Is It Time To Move On Five Years After The Coup?

[Ricardo]

as hammered explained, the ability of the institutions to remove the tyrant was contrained.

It took over 20 years in the Philippines before their "people power" removed Marcos, which, as you say... is "eventually"

Re some of the above posts. Lets put this in perspective.

On one side we have Mr. Thaksin and TRT. Initially they were sitting in parliament with a massive overall majority. They have virtually all the state institutions at both national and local level to do their bidding. They have virtually all of the police behind an rumors suggest half the military. The EC, OAG are their people. The constitutional court has overturned precedent in the past to find Mr. Thaksin not guilty. They have immense amounts of money. They have control over most of the countries influential ones. All of the TV media is more inclined towards them. Radio is a virtual TRT monopoly. Even the newspapers have to be careful or they lose their advertising. They have the their diplomats to spread the gospel worldwide. They allegedly have total control of both the caretaker and incoming senate. They even have some of the ultra nationalists like Samak backing them.

jesus, you must be in the CIA...bringing up posts from way back when

hope you haven't got files on all of us

tho i'm not posting here long... under my current name anyhow!

Personally I'd say that hammered's post from 2006 was a spot-on summary, of the situation pre-2006-coup, and therefore memorable even without files. He has a long history of good posts on TV. :jap:

More-recent arrivals needed to be here, to have seen just how democratic & free things had become, under that particular administration.

But one hopes that the same solution, to unravel a Gordian-knot in the Constitution, doesn't become necessary again.

[nurofiend]

as hammered explained, the ability of the institutions to remove the tyrant was contrained.

It took over 20 years in the Philippines before their "people power" removed Marcos, which, as you say... is "eventually"

Re some of the above posts. Lets put this in perspective.

On one side we have Mr. Thaksin and TRT. Initially they were sitting in parliament with a massive overall majority. They have virtually all the state institutions at both national and local level to do their bidding. They have virtually all of the police behind an rumors suggest half the military. The EC, OAG are their people. The constitutional court has overturned precedent in the past to find Mr. Thaksin not guilty. They have immense amounts of money. They have control over most of the countries influential ones. All of the TV media is more inclined towards them. Radio is a virtual TRT monopoly. Even the newspapers have to be careful or they lose their advertising. They have the their diplomats to spread the gospel worldwide. They allegedly have total control of both the caretaker and incoming senate. They even have some of the ultra nationalists like Samak backing them.

jesus, you must be in the CIA...bringing up posts from way back when

hope you haven't got files on all of us

tho i'm not posting here long... under my current name anyhow!

Personally I'd say that hammered's post from 2006 was a spot-on summary, of the situation pre-2006-coup, and therefore memorable even without files. He has a long history of good posts on TV. :jap:

More-recent arrivals needed to be here, to have seen just how democratic & free things had become, under that particular administration.

But one hopes that the same solution, to unravel a Gordian-knot in the Constitution, doesn't become necessary again.

i don't really think that post should be aimed towards me m8

i was just joking with buchholz about him quoting a post from 2006

Edited September 23, 2011 by nurofiend

[Ricardo]

i don't really think that post should be aimed towards me m8

i was just joking with buchholz about him quoting a post from 2006

Sorry, not aimed at you, I did appreciate your own joke too, and wished merely to applaud hammered's original post, trying subtly (and failing) to suggest that it was so very memorable, as not to need CIA-style-files to be worth recalling, I'm tempted now to say something like "Nobody Expects The Spanish Inquisition", in the TV-tradition of harking-back to Monty-Pythoneque punchlines.

[Buchholz]

as hammered explained, the ability of the institutions to remove the tyrant was contrained.

It took over 20 years in the Philippines before their "people power" removed Marcos, which, as you say... is "eventually"

Re some of the above posts. Lets put this in perspective.

On one side we have Mr. Thaksin and TRT. Initially they were sitting in parliament with a massive overall majority. They have virtually all the state institutions at both national and local level to do their bidding. They have virtually all of the police behind an rumors suggest half the military. The EC, OAG are their people. The constitutional court has overturned precedent in the past to find Mr. Thaksin not guilty. They have immense amounts of money. They have control over most of the countries influential ones. All of the TV media is more inclined towards them. Radio is a virtual TRT monopoly. Even the newspapers have to be careful or they lose their advertising. They have the their diplomats to spread the gospel worldwide. They allegedly have total control of both the caretaker and incoming senate. They even have some of the ultra nationalists like Samak backing them.

jesus, you must be in the CIA...bringing up posts from way back when

hope you haven't got files on all of us

tho i'm not posting here long... under my current name anyhow!

Not CIA, just simply able to work with the very helpful search engine the forum has.

Replies are quickly retrieved from posting at any time. It's especially useful when seeking to find replies that were considerably quite different from those posted presently.

So, no "files" on your current name nor the the name you used here previously.

.

Edited September 24, 2011 by Buchholz

[nurofiend]

as hammered explained, the ability of the institutions to remove the tyrant was contrained.

It took over 20 years in the Philippines before their "people power" removed Marcos, which, as you say... is "eventually"

Re some of the above posts. Lets put this in perspective.

On one side we have Mr. Thaksin and TRT. Initially they were sitting in parliament with a massive overall majority. They have virtually all the state institutions at both national and local level to do their bidding. They have virtually all of the police behind an rumors suggest half the military. The EC, OAG are their people. The constitutional court has overturned precedent in the past to find Mr. Thaksin not guilty. They have immense amounts of money. They have control over most of the countries influential ones. All of the TV media is more inclined towards them. Radio is a virtual TRT monopoly. Even the newspapers have to be careful or they lose their advertising. They have the their diplomats to spread the gospel worldwide. They allegedly have total control of both the caretaker and incoming senate. They even have some of the ultra nationalists like Samak backing them.

jesus, you must be in the CIA...bringing up posts from way back when

hope you haven't got files on all of us

tho i'm not posting here long... under my current name anyhow!

Not CIA, just simply able to work with the very helpful search engine the forum has.

Replies are quickly retrieved from posting at any time. It's especially useful when seeking to find replies that were considerably quite different from those posted presently.

So, no "files" on your current name nor the the name you used here previously.

.

it a was a joke...

clearly emphasized by smileys and it's ludicrousness i might add.

you needn't have answered my 'claims'... especially so matter-of-factly!

[phiphidon]

as hammered explained, the ability of the institutions to remove the tyrant was contrained.

It took over 20 years in the Philippines before their "people power" removed Marcos, which, as you say... is "eventually"

Re some of the above posts. Lets put this in perspective.

On one side we have Mr. Thaksin and TRT. Initially they were sitting in parliament with a massive overall majority. They have virtually all the state institutions at both national and local level to do their bidding. They have virtually all of the police behind an rumors suggest half the military. The EC, OAG are their people. The constitutional court has overturned precedent in the past to find Mr. Thaksin not guilty. They have immense amounts of money. They have control over most of the countries influential ones. All of the TV media is more inclined towards them. Radio is a virtual TRT monopoly. Even the newspapers have to be careful or they lose their advertising. They have the their diplomats to spread the gospel worldwide. They allegedly have total control of both the caretaker and incoming senate. They even have some of the ultra nationalists like Samak backing them.

jesus, you must be in the CIA...bringing up posts from way back when

hope you haven't got files on all of us

tho i'm not posting here long... under my current name anyhow!

Not CIA, just simply able to work with the very helpful search engine the forum has.

Replies are quickly retrieved from posting at any time. It's especially useful when seeking to find replies that were considerably quite different from those posted presently.

So, no "files" on your current name nor the the name you used here previously.

.

So, just how specific were your search trigger words to bring that particular post out of the ether, Buchholz? It wasn't Thaksin, was it?

[Buchholz]

Re some of the above posts. Lets put this in perspective.

On one side we have Mr. Thaksin and TRT. Initially they were sitting in parliament with a massive overall majority. They have virtually all the state institutions at both national and local level to do their bidding. They have virtually all of the police behind an rumors suggest half the military. The EC, OAG are their people. The constitutional court has overturned precedent in the past to find Mr. Thaksin not guilty. They have immense amounts of money. They have control over most of the countries influential ones. All of the TV media is more inclined towards them. Radio is a virtual TRT monopoly. Even the newspapers have to be careful or they lose their advertising. They have the their diplomats to spread the gospel worldwide. They allegedly have total control of both the caretaker and incoming senate. They even have some of the ultra nationalists like Samak backing them.

jesus, you must be in the CIA...bringing up posts from way back when

hope you haven't got files on all of us

tho i'm not posting here long... under my current name anyhow!

Not CIA, just simply able to work with the very helpful search engine the forum has.

Replies are quickly retrieved from posting at any time. It's especially useful when seeking to find replies that were considerably quite different from those posted presently.

So, no "files" on your current name nor the the name you used here previously.

So, just how specific were your search trigger words to bring that particular post out of the ether, Buchholz? It wasn't Thaksin, was it?

As the discussion at the time earlier in the thread had concerned control of the Senate by Thaksin, simply searching for posts by "hammered" on "Senate" revealed the contradictory post.

.

Edited September 24, 2011 by Buchholz

[rogerdee123]

Regarding the Title of the topic "Is it time to move on 5 years after the coup" ....

I know it isn't PC but ...... still it's conceivable I could be cheering on another coup ..... like I was 5 years ago.

Depending upon what happens, in a few months or so ... I may feel like a coup is justified. And I don't think I'm alone.

[nurofiend]

Regarding the Title of the topic "Is it time to move on 5 years after the coup" ....

I know it isn't PC but ...... still it's conceivable I could be cheering on another coup ..... like I was 5 years ago.

Depending upon what happens, in a few months or so ... I may feel like a coup is justified. And I don't think I'm alone.

BAM

[hammered]

As the discussion at the time earlier in the thread had concerned control of the Senate by Thaksin, simply searching for posts by "hammered" on "Senate" revealed the contradictory post.

.

Thaksin appeared pretty bad and worse than most alternatives back than, sad to say his opponents aptly showed they could be even worse when given the chance. It just shows that however, bad things get, and they were quite bad, letting democracy run its course is the best answer whoever controls the bodies

Edited to add: there is nothing contradictory with reassessing opinions as more information is garnered over a historical period and other players show themselves to be so badly flawed. Thaksin was bad and he exerted control over a lot but he never got control over the army or courts. What came later has been worse and they took full control of everything as Thaksin had tried. The only thing they failed to get full control over was the people. How can anyone who criticized Thaksin for his attempts at exerting total influence over everything but ultimately failing not criticise the Abhisit regime and their military allies for actually doing the same but succesfully?

Edited September 24, 2011 by hammered

[Crushdepth]

As the discussion at the time earlier in the thread had concerned control of the Senate by Thaksin, simply searching for posts by "hammered" on "Senate" revealed the contradictory post.

.

Thaksin appeared pretty bad and worse than most alternatives back than, sad to say his opponents aptly showed they could be even worse when given the chance. It just shows that however, bad things get, and they were quite bad, letting democracy run its course is the best answer whoever controls the bodies

I cannot agree with you. If independent authorities or arms of government are "under control" then it's just not democracy. You're position relies on the various democratic institutions being functional, which they aren't. What you're saying in effect is let the tyrants run their course, and we already know where that goes.

There is no getting away from the fact that politicians need to be brought under the rule of law, rather than being exceptions to it.

Edited September 24, 2011 by Crushdepth

[hammered]

As the discussion at the time earlier in the thread had concerned control of the Senate by Thaksin, simply searching for posts by "hammered" on "Senate" revealed the contradictory post.

.

Thaksin appeared pretty bad and worse than most alternatives back than, sad to say his opponents aptly showed they could be even worse when given the chance. It just shows that however, bad things get, and they were quite bad, letting democracy run its course is the best answer whoever controls the bodies

I cannot agree with you. If independent authorities or arms of government are "under control" then it's just not democracy. You're position relies on the various democratic institutions being functional, which they aren't. What you're saying in effect is let the tyrants run their course.

But the Abhisit regime had every one of the bodies you talk about under their control and they lost the election because the people didnt want them. The problem with Thaksin wasnt that he controlled the bodies (less than the Abhisit regime, but a lot) but that he was popular with the people and in an election that is what counts.

Remember all kinds of bodies were investigating Thaksin and he had lost a few court cases. The Abhisit regime didnt even face an investigation worth talking about and none of their corrupt disappeared ministers faced even a question. That was control of the checks and balances

[rixalex]

Thaksin was bad and he exerted control over a lot but he never got control over the army or courts.

The old Thaksin was bad but... chestnut. Who'd have thought

Thaksin didn't have absolute control over the army, but he did have considerable influence, and his desire to secure more is partly what led to the coup. Can't really say that Abhisit had much control at all. More like they had control of him.

As for the courts, what led us all to this mess was the courts not daring to find against him, right back at the beginning of his first term. How you can say he had no control is strange.

[rixalex]

Remember all kinds of bodies were investigating Thaksin and he had lost a few court cases. The Abhisit regime didnt even face an investigation worth talking about and none of their corrupt disappeared ministers faced even a question. That was control of the checks and balances

That wasn't control of checks and balances, that was not blatantly and arrogantly doing things like changing laws hours before selling your own company and making massive tax free profits. Thaksin felt invincible, and acted accordingly as far as his transgressions went. Abhisit and the Dems, whilst not without their own transgressions, were always careful.