Nuclear reactor temperature at Japan's Fukushima Daiichi plant rises to 82°C

[MJP]

Where's the IAEA in all this?

This could well turn out to be a global public health issue and I would have thought the IAEA would be all over this, if not already.

Exactly!

In August the IAEA urged Japan to explain more clearly what is happening at Fukushima and avoid sending "confusing messages" about the disaster.

http://phys.org/news/2013-08-japan-messages-fukushima-iaea.html

In an article I read yesterday it explained TEPCO and the Japanese government to some extent is relying on semantics or differences in Japanese terminology when it is translated into English ti justify its behaviour ( or lack thereof ). Can you believe this ?

For example in Japanese the words to describe " open ocean " is apparently different from the English interpretation and this is how they are getting away with denying that contaminated water is dangerously affecting the Pacific Ocean.

We are talking about long-term damage to a huge part of the northern hemisphere ecological system and the Japanese want to play with words.

It's criminal!

It's also seems so low down on the news agenda. Not going conspiracy theory at all, I just wonder whether the scale of this is really understood.

I remember Chernobyl going up and it was huge news for ages afterwards. We all know the effects Chernobyl had on people and the environment, so how come Fukushima isn't front and centre daily?

[SjaakNL2013]

About bombs, nuclear plants and fuel rods.

Lets go back in time.

The USA Bomber Enola Gay dropped Little Boy on Hiroshima on August 6, 1945, Little Boy was a uranium fueled bomb about 10 feet long and just over two feet across, that held 140 pounds of uranium and weighed nearly 10,000 pounds.

Three days later Fat Man was dropped on the city of Nagasaki on August 9, 1945. Holding 14 pounds of plutonium

Both bombs exploded above the ground, resp 2000 and 1650 feet.

From Little Boy only 2 pounds of uranium did go in state of fusion releasing 17 kilotons of explosive force

Also by Fat Man only 2 pounds of plutonium started the fusion but released 21 kilotons of explosive force.

Now to Chernobyl, reactor 4, the one that exploded contained about 180 ton of nuclear material, mainly build up from caesium-137, strontium-90 and iodine-131.

Because the bombs exploded in the air the spread area much wider then by the nuclear power plant, the used material a less radioactive level and the amount of material was compared to Chernobyl peanuts.

There are many types of reactors, all with their pro's and contras. Normal spoken the nuclear fuel rods stay in position and the graphite temper rods are moveable between the fuel rods. By lowering the graphite between the fuel rods the reaction get tempered through the graphite. If tempered the tempreture go down inside the reactor.

If fuel rods come outside the inner reaction area then the cooling will stop. Emergency cooling is needed like in Japan. Depends on the reactor how many inner scales their are before it will burn his way to the outer scale. If it leave the outer scale, most time meters of concrete thick, no cooling is anymore possible and and heat will speed up the reaction in a vicious circle.till explosion occurs.

The contaminated sea area comes from leaks in the emergency cooling. Normal the cool fluid stay in a closed circuit but in Japan the normal cooling stopped, overheating burn through an inner scale. Cool water is now pumped in and after usage stored in storage tanks. I suspect this tanks, pipes and protective measurements are also damaged what make it leak in the ground/sea.

Thank you for that! You certainly know your history about nuclear bombs.

So, do you agree with the approximate calculations that were provided in the article in post number 105 where the article said an accident could be the equivalent of 15,000x radiation of Hiroshima or 85 Chernobyls?

I am not sure of those calculations because there are so many unknown factors. Forget comparisons to the nuclear bombs because they exploded in a total different environment, in the air.

First of all the type of nuclear material is from a lower grade then the one used in Chernobyl. In the Fukushima plant, a original General Electric design, they use Uranium Dioxide UO2. I am not sure if TEPCO did do all the moderation's to the plant as suggested in the stream of update papers from General Electric.

TEPCO have a long history of doing things they want and not following any advice and the Japanese government is not interested in long scandal. Japan need their reactors to ensure electricity for their population and to stay aside from expensive oil,cokes or gas

Also how it's brought in the air/water/soil and the position of the plant play a big part from the outburst.

But if it as much, lesser or more, it make all not so much difference for the direct area, 100 Km2. The coming 50 years there will be no normal life possible. The water and air streams, luckily not by Chernobyl, make this disaster unique and difficult to isolate.

I think the Japanese must stop with do if all is OK. It's not and the problem grow with the day. First of all fly in experts, General Electric, Excelon, Siemens. Oerlikon to name a few companies with proven track in problem solving in nuclear plants.

What ever happen in the near future will have for sure his impact on the world.

[midas]

Where's the IAEA in all this?

This could well turn out to be a global public health issue and I would have thought the IAEA would be all over this, if not already.

Exactly!

In August the IAEA urged Japan to explain more clearly what is happening at Fukushima and avoid sending "confusing messages" about the disaster.

http://phys.org/news/2013-08-japan-messages-fukushima-iaea.html

In an article I read yesterday it explained TEPCO and the Japanese government to some extent is relying on semantics or differences in Japanese terminology when it is translated into English ti justify its behaviour ( or lack thereof ). Can you believe this ?

For example in Japanese the words to describe " open ocean " is apparently different from the English interpretation and this is how they are getting away with denying that contaminated water is dangerously affecting the Pacific Ocean.

We are talking about long-term damage to a huge part of the northern hemisphere ecological system and the Japanese want to play with words.

It's criminal!

It's also seems so low down on the news agenda. Not going conspiracy theory at all, I just wonder whether the scale of this is really understood.

I remember Chernobyl going up and it was huge news for ages afterwards. We all know the effects Chernobyl had on people and the environment, so how come Fukushima isn't front and centre daily?

But if you saw the video of the interview with the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland , which I posted earlier, according to him, there is a conspiracy theory.

He says it's because America has 23 of these power stations with same specs designed by the same company and that pressure was put on Japan to keep the publicity low to avoid panic or concern in USA.

[MJP]

Where's the IAEA in all this?

This could well turn out to be a global public health issue and I would have thought the IAEA would be all over this, if not already.

Exactly!

In August the IAEA urged Japan to explain more clearly what is happening at Fukushima and avoid sending "confusing messages" about the disaster.

http://phys.org/news/2013-08-japan-messages-fukushima-iaea.html

In an article I read yesterday it explained TEPCO and the Japanese government to some extent is relying on semantics or differences in Japanese terminology when it is translated into English ti justify its behaviour ( or lack thereof ). Can you believe this ?

For example in Japanese the words to describe " open ocean " is apparently different from the English interpretation and this is how they are getting away with denying that contaminated water is dangerously affecting the Pacific Ocean.

We are talking about long-term damage to a huge part of the northern hemisphere ecological system and the Japanese want to play with words.

It's criminal!

It's also seems so low down on the news agenda. Not going conspiracy theory at all, I just wonder whether the scale of this is really understood.

I remember Chernobyl going up and it was huge news for ages afterwards. We all know the effects Chernobyl had on people and the environment, so how come Fukushima isn't front and centre daily?

But if you saw the video of the interview with the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland , which I posted earlier, according to him, there is a conspiracy theory.

He says it's because America has 23 of these power stations with same specs designed by the same company and that pressure was put on Japan to keep the publicity low to avoid panic or concern in USA.

When I have time, I'm going to research Fukushima in depth.

[ding]

Tritium soaring in water at No. 1 plant

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2013/07/07/national/tritium-soaring-in-water-at-no-1-plant/#.Udt04KxWp-z

Thanks for this link.

Not a peep about this on American news.

Idiots.

[midas]

Exactly!

In August the IAEA urged Japan to explain more clearly what is happening at Fukushima and avoid sending "confusing messages" about the disaster.

http://phys.org/news/2013-08-japan-messages-fukushima-iaea.html

In an article I read yesterday it explained TEPCO and the Japanese government to some extent is relying on semantics or differences in Japanese terminology when it is translated into English ti justify its behaviour ( or lack thereof ). Can you believe this ?

For example in Japanese the words to describe " open ocean " is apparently different from the English interpretation and this is how they are getting away with denying that contaminated water is dangerously affecting the Pacific Ocean.

We are talking about long-term damage to a huge part of the northern hemisphere ecological system and the Japanese want to play with words.

It's criminal!

It's also seems so low down on the news agenda. Not going conspiracy theory at all, I just wonder whether the scale of this is really understood.

I remember Chernobyl going up and it was huge news for ages afterwards. We all know the effects Chernobyl had on people and the environment, so how come Fukushima isn't front and centre daily?

But if you saw the video of the interview with the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland , which I posted earlier, according to him, there is a conspiracy theory.

He says it's because America has 23 of these power stations with same specs designed by the same company and that pressure was put on Japan to keep the publicity low to avoid panic or concern in USA.

When I have time, I'm going to research Fukushima in depth.

I couldn't remember whether I had posted the video of Mr Kohei Murata in this thread or another thread but it's actually in this thread on page 1. and post number 25.

I have no reason to disbelieve the warnings of a former Japanese Ambassador balanced against the Japanese government who seemed more concerned to be host of the 2020 Olympic Games!

Also read about what other people say, like Dr Helen Caldicott.

[midas]

Also read about what other people say, like Dr Helen Caldicott.

“ Finding someone with the insight and knowledge and as important, with the guts, to state what’s really happening as a result of the damaged Fukushima nuclear plant in Japan, has unfortunately become an equally disastrous media event “

[midas]

It's also seems so low down on the news agenda. Not going conspiracy theory at all, I just wonder whether the scale of this is really understood.

I remember Chernobyl going up and it was huge news for ages afterwards. We all know the effects Chernobyl had on people and the environment, so how come Fukushima isn't front and centre daily?

But if you saw the video of the interview with the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland , which I posted earlier, according to him, there is a conspiracy theory.

He says it's because America has 23 of these power stations with same specs designed by the same company and that pressure was put on Japan to keep the publicity low to avoid panic or concern in USA.

When I have time, I'm going to research Fukushima in depth.

I couldn't remember whether I had posted the video of Mr Kohei Murata in this thread or another thread but it's actually in this thread on page 1. and post number 25.

I have no reason to disbelieve the warnings of a former Japanese Ambassador balanced against the Japanese government who seemed more concerned to be host of the 2020 Olympic Games!

That video clip in which Mr Kohei Murata ( the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland) warns the world and tells the truth as it is, has been removed from YouTube ! What does that tell you?

[midas]

Tokyo Mother: “Total media blackout” in Japan of lots and lots of people developing symptoms related to Fukushima disaster (VIDEO) — “Many cases of sickness and death among young generations” not reported

[midas]

At least 700 people working in the nuclear industy in Japan may have died from exposure to dangerous levels of radioactivity.

The incident at the Tokaimura plant one month ago has revealed dangerous practices likened by some critics to "modern slavery" within the industry, putting the lives of untrained temporary workers at risk.

Employment brokers are recruiting temporary workers from Japan's growing number of homeless people to do jobs like cleaning nuclear reactors.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/493133.stm

[F430murci]

Where's the IAEA in all this?

This could well turn out to be a global public health issue and I would have thought the IAEA would be all over this, if not already.

Exactly!

In August the IAEA urged Japan to explain more clearly what is happening at Fukushima and avoid sending "confusing messages" about the disaster.

http://phys.org/news/2013-08-japan-messages-fukushima-iaea.html

In an article I read yesterday it explained TEPCO and the Japanese government to some extent is relying on semantics or differences in Japanese terminology when it is translated into English ti justify its behaviour ( or lack thereof ). Can you believe this ?

For example in Japanese the words to describe " open ocean " is apparently different from the English interpretation and this is how they are getting away with denying that contaminated water is dangerously affecting the Pacific Ocean.

We are talking about long-term damage to a huge part of the northern hemisphere ecological system and the Japanese want to play with words.

It's criminal!

It's also seems so low down on the news agenda. Not going conspiracy theory at all, I just wonder whether the scale of this is really understood.

I remember Chernobyl going up and it was huge news for ages afterwards. We all know the effects Chernobyl had on people and the environment, so how come Fukushima isn't front and centre daily?

This! I have been saying the same thing for month.

[atsiii]

I would think this should be a big deal. Seems like world leaders would be helping Japan fix this problem ASAP. The implications are, to me, more devastating and long term than say Syrian conflict, Iran nuclear program or North Korea's mighty midget. Radiation in the ocean and already reaching California. What percentage of the world's population's food comes from the Pacific Ocean? What are they going to do with all of this radioactive water that is a by product of their cooling efforts to keep from having a melt down?

i agree !

Listen to Mr Kohei Murata , who was the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland. What he says in this interview makes every other issue going on in the world seem quite irrelevant….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LCTv65aqgA&feature=youtu.be

When I try to watch this video, I get a message that says "This video does not exist." What's up?

[midas]

I would think this should be a big deal. Seems like world leaders would be helping Japan fix this problem ASAP. The implications are, to me, more devastating and long term than say Syrian conflict, Iran nuclear program or North Korea's mighty midget. Radiation in the ocean and already reaching California. What percentage of the world's population's food comes from the Pacific Ocean? What are they going to do with all of this radioactive water that is a by product of their cooling efforts to keep from having a melt down?

i agree !

Listen to Mr Kohei Murata , who was the former Japanese Ambassador to Switzerland. What he says in this interview makes every other issue going on in the world seem quite irrelevant….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LCTv65aqgA&feature=youtu.be

When I try to watch this video, I get a message that says "This video does not exist." What's up?

That video clip in which Mr Kohei Murata has been removed from YouTube ! What does that tell you?

His warning was probably too harsh for those in authority

Many video's covering this disaster have been removed from the internet but they attract more attention when they do that.

Here is Mr Kohei Murata in another shorter video

http://enenews.com/ambassador-murata-makes-public-statement-in-english-once-a-quake-beyond-magnitude-6-or-7-happens-then-the-world-starts-heading-towards-the-ultimate-catastrophe-unit-4-a-global-security-issue-vid

[SjaakNL2013]

At least 700 people working in the nuclear industy in Japan may have died from exposure to dangerous levels of radioactivity.

The incident at the Tokaimura plant one month ago has revealed dangerous practices likened by some critics to "modern slavery" within the industry, putting the lives of untrained temporary workers at risk.

Employment brokers are recruiting temporary workers from Japan's growing number of homeless people to do jobs like cleaning nuclear reactors.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/493133.stm

Every (Nuclear) disaster have "trow away" workers. Most time unschooled, temporary workers. Send them in, do the job, get your money, go back home, and sadly in most cases they die on the spot or in a few months and will later be remembered in a monument as hero's.

This is nothing new and the history go, for nuclear power plants, back to USA Three Mile Island in 1979.

Not one country, government, power plant operator or pression group will give open answers and mostly reduce the numbers to 'acceptable numbers' to keep the investors happy and the big public in the mist.

[midas]

we should hope for the best………… but prepare for the worst

Within days, Fukushima nuclear plant operators will begin what is being described as the most dangerous phase of the decommissioning process so far.

One slip-up in the latest step to decommission Japan's crippled Fukushima nuclear plant could trigger a "monumental" chain reaction, experts warn.

Yale University professor Charles Perrow wrote about the number 4 fuel pool this year in the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists.

He said one pool contains 10 times the amount of radioactive caesium present in the Chernobyl disaster and warned one slip-up with the removal could trigger a chain reaction.

"This has me very scared," he told the ABC.

"Tokyo would have to be evacuated because [the] caesium and other poisons that are there will spread very rapidly.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-31/fukushima-nuclear-meltdown-tepco-tokyo/5059514

[midas]

At least 700 people working in the nuclear industy in Japan may have died from exposure to dangerous levels of radioactivity.

The incident at the Tokaimura plant one month ago has revealed dangerous practices likened by some critics to "modern slavery" within the industry, putting the lives of untrained temporary workers at risk.

Employment brokers are recruiting temporary workers from Japan's growing number of homeless people to do jobs like cleaning nuclear reactors.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/493133.stm

Every (Nuclear) disaster have "trow away" workers. Most time unschooled, temporary workers. Send them in, do the job, get your money, go back home, and sadly in most cases they die on the spot or in a few months and will later be remembered in a monument as hero's.

This is nothing new and the history go, for nuclear power plants, back to USA Three Mile Island in 1979.

Not one country, government, power plant operator or pression group will give open answers and mostly reduce the numbers to 'acceptable numbers' to keep the investors happy and the big public in the mist.

i bet the working conditions at Three Mile Island weren't this bad ?

Anonymous Workers at #Fukushima I Nuke Plant Blast Government, TEPCO, Speak of Radiation Dangers at the Plant: "It's Yakuza and Rank Amateurs at the Plant"

http://ex-skf.blogspot.com/2013/10/anonymous-workers-at-fukushima-i-nuke.html

[MJP]

At least 700 people working in the nuclear industy in Japan may have died from exposure to dangerous levels of radioactivity.

The incident at the Tokaimura plant one month ago has revealed dangerous practices likened by some critics to "modern slavery" within the industry, putting the lives of untrained temporary workers at risk.

Employment brokers are recruiting temporary workers from Japan's growing number of homeless people to do jobs like cleaning nuclear reactors.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/493133.stm

Every (Nuclear) disaster have "trow away" workers. Most time unschooled, temporary workers. Send them in, do the job, get your money, go back home, and sadly in most cases they die on the spot or in a few months and will later be remembered in a monument as hero's.

This is nothing new and the history go, for nuclear power plants, back to USA Three Mile Island in 1979.

Not one country, government, power plant operator or pression group will give open answers and mostly reduce the numbers to 'acceptable numbers' to keep the investors happy and the big public in the mist.

i bet the working conditions at Three Mile Island weren't this bad ?

Anonymous Workers at #Fukushima I Nuke Plant Blast Government, TEPCO, Speak of Radiation Dangers at the Plant: "It's Yakuza and Rank Amateurs at the Plant"

http://ex-skf.blogspot.com/2013/10/anonymous-workers-at-fukushima-i-nuke.html

Interesting comment . . .

Anonymous said...

hello Arevamirpal::laprimavera,

I would like to know how you understand the more and more frequent posts about high level of contamination in Tokyo.

Sure many don't know Tokyo is also a wide east-west prefecture, and think Chiba and Tokyo are the same, yet it is a difficult case.

I've known three persons living in Kashiwa, they all died of cancer sooner than usual (sorry for the usual) but that was just before the F. crisis. My wife who is Japanese (we live in France and often stay in Japan) told me every body knows it's a roten place, very poluted. And sure a lot of industries use radioactive material, e.g. the radium bottles found in Setagaya. (I visited there for a big flea-market, there was a piece of land digged up and forbiden by the police, ten yards away from the ambulant noodle stands. Sellers in the market kept joking "don't worry, it's not radioactive.)

On the other side I'm not that worried, the home of my familly in law is in the center of Tokyo prefecture, and close to a city with a communist majority, where they say it's OK.

Thanks if you have some usefull information about this, and I whish you a good health recovery.

[midas]

Every (Nuclear) disaster have "trow away" workers. Most time unschooled, temporary workers. Send them in, do the job, get your money, go back home, and sadly in most cases they die on the spot or in a few months and will later be remembered in a monument as hero's.

This is nothing new and the history go, for nuclear power plants, back to USA Three Mile Island in 1979.

Not one country, government, power plant operator or pression group will give open answers and mostly reduce the numbers to 'acceptable numbers' to keep the investors happy and the big public in the mist.

i bet the working conditions at Three Mile Island weren't this bad ?

Anonymous Workers at #Fukushima I Nuke Plant Blast Government, TEPCO, Speak of Radiation Dangers at the Plant: "It's Yakuza and Rank Amateurs at the Plant"

http://ex-skf.blogspot.com/2013/10/anonymous-workers-at-fukushima-i-nuke.html

Interesting comment . . .

Anonymous said...

hello Arevamirpal::laprimavera,

I would like to know how you understand the more and more frequent posts about high level of contamination in Tokyo.

Sure many don't know Tokyo is also a wide east-west prefecture, and think Chiba and Tokyo are the same, yet it is a difficult case.

I've known three persons living in Kashiwa, they all died of cancer sooner than usual (sorry for the usual) but that was just before the F. crisis. My wife who is Japanese (we live in France and often stay in Japan) told me every body knows it's a roten place, very poluted. And sure a lot of industries use radioactive material, e.g. the radium bottles found in Setagaya. (I visited there for a big flea-market, there was a piece of land digged up and forbiden by the police, ten yards away from the ambulant noodle stands. Sellers in the market kept joking "don't worry, it's not radioactive.)

On the other side I'm not that worried, the home of my familly in law is in the center of Tokyo prefecture, and close to a city with a communist majority, where they say it's OK.

Thanks if you have some usefull information about this, and I whish you a good health recovery.

Maybe the anonymous who wrote that is an IOC delegate?

I was wondering only the other day if the IOC would have contingency plans to relocate the 2020 games at short notice and whether it would be Madrid or Istanbul that would be the new host if an emergency occurs in Tokyo?

[Scott]

Wouldn't they have to relocate to a place with existing facilities. I don't know if Istanbul could do that.

[midas]

Wouldn't they have to relocate to a place with existing facilities. I don't know if Istanbul could do that.

Yes that is a good point.

I wonder if any journalist has posed this question to the IOC in any way? Surely they need to think about a backup scenario seriously?

I was also just looking at the stated mission of the IOC as to whether their constitution requires them to come clean on this issue and I noticed there are 16 items listed as being their mission

I had to chuckle at the following...................

· Encourage and support measures protecting the health of athletes

[midas]

David Suzuki at the University of Alberta, October 30, 2013 (At 2:45 minutes in this video ): Fukushima is the most terrifying situation I can imagine. You ask, what can we do? First of all you have got a government that is in total collusion with Tepco, they’re lying through their teeth. […] The fourth one has been so badly damaged that the fear is if there’s another quake of a 7 or above that that building will go, and then all hell breaks loose. And the probability of a 7 or above quake in the next 3 years is over 95%. […] They don’t know what to do. We need to get a group of international experts to go in with complete freedom to do what they suggest. Right now the Japanese government has too much pride to admit that. I’ve seen a paper which says that if in fact the fourth plant goes under an earthquake and those rods are exposed, it’s bye-bye Japan, and everybody on the West Coast of North America should evacuate. Now if that isn’t terrifying, I don’t know what is.

[SjaakNL2013]

For the Japanese Government and TEPCO, a new and heavy earthquake would be a gift of heaven.

The reactor 4 is a mine field and with all the hiding of facts it's almost impossible to get a real and objective view of the situation. If there come a new earthquake, heave enough to shake the area , the Japanese government and TEPCO can hide more info and blame the earthquake for the damage and the nuclear ramp that will follow.

Then they will send in more "volunteers" who will become a "heroes" with a short life. The area will be closed for the next 200 year and Japan will have an other nuclear highpoint to celebrate.

[wprime]

the only solution I see is to make a spaceship and pack them all there and fly it as far as possible before it melts through. After that shut down all nuclear power plants. It never was a solution and never will be. By attacking America, I think he meant GE and a few other lobby elites.

There's no need to shut down all the nuclear power plants. Once your spaceship 'melts through', the radioactive matter will return to earth wiping out humanity anyway.

[midas]

Place your bet's…………………..no room for even the slightest tremor any more over a period of 12 months? .................

Earthquake hits close to Fukushima, tremors felt as far as Tokyo

Sunday’s tremors were felt as far away as Tokyo, but no casualties or damage reports were released at the time. The news comes just ahead of one of the most dangerous nuclear cleanup operations ever attempted. Scheduled to start at the beginning of November, it will involve the careful, manual removal of 400 tons of spent nuclear fuel rods from the plant’s Reactor No. 4 - with an atomic yield greater than the Hiroshima bomb. The long and cumbersome operation will not permit even the slightest tremor, or Japan risks a catastrophe greater than Chernobyl.

http://rt.com/news/fukushima-earthquake-evacuees-return-152/

[atsiii]

Place your bet's…………………..no room for even the slightest tremor any more over a period of 12 months? .................

Earthquake hits close to Fukushima, tremors felt as far as Tokyo

Sunday’s tremors were felt as far away as Tokyo, but no casualties or damage reports were released at the time. The news comes just ahead of one of the most dangerous nuclear cleanup operations ever attempted. Scheduled to start at the beginning of November, it will involve the careful, manual removal of 400 tons of spent nuclear fuel rods from the plant’s Reactor No. 4 - with an atomic yield greater than the Hiroshima bomb. The long and cumbersome operation will not permit even the slightest tremor, or Japan risks a catastrophe greater than Chernobyl.

http://rt.com/news/fukushima-earthquake-evacuees-return-152/

But to be fair, the article should say, "or the earth risks a catastrophe greater than Chernobyl." It will not just affect Japan... far from it.

[midas]

Place your bet's…………………..no room for even the slightest tremor any more over a period of 12 months? .................

Earthquake hits close to Fukushima, tremors felt as far as Tokyo

Sunday’s tremors were felt as far away as Tokyo, but no casualties or damage reports were released at the time. The news comes just ahead of one of the most dangerous nuclear cleanup operations ever attempted. Scheduled to start at the beginning of November, it will involve the careful, manual removal of 400 tons of spent nuclear fuel rods from the plant’s Reactor No. 4 - with an atomic yield greater than the Hiroshima bomb. The long and cumbersome operation will not permit even the slightest tremor, or Japan risks a catastrophe greater than Chernobyl.

http://rt.com/news/fukushima-earthquake-evacuees-return-152/

But to be fair, the article should say, "or the earth risks a catastrophe greater than Chernobyl." It will not just affect Japan... far from it.

Those that are seeking to play down the seriousness of this have some advantage in that many of the effects of what has happened so far are not so readily apparent right now, except to scientists and critics. i.e. a lot of damage to health may not show up for many years from now.

On the other hand if the rod removal procedure goes wrong, I can't possibly see how they will be able to downplay or hide that and it will become an instant catastrophe because where the hell do you move 39 million people from greater Tokyo?

[SjaakNL2013]

"I can't possibly see how they will be able to downplay or hide that and it will become an instant catastrophe because where the hell do you move 39 million people from greater Tokyo?"

Don t move them. This will bring panic all over. Just play it down. A few 1000 dead here a few 1000 there but never enclose the hole and feed the info in all kind misty bulletins. Use all kind of standards through each other, mix fiction and reality. Announce research after research. Mix, cheat, lie but never give any correct answer. Keep up the mist about safety standards.

That is happening now and will happen if it go wrong. Nobody want 39 Milj. people on the walk.

[boomerangutang]

Knowing what I know about Japan and its engineers, and what I know about Thailand or China and its engineers, I'd have to say; a similar scenario in Thailand or China would be worse.

Why? Partly because China and Thailand are poorer countries than Japan, and therefore have less material resources to devote to a problem of such large scale. Secondly, I believe, in spite of the misgivings reported, that Japanese authorities are generally more open and 'transparent' about catastrophes than China or Thailand. Thirdly, Japanese engineers are generally more adept than their Chinese or Thai counterparts.

I'm not saying Japanese are handling this well, am just saying Chinese or Thai authorities would handle a similar grave situation worse. It's a comparison.

P.S. Thailand still plans to go nuclear - and has 2 N plants on its wish-list (down from 5 or 6 earlier).

[midas]

"I can't possibly see how they will be able to downplay or hide that and it will become an instant catastrophe because where the hell do you move 39 million people from greater Tokyo?"

Don t move them. This will bring panic all over. Just play it down. A few 1000 dead here a few 1000 there but never enclose the hole and feed the info in all kind misty bulletins. Use all kind of standards through each other, mix fiction and reality. Announce research after research. Mix, cheat, lie but never give any correct answer. Keep up the mist about safety standards.

That is happening now and will happen if it go wrong. Nobody want 39 Milj. people on the walk.

" Just play it down "

I would imagine that would now be impossible? The genie is already out of the bottle…………….

how could they explain to the Japanese and the rest of the world that an evacuation was not necessary when the government already confessed they were thinking about it just after the tsunami? And surely now there are too many experts carefully watching this from around the world who would stop any attempt to cover it up?

Tokyo faced evacuation scenario: Kan

In the days immediately after the crisis began at the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant, the government received a report saying 30 million residents in the Tokyo metropolitan area would have to be evacuated in a worst-case scenario, former Prime Minister Naoto Kan revealed in a recent interview.

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2011/09/19/news/tokyo-faced-evacuation-scenario-kan/#.UneHnVNWp-w

and it looks like the Kuril Islands have already been earmarked...........................

A new report circulating in the Kremlin today prepared by the Foreign Ministry on the planned re-opening of talks with Japan over the disputed Kuril Islands during the next fortnight states that Russian diplomats were “stunned” after being told by their Japanese counterparts that upwards of 40 million of their peoples were in “extreme danger” of life threatening radiation poisoning and could very well likely be faced with forced evacuations away from their countries eastern most located cities… including the world’s largest one, Tokyo.

http://readersupportednews.org/news-section2/344-208/11006-russia-stunned-after-japanese-plan-to-evacuate-40-million-revealed

[midas]

Mark Willacy is ABC North Asia Correspondent who received a Walkley award for his reports.

Reactor Designer: “It was a nuclear explosion” at Fukushima Unit 3; Plutonium scattered after blast — ABC: “There’s willful denial and lying going on here, even at the highest levels”

http://podcast.getwebreader.com/abc-net-radionational-programs-breakfast/the-fukushima-aftermath-mp3-download/2013/06/978-551463