U.S. says it will veto Palestinian statehood bid at the UN

[flying]

Excellently put! I suspect exploding heads all round for the apologists

I tend to agree but....

It will be Israel Apologists

It will be Palestinian Apologists

It will be Turkish Apologists

It will be Iranian Apologists

It will be Iraqi Apologists

It will be Pakistani Apologists

It will be UN Apologists

It will be Libyan Apologists

It will be American Apologists

It will be Egyptian Apologists

It will be EU Apologists

etc...etc...etc....

It is funny to watch so many take a smug bit of joy in what they

think will be a localized slam dunk. They think the US will somehow not be forced

into the usual alliances.

If the past 3-4 years have shown the world anything it has shown how

everything has become interlinked & dependent on others. It has shown

upheaval & military presence is beyond costly.

So yeah I agree exploding heads all around.....enjoy

because in the end if anything remains it will probably be China that enjoys it.

[elgato]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

[pbay]

[

They have offered peace over and over again and accepted the UN peace plan in 1948 - all of which the Arabs refused. You need to read a little history before giving silly lectures on the Internet.

I think it is you who needs the history lesson,all you are doing it repeating various Israeli propaganda in this thread. People who actually know a lot about the conflict like myself can see that clear as day. You have had god knows how many posts in this thread backing Israel with the same rubbish that you can pick up on any zionist fantasy history site. You do not tell people to read a little history when it is clear you have never ever bothered to.

As for the Palestinian going to the UN for statehood,that is a good thing because when the Israelis have to stand up and say why they object then the world will see that they have no good reasons at all. The Israeli have kicked every peace process into the long grass and kept building illegal settlements on occupied land. Israel is guilty as a kid caught with his hand in the cookie jar and frankly their time has come as the world view of them goes from bad to worse.No one believes them anymore apart from some Jews and some rightwing Americans.The sensible educated people in the world see right thru the Israeli government lies.

[Steely Dan]

[

They have offered peace over and over again and accepted the UN peace plan in 1948 - all of which the Arabs refused. You need to read a little history before giving silly lectures on the Internet.

People who actually know a lot about the conflict like myself can see that clear as day.

Oh I am impressed, please tell us your credentials, and while you're at it which parallel universe you inhabit.

[coma]

[

They have offered peace over and over again and accepted the UN peace plan in 1948 - all of which the Arabs refused. You need to read a little history before giving silly lectures on the Internet.

I think it is you who needs the history lesson,all you are doing it repeating various Israeli propaganda in this thread. People who actually know a lot about the conflict like myself can see that clear as day. You have had god knows how many posts in this thread backing Israel with the same rubbish that you can pick up on any zionist fantasy history site. You do not tell people to read a little history when it is clear you have never ever bothered to.

As for the Palestinian going to the UN for statehood,that is a good thing because when the Israelis have to stand up and say why they object then the world will see that they have no good reasons at all. The Israeli have kicked every peace process into the long grass and kept building illegal settlements on occupied land. Israel is guilty as a kid caught with his hand in the cookie jar and frankly their time has come as the world view of them goes from bad to worse.No one believes them anymore apart from some Jews and some rightwing Americans.The sensible educated people in the world see right thru the Israeli government lies.

Well said. I do note however how the US has persuaded the Australian PM to abstain from the vote. Ohh. That is right. You said "sensible educated people" .

[Naam]

What currency will they use? I am guessing the shekel will be out of the question. Perhaps the Palestinian Peso?

I'd go for something more primitive than currency, perhaps simple bartering based on the availability of daughters and donkeys.

perhaps your daughters?

[Scott]

One post deleted. Please stay on topic and we don't need a history of the US or the area in this topic that goes back 2,000 years.

[Steely Dan]

What currency will they use? I am guessing the shekel will be out of the question. Perhaps the Palestinian Peso?

I'd go for something more primitive than currency, perhaps simple bartering based on the availability of daughters and donkeys.

perhaps your daughters?

Two problems there I'm afraid. Firstly I have no daughters, secondly, if I did I would regard them as offspring and not chattels.

[koheesti]

Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

Why should they? They were given Gaza and immediately started launching rockets. Totally irresponible people like themselves have no business having their own state.

[up-country_sinclair]

It is really is quite frustrating that the inept and arrogant Israeli govt. has put the US in this very difficult position. With "friends" like these...

Hopefully the Israeli people will rise up and throw the current regime out of power. It would be the best thing for the prospects for peace in the region, and the future of Israel .

[endure]

Anyone know the difference between Chapter VI and Chapter VII resolutions in the UN?

I'd love to see a two-state solution in Israel/Palestine. I just don't believe for one nano-second that the leaders of the Palestinian people could be peaceful neighbors of Israel (again, look at Gaza). Most Palestinians have been brainwashed since childhood to hate the Jews (Sesame Jihad Street) so I see little hope in the future. It is a shame that such blatant hatred not only exists but is blindly accepted by the useful idiots in the West.

There was a programme on TV a while ago that went into Palestinian and Israeli schools and brought together a gang of 12 year olds from both sides for a few days. They were quite surprised that after they got to know each other how well they got on.

What you say is true. Palestinian school teachers were pumping hatred into their students. Exactly the same thing was true of the Israeli schools. Israeli school teachers were pumping hated into their students too.

As long as that keeps happening there'll never be a solution to the problem.

[maidu]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

Because they're not ready to be a state. They can't stand on their own feet in terms of resources and revenue. Better if they became a province of Egypt, but of course the Egyptians would never even consider such a concept - they don't want additional welfare recipients to deal with.

In the old days, when there were settlement disputes, there would usually be armed conflict. Am not saying that's good, but if there had been a Biblical sort of war in the latter part of the 20th century, then one side wins and the other side loses, and whomever is left picks up the pieces, dust themselves off, and gets on with things.

In the current scenario of incessant non-resolution, there's simmering antagonism and small scale wars that fester for decades.

One basic factoid that is never mentioned: The area has woefully little natural resources. No forests, few fish, no fresh water lakes to speak of, few rivers, no decent soil. The whole mega region, from Turkey to Kenya, and from India to the Canary Islands, barely has a carrying capacity for more than a smattering of human settlements. That's one of the basic reasons why there are deep problems in that part of the world which have festered for generations.

[maidu]

There was a programme on TV a while ago that went into Palestinian and Israeli schools and brought together a gang of 12 year olds from both sides for a few days. They were quite surprised that after they got to know each other how well they got on.

What you say is true. Palestinian school teachers were pumping hatred into their students. Exactly the same thing was true of the Israeli schools. Israeli school teachers were pumping hated into their students too. As long as that keeps happening there'll never be a solution to the problem.

Not true. Whereas what you relate about Palestinian kids getting brainwashed daily to hate Israel (similar in Iran, Syria and most other dune countries) is true. Israeli elders, on average, don't brainwash their youngsters anywhere near as much - to hate Palestinians. It's not an even-steven sort of thing at all.

Edited September 18, 2011 by maidu

[endure]

There was a programme on TV a while ago that went into Palestinian and Israeli schools and brought together a gang of 12 year olds from both sides for a few days. They were quite surprised that after they got to know each other how well they got on.

What you say is true. Palestinian school teachers were pumping hatred into their students. Exactly the same thing was true of the Israeli schools. Israeli school teachers were pumping hated into their students too. As long as that keeps happening there'll never be a solution to the problem.

Not true. Whereas what you relate about Palestinian kids getting brainwashed daily to hate Israel (similar in Iran, Syria and most other dune countries) is true. Israeli elders, on average, don't brainwash their youngsters anywhere near as much - to hate Palestinians. It's not an even-steven sort of thing at all.

Did you see the programme?

[up-country_sinclair]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

They can't stand on their own feet in terms of resources and revenue.

Things will be different once Palestine has the Israeli boot taken off its neck.

[Scott]

Several off-topic posts have been deleted.

[geriatrickid]

It is really is quite frustrating that the inept and arrogant Israeli govt. has put the US in this very difficult position. With "friends" like these...

Hopefully the Israeli people will rise up and throw the current regime out of power. It would be the best thing for the prospects for peace in the region, and the future of Israel .

No need to rise up, as Israel has the only functioning electoral process in the region. Israelis use the power of elections regularly. Unlike the PLA territories which have not had the legally required elections in the past 2 years. In case you didn't realize it, Israel's weakness is that it is overly democratic with a proportional representation system that allows every minority group to have a chance at representation. One of the reasons why the Israeli government has the policies it does is because its elected parliament is made up of many disparate groups including arabs, religious holy rollers,, lefties, righties, russian emigres and traditional centrists. I doubt one will ever see a jew being allowed to hold office under a Palestinian state.

[geriatrickid]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

They can't stand on their own feet in terms of resources and revenue.

Things will be different once Palestine has the Israeli boot taken off its neck.

As opposed to a gun to the head from fellow Palestinians. Have a look at what happened to the arabs that wanted to make peace or to negotiate something intelligent. They got bumped off. It's why Arafat walked away from a comprehensive peace deal: He was afraid of the radicals.

[up-country_sinclair]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

They can't stand on their own feet in terms of resources and revenue.

Things will be different once Palestine has the Israeli boot taken off its neck.

As opposed to a gun to the head from fellow Palestinians. Have a look at what happened to the arabs that wanted to make peace or to negotiate something intelligent. They got bumped off. It's why Arafat walked away from a comprehensive peace deal: He was afraid of the radicals.

Remind me again what happened to Yitzhak Rabin for signing the Oslo Accords?

[Jingthing]

Tally Ho!

Lets stay on the topic of Palestine and not about personal attacks. OK?

[Pedzie]

What country holds the record for defying countless UN resolutions ?

Israel...

[Steely Dan]

What country holds the record for defying countless UN resolutions ?

Israel...

That's because the UNHRC became a voting block of OIC states all with appalling human rights records themselves and sharing the sole agenda of trying to delegitimize Israel.

NEXT

[Steely Dan]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

They can't stand on their own feet in terms of resources and revenue.

Things will be different once Palestine has the Israeli boot taken off its neck.

That's like taking the boot off the neck of a Unicorn.

[koheesti]

What country holds the record for defying countless UN resolutions ?

Israel...

Actually many if not most of those resolutions require action from both Israel and the Palestinians.

[koheesti]

Sounds like more string-pulling on the part of the Israeli puppet masters of the US govt. Why shouldn't Palestine be a state?

They can't stand on their own feet in terms of resources and revenue.

Things will be different once Palestine has the Israeli boot taken off its neck.

That's like taking the boot off the neck of a Unicorn.

I would be very interested to hear from some of the anti-Israel posters as to what parts of this they believe to be untrue.

[Scott]

One flame has been deleted. I will close this topic at this time since the number of posts deleted is now starting to exceed the number that are permissible.

reopened after cleanup.

Edited September 19, 2011 by Scott
re-opened

[Pedzie]

What country holds the record for defying countless UN resolutions ?

Israel...

Actually many if not most of those resolutions require action from both Israel and the Palestinians.

I think more so Israel

This was on the BBC'S website this morning

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-14946179

[Pedzie]

A list of resolutions against Israel,not just to do with Palestine.

I'm sure you'll agree the list is quite exhaustive

http://www.wake-up-america.net/UN%20Resolutions%20against%20Israel.htm

[up-country_sinclair]

^ A great questions is asked on that link, "Does the Israeli tail wag the American dog?".

[Steely Dan]

^ A great questions is asked on that link, "Does the Israeli tail wag the American dog?".

Does the OIC tail wag the UN dog?