Why Is There Smoke In Chiang Mai?

[gowdy]

Hey Guys,

Anyone know why there is smoke in Chiang Mai already? I thought it happened in March... not December/Jan

[Semper]

Maybe it's just the smog.

[Tywais]

Up by Hang Dong where I live there has been some major burning going on as I can see huge plumes of smoke in the distance at a couple of locations over the last two weeks. Has been filling the house in the evenings with smoke.

[hellodolly]

I don't know why there is so much smoke in the air now.

Could it be that they are burning what they couldn't burn last year due to the life giving rain.

[ianf]

I have seen far more burning this past two months than I did during a similar period last year. One day they'll understand that burning is not the way to get rid of waste (burning plastic and rubber last week by the Mae Ping) or a practical solution to the clearing of rice fields, overgrown verges and so on. It makes me angry every time I see this ........

[simoncnx]

just driven back from bkk. Burning all the way for the last 200km

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Good. What they burn now they don't have to burn during the main crunch in March.

[hellodolly]

Good. What they burn now they don't have to burn during the main crunch in March.

Yes but what they are burning now is it not just left over from last year?

[CNX1984]

All of the burning is from the mass vegetation that grew from all the rain we accumulated during the rainy months. I have a large piece of property to tend to and it is quite amazing how fast it grows with that extra rain. Previous years we hadn't gotten that much.

[hellodolly]

All of the burning is from the mass vegetation that grew from all the rain we accumulated during the rainy months. I have a large piece of property to tend to and it is quite amazing how fast it grows with that extra rain. Previous years we hadn't gotten that much.

Many Thanks

Makes a lot of sense when you stop to think about it.

[ludditeman]

Just drove through the mountains near Chang Dow and Fang. Fields burning all over, very smelly!

Mainly rice straw/stubble, but plenty of undergrowth clearing too.

[el jefe]

Lots of fields burning north of Mae Jo (between the 1001 and the canal) for the last two weeks and I've seen them burn the roadside undergrowth out near Mae Win too. I don't mind the rice field burning. It's the endless burning of garbage that sucks. If it was just leaves they were burning I wouldn't care but you can see and smell the difference when they've put plastic bags in the pile.

[lannarebirth]

In addition to the increased vegetation that wasn't burned last year due to the early rains, many farmers, who don't normally plant twice per year are trying to get second rice crops in due to the incresed government subsidy. So maybe double field burnings this year.

[Blinky Bill]

Deja vu. An annual posting. Ho hum.

[Briggsy]

Rain stops, burning starts.

[ogb]

Lots of fields burning north of Mae Jo (between the 1001 and the canal) for the last two weeks and I've seen them burn the roadside undergrowth out near Mae Win too. I don't mind the rice field burning. It's the endless burning of garbage that sucks. If it was just leaves they were burning I wouldn't care but you can see and smell the difference when they've put plastic bags in the pile.

Burning leaves is dumb, and it gets dumber.

[el jefe]

Deja vu. An annual posting. Ho hum.

Yet you thought this would be an interesting enough subject that you clicked on it to read.

I've seen plenty of threads on the burning in March but never one explaining the burning in December.

And if we're boring you, please feel free to leave.

[Blinky Bill]

Yet you thought this would be an interesting enough subject that you clicked on it to read.

I've seen plenty of threads on the burning in March but never one explaining the burning in December.

And if we're boring you, please feel free to leave.

I guess you're right, el jefe. A thread on burning in December is far more intersting than a thread on burning in March. Or for that matter, February and January as well.

Many thanks for the invite to leave all the same, but I think I'll stick around to see how this one pans out. Fascinating stuff.

[Semper]

I guess you're right, el jefe. A thread on burning in December is far more intersting than a thread on burning in March. Or for that matter, February and January as well.

Many thanks for the invite to leave all the same, but I think I'll stick around to see how this one pans out. Fascinating stuff.

Riveting.

[Priceless]

Just to put this discussion into perspective:

The Thai Pollution Control Department has two standards for Particulate Matter Pollution (PM₁₀):

- The yearly average level should not exceed 50 µg/m^3.

- The daily average should not exceed 120 µg/m³ for any 24-hour period.

This year in Chiang Mai (with four days to go) has had an average level of 33.2 µg/m³. There has not been a single day in excess of 120 µg/m³, in fact the maximum value recorded this year was 92.0 µg/m³. These levels make 2011 the best year on record (pollution-wise).

As concerns the present month the average, at 44.3 µg/m³, has been slightly better than an average December, though not as good as December of last year which was the best on record. There has not been a single observation in excess of 60 µg/m³, i.e. half the PCD standard. In fact, you have to go back to April 6th to find an observation in excess of 60 µg/m3.

/ Priceless

[Thailand]

Just to put this discussion into perspective:

The Thai Pollution Control Department has two standards for Particulate Matter Pollution (PM₁₀):

- The yearly average level should not exceed 50 µg/m^3.

- The daily average should not exceed 120 µg/m³ for any 24-hour period.

This year in Chiang Mai (with four days to go) has had an average level of 33.2 µg/m³. There has not been a single day in excess of 120 µg/m³, in fact the maximum value recorded this year was 92.0 µg/m³. These levels make 2011 the best year on record (pollution-wise).

As concerns the present month the average, at 44.3 µg/m³, has been slightly better than an average December, though not as good as December of last year which was the best on record. There has not been a single observation in excess of 60 µg/m³, i.e. half the PCD standard. In fact, you have to go back to April 6th to find an observation in excess of 60 µg/m3.

/ Priceless

I guess everything was too wet to burn! Hopefully a repeat in the coming year without the flooding.

This has been an awful 2 - 3 weeks where we are,burning day and night in the surrounding area rice fields verges anything and everything it seems and just had to close the doors and windows to try to block out the smell of yet more burning-can see black smoke rising not too far away.

And as for it being an annual event that some seem to think does not warrant discussion, it is unhealthy, dangerous and needs to be brought to peoples attention- whenever it occurs!

[MESmith]

Everything in the rice fields that isn't baled (they do have baling machines here, but many farmers are just too eager with the lighter) should be ploughed into the soil. They do have tractors now, it's not peasants working with buffalo anymore. People should re-learn the old ways of composting their garden waste. Not exactly rocket science "Einstein-not".

[KRS1]

Everything in the rice fields that isn't baled (they do have baling machines here, but many farmers are just too eager with the lighter) should be ploughed into the soil. They do have tractors now, it's not peasants working with buffalo anymore. People should re-learn the old ways of composting their garden waste. Not exactly rocket science "Einstein-not".

I guess you don't realize the benefits of charcoal in soil for future crops. Or would you prefer more chemical fertilizers?

...and i guess there wouldn't have to be any fuel involved to operate the bailers, or the complexity of operating a bailing machine on a hill slope or even getting the bailer to the location. Where would you compost all that stuff, in the same field thats about to get replanted?

Bailing could work if they harvested the heat produced from decomposition to generate electricity.But then again some farang would complain about the smell and call Thais stupid again.

[ogb]

I guess you don't realize the benefits of charcoal in soil for future crops. Or would you prefer more chemical fertilizers?

Might you be confusing ash with charcoal?

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Just to put this discussion into perspective:

The Thai Pollution Control Department has two standards for Particulate Matter Pollution (PM₁₀):

- The yearly average level should not exceed 50 µg/m^3.

- The daily average should not exceed 120 µg/m³ for any 24-hour period.

This year in Chiang Mai (with four days to go) has had an average level of 33.2 µg/m³. There has not been a single day in excess of 120 µg/m³, in fact the maximum value recorded this year was 92.0 µg/m³. These levels make 2011 the best year on record (pollution-wise).

As concerns the present month the average, at 44.3 µg/m³, has been slightly better than an average December, though not as good as December of last year which was the best on record. There has not been a single observation in excess of 60 µg/m³, i.e. half the PCD standard. In fact, you have to go back to April 6th to find an observation in excess of 60 µg/m3.

This has been an awful 2 - 3 weeks where we are,burning day and night in the surrounding area rice fields verges anything and everything it seems and

As so many people in these discussions, you are mixing up local occurrences and annoyances with seasonal regional air quality. You can't take a look at a neighbor, then add to a topic on seasonal air quality and then go 'oh, this year is worse'. (or better, for that matter.)

[mesquite]

Just to put this discussion into perspective:

The Thai Pollution Control Department has two standards for Particulate Matter Pollution (PM₁₀):

- The yearly average level should not exceed 50 µg/m^3.

- The daily average should not exceed 120 µg/m³ for any 24-hour period.

This year in Chiang Mai (with four days to go) has had an average level of 33.2 µg/m³. There has not been a single day in excess of 120 µg/m³, in fact the maximum value recorded this year was 92.0 µg/m³. These levels make 2011 the best year on record (pollution-wise).

As concerns the present month the average, at 44.3 µg/m³, has been slightly better than an average December, though not as good as December of last year which was the best on record. There has not been a single observation in excess of 60 µg/m³, i.e. half the PCD standard. In fact, you have to go back to April 6th to find an observation in excess of 60 µg/m3.

/ Priceless

Very true and if you use the Thai standards, CM is doing well indeed. But if you use the World Health Organization guidelines,

PM₁₀

20 μg/m³ annual mean

50 μg/m³ 24-hour mean

you find we are not doing well at all.

[lannarebirth]

Actually, until I stumbled onto this thread i didn't know the air quality was bad at all yet.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Just to put this discussion into perspective:

The Thai Pollution Control Department has two standards for Particulate Matter Pollution (PM₁₀):

- The yearly average level should not exceed 50 µg/m^3.

- The daily average should not exceed 120 µg/m³ for any 24-hour period.

This year in Chiang Mai (with four days to go) has had an average level of 33.2 µg/m³. There has not been a single day in excess of 120 µg/m³, in fact the maximum value recorded this year was 92.0 µg/m³. These levels make 2011 the best year on record (pollution-wise).

As concerns the present month the average, at 44.3 µg/m³, has been slightly better than an average December, though not as good as December of last year which was the best on record. There has not been a single observation in excess of 60 µg/m³, i.e. half the PCD standard. In fact, you have to go back to April 6th to find an observation in excess of 60 µg/m3.

/ Priceless

Very true and if you use the Thai standards, CM is doing well indeed. But if you use the World Health Organization guidelines,

PM₁₀

20 μg/m³ annual mean

50 μg/m³ 24-hour mean

you find we are not doing well at all.

..and neither is the rest of the world, some coastal and sparsely populated regions excepted.

[Priceless]

The WHO guidelines are a complicated subject, but to (over)simplify a bit, the WHO Air Quality Guidelines (AQG) of 20 and 50, respectively, are values below which science at present has not been able to demonstrate any adverse effects from ambient air pollution. This is implicit in the fact that WHO also has three 'Intermediate Targets' for each guideline, as indicated in these two tables:

Chiang Mai's yearly average is currently in the 'Intermediate Target 2' range, bordering on 'Intermediate Target 3' by this year's result. The city rates very favourably in this context and has also been on a quite strongly positive trend (i.e. towards lower levels) for at least the last 7½ years.

WHO has relatively recently published a list of 1,082 cities worldwide with their respective yearly average pollution levels. Of these cities 490 (i.e. a minority) are within the AQG. What is more interesting is that of these 490, only four (4) have a tropical climate (Belo Horizonte and its neighbour Ibrité in Brazil, Mauritius and Pekanbaru in Indonesia). You will find that if the lowest pollution level is a priority for you, you'll probably have to leave the tropics.

/ Priceless

Edit: Winnie posted while I was writing my reply. My reply is more verbose, his is more directly to the point.

[MESmith]

Ignore the govt statistics or pm data from some site they probably have sprinklers all around to clean the air, take a drive around the countryside outside of CM. It is f*cking sh1t. Smoke everywhere, kids can't play outside. It's a freaking burnfest.