As Thailand Floods Spread, Experts Blame Officials, Not Rains

[MaxYakov]

We really need to get all dem boats to just go upstream and push all da water out to sea. It's such a brilliant and innovative plan. Got to love dear old Yingluck. Stop boats going downstream because that just slows the whole process down.

The farcical '1000 boats' idea isn't hers.

I'll bet she couldn't have stopped it either because of one MAJOR obstacle to attempting that.

Besides, she's been pretty busy lately, overseeing canal dredging and waving at flood-stranded Thais from helicopters ... and who-knows-what other PR stunts. PR and micro-management takes its toll, I suppose.

Edited October 14, 2011 by MaxYakov

[ResX]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

[SomchaiCNX]

If you have problems with water, hire the Dutch.

In 1902 they hired a Dutch expert J.H. van der Heide.

In 1903 he finished his report.

The guy made several suggestions result.......... you know the answer.

He stayed until 1909.

Economic change in Thailand, 1850-1970

By James C. Ingram

[volk666]

The serious risk of huge flooding was sounded months ago. Unfortunately "Thaksin thinks, Phue Thai acts" approach to decision making is unsuitable in situations like this and no one listened.

Yongyuth Wichaidit, the PTP leader before Yingluck and current Interior Minister, was put in charge but did nothing until it was too late.

Finally:

"The government carried on work in the flood-as-usual manner. The Hydrology and Water Management Office declared a red alert - a highest critical level 3 - on water management on September 5, but Yingluck and top government leaders did not acknowledge the crisis at hand."

The full chronology is here

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/new/politics/Lethargy-over-water-woes-will-hurt-govt-30167321.html

I'm sure there are lots of people to lay the blame on but this flood is really extraordinary.

[mdechgan]

Well that's true but also requires a better drainage system design entirely that doesn't block up so easily. These drains here and the entire system is <deleted>, they shouldn't be in the road surface for one and they shouldn't be just 2 small holes with 1.5 inch PVC pipe going through them, a single large leaf can block these let alone a plastic bag..

Here's one very nice example of what should be used

Here's another nice example, the vertical grating allows water to pass through even if the horizontal grating is blocked by debris.

These are kind of clever and cheaply constructed, if not dirty.

Here is a real prime example.

All of these pictured also have large internal traps that catch debris to prevent more pollution and blockage so there are many successful solutions to be found in the western world, the question is do they really want to know and spend the needed funds or is narcissism and pocket corruption the real obstacles to blocking their education?

None of these will dent your new rims, knock the fillings out of your teeth while damaging your suspension, nor break in half to seriously injure a cyclist or pedestrian either.

On a final note all of these designs have been around for decades in the western world..

Contstruction like this can never happen here.

1. Because if the corruption the cost of drains like this would be in the millions per km.

2. Most of the roads in Bkk don't even have a standard. Some have a good base, some are just compacted sand, some are concrete, some are just asphalt, some have drain pipes, some don't, some don't even have sidewalks. The ones that do have sidewalks have people in carts and stalls selling foods and noodles and these people are very hard to move even temporarily for construction.

3. Some roads the ownership and responsibility aren't even clear. Some roads like in the moobans are usually private and the government won't take resposibility for them. Phutthamonthon Sai 4 has three governments taking claim, Bangkok, Nakorn Pathom and Samut Sakorn now how is that going to work?

4. We can't use steel grating because people will steal them and sell them as scrap.

[puipuitom]

As long as the Thai's do not give a dam_n,. which politician is stealing their money, but only in the 20-100 baht election money, who is to blame ?

Tha's only look till prung nee, but never next year, next generation, next century.

In 1134 ( yeas, BEFORE Sukhutai kingdom) the ruler of what is now Bremen and Hamburg in northern Germany brought Dutch to his territory to build dikes, seen their over 200 years of experience. For business I travelk through Thailand since 1977. I have seen many floods, nut never one dike being built. I guarantee you: even now, all Thais will think of their bad karma for 2011 and continue their lives till the next flood.

[OzMick]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

Who is "we"?

[bigbamboo]

You cannot blame nature or Yingluck or even the fool Plodrasop for the current situation. The blame lies with years of a lack of pre planning of an integrated water management system in a country that is prone to flooding.

Edited October 14, 2011 by bigbamboo

[WarpSpeed]

Well that's true but also requires a better drainage system design entirely that doesn't block up so easily. These drains here and the entire system is <deleted>, they shouldn't be in the road surface for one and they shouldn't be just 2 small holes with 1.5 inch PVC pipe going through them, a single large leaf can block these let alone a plastic bag..

Here's one very nice example of what should be used

Here's another nice example, the vertical grating allows water to pass through even if the horizontal grating is blocked by debris.

These are kind of clever and cheaply constructed, if not dirty.

Here is a real prime example.

All of these pictured also have large internal traps that catch debris to prevent more pollution and blockage so there are many successful solutions to be found in the western world, the question is do they really want to know and spend the needed funds or is narcissism and pocket corruption the real obstacles to blocking their education?

None of these will dent your new rims, knock the fillings out of your teeth while damaging your suspension, nor break in half to seriously injure a cyclist or pedestrian either.

On a final note all of these designs have been around for decades in the western world..

Contstruction like this can never happen here.

1. Because if the corruption the cost of drains like this would be in the millions per km.

2. Most of the roads in Bkk don't even have a standard. Some have a good base, some are just compacted sand, some are concrete, some are just asphalt, some have drain pipes, some don't, some don't even have sidewalks. The ones that do have sidewalks have people in carts and stalls selling foods and noodles and these people are very hard to move even temporarily for construction.

3. Some roads the ownership and responsibility aren't even clear. Some roads like in the moobans are usually private and the government won't take resposibility for them. Phutthamonthon Sai 4 has three governments taking claim, Bangkok, Nakorn Pathom and Samut Sakorn now how is that going to work?

4. We can't use steel grating because people will steal them and sell them as scrap.

Right but none of that is sensible, not by your post, it's entirely Thai like but any such suggestion by officials is nonsensical..

[mdechgan]

Thailand has two seasons, drought and flood. This has been going on for ages.

Would many of you believe in a few months the Thai farmers will be complaining about lack of rain for their crops causing crop shortages and price increases forcing the government to seed the clouds.

[mdechgan]

Right but none of that is sensible, not by your post, it's entirely Thai like but any such suggestion by officials is nonsensical..

It is really simple. The government does not have the money to fix the infrastructure and they don't have a reason to.

The billions are needed for the other wonderous and ingenious ideas.

There is also a problem where if billions are used for Bangkok the other provinces would start a ruckus saying why is all the money going into Bkk while we suffer.

[WarpSpeed]

Right but none of that is sensible, not by your post, it's entirely Thai like but any such suggestion by officials is nonsensical..

It is really simple. The government does not have the money to fix the infrastructure and they don't have a reason to.

The billions are needed for the other wonderous and ingenious ideas.

There is also a problem where if billions are used for Bangkok the other provinces would start a ruckus saying why is all the money going into Bkk while we suffer.

You need to go back to the original post in which I responded to, your posts are out of context and as such opening up a debate with the mere messenger.. As a singular example my supposition is regarding the entire country & not limited to just Bangkok.

Edited October 14, 2011 by WarpSpeed

[Rinrada]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

Who is "we"?

Must be 2 of "em.......one to hold the ladder and the other to....?

[mdechgan]

Well that's true but also requires a better drainage system design entirely that doesn't block up so easily. These drains here and the entire system is <deleted>, they shouldn't be in the road surface for one and they shouldn't be just 2 small holes with 1.5 inch PVC pipe going through them, a single large leaf can block these let alone a plastic bag..

Here's one very nice example of what should be used

Here's another nice example, the vertical grating allows water to pass through even if the horizontal grating is blocked by debris.

These are kind of clever and cheaply constructed, if not dirty.

Here is a real prime example.

All of these pictured also have large internal traps that catch debris to prevent more pollution and blockage so there are many successful solutions to be found in the western world, the question is do they really want to know and spend the needed funds or is narcissism and pocket corruption the real obstacles to blocking their education?

None of these will dent your new rims, knock the fillings out of your teeth while damaging your suspension, nor break in half to seriously injure a cyclist or pedestrian either.

On a final note all of these designs have been around for decades in the western world..

I'm just saying the officials don't really have a reason to make Thailand a better place.

I wouldn't go so far in saying that they are uneducated but I think they just have their priorities wrong.

If these officials would care less about themselves and more about the country just a little bit Thailand would be a wonderful place.

[DGS1244]

The previous statement from ResX is so true, he also mentions another previous comment.

“I have tried to inform them many times, but they tell me I am a crazy man,” said Smith Dharmasaroja, former director general of the". I have worked with K. Smith after the Tsunami when he was incharge of the post Tsunami disaster center. A man who has my greatest respect yet is just about always ignored by those in power. A few more people like him and this country might actually get something done.

[Rinrada]

Thames Water in Bangers ..

Seem to remember talking to some guys about 15+ years ago in Bangkok when Thames Water got the contract to cleam up and "Re-Do" the klongs and sewers but they were having a bit of in house fighting with the local chaps who were probably a bit upset at a foreign outfit getting the programme....

What ever happened?.. are they still there?...and will they get the blame..??

I know they have/had an office on Suk Rd (opp soi 19)but as said been some time...

[MaxYakov]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently).

I think we're being troubled currently by a lot more than just 1 Billion CMs ( 2 X 500 million CMs ) of water these days. I've seen estimates of > 7 Billion CMs. Phraya passage capacity PER DAY was been stated at 550 Million CMs. This correlates roughly with other Phraya flow rate estimates at 4K - 5K CMs/sec (or greater).

Can you be more specific about how much water is/was troubling us and where it is/was?

Thanks In Advance

Edited October 14, 2011 by MaxYakov

[WarpSpeed]

Well that's true but also requires a better drainage system design entirely that doesn't block up so easily. These drains here and the entire system is <deleted>, they shouldn't be in the road surface for one and they shouldn't be just 2 small holes with 1.5 inch PVC pipe going through them, a single large leaf can block these let alone a plastic bag..

Here's one very nice example of what should be used

Here's another nice example, the vertical grating allows water to pass through even if the horizontal grating is blocked by debris.

These are kind of clever and cheaply constructed, if not dirty.

Here is a real prime example.

All of these pictured also have large internal traps that catch debris to prevent more pollution and blockage so there are many successful solutions to be found in the western world, the question is do they really want to know and spend the needed funds or is narcissism and pocket corruption the real obstacles to blocking their education?

None of these will dent your new rims, knock the fillings out of your teeth while damaging your suspension, nor break in half to seriously injure a cyclist or pedestrian either.

On a final note all of these designs have been around for decades in the western world..

I'm just saying the officials don't really have a reason to make Thailand a better place.

I wouldn't go so far in saying that they are uneducated but I think they just have their priorities wrong.

If these officials would care less about themselves and more about the country just a little bit Thailand would be a wonderful place.

Right well that's what my original post was...So we are in agreement.. But along with an attitude of thinking it's "not needed to make Thailand a better place" goes a lack of education coupled with narcissism..

[SICHONSTEVE]

Yeah...ahm...floodings during rainy season in Thailand. That has been going on since...what is the correct term, I am looking for?...oh yeah: FOREVER!

If you are talking about "floods", you always have to talk about "worst case scenario" and not "mai pen rai"!

But as long as rainforrest will be destroyed and replaced by the giant asphalt parking lot of an even gian'er industrial complex and no one gives a sh**...this is what you get.

Who is responsible? The rain? Yeah...now here is the deal: rain = being around for 4 billion years...

Politics, greedy people...basically all people, who just don't care...are to blame for the current situation.

"The main factors, they say, are deforestation, overbuilding in catchment areas, the damming and diversion of natural waterways, urban sprawl, and the filling-in of canals, combined with bad planning. Warnings to the authorities, they say, have been in vain".

The government is clearly to blame for the situation we have now.

I can remember that when we had the floods in the South earlier in the year some TV posters (red's and Thaksin supporters) were blaming Abhisit for the problems (deforestation especially) even after I happened to mention the fact that he had only been in office for about 2 years - using that logic then these problrms must be blamed on Yingluck and her Pheu Thai led government for not preventing greedy landlords from deforestating the lands surrounding mountains as they are the government upon who's watch this disaster has happened!!!!

Completely flawed logic I know and of course I don't blame the incumbent government - the point I'm trying to make is this illustrates just how STUPID their argument was on trying to pin all the problems on Abhisit and the Democrats back then!!!!.

[NCFC]

The serious risk of huge flooding was sounded months ago. Unfortunately "Thaksin thinks, Phue Thai acts" approach to decision making is unsuitable in situations like this and no one listened.

Yongyuth Wichaidit, the PTP leader before Yingluck and current Interior Minister, was put in charge but did nothing until it was too late.

Finally:

"The government carried on work in the flood-as-usual manner. The Hydrology and Water Management Office declared a red alert - a highest critical level 3 - on water management on September 5, but Yingluck and top government leaders did not acknowledge the crisis at hand."

The full chronology is here

http://www.nationmul...t-30167321.html

I'm sure there are lots of people to lay the blame on but this flood is really extraordinary.

September 5th is not "months ago". We know which party and which Prime Minister was in power "months ago" and they were too busy tooling up their military friends to worry about the people.

[NCFC]

Yeah...ahm...floodings during rainy season in Thailand. That has been going on since...what is the correct term, I am looking for?...oh yeah: FOREVER!

If you are talking about "floods", you always have to talk about "worst case scenario" and not "mai pen rai"!

But as long as rainforrest will be destroyed and replaced by the giant asphalt parking lot of an even gian'er industrial complex and no one gives a sh**...this is what you get.

Who is responsible? The rain? Yeah...now here is the deal: rain = being around for 4 billion years...

Politics, greedy people...basically all people, who just don't care...are to blame for the current situation.

"The main factors, they say, are deforestation, overbuilding in catchment areas, the damming and diversion of natural waterways, urban sprawl, and the filling-in of canals, combined with bad planning. Warnings to the authorities, they say, have been in vain".

The government is clearly to blame for the situation we have now.

I can remember that when we had the floods in the South earlier in the year some TV posters (red's and Thaksin supporters) were blaming Abhisit for the problems (deforestation especially) even after I happened to mention the fact that he had only been in office for about 2 years - using that logic then these problrms must be blamed on Yingluck and her Pheu Thai led government for not preventing greedy landlords from deforestating the lands surrounding mountains as they are the government upon who's watch this disaster has happened!!!!

Completely flawed logic I know and of course I don't blame the incumbent government - the point I'm trying to make is this illustrates just how STUPID their argument was on trying to pin all the problems on Abhisit and the Democrats back then!!!!.

And you think that two years as Prime Minister is not long enough to get off hisbackside and do something about thisannual problem? But then I suppose he was waiting for instructions from his friends before he could act.

[OzMick]

When it comes to discussion of floods and the role of dams, there is quite a bit of unreal expectation mixed with a generous dose of hypocrisy.

Thailand doesn't have the finance, the suitable terrain or the political will to build dams that would PREVENT flooding, due to the huge watershed area subject to tropical storm deluge, nearly all of which drains through the Chao Phraya. If you recall the thread about a month ago re a dam on the Mekong, you will understand the lack of political will and hypocrisy, as every time a new dam is suggested NIMBYs appear as if out of the woodwork decrying the risk to some bird, fish or frog, or simply change. I wonder if they change their tune when up to their neck in a flood.

The dams that have been built are multi-purpose which includes flood MITIGATION. All that they can hope to do in the current situation is reduce peak flows which cause the greatest destruction and loss of life. Even if every reservoir in the country was near empty, how long do you think it would take to fill them with flows around 4000 cu m/sec? To reduce peaks, releases which may cause flooding have to be made and sustained even after upstream river flow has dropped to make room for the next peak which may or may not occur. So the dam will actually increase the duration of a flood because the volume of water to be drained is the same. But it is much more tolerable to have a 1 metre flood for 3 days than a 3 metre flood for one day.

[wintermute]

If you recall the thread about a month ago re a dam on the Mekong, you will understand the lack of political will and hypocrisy, as every time a new dam is suggested NIMBYs appear as if out of the woodwork decrying the risk to some bird, fish or frog, or simply change. I wonder if they change their tune when up to their neck in a flood.

It has to do with money. The government departments that finance this need to get their cut from it and see an angle beyond "serving the public good" before they do it. I guess the corruption money scheme wasn't high enough for a mere dam. They probably make more cash on endless emergency provisions than anything else.

[ResX]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

Who is "we"?

Sorry. We is myself and major hydroelectric reservoir authorities in my country. FYI, I'm not from Thailand.

[salween]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

Wow, spoken like the Thai representative to the International Commission on Large Dams. Nonetheless, you encapsulate the mythology of multi-purpose dams, especially when it comes to flood management. Somchi wants to make sure he gets his kickbacks for all the extra power due to the high pool level so as the money comes in from the additional hydropower, the risk of miscalculation grows. Thailand's not the first place this has happened, and likely won't be the last. Hopefully the Chinese don't play the same game of roulette with the Three Gorges Dam on the Yangtze.

Nonetheless, despite being multi purpose dams, when the rains come, the priority must ALWAYS be given to flood management. We may never know how close they may have come to the dams overtopping and potentially collapsing. They may have gotten very lucky. In fact it's most likely that it was not until that point that the spillways were opened. They got greedy and a whole section of the country now has to pay. There is absolutely no other way to frame it: bad judgement.

Edited October 14, 2011 by salween

[bigbamboo]

Yeah...ahm...floodings during rainy season in Thailand. That has been going on since...what is the correct term, I am looking for?...oh yeah: FOREVER!

If you are talking about "floods", you always have to talk about "worst case scenario" and not "mai pen rai"!

But as long as rainforrest will be destroyed and replaced by the giant asphalt parking lot of an even gian'er industrial complex and no one gives a sh**...this is what you get.

Who is responsible? The rain? Yeah...now here is the deal: rain = being around for 4 billion years...

Politics, greedy people...basically all people, who just don't care...are to blame for the current situation.

"The main factors, they say, are deforestation, overbuilding in catchment areas, the damming and diversion of natural waterways, urban sprawl, and the filling-in of canals, combined with bad planning. Warnings to the authorities, they say, have been in vain".

The government is clearly to blame for the situation we have now.

I can remember that when we had the floods in the South earlier in the year some TV posters (red's and Thaksin supporters) were blaming Abhisit for the problems (deforestation especially) even after I happened to mention the fact that he had only been in office for about 2 years - using that logic then these problrms must be blamed on Yingluck and her Pheu Thai led government for not preventing greedy landlords from deforestating the lands surrounding mountains as they are the government upon who's watch this disaster has happened!!!!

Completely flawed logic I know and of course I don't blame the incumbent government - the point I'm trying to make is this illustrates just how STUPID their argument was on trying to pin all the problems on Abhisit and the Democrats back then!!!!.

Be fair, it's not just this government, it's the fault of successive governments.

[bigbamboo]

Yeah...ahm...floodings during rainy season in Thailand. That has been going on since...what is the correct term, I am looking for?...oh yeah: FOREVER!

If you are talking about "floods", you always have to talk about "worst case scenario" and not "mai pen rai"!

But as long as rainforrest will be destroyed and replaced by the giant asphalt parking lot of an even gian'er industrial complex and no one gives a sh**...this is what you get.

Who is responsible? The rain? Yeah...now here is the deal: rain = being around for 4 billion years...

Politics, greedy people...basically all people, who just don't care...are to blame for the current situation.

"The main factors, they say, are deforestation, overbuilding in catchment areas, the damming and diversion of natural waterways, urban sprawl, and the filling-in of canals, combined with bad planning. Warnings to the authorities, they say, have been in vain".

The government is clearly to blame for the situation we have now.

I can remember that when we had the floods in the South earlier in the year some TV posters (red's and Thaksin supporters) were blaming Abhisit for the problems (deforestation especially) even after I happened to mention the fact that he had only been in office for about 2 years - using that logic then these problrms must be blamed on Yingluck and her Pheu Thai led government for not preventing greedy landlords from deforestating the lands surrounding mountains as they are the government upon who's watch this disaster has happened!!!!

Completely flawed logic I know and of course I don't blame the incumbent government - the point I'm trying to make is this illustrates just how STUPID their argument was on trying to pin all the problems on Abhisit and the Democrats back then!!!!.

[salween]

The obvious simple thing that could have been done and could be every year is to release water from behind dams at an earlier point rather than wait until everything is full and then release huge deluges all at the same time

Actually we have done this for our major hydroelectric reservoirs about 5 years ago. In 2009 we have successfully captured the biggest flood in 50 years. Not even a drop of water lost through spillage. We were making additional money worth USD 7million since we managed to store flood water more than 500million cubic meter (Half of the volume of water that troubled you currently). Obviously ordinary citizen may not realize our ingenuity since they took for granted that the flood should not be there in the first place. Doing the job like this you have to bear with the fact that if you perform your job perfectly well nobody realize that you exist. Next time when you fail people will start to know more about you so that they can channel their anger.

You almost get it right in term of overall concept. In reality, it is much more difficult. Let me ask you one question. How low that you think the dams water levels shall be kept before the next monsoon? Too low you ends up having no water for your purposes. Too high will increase the risk of flooding. It is very tricky business. Nevertheless as you said, it can be done. We have done it.

Who is "we"?

Sorry. We is myself and major hydroelectric reservoir authorities in my country. FYI, I'm not from Thailand.

Dams perpetuate the myth of flood control. And this is an excellent example of why. At best, dams decrease the frequency of flooding, but dramatically increase both the magnitude and economic loss when they can't control (or cause) them. It is for this reason that for more than a decade now both the US and Japan have abandoned the promotion of dams for flood "control" purposes.

[DocN]

Yeah...ahm...floodings during rainy season in Thailand. That has been going on since...what is the correct term, I am looking for?...oh yeah: FOREVER!

If you are talking about "floods", you always have to talk about "worst case scenario" and not "mai pen rai"!

But as long as rainforrest will be destroyed and replaced by the giant asphalt parking lot of an even gian'er industrial complex and no one gives a sh**...this is what you get.

Who is responsible? The rain? Yeah...now here is the deal: rain = being around for 4 billion years...

Politics, greedy people...basically all people, who just don't care...are to blame for the current situation.

"The main factors, they say, are deforestation, overbuilding in catchment areas, the damming and diversion of natural waterways, urban sprawl, and the filling-in of canals, combined with bad planning. Warnings to the authorities, they say, have been in vain".

The government is clearly to blame for the situation we have now.

I can remember that when we had the floods in the South earlier in the year some TV posters (red's and Thaksin supporters) were blaming Abhisit for the problems (deforestation especially) even after I happened to mention the fact that he had only been in office for about 2 years - using that logic then these problrms must be blamed on Yingluck and her Pheu Thai led government for not preventing greedy landlords from deforestating the lands surrounding mountains as they are the government upon who's watch this disaster has happened!!!!

Completely flawed logic I know and of course I don't blame the incumbent government - the point I'm trying to make is this illustrates just how STUPID their argument was on trying to pin all the problems on Abhisit and the Democrats back then!!!!.

What I am saying is: stop pointing fingers! It is EVERYBODIES responsibility to learn from THIS disaster and finally DO something!

[blakegeee]

I am not saying that this flooding has been intentional necessarily, but I certainly wouldn't put it past them.

Doesn't anybody remember that recent Thaksin Yingluck plan to build a multi trillion baht water project diverting water to new huge reservoirs in Isaan during the rainy season (much like they've already failed at "tried" before). Obviously this multi-trillion baht scheme would be very profitable for the powers that be. After all this flooding, I don't imagine they will get much resistance about going ahead with the plan now! It all just seems quite convenient.