after they stole the peoples votes by coercing into the tricks of the army.

[rubl]

By reviving memories of May 19 mayhem, party is using an old tactic 'to woo undecided voters'

I hope they will also revive memories of the Foreign Minister saying the PAD/Democrat airport armed seizure and consequent armed occupation behind barbed wire was "fun", & that if the army had moved in on that armed occupation the PAD/Democrats would have destroyed public property in the same manner as any group of people being shot at with military weapons.

Armed occupation behind barbed wire? I've seen barbed wire along Saladaeng, but that was after the April 26 attack and with the tyre/bamboo spears wall already erected. The group shot at at that time with military weapons (i.e. grenades) didn't retaliate with destroying public property. That happened around the 19th of May when the army exchanged gunfire with unarmed protesters and others still lobbed grenades. With UDD leaders still shouting 'we fight on till the last drop of our blood' and when all in the right mood simply said 'it's over, go home' and surrendered. That's when the riot really started, moments later things started to burn. Too much fun indeed that day

Edited June 18, 2011 by rubl

[Moruya]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

[Moruya]

Only the insane could accept that.

[whybother]

...

Just read the comments in the economist from yesterday.

...

WHICH article in the Economist yesterday?

[drdoom6996]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

The single largest portion of the electorate believe that burning some buildings in retaliation for stealing their votes and shooting at them is a reasonable response.

Which is why the people of Thailand do not need their representation. Rational thought is necessary.

[MrChangers]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

I do not know so that wipes the "Everyone" statement of the list.

Men in black, let's say agent provocateur instead.

[lungmi]

A report by Bloomberg in todays Sydney Morning Herald.For those of you who don't know who Bloomberg are they are one of the top Financial Reporting Agencies in the world...no financial institution or big investor does not move until they have read/researched Bloomberg...Abhisit does not smell of roses in the report but he is a mile ahead of Thaksin

http://www.smh.com.a...0617-1g7p3.html

The comparision with Berlusconi in this article is a good point. Look at Italy now.

[lannarebirth]

A report by Bloomberg in todays Sydney Morning Herald.For those of you who don't know who Bloomberg are they are one of the top Financial Reporting Agencies in the world...no financial institution or big investor does not move until they have read/researched Bloomberg...Abhisit does not smell of roses in the report but he is a mile ahead of Thaksin

http://www.smh.com.a...0617-1g7p3.html

The comparision with Berlusconi in this article is a good point. Look at Italy now.

Except Berlusconi isn't also generally regarded as a mass murderer as well.

[OzMick]

By reviving memories of May 19 mayhem, party is using an old tactic 'to woo undecided voters'

I hope they will also revive memories of the Foreign Minister saying the PAD/Democrat airport armed seizure and consequent armed occupation behind barbed wire was "fun", & that if the army had moved in on that armed occupation the PAD/Democrats would have destroyed public property in the same manner as any group of people being shot at with military weapons.

Wouldn't it be the job of the PTP to revive memories of the PAD?

What do you think he was doing?

[unanimosity]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

So, if this kind of attitude is not hang 'em high, moderators, what is?

[animatic]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

So, if this kind of attitude is not hang 'em high, moderators, what is?

It's not hang em high.

It's vote the rotters back to hell, not to control over all our lives.

[Skywalker69]

A report by Bloomberg in todays Sydney Morning Herald.For those of you who don't know who Bloomberg are they are one of the top Financial Reporting Agencies in the world...no financial institution or big investor does not move until they have read/researched Bloomberg...Abhisit does not smell of roses in the report but he is a mile ahead of Thaksin

http://www.smh.com.a...0617-1g7p3.html

Thanks for the link!

[mrtoad]

Pheu Thai deputy leader Kanawat Wasinsungworn warned yesterday that the Democrats are reviving memories of the May 19 turbulence at their peril. "You know who killed protesters," he said, "but can the government prove the red shirts burned buildings?"

Really, some of us saw it with our own eyes, Guns and Fire. and more to the point the Leadership of the Reds was telling them to do it. What other proof do you need?

Everyone knows... We don't need to prove it was red shirts!

So, if this kind of attitude is not hang 'em high, moderators, what is?

I can't see why there are complaints regarding the Democrats use of reminding people what happened last year, and who organised it. After all, those involved in it, could end up forming a government.

Mrs Toad is certainly under no illusions, and has said she will be voting democrat - which I believe is a first for her. She's not been too impressed with the Reds and Thaksin over the past couple of years, and that's from a previous die hard Thaksin supporter.

[OzMick]

By reviving memories of May 19 mayhem, party is using an old tactic 'to woo undecided voters'

I hope they will also revive memories of the Foreign Minister saying the PAD/Democrat airport armed seizure and consequent armed occupation behind barbed wire was "fun", & that if the army had moved in on that armed occupation the PAD/Democrats would have destroyed public property in the same manner as any group of people being shot at with military weapons.

Armed occupation behind barbed wire? I've seen barbed wire along Saladaeng, but that was after the April 26 attack and with the tyre/bamboo spears wall already erected. The group shot at at that time with military weapons (i.e. grenades) didn't retaliate with destroying public property. That happened around the 19th of May when the army exchanged gunfire with unarmed protesters and others still lobbed grenades. With UDD leaders still shouting 'we fight on till the last drop of our blood' and when all in the right mood simply said 'it's over, go home' and surrendered. That's when the riot really started, moments later things started to burn. Too much fun indeed that day

When the mask of peaceful protest dropped, the reality was pretty dam_n ugly.