webfact Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Suvarnabhumi Airport Ready to Combat Flooding An executive from Suvarnabhumi Airport expresses confidence that the earthen levee erected there will be capable of withstanding the floodwater that is expected to reach the area in the near future. Deputy Managing Director for the Airports of Thailand Somchai Sawasdeephol, as the acting director of Suvarnabhumi Airport, said a 3.5 meter high earthen levee has been built around its 23.5 kilometer perimeter to protect the airport from being flooded. Somchai affirmed that the levee is strong enough to cope with floods. Recent tests show that it is safe and up to standards and if the flood water flowing into the vicinity of the airport is not higher than 3.5 meters, it premises will be saved from flooding. The acting director then ruled out the possibility of flood water penetrating the airport through the drain tubes, given that the drainage system is a closed network that has no links to outside pipes, while all of the entrances and exits have been raised above the levee level so water has no opportunity to enter. Somchai said his agency is also coordinating with the Highways Department to arrange staff and equipment to make repairs and reinforce the levee in cases of emergency. He said he has also asked the police and the military to dispatch officers to help safeguard the levee against people who have ill intentions and wish to destroy it. Military officials will also assist in evacuating aircraft, equipment, passengers and staff should the situation spin out of control. Somchai affirmed that Suvarnabhumi Airport is operating as usual and that the average number of daily passengers is 100,000 right now, an increase of roughly 10 percent year-on-year while the number of flights departing and arriving there is some 900 a day, an increase of 14.9 percent from the same period of last year. -- Tan Network 2011-11-07 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keestha Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) Everybody who depends on tourism business for a living: keep your fingers crossed. Edited November 7, 2011 by keestha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadiseLost Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Somchai affirmed that Suvarnabhumi Airport is operating as usual and that the average number of daily passengers is 100,000 right now, an increase of roughly 10 percent year-on-year while the number of flights departing and arriving there is some 900 a day, an increase of 14.9 percent from the same period of last year. More useless information. As all domestic flights from DMK are landing at BKK one would assume daily passenger numbers would increase. What would be interesting (but less self fulfilling) info would be the number of international passengers arriving. Comparing to this time last year is totally meaningless - why not compare to the time of the (yellow shirt) closure, then your stats will really look good. Glad to hear the gun emplacements are up to prevent vandals damaging the mounds; this is becoming the equivalent of Custer's Last Stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siampolee Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) Somchai said his agency is also coordinating with the Highways Department to arrange staff and equipment to make repairs and reinforce the levee in cases of emergency. He said he has also asked the police and the military to dispatch officers to help safeguard the levee against people who have ill intentions and wish to destroy it. Military officials will also assist in evacuating aircraft, equipment, passengers and staff should the situation spin out of control. Interesting comments, maybe there are economies of the truth in statements concerning the safety, operation of and the security of Suvarnabhumi Airport. Edited November 7, 2011 by siampolee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexakap Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 I hardly believe that Swampy will stay against the waters for 1 month. Those newsmakers seems not understand how much water is going to pass through, how wide Swampy territory is....and how low the Swampy itself is built... It will be not a pleasant draining after the common rain....Yet those in charge have failed ALL the places they tried to protect. See DonMuang scenario, or any industrial estate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Military officials will also assist in evacuating aircraft, equipment, passengers and staff should the situation spin out of control. How wonderfully re-assuring. Sometimes somethings are better left unsaid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cloudhopper Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Is it possible for the entire water table inside the airfield perimeter to be forced above ground level due to hydrostatic pressure from surrounding flood water? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siampolee Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) Cloudhopper 3 7 Is it possible for the entire water table inside the airfield perimeter to be forced above ground level due to hydrostatic pressure from surrounding flood water? More of a fact than a possibility, I know the area well and flooding is not a rare occurrence, the man made drainage system is impressive, however mother natures system has been in action and perfected over millions of years. Airport construction has put many obstructions in the way of natural drainage and as the saying goes, " The Only Way Is Up." Those flood barriers may well be the kiss of death by actually retaining any flood water within the airport perimeter rather than keeping it out. There is of course the added problem that flood water could be of an equal level either side of the flood barriers, thus drainage would in that event be a long and slow process to say the least. Mind you that is of course the worst scenario, although to date the handling of the flooding does leave one feeling just a little pessimistic or somewhat cymical regarding the claims made by assorted bodies and persons supposedly dealing with matters aquatic.. . Edited November 7, 2011 by siampolee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparebox2 Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 I better book to fly via U-Tapao out. Bangkok Airways still have some seats available. Not taking any chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrChangers Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 "The acting director then ruled out the possibility of flood water penetrating the airport through the drain tubes, given that the drainage system is a closed network that has no links to outside pipes, while all of the entrances and exits have been raised above the levee level so water has no opportunity to enter." A closed drainage system? Can anyone explain this one to me as I thought a drain would need at least one output or are the staff lobbing the water over the levee in buckets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybother Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 "The acting director then ruled out the possibility of flood water penetrating the airport through the drain tubes, given that the drainage system is a closed network that has no links to outside pipes, while all of the entrances and exits have been raised above the levee level so water has no opportunity to enter." A closed drainage system? Can anyone explain this one to me as I thought a drain would need at least one output or are the staff lobbing the water over the levee in buckets? They've got pumps pumping water over the levee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayned Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Aren't these the same people that said that Bangkok wasn't going to flood? I hardly believe that Swampy will stay against the waters for 1 month. Those newsmakers seems not understand how much water is going to pass through, how wide Swampy territory is....and how low the Swampy itself is built... It will be not a pleasant draining after the common rain....Yet those in charge have failed ALL the places they tried to protect. See DonMuang scenario, or any industrial estate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siampolee Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 They've got pumps pumping water over the levee. Great where is said water going ? All that is happening is that the outside area of the flood barrier will be becoming waterlogged and subsequently that water will find its way up to the surface barrier or not, water will rise to the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybother Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 They've got pumps pumping water over the levee. Great where is said water going ? All that is happening is that the outside area of the flood barrier will be becoming waterlogged and subsequently that water will find its way up to the surface barrier or not, water will rise to the top. They pump water out to the south of Suvarnibhumi and from there it is only a few kilometres to the gulf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moe666 Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Last week when I flew in the drainage system had very little water in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siampolee Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) They pump water out to the south of Suvarnibhumi and from there it is only a few kilometres to the gulf. With a lot of people and a lot of property in the way of the 12-15 kilometer water roll to the sea, Bangna Trad highway and a fair amount of assorted industrial units as well as villages and let us not forget the people. If the water rolls the other way Lab Krabang town is in trouble. It is not going to be an easy time if the worst happens. Edited November 7, 2011 by siampolee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Last week when I flew in the drainage system had very little water in it. I can see the headlines next week. "Subsidence caused by over emptying Survanabhumi's drainage system" Somchai admitted he was very curious about how they had managed to cause cracking by removing so much water from the area inside the area of the airport in preparation for the coming flood. 'We have never pumped so much water out before, because we were getting ready for the flood, now the land is so dry it is starting to crack, so we may have to deliberately let some of the flood water in to stop the runways subsiding'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapk Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Interesting though. The airport is protected by a wall of 3.5 meters high. What if the water reaches 3 meter? How will people get to the airport? By boat???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cloudhopper Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 An old but interesting article from The Nation about runway cracks and water. http://nationmultimedia.com/2007/02/10/national/national_30026474.php According to Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suvarnabhumi_Airport the DCA did not renew their safety permit around this same time (2007) but the airport has continued to operate because the relevant ICAO requirement was never adopted into Thai law! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexakap Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) I hardly believe that Swampy will stay against the waters for 1 month. Those newsmakers seems not understand how much water is going to pass through, how wide Swampy territory is....and how low the Swampy itself is built... It will be not a pleasant draining after the common rain....Yet those in charge have failed ALL the places they tried to protect. See DonMuang scenario, or any industrial estate. Aren't these the same people that said that Bangkok wasn't going to flood? Flood?? In BANGKOK?? Which flood?? ...(a sad joke, I know....But this will not affect tourism!!!) Edited November 7, 2011 by alexakap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
givenall Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Everybody who depends on tourism business for a living: keep your fingers crossed. it his assurance the same as PM who assured Bangkokian that they will not be flooded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starrysky Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Flew in to Suvarnabhum on Saturday 5th from KL and the plane had to circle for about 20 minutes before it could land. Leaving again for C. Mai, we had to wait in a queue of planes for about the same time before we could take off. I've never experienced either situation before at the airport and it didn't seem particularly busy. When I got home, my Thai neighbour said that she'd heard something about there already being a small problem with water at the airport. So perhaps not all runways were being used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamestsao Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 I am jsut curious of who is coming in and what are they coming in for??? Thought most of the tourist areas are closed and they would be transiting to other destinations I think....definitely not Bangkok. "The acting director then ruled out the possibility of flood water penetrating the airport through the drain tubes, given that the drainage system is a closed network that has no links to outside pipes, while all of the entrances and exits have been raised above the levee level so water has no opportunity to enter." A closed drainage system? Can anyone explain this one to me as I thought a drain would need at least one output or are the staff lobbing the water over the levee in buckets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaidam Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 An old but interesting article from The Nation about runway cracks and water. http://nationmultimedia.com/2007/02/10/national/national_30026474.php According to Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suvarnabhumi_Airport the DCA did not renew their safety permit around this same time (2007) but the airport has continued to operate because the relevant ICAO requirement was never adopted into Thai law! from ACME Dictators almanac:- Chapter 3. Painting over the hacks. In case of unexpected cracks on runway/terminal buildings through trousering the budget, deny existance of said cracks,fire the editor of best selling rag that was insolent enough to print the story. Silence is golden, to hell with safety. In this instance it was the Bangkok Post senior editor that was sacked on TRT orders for printing the runway cracks story, subsequently proved true after quite a struggle. Soon the new media law will be passed (can't block it with the PPP having a majority) giving brother-in-law a free pass to unilaterally block any adverse press. I wonder if a flooded Swampy airport would be a taboo subject. Probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kutjebu Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Somchai affirmed that the levee is strong enough to cope with floods. Somchai is right about it.I checked myself.I've seen many dykes in Holland of that size who can stand this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smiling mantis Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 An old but interesting article from The Nation about runway cracks and water. http://nationmultimedia.com/2007/02/10/national/national_30026474.php According to Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suvarnabhumi_Airport the DCA did not renew their safety permit around this same time (2007) but the airport has continued to operate because the relevant ICAO requirement was never adopted into Thai law! Um, I had no idea it was this bad. So it isn't just a question of evacuating aircraft in the event of flooding, nor of protecting navaids or any of the other equipment that makes the airport go. It isn't just a question of what happens to the terminal which is itself a fairly novel structure. It's what the flooding is going to do to runways that are already being greatly stressed by water below the surface. And they're deploying earthen levees atop what was essentially a swamp. From a a report evaluating earthen levees in New Orleans: if the underlying foundation materials that support the levee are highly permeable, water can quickly travel through these porous materials as the water differential between the outboard and inboard sides of the levee increases. This underseepage (which is very similar to internal erosion and piping with the exception that the foundation materials are internally eroded, not the levee materials) can result in the catastrophic failure of the levee in that once the foundation materials have been eroded, the levee (which may be completely undamaged) has no underlying support and falls into the resulting void and essentially washes away. Indeed, one wonders whether you would even want to deploy levees in such a circumstance. Perhaps it would be better to let the water pass by quickly rather than letting it accumulate the kind of pressure that can cause further seepage into the sand layer the runways sit on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geriatrickid Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Is it possible for the entire water table inside the airfield perimeter to be forced above ground level due to hydrostatic pressure from surrounding flood water? Yup. I am not as worried about flooding as the ground going mushy. Consider the implications to the integrity of the runways. It would be interesting to hear the thoughts on that aspect. I have a feeling that Swampy will become spongey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felt 35 Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Somchai affirmed that Suvarnabhumi Airport is operating as usual and that the average number of daily passengers is 100,000 right now, an increase of roughly 10 percent year-on-year while the number of flights departing and arriving there is some 900 a day, an increase of 14.9 percent from the same period of last year. More useless information. As all domestic flights from DMK are landing at BKK one would assume daily passenger numbers would increase. What would be interesting (but less self fulfilling) info would be the number of international passengers arriving. Comparing to this time last year is totally meaningless - why not compare to the time of the (yellow shirt) closure, then your stats will really look good. Glad to hear the gun emplacements are up to prevent vandals damaging the mounds; this is becoming the equivalent of Custer's Last Stand. Passengers are down a lot,” Piyasvasti Amranand, president of Thai Airways International Pcl (THAI), said at the Seoul conference. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-11-06/bangkok-tourists-vanish-on-floods-leaving-shangri-la-bar-empty.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smiling mantis Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 It's the old articles that are really eye-opening. Here are some quotes from one dated 2007 from the Suvarnabhumi's own website: The earthen dyke preventing water from overflowing into Suvarnabhumi airport urgently needs improvement as it has subsided to a critical point, an airport construction engineer said yesterday.Surajit Surapolchai, the expert at Airports of Thailand supervising construction at the airport, said the dyke had subsided by nearly one metre, from 3.5m high to about 2.5m, leaving Suvarnabhumi vulnerable to flooding. Last year, the flood level outside the airport rise to about 2.20m. and another: Construction experts suspected that ground water from outside could seep through the soil and increase the ground water level inside the airport, which was very close to the soil surface. This could weaken the airport’s pavement. So I get it now when I see the long-term expats grouse about government corruption here. If the water was over two meters high at the airport in the 2006 flood, which was a baby compared to this one, and it was a flawed design from the start, and the measures being touted as the airport's defense are being condemned on the airport's own website, and they knew about this problem for this long and still did nothing, what else is to be said? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smiling mantis Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 And then there's this guy: "In the long run it may be necessary to pile all the aprons. The new runway east of the existing polder (a polder is a dyked area), slated for expansion, might be built sooner rather than later."In this respect the polder must not be expanded, and the new runway must not be land-filled. Instead the runway should be built above flood level on piers in order to allow flood water to pass under it," Sumet said. "In this way it will not impede water flow or further reduce the flood-retention capacity of Nong Ngu Hao swamp (on which the airport is built)." "There is nothing new in this. You can draw a lesson from the traditional Thai house on stilts standing comfortably in watery terrain. Traditional Thai architecture is amphibious and in harmony with nature." Wow. Just wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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