Farang Ghetto Pricing

[winner]

I was down on Sukhumvit yesterday and saw the new building going on. I also looked at yesterday's BKK post and saw the sale prices and the rental rates there. We are being ripped off particularly in the white ghetto area!!!! Thais don't pay what we do--nowhere near it. They are taking us for suckers. I live in a nice furnished apartment in the Chatujak area. 2 bedrooms and a living and dining room with one bath and a small kitchen and a balcony. I pay 7000bht per month. Why should things cost so much more in the area that they think all farangs want to live in. I know---location, location, location. Don't be sucked in!! If people refused to pay these inflated prices, they would come down fast.

Billy

[Judge]

The "best", most convienient locations are always expensive, everywhere!

I'm afraid that these prices will continue to rise as long as people want to make their lives easier.

[winner]

The "best", most convienient locations are always expensive, everywhere!

I'm afraid that these prices will continue to rise as long as people want to make their lives easier. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Judge

I agree that you pay for convenience but there is a limit to a fair differential. I am close to the BTS also and have everything that I need except for the Villa Market in my immediate neighborhood. I just feel that too many foreigners still compare pricing to their home countries instead of the local market. I just hate to see us seen as fools by the local landlords.

Billy

[Judge]

You are absolutely right, but, believe me, they will continue to pay those prices despite what you and I think.

[WhiteShiva]

I was down on Sukhumvit yesterday and saw the new building going on.  I also looked at yesterday's BKK post and saw the sale prices and the rental rates there.  We are being ripped off particularly in the white ghetto area!!!! Thais don't pay what we do--nowhere near it.  They are taking us for suckers.  I live in a nice furnished apartment in the Chatujak area.  2 bedrooms and a living and dining room with one bath and a small kitchen and a balcony.  I pay 7000bht per month.  Why should things cost so much more in the area that they think all farangs want to live in.  I know---location, location, location.  Don't be sucked in!! If people refused to pay these inflated prices, they would come down fast. 

Billy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You may be surprised to know that the majority of people living in Sukhumvit are Thais, often very wealthy Thais, and they are willing and capable of paying the prices quoted. Hence the sellers are asking for these prices.

Otherwise known as a market economy........

The fact that you (and possibly a few others) think it is too expensive is irrelevant.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Simply the laws of supply and demand

[Khutan]

You may be surprised to know that the majority of people living in Sukhumvit are Thais, often very wealthy Thais, and they are willing and capable of paying the prices quoted.  Hence the sellers are asking for these prices.

Otherwise known as a market economy........

The fact that you (and possibly a few others) think it is too expensive is irrelevant.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So true.

The Condo's right behind me are rented at 100k a month. Plenty of farang and Thai people there.

[Captain Chaos]

It's a bit of vicious (or virtuous cycle, depending on how you look at it) ..... lower to mid Sukhumvit is considered a desirable area ..... which attracts rich Thais ..... which makes it more desirable ..... which attracts expats (both western and Japanese) .... which makes it more desirable ..... which attracts ......

My solution was to move away from Suk down to Yannawa. My rent, for a comparable place, came down by 30%, yet it's only 100 baht and 15 minutes in a cab to get back up to the Suk road.

Just my two baht's worth .....

[LazyCat]

I just don't get one thing, while the new blds are asking higher rent the old and dirty ones also raise the price ....

the fact that we are getting ripped off is true in everything not only rent... the Rich thais are not renting, I haven't seen a thai person in my life who will pay their own money to rent something more expencive than 15 000Bht/m those who live in 100K per month they got these places rented for them by the company, it's just not worth it for thais to rent as much as farangs do ...

you should mention the subj of getting back the deposit money !!! from a thai landlord ! so many times they were just not willing to give it back , claiming they will have to wait for the bills to arrive or some other lame excuse... just drive me nuts and I am less likely to deposit any money to a thai person...

[raro]

Those who are inapt or too lazy to compare prices vs. value for money and the overall market will always get ripped off. However, if someone believes he/she needs to live in downtown Sukhumvit and is willing to come forward with the money asked, fine with me. It's the same thing with cars, mobile phones and other "must-haves"

Just one thing is totally incomprehensile to me: Why are condos always more expensive than houses? Markets aside, shouldn't it be cheaper building a condo unit than a house?

[Erwin1011]

Those who are inapt or too lazy to compare prices vs. value for money and the overall market will always get ripped off. However, if someone believes he/she needs to live in downtown Sukhumvit and is willing to come forward with the money asked, fine with me. It's the same thing with cars, mobile phones and other "must-haves"

Just one thing is totally incomprehensile to me: Why are condos always more expensive than houses? Markets aside, shouldn't it be cheaper building a condo unit than a house?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Condo's are priced in function of the minimum 3.5 mil required for a farang to invest if he wants to stay here. I went shopping for a condo around my place. Asked 4.2, haggled a bit down to 3.5...then send the wife to go for it. Asked 3.5 haggled it down to 2.9.

[winner]

Those who are inapt or too lazy to compare prices vs. value for money and the overall market will always get ripped off. However, if someone believes he/she needs to live in downtown Sukhumvit and is willing to come forward with the money asked, fine with me. It's the same thing with cars, mobile phones and other "must-haves"

Just one thing is totally incomprehensile to me: Why are condos always more expensive than houses? Markets aside, shouldn't it be cheaper building a condo unit than a house?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Condo's are priced in function of the minimum 3.5 mil required for a farang to invest if he wants to stay here. I went shopping for a condo around my place. Asked 4.2, haggled a bit down to 3.5...then send the wife to go for it. Asked 3.5 haggled it down to 2.9.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Erwin

That is a great example. The price went down from 4.2 million to 2.9 million. You better believe some foreigner has payed the 4.2 or "beaten" them down to 4 mill and is walking around saying that he got a great deal and that it would cost twice or much more than that that in London or New York. Even my apartment where I pay 7000, the few Thais here pay 6500. When I first moved in I was paying 8000 but when I found out what the Thais were paying got it reduced to 7000.

Condos should be cheaper than houses if only for the saving in land costs. They also use materials that are pretty cheap and labor costs are minimal.

Billy

[toastwars]

Easy answer, don't live in white ghetto's. I live a 25bt 15 min ride from Victory monument and pay 1800bt a month for a large studio in Muang thong. Depends on your needs but if you don't like paying for it just move

[monochaser]

Dude, you think I'm happy to pay 50K to live in Sukhumvit? No I'm not but guess what? I'm gonna keep paying it regardless. You go on paying your 7 and I'll pay what I pay. You've simply been priced out of the area

[nonameidentified]

I was down on Sukhumvit yesterday and saw the new building going on.  I also looked at yesterday's BKK post and saw the sale prices and the rental rates there.  We are being ripped off particularly in the white ghetto area!!!! Thais don't pay what we do--nowhere near it.  They are taking us for suckers.  I live in a nice furnished apartment in the Chatujak area.  2 bedrooms and a living and dining room with one bath and a small kitchen and a balcony.  I pay 7000bht per month.  Why should things cost so much more in the area that they think all farangs want to live in.  I know---location, location, location.  Don't be sucked in!! If people refused to pay these inflated prices, they would come down fast. 

Billy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Generally speaking, Asians do have a perception that the Caucasians who worked in their country get really well paid and spend well too. And as Thailand is a country of bargains, they'll mark up all prices despite Westerns or Easterns. But perhaps they'll mark the prices up a lot higher for the Westerns. In anyway, their main target is to make money!

It's true that we should never compare the prices in thailand to our hometown. It's two different stories. Though I've not moved into Thailand yet (but in 2 months time!), we're in the midst of calculating our cost of living to the cost of living in Thailand. Apparently what comes to my surprise is the rental prices. What I can find on the internet's so expensive!! Doesn't makes sense comparing to the cost of living. I've also 'tried' reading Thai property websites renting out houses (by the help of language translation online), a house in the same area with similar characteristics is rented out for 75,000baht in the english websites and 20,000 baht on the Thai websites. That's daylight robbing!

Can you imagine how much you can save by understanding thai?

[sleepybeau]

Hello Billy,

Could you please tell me where in the Chatujak area I could find the apartment of your size & price? Well, I'm looking to move out of the Sukhumvit area too..

Sleepybeau.

[gryphn]

same goes for me... i've been looking for a place around that area... and one more thing, does the building allow direct telephone lines?

[samran]

Its a strange market thats for sure. I have looked at over two dozen places in the past week. The quality of the supply varies immensely, but you quickly work out whats value for money in your price range and what is not.

We settled on early Sukhumvit, a place which I swore I would never live, mainly as it was close to work (I can walk) and K. Wife can be near other English speaking mothers when the baby is born.

One of the main reasons why prices are probably higher than they should be is due to the fact that the places are owned outright by rich Thai's, who have no real pressure to get any sort of return on their rental. As such, many are happy to keep their places empty for a year rather than rent it out. We saw many places like that and the owners wouldn't budge on price.

The other problem is that the owners themselves don't know whats out there. As someone told me recently, there is not an estate agent on every corner like there is in London, and hence no open market to compare prices. Someone I saw wanted 40K (down from 55K) for a old 2 bedroom 110 sqm place in Silom. She didn't beleive me that someone was also offering me a modern 115 sqm place in Suk, 15 mins walk from work, with a u-beat gym for 38K.

[fxm88]

1800bt a month for a large studio in Muang thong.

Why just a large studio? I heard you could rent an entire condo block there for 1800bt a month.

[Heng]

Its a strange market thats for sure. I have looked at over two dozen places in the past week. The quality of the supply varies immensely, but you quickly work out whats value for money in your price range and what is not.

We settled on early Sukhumvit, a place which I swore I would never live, mainly as it was close to work (I can walk) and K. Wife can be near other English speaking mothers when the baby is born.

One of the main reasons why prices are probably higher than they should be is due to the fact that the places are owned outright by rich Thai's, who have no real pressure to get any sort of return on their rental. As such, many are happy to keep their places empty for a year rather than rent it out. We saw many places like that and the owners wouldn't budge on price.

The other problem is that the owners themselves don't know whats out there. As someone told me recently, there is not an estate agent on every corner like there is in London, and hence no open market to compare prices. Someone I saw wanted 40K (down from 55K) for a old 2 bedroom 110 sqm place in Silom. She didn't beleive me that someone was also offering me a modern 115 sqm place in Suk, 15 mins walk from work, with a u-beat gym for 38K.

Yeah, you can see that imperfect market information for just about every single product out there. Prices (not displayed) fluctuate for everyone and a lot of customers simply don't have the patience or will to survey the market. Foreigners who aren't accustomed to spending hours in traffic and perhaps on the verge of heat stroke, even more so.

[winner]

Its a strange market thats for sure. I have looked at over two dozen places in the past week. The quality of the supply varies immensely, but you quickly work out whats value for money in your price range and what is not.

We settled on early Sukhumvit, a place which I swore I would never live, mainly as it was close to work (I can walk) and K. Wife can be near other English speaking mothers when the baby is born.

One of the main reasons why prices are probably higher than they should be is due to the fact that the places are owned outright by rich Thai's, who have no real pressure to get any sort of return on their rental. As such, many are happy to keep their places empty for a year rather than rent it out. We saw many places like that and the owners wouldn't budge on price.

The other problem is that the owners themselves don't know whats out there. As someone told me recently, there is not an estate agent on every corner like there is in London, and hence no open market to compare prices. Someone I saw wanted 40K (down from 55K) for a old 2 bedroom 110 sqm place in Silom. She didn't beleive me that someone was also offering me a modern 115 sqm place in Suk, 15 mins walk from work, with a u-beat gym for 38K.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, you can see that imperfect market information for just about every single product out there. Prices (not displayed) fluctuate for everyone and a lot of customers simply don't have the patience or will to survey the market. Foreigners who aren't accustomed to spending hours in traffic and perhaps on the verge of heat stroke, even more so.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Part of the problem is that prices as advertised in the BKK Post are the inflated ones and people unconsciously look at them as sort of a guideline. You seldom see reasonably priced places advertise. Even on here you see one room apartments (if you would want to live in one) advertised at foolish prices (17000??) Once again this gives you a guideline.

Looking at your post, the part about walking to work is nice but you are probably paying somewhere in the neighborhood of 20000 for the privilege. That pays a lot of BTS fares. Can't dispute the needs of the wife. That is the advantage of living in the ghetto. The Villa market is the other one!!! Beyond that--why live there? I can think of a few reasons not to:

1. Where is the only place in the city that I have ever had a taxi driver not turn on the meter? The ghetto--numerous times!

2. Where is the only place where the taxi driver trys to take me to a massage parlor instead of my destination? The ghetto

3. Where is the only place in the city that I see 40 year old plus shaved headed, tatooed, drunk white men in the daytime wearing shorts and tank tops? The ghetto!

4. Where am I overcharged for everything? The ghetto!

Sorry--I am on a soapbox, but I didn't move to Asia to live around the same people that I could have at home.

Billy

[samran]

Looking at your post, the part about walking to work is nice but you are probably paying somewhere in the neighborhood of 20000 for the privilege.  That pays a lot of BTS fares.  Can't dispute the needs of the wife.  That is the advantage of living in the ghetto.  The Villa market is the other one!!!

Yeah, factored in the cost of fares as well as the travel time that would be involved. I was willing to pay a bit more to avoid the travel, especially just having given up a 3 stage, one hour commute in London. Also factored in the fact that my place has a great gym which will save 4000 baht per month for the wife and I in membership elsewhere. Unless we moved out to the burbs though, I don't think we are saving 20K for what we are looking for. Also, I speak Thai and contacted a lot of places over the phone, and was still quoted quite high prices.

Plus, while I am earning a realatively good pay packet (but not a 'package'), we have both lived in Thaiand before for many years, so are pretty happy not to need many of expensive things in life that so many expats on packages want. Noodles for dinner from the lady downstairs for 25 baht will be fine. The weekly shop will be a Thai style 'Tops' and Villa will be there only to supplement the larder.

Beyond that--why live there?  I can think of a few reasons not to:

1.  Where is the only place in the city that I have ever had a taxi driver not turn on the meter?  The ghetto--numerous times!

2.  Where is the only place where the taxi driver trys to take me to a massage parlor instead of my destination?  The ghetto

3.  Where is the only place in the city that I see 40 year old plus shaved headed, tatooed, drunk white men in the daytime wearing shorts and tank tops?  The ghetto!

4.  Where am I overcharged for everything?  The ghetto! 

Sorry--I am on a soapbox, but I didn't move to Asia to live  around  the same people that I could have at home.

Billy

yeah, TOTALLY agree with you. Actually, get off my soapbox...:D/

These were the reasons why I said NO NO NO to Sukhumvit before we moved here. Somehow, K.wife managed to convince me otherwise.

[Drew Aitch]

Bangkok is a very hot, noisy, polluted and dirty city and I personally have a love hate relationship with the place, especially in the central or business area though it is convenient for reasons already mentioned.

It’s the kind of city that independent home hunters quickly become exhausted and fed up with as they drag themselves around the unknown streets looking for a new place to live. Often folk take a place simply because they get tired of looking, but it’s often not the kind of home they had in mind when they first set off on their search.

There are bargains, rip-offs, and places in between, and the best advice is to give yourself time to look if you can afford that luxury.

Condo owners simply try and to get the best price for their vacant property. There are so many different shapes, sizes, buildings, Sois, local conveniences, access to transportation and many other factors that can influence the asking price, but the biggest one is perhaps governed by whatever someone is prepared to pay at that time, and this is determined by simple supply and demand.

Apartment buildings usually have a fixed price for all the available rooms and generally tenants do not have to sign lengthy lease agreements to reside there which makes it a little easier to move into these places, but watch out for inflated extras!

Never be afraid to negotiate on all the various charges if you feel it’s appropriate.

One place I moved into sent me a shocking 1,000 THB/Mo. fixed fee for water usage. I went to the office and said I’m all for profit but this is pure greedy and as I was living alone at the time I’d be pushed to use water totalling 150 THB/Mo. The manager apologised and we agreed I’d pay for the month in question but there was no charge for water after that for the remaining 11 months of the contract.

Also, and finally, interact in forums like this to get some pointers but at the end of the day, the decision is still yours and there are pros and cons that only you can weigh up as deciding factors. If you are personally happy with the price, the location, the facilities and proximity to all your needs, then perhaps it’s not a rip off to you despite appearing well over priced to many others that have different needs and expectations.

Aitch

[The Dude]

The Dude thinks "the ghetto" rules. He would never live anywhere else regardless of price. The Dude likes his people mix he gets there and feels that living in scum low rents areas totally blows. Can you dig that with a shovel? Oh yeah BTW, nosepicker dude, congrats on your new pad. You did the right thing; you rule. Don't let anyone convince you otherwise.

[jezchesters]

I was down on Sukhumvit yesterday and saw the new building going on.  I also looked at yesterday's BKK post and saw the sale prices and the rental rates there.  We are being ripped off particularly in the white ghetto area!!!! Thais don't pay what we do--nowhere near it.  They are taking us for suckers.  I live in a nice furnished apartment in the Chatujak area.  2 bedrooms and a living and dining room with one bath and a small kitchen and a balcony.  I pay 7000bht per month.  Why should things cost so much more in the area that they think all farangs want to live in.  I know---location, location, location.  Don't be sucked in!! If people refused to pay these inflated prices, they would come down fast. 

Billy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi,

We're looking for a condo at the mo and have considered Chatujak as a possibility. Can you tell me more specifically where you live as this sounds perfect. A road or building name would be great.

Thanks!

Jez

[winner]

The Dude thinks "the ghetto" rules. He would never live anywhere else regardless of price. The Dude likes his people mix he gets there and feels that living in scum low rents areas totally blows. Can you dig that with a shovel? Oh yeah BTW, nosepicker dude, congrats on your new pad. You did the right thing; you rule. Don't let anyone convince you otherwise.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey Dude,

Glad to see that you agree with the gentleman! I really like your third person referencing and your use of California style colloqualisms from the 80s (" ghetto rules...The Dude...totally blows...dig that with a shovel... nosepicker dude...you rule). Don't see much of that in written English anymore. Hope that you outgrow it! LOL

Billy

[winner]

I was down on Sukhumvit yesterday and saw the new building going on.  I also looked at yesterday's BKK post and saw the sale prices and the rental rates there.  We are being ripped off particularly in the white ghetto area!!!! Thais don't pay what we do--nowhere near it.  They are taking us for suckers.  I live in a nice furnished apartment in the Chatujak area.  2 bedrooms and a living and dining room with one bath and a small kitchen and a balcony.  I pay 7000bht per month.  Why should things cost so much more in the area that they think all farangs want to live in.  I know---location, location, location.  Don't be sucked in!! If people refused to pay these inflated prices, they would come down fast. 

Billy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi,

We're looking for a condo at the mo and have considered Chatujak as a possibility. Can you tell me more specifically where you live as this sounds perfect. A road or building name would be great.

Thanks!

Jez

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Try the Paholyothin Road area near Ratchada--Rathayothin, in the neighborhood of the Major Ratchayothin Movie complex. There are plenty of apartments and good Condos in the area off Soi 33 to 39.

Billy

[daleyboy]

The Dude thinks "the ghetto" rules. He would never live anywhere else regardless of price. The Dude likes his people mix he gets there and feels that living in scum low rents areas totally blows. Can you dig that with a shovel? Oh yeah BTW, nosepicker dude, congrats on your new pad. You did the right thing; you rule. Don't let anyone convince you otherwise.

Why do you talk about yourself in the third person? Very irritating

[kenk3z]

How much is the rent for one of those corrugated metal lean-to's along the railroad tracks near Phiyathai? Looks like an easy stroll into BTS and a great way to learn some of the language. Don't need a TV, a frig, and can wash at work.

kenk3z

[GoodHeart]

Why should things cost so much more in the area that they think all farangs want to live in. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Gee, I wonder.. Could it be because most all farangs do want to live there?