Power To House Only 190 Volts Due To Distance

[jko]

We are living in a leased property connected to a 3-phase electrical supply which is stable, but due to the distance from the main source, the voltage reaching us only measures 190 V

Things actually work OK - fridge, front load washing machine, but I'm told they may be damaged long term with this electricity supply?

Is this correct?

If so, is there any solution which will not cost the landlord the earth to implement?

Thanks for any advice on this...

[InterestedObserver]

That is correct. Who actually owns the appliances?

[Crossy]

Consistently low voltage certainly does no good. 190V on a nominal 220V supply is about 14% low, not ideal but if it does not go any lower you're unlikely to cause serious damage. Things with motors are most likely to suffer (washer, A/C, water pump etc).

How far is it from meter to house? Can you measure the voltage at the meter? It could be as simple as replacing the supply cable. What size meter do you have, what size is the incoming cable?

Alternatively a self-regulating transformer could be used to protect critical appliances, locals call them an AVR or stabilizer. Obviously you need to get one of suitable size for each appliance.

Lot's of questions I know but we need to get some idea as to where the drop is occurring, what do PEA have to say?

[jko]

Consistently low voltage certainly does no good. 190V on a nominal 220V supply is about 14% low, not ideal but if it does not go any lower you're unlikely to cause serious damage. Things with motors are most likely to suffer (washer, A/C, water pump etc).

How far is it from meter to house? Can you measure the voltage at the meter? It could be as simple as replacing the supply cable. What size meter do you have, what size is the incoming cable?

Alternatively a self-regulating transformer could be used to protect critical appliances, locals call them an AVR or stabilizer. Obviously you need to get one of suitable size for each appliance.

Lot's of questions I know but we need to get some idea as to where the drop is occurring, what do PEA have to say?

Many thanks for this help!

1) The meter is next to the house itself. Supply comes from circuit board about 100 metres away.

2) The 190 voltage was measured at the 6000W hot water heater which runs lukewarm. I presume it will be the same voltage at the meter itself?

3) Meter spec is: TODA kW-h Watt Hour meter 3-phase 4 wire Type DT8 3x220/380V 3x15 (45)A 50 Hz 90r/k W-h

4) Incoming cable spec is BKK Cable 750 V THW-A 10 SQ.MM TIS 293-2541 Table 1

5) PEA advice has to go through landlord who has not yet responded to the problem

Any idea of approx costs for AVR/Stabilizer?

Renewed thanks!

[Tywais]

Can you measure the voltage at the meter? It could be as simple as replacing the supply cable. What size meter do you have, what size is the incoming cable?

He could disconnect all power at the breaker and measure the voltage at the mains box. This way there would be no voltage drop in the line and would be nearly the same as measuring at the meter. A bit easier perhaps.

[Crossy]

1. PEA responsibility usually stops at the meter unless it's a private supply from your landlord (do you pay PEA directly for your power?).

2. Was that with the heater on or off?

3. 15/45 meter should be easily capable of 60A per phase.

4. Marginal but standard for this size supply.

5. Subject to 1. it is up to PEA to provide you with a suitable supply.

[jko]

1. PEA responsibility usually stops at the meter unless it's a private supply from your landlord (do you pay PEA directly for your power?).

2. Was that with the heater on or off?

3. 15/45 meter should be easily capable of 60A per phase.

4. Marginal but standard for this size supply.

5. Subject to 1. it is up to PEA to provide you with a suitable supply.

1) Private supply, payable to landlord as per meter

2) With heater on

-Appliances are ours, and all brand new.

[Crossy]

Ah, now we are getting somewhere.

More questions I'm afraid. Sorry if it's dragging on, but the answers to the questions determine the next step.

What is the voltage with the heater OFF?

Is the heater single or 3-phase?

Can you access the junction box that's 100m away?

If so check your supply terminals with the heater on and off, measure all three phases to neutral, report results here.

The heater is a convenient, large and known load that we can use to determine where the volt drop is occurring.

Sadly PEA are correct, not their problem, yet!

[InterestedObserver]

Boy do I hate lukewarm showers. As said, what is the voltage with shower OFF?

[jko]

Ah, now we are getting somewhere.

More questions I'm afraid. Sorry if it's dragging on, but the answers to the questions determine the next step.

What is the voltage with the heater OFF?

Is the heater single or 3-phase?

Can you access the junction box that's 100m away?

If so check your supply terminals with the heater on and off, measure all three phases to neutral, report results here.

The heater is a convenient, large and known load that we can use to determine where the volt drop is occurring.

Sadly PEA are correct, not their problem, yet!

-Thanks first of all for your incredible patience and courtesy!

I checked with the handyman who measured the voltage - he confirms 190 V switched ON and 220 V when OFF

I'm not sure whether heater is single or 3 phase (Model ref Panasonic DH-6GM2 220 V 50 Hz) 6000W how to tell?

I will try to access junction box tomorrow as suggested.

[Crossy]

Just found your post in the Chiang Mai forum jko, this one

I note you say the lights get BRIGHTER when you turn on the heater, this is a classic sign of imbalance and poor volt drop performance in a 3-phase system, looks like the Panasonic DH-6GM2 is single phase 6kW.

I note one of the replies in the other thread suggested a poor neutral connection, something to check whenever your man has the lid off any boxes particularly if aluminium cable is used.

Let us know ALL the phase voltages when you measure them, it's important that we ascertain where the problem lies. You will be tracking back through the system measuring voltages for a couple of days yet

[InterestedObserver]

-Thanks first of all for your incredible patience and courtesy!

I checked with the handyman who measured the voltage - he confirms 190 V switched ON and 220 V when OFF

I'm not sure whether heater is single or 3 phase (Model ref Panasonic DH-6GM2 220 V 50 Hz) 6000W how to tell?

I will try to access junction box tomorrow as suggested.

If this were a single-phase system the answer would be easy, too much load for the cable size and distance. However, the three-phase system plus lights brightening complicates things somewhat. Measure the three line-to-neutral and phase-to-phase voltages with the shower heater both ON and OFF.

[haveaniceday]

Do note that I know nothing about this subject, but I was surprised to see,

Post #4 " Incoming cable spec is BKK Cable 750 V THW-A 10 SQ.MM"

May be worth confirming that there is not 100m of 10mm2 cable ? Some times the simple things are overlooked !!!

[InterestedObserver]

Do note that I know nothing about this subject, but I was surprised to see,

Post #4 " Incoming cable spec is BKK Cable 750 V THW-A 10 SQ.MM"

May be worth confirming that there is not 100m of 10mm2 cable ? Some times the simple things are overlooked !!!

We are waiting for the three-phase voltage readings, but the symptom "lights get BRIGHTER when you turn on the heater" is an indication of neutral point shift that can be caused by a faulty neutral connection or grossly imbalanced loads.

[Crossy]

If it was single phase 100m of 10mm² would cause about 1/2 the droop being seen at 6kW.

Three-phase makes things so much more complex to diagnose when we have a potentially under-rated system that's likely badly installed and not maintained

[jko]

We're very grateful to all who helped with advice on this

Since we live in the boondocks, we finally couldn't find an electrician savvy enough to take on the technicalities, so we have referred it back to the owner for a direct line of help, hopefully through the electricity authority direct, but suspect it may take a long time this way.

We'll post the final outcome, hopefully a happy ending, meanwhile, many thanks to you all!

Much appreciated...

[cdmtdm]

my two cent worth loose connection most likely on the neutral side , check to make sure no junction has been made from the house to point of entry onto the property ......goodluck

We're very grateful to all who helped with advice on this

Since we live in the boondocks, we finally couldn't find an electrician savvy enough to take on the technicalities, so we have referred it back to the owner for a direct line of help, hopefully through the electricity authority direct, but suspect it may take a long time this way.

We'll post the final outcome, hopefully a happy ending, meanwhile, many thanks to you all!

Much appreciated...