Some Thoughts On The Passing Of John Wilson

[Mobi]

Several times a week, as I take my evening walk around Lake Mabprachan, I pass the spot where John Wilson met his maker, and I wish him well, wherever he may be.

I don’t know much about John Wilson – in fact I know very little indeed. All that I know that he was a biker, and that on February 5^th, 2008 he died when he was driving around Mabprachan Lake on his motor bike. I know this because there is a small memorial plate and stone affixed to the grass verge which tells me so.

Maybe there is someone out there who knows more about John Wilson than I do.

I first came to live by the Lake out here on the Darkside in 2005, and apart from a brief flirt with living in Jomtien I have lived out here ever since.

I have seen the area grow from a sparsely populated, almost traffic-free and truly ‘Darkside’ area, (once the sun set), to a bustling area, teeming with new arrivals, both farangs and Thais, and burdened with an incredible increase in traffic on what is not a very good, two lane, twisting highway, containing many hidden and unexpected pot holes.

In 2005 the only restaurant was ‘Khun John’s’ and the only bars were ‘Fisherman’s Rest’, (I still recall its opening day) and ‘Charlie’s’, which is today’s ‘Mannequin Pis’.

Today, the Lakeside area is awash with Motels, bars, restaurants, shops, massage parlours, hair salons and God knows what else, together with a commensurate increase in traffic; from tours buses and trucks, to pickups, to SUV’s to saloon cars to motorcycles, to motorcycle combinations and even a surprising number of pedal cycles – all going hither and thither around the lake .

The traffic has increased to such an extent, that I sometimes fear for my safety when taking my evening walk, and I have recently started to take walking routes off the main lakeside road to avoid the worst of the traffic.

But the other day I was actually walking on the grass verge next to the Lakeside road, about a meter from the tarmac, when I was almost blown off my feet by the turbulence created by a passing motorbike that was going at such speed that I felt he would surely never survive more than a few more minutes. For a few brief moments I actually hoped that he ended up joining John Wilson on the ‘other side’, so angry was I at the man’s thoughtless and dangerous driving.

Of course he was a farang, and I would guess he must have been going well in excess of 140 kms/hr.

Every time I go for my walk I see at least one, sometimes several, farang motorcyclists driving around the lake in a similar manner – not one of them ever wearing a helmet. The road is so dangerous with its twisty hairpin bends, pot holes, cross roads with no rights of way, and last but by no means least, by having to navigate through all manner of traffic, ranging from pedal bicycles to cement trucks.

I would venture to suggest that the fastest safe speed on a road jam-full of obstacles and potential accident victims should be no more than 60 kms/hr. Even then, you need to keep your eyes well open.

Yet these motorcyclists, all of them farangs, seem to think they are indestructible and that they own the road. They should ask John Wilson when they meet him or one of several motorcyclist farangs that I know of personally who have met their maker on the streets of Pattaya.

And it is not only the farang ‘bikers’ that drive in such an irresponsible manner. There are also many in SUV’s, pickups and cars who also tear around the lake as though they are on a racing track. I see so many of them every day.

Those of you who know me from way back will know that I too have had the odd accident or two on this road, and it is certainly nothing that I am proud of and am very glad that I have put those days far behind me.

I am very fortunate that the only person I ever hurt was myself, as God help me if I had ever done injury to some poor innocent victim. I doubt if I could ever live with myself.

But these days, in my sober state, I see more clearly than ever what a terrible, selfish and dangerous thing these thoughtless, quite often drunk farangs are doing on the roads of the Darkside and I dread to think how many of them end up maimed, dead or at the very least, in a Thai jail.

So guys, I don’t really care if you want to kill yourselves, but instead of putting the community at large at risk from your reckless driving, do us all a favour and drop by the Pattaya shooting range and put a bullet in your brain like that poor devil did the other day.

Maybe only then our beloved the Lakeside will return to a safe place for one and all to enjoy, without fearing for our lives every time venture out onto the roads.

[Mobi]

I just returned from my evening walk around the lake.

The first offender was a farang on a large, very noisy motorbike who shot past me at speed - I would guess well in excess of 100km/rh. To be fair he was wearing a helmet, but that's no excuse fopr the speed he was travelling.

Ten minutes later, on my return leg, I witnessed two near accidents in a row, both involving highly dangerous overtaking. The first was a pick-up who was overtaking a line of 3 vehicles and actually ran a motorbike coming the other way off the road. The man wasn't hurt, but he was shaken up and not at all impressed with the farangs in his midst!

Within a few seconds there was a gleaming white Fortuner performing a similar manoeuvre at high speed at almost the same spot. This time, thank God, there no bikes coming the other way, but boy! was that <deleted> Fortuner travelling! And yes, you've guessed it, yet another farang at the wheel.

If you could just see the number of bikes with little families piled on board and rickety bikes with converted side cars selling their wares or loaded up with women and babies, it would make your heart stop when you see the reckless way these farangs are driving.

I know, the Thais shouldn't be allowed to pile up their bikes and side cars with family in such a dangerous manner - but this is Thailand and they do, and nothing is about to change in the foreseeable future.

We should be aware of this and drive accordingly, not behave like arrogant, selfish pr..cks from another planet.

[lemel]

I think it was 2006 that John Died.

[RabC]

I just returned from my evening walk around the lake.

The first offender was a farang on a large, very noisy motorbike who shot past me at speed - I would guess well in excess of 100km/rh. To be fair he was wearing a helmet, but that's no excuse fopr the speed he was travelling.

Ten minutes later, on my return leg, I witnessed two near accidents in a row, both involving highly dangerous overtaking. The first was a pick-up who was overtaking a line of 3 vehicles and actually ran a motorbike coming the other way off the road. The man wasn't hurt, but he was shaken up and not at all impressed with the farangs in his midst!

Within a few seconds there was a gleaming white Fortuner performing a similar manoeuvre at high speed at almost the same spot. This time, thank God, there no bikes coming the other way, but boy! was that <deleted> Fortuner travelling! And yes, you've guessed it, yet another farang at the wheel.

If you could just see the number of bikes with little families piled on board and rickety bikes with converted side cars selling their wares or loaded up with women and babies, it would make your heart stop when you see the reckless way these farangs are driving.

I know, the Thais shouldn't be allowed to pile up their bikes and side cars with family in such a dangerous manner - but this is Thailand and they do, and nothing is about to change in the foreseeable future.

We should be aware of this and drive accordingly, not behave like arrogant, selfish pr..cks from another planet.

Mobi

You say a Fortuner, why am I not surprised, they are the penis extension of the car world just like the Harley is of the bike world. Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner unless they have an inferiority complex?

[transam]

I just returned from my evening walk around the lake.

The first offender was a farang on a large, very noisy motorbike who shot past me at speed - I would guess well in excess of 100km/rh. To be fair he was wearing a helmet, but that's no excuse fopr the speed he was travelling.

Ten minutes later, on my return leg, I witnessed two near accidents in a row, both involving highly dangerous overtaking. The first was a pick-up who was overtaking a line of 3 vehicles and actually ran a motorbike coming the other way off the road. The man wasn't hurt, but he was shaken up and not at all impressed with the farangs in his midst!

Within a few seconds there was a gleaming white Fortuner performing a similar manoeuvre at high speed at almost the same spot. This time, thank God, there no bikes coming the other way, but boy! was that <deleted> Fortuner travelling! And yes, you've guessed it, yet another farang at the wheel.

If you could just see the number of bikes with little families piled on board and rickety bikes with converted side cars selling their wares or loaded up with women and babies, it would make your heart stop when you see the reckless way these farangs are driving.

I know, the Thais shouldn't be allowed to pile up their bikes and side cars with family in such a dangerous manner - but this is Thailand and they do, and nothing is about to change in the foreseeable future.

We should be aware of this and drive accordingly, not behave like arrogant, selfish pr..cks from another planet.

Mobi

You say a Fortuner, why am I not surprised, they are the penis extension of the car world just like the Harley is of the bike world. Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner unless they have an inferiority complex?

Little surprised at your post.

[banglay]

"Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner " maybe the people who can afford one and that are not the "Cheap Charlie" types

[RabC]

"Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner " maybe the people who can afford one and that are not the "Cheap Charlie" types

I have a saloon costing similar money to a Fortuner but had no need for an ego trip. Seriously who needs a vehicle that size if only living here and driving on Thai motorways?

[transam]

"Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner " maybe the people who can afford one and that are not the "Cheap Charlie" types

+1

[transam]

"Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner " maybe the people who can afford one and that are not the "Cheap Charlie" types

I have a saloon costing similar money to a Fortuner but had no need for an ego trip. Seriously who needs a vehicle that size if only living here and driving on Thai motorways?

Why does anyone buy antiques or spend lots on restaurant food ? Cos it's what they want. Ferrari's, Porsche's etc etc. The list goes on, if we thought the way you are thinking then we all might as well ride bikes and eat crap.

[RabC]

"Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner " maybe the people who can afford one and that are not the "Cheap Charlie" types

Sorry previously I forgot to thank you for proving me correct, you immediately went into a willy waving contest by assuming I couldnt afford a car of same value therefore you were better than me.

I didnt arrive in Thailand hating Fortuner drivers but it took less than six months of being cut up by the Hi-Sos (Thai and Farang) for me to generate my dislike.

Again thanks for proving my opinion.

[guzzi850m2]

The roads outside my village have speed bumps and they work very good, all slow down, don't want to ruin that nice Fortuner, eh.

Regarding cars, I have a saloon but will shift to either SUV or pick-up due to safety issues, you don't want to sit in a saloon and get t-boned by a suv/pick-up. I don't really care what other thinks about that, its my business.

[bergen]

The roads outside my village have speed bumps and they work very good, all slow down, don't want to ruin that nice Fortuner, eh.

Regarding cars, I have a saloon but will shift to either SUV or pick-up due to safety issues, you don't want to sit in a saloon and get t-boned by a suv/pick-up. I don't really care what other thinks about that, its my business.

[Rimmer]

Inflammatory post removed from view.

[Bagwan]

"Who in Pattaya seriously needs a Fortuner " maybe the people who can afford one and that are not the "Cheap Charlie" types

I do not see any connection between being affluent and generous and the NEED for a Fortuner. Perhaps you would be so kind as to explain? The majority of people living in Thailand seem to be able to survive without owning one. Perhaps they are secure in themselves and don't feel the need to pander to a non-existent but perceived audience and flounce around in expensive boys toys. Should we lesser beings lower our heads and tug at our forelocks, if they still exist, to owners of these supposedly desirable machines?

Why would anybody enjoy shelling out big bucks at the pumps to fill the tank? Or getting a thrill over paying an arm and leg to replace tyres or renew mechanical parts? It wouldn't have anything to do with the size of their wedding equipment would it? Or being here too long that they have taken onboard the ridiculous concept of 'face'?

Be warned folks. Don't ever be seen travelling in an economy sized vehicle, or horror of horrors, be seen on a baht bus, or people will think you are an impoverished, miserly skinflint seems to be your message.

.

[Spoonman]

I have a saloon costing similar money to a Fortuner but had no need for an ego trip. Seriously who needs a vehicle that size if only living here and driving on Thai motorways?

Whats your thoughts on the Vigo, it is longer in both overall and wheelbase than the Fortuner, and at 1790mm high it is is shadowed by the Vigo by 20mm as well.....................

[LennyW]

I think the message of this topic is not about fortuner's and vigo's, it's more like a warning that if you live round lake maprachan - then everytime you go out you are taking your life in your hands!!

[londoedan]

I think the message of this topic is not about fortuner's and vigo's, it's more like a warning that if you live round lake maprachan - then everytime you go out you are taking your life in your hands!!

Too true, and not just around lake maparachan: traffic in Pattaya must rank number 1 in my list of concerns whilst living here, and I don't drive - just crossing 2nd Rd is an adventure at times.

However I think several posters above make a very valid point about the types of vehicles that people tend to drive in a town and urban environment. Some of these monsters are driven with very little regard to the safety of other road users and pedestrians.

On top of this we then have this type of attitude:

"I don't really care what other thinks about that, its my business" by poster guzzi850m2.

I'm with RabC - when I see people driving these trev'ed-up SUV's and pick-ups or riding around on mid-life crisis soft-tails and cruisers, I tend to feel only pity for the hidden messages these transport choices are making and resentment at the noise / pollution / threat to life and limb these vehicles pose.

Peace

Simon

[dogtim]

Jonathon Wilson was killed in a motorcycle accident in February 2006. I was with him when it happened. There were three of us on three bikes, Jon was leading. A large brown snake crossed the road in front of us just before that sharp curve in the road. He took his eyes off the road for just a couple of seconds, looking back at this large snake and strayed onto the wrong side of the road on that curve. A minivan coming the opposite way hit him head on. We were not speeding, doing probably 40 to 50 kph enjoying the scenery. We had not been drinking, it was early afternoon. We placed that memorial stone there and still pay someone to tend it every month. Jon was a former British paratrooper who had helped raise millions of Baht for charity in the years that he lived here. The other rider with us that day is a retired British police officer.

If you wish to rant about driving standards in this country and the sort of people who drive large cars etc., please do it without linking it to the death of a very fine man. There are many of his friends who read this forum as does his daughter.

[NanLaew]

^ As you can see, the OP mentioned Jonathon's memorial in a reverential and respectful manner. Unfortunately, the petrol-heads and 'I am different' crowd hijacked the thread so your post is a much appreciated reminder of the core of Mobi's post.

Take a moment and consider what happened to Jonathon (and all the other Jonathon's in the area) and drive moderately. Just because you 'live' in Thailand does not mean you have to abandon all sense and safety when driving and end up dying here.

[Mobi]

I meant no disrespect to the memory of Jon Wilson and thank you for telling us how he died, which further demonstrates my point of how potentially dangerous this two lane road is from the many obstacles, both human and ‘natural’, although I never imagined that a snake would contribute to a road accident.

I was simply using the memory of this tragic accident to observe how reckless it has become to drive at speed on a road that is simply not designed for the amount of traffic that now uses it.

If any of Jon’s family are upset by my post, then I apologise, but somehow I doubt it, as I trust it is clear that the thread has been opened with the best of intentions.

As to the use of ‘speed bumps’, well that works very well on short stretches of road in residential areas , but this road is probably around 5 kilometres in length and it is simply impractical to put ‘bumps’ along its entire length. What might work would be large signs reminding drivers in Thai and English that ‘SPEED KILLS – PLEASE DRIVE CAREFULLY!” along with frequent signs showing a low speed limit.

This might help to make drivers realise that the road is no longer a quiet country lane, but an increasingly busy thoroughfare full of dangerously loaded and slow moving vehicles; but those who live in the area already know this very well.

And no, it you do not put your life in your hand every time you go out on this road. It hasn’t got that bad – not yet anyway. Walking a meter or so off the main road is probably as safe as anywhere in the world; I take walking routes away from the lake because I wish to have peace and quiet, away from the incessant traffic, not because it is dangerous to walk alongside the lake.

By far and away the greatest danger out here is to motorcyclists – mainly Thais - with and without side cars, who poodle around the lake, loaded up with families and/or produce. The slightest error on the part of speeding motorists will cause a terrible accident.

I did not intend this thread to become a debate over the choice of vehicles to drive on Pattaya’s roads.

Indeed, back in 2005 I bought one of the early Fortuners myself as it was the first of a new breed of 8 -seater, 4 wheel drive SUV’s and at the time was excellent value for money. It was just what I wanted as I used it on frequent occasions to transport loads of Thai family around Sa Keo and Issan, used it off road in and around my wife’s rubber plantations and also travelled extensively throughout Thailand, often on less than perfect terrain and nearly always with a good load of passengers on board.

On two occasions my extended family from the UK visited me and I was able to squeeze all of them in one vehicle for travelling around the country rather than have two vehicles which would have been the case had I not had a Fortuner.

So it performed its part very well for me for 3 years, but when my circumstances changed I sold it and bought a smaller car, more suitable for some of Pattaya’s small sois and parking spaces.

The point is that its ‘horses for courses’ and how do we know the purpose any particular farang may put his vehicle to? Maybe they, like me, need a large, 4 wheel drive vehicle for trips up country. In any case, surely it’s their choice and quite frankly who cares? I don’t, but if they do wish to drive these monsters, then they should drive them appropriately on Pattaya’s often dangerous highways.

I’m not a particular fan of Harleys as I cannot see what pleasure they get out of driving these noisy, monster bikes on Thailand’s dangerous roads, but if it makes them happy then good luck to them. A week or so back, I observed a group of them driving around the lake, (they always drive in packs), at a fairly reasonable speed, - although I personally feel it should have been even slower - when they suddenly veered off the road and pulled up on a large verge and surrounded a Thai motorcyclist who wondered what the heck had happened. It transpired that the bikers were angry at him because he cut out in front of them from a side soi.

The incident was ridiculous on two fronts. Firstly, because the bikers couldn’t speak a word of Thai and the man simply had no idea what they were talking about, and secondly even if he did understand them, he still wouldn’t understand why they were taking him to task; as in Thailand, it is perfectly normal practice to ‘jump out’ in front of moving traffic, provided that the oncoming traffic has sufficient time to brake. If these bikers wish to remonstrate with every vehicle who cuts them off, they will never reach their destination.

This anecdote simply demonstrates, yet again, how foolish it is to drive at speed, as you simply never know what may occur in front of you. These vehicles that jump out of sois are used to the oncoming traffic advancing at between 40-60 kms/hr, not 80- 140 kms hr as is often the case around the lake.

So by all means comment on the drivers and driving behaviour and what may be done about it, but please express your thoughts as to why certain farangs drive certain types of vehicles to other threads….

Thank you.

And… RIP John Wilson

[Rimmer]

Thank you Mobi, dogtim and NanLaew for setting the record straight, I think with that we can close the thread

//CLOSED//