submaniac Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 If the BTS CCTV video is made available, and the security guard threw the first punch, I'll be on here saying how wrong I was to make the assumption I have. Won't happen for two reasons, firstly the CCTV video won't be released to the public, and secondly, I bet the guard didn't throw the first punch. This is what gets me: If the guy was acting beserk before the incident, shoving guards, kicking trash bins, etc., why doesn't BTS just release the video to prove that Mr. Behan was misbehaving? If the video shows this, then there is no benefit in them keeping it hidden. I have a suspicion (once again ONLY my speculation) that it's not being released because it MAY NOT SHOW WHAT THEY CLAIM IT SHOWS. If they just released the video, it would end alot of the wild speculation going on Maybe Mr. Behan deserved a thump on the head, maybe he didnt...I would really like to see the video before making a decision one way or the other. If it is not released (BTW Mr. Behan requested it be released on his television interview) it just might support what he's saying. Just my thoughts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phosphorescent Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I'm so proud to be a member of the TV community. It's a well known fact that us TV members are all so cool and placid that absolutely no force, seen or unseen, on earth or in heaven could possibly make any one of us lose our rag. We're all just brilliant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
submaniac Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 From a quick Google, here are the 3 most readily-available gaseous fuels (well, propane is common in the US at least) and 2 nasties: a) LPG is heavier than air http://en.wikipedia....d_petroleum_gas propane is heavier than air (1.5 times as dense). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propane c) LNG vapor is heavier than air (by 1.52) http://www.narucmeet...raj-gas0704.pdf d) sarin is heavier than air http://emergency.cdc...asics/facts.asp e) Phosgene gas is heavier than air http://www.bt.cdc.go...sgene-facts.pdf Ummm....Phosgene Gas and Sarin? Like the same phosgene gas used in WWI and outlawed by international convention? Sarin? Like the sarin used in the Tokyo railway attacks by that cult? I kind of think that any of these chemicals are too heavy duty to be carried around in an inflatable balloon without rupturing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuang Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 And all the other idiots who can't stop complaining, moaning, seem to be so unhappy with so much in Thailand, especially with the Thais; go home, if its so much whatever . . . Just go away and let the rest of us who like the Thais the way they are, get on with enjoying this lovely place. I'm sick of seeing Argo situations, road rage and misunderstandings which are totally visitor created, by visitor who are suggesting the Thais need to change and do it their way. The thais have their own ways of doing stuff and it works for them. Yea if all those mighter than thou farangs or otherwise can go back to the own countries, if they have one...thaland would be such a nice place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) The guy was told by security he couldn't bring it on. He ignored it. Case closed.. The niceties, or otherwise, of who threw the first punch, can be sorted out later, but my observation is that the Irish guy was behaving badly, and continued to do so, and my guess would be it was him. Lets examine the facts and ask the following questions, this has nothing to do with people see or think they see in a video clip: 1. BTS company has come out and apologized to the guy concerned and sent flowers 2. BTS company has fired the guard concerned 3. BTS company has promised to co-operate with any police investigation 4. Injured party (the farang) has indicated he does not wish to press charges or the guys lose his job 5. does it appear that the farang acted like an ass-hole...yes...but does this warrant being beaten around the head with a metal detector Have the police/ BTS company pressed charges against the farang for vandalism/assualt/criminal tresspass ?...as far as I am aware.. No Has the Security guard come out an publically apologised for his conduct....as far as i am aware No. Is there full video survelliance footage of the incident from BTS CCTV system (you bet your life there is....therefore see items 1,2,3) so tell me again who threw the first "punch" ? Just based on the facts under 1,2,3, there can only be one conclusion...? Spoutpeel, I'd hate to have you representing me in court with logic like that. Your logic has more holes than a colander. Because somebody apologizes does not make them in the wrong, particularly in a place like Thailand, where 'face' is so important. Politicians apologize every day for non events. Ordinary people apologize to defuse situations. I can't imagine the security guard going up to the Irishman and clobbering him for no reason. If he did, Behan would be pressing charges, and would want the guard to lose his job. I'm sure he was asked, before the youtube video started to lose the balloons, he refused and became violent, so was given a 'touch up'. The video then started and he continued being violent, and from where I stand, the security guy used enormous restraint. Even the Irish guy's mate tried to hold him back, but he wasn't having any of that as he had a point to prove. The wide eye must win at all costs. If the BTS CCTV video is made available, and the security guard threw the first punch, I'll be on here saying how wrong I was to make the assumption I have. Won't happen for two reasons, firstly the CCTV video won't be released to the public, and secondly, I bet the guard didn't throw the first punch. I am not presenting logic or assumption I am presenting facts, please direct me to any fact which is in dispute show what I have posted is not factual. You are presenting assumptions and personal bias' with absolutely no foundation in fact... As to representing you in court...you couldnt afford me old chap Edited March 24, 2012 by Soutpeel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronz28 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) When the man was informed of the security rules, he should have left and used a Taxi. The rules are there to protect the rest of us from nuts with poisonous or explosive gasses. Security tried to do their job and protect all of us from terrorists. They have no way of knowing what is in the balloons but can prevent a potential attack by preventing him from accessing BTS. This guy can't be kicking and/or hitting security or he can expect a reaction. I think he owes the security people and BTS an apology and compensation for his actions and any lost paychecks. He should also get a citation from the police for his multiple offenses of assaulting BTS security and for attempting to carry prohibited items onto the BTS as documented on Youtube. He should have known what he did was very wrong and threatening to the safety of the other passengers even if he knew the balloons only had harmless air -they did not. If he doesn't think he needs to comply with security/safety rules on the BTS and will fight security over compliance, he should be deported. Edited March 24, 2012 by ronz28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 The rules are there to protect the rest of us from nuts with poisonous or explosive gasses. There are also rules there to protect us from nuts wielding metal detectors trying to bash peoples heads in... The only gas involved in all of this is the hot air people are spouting on TV... ronz28....is it time for your meds yet ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisinth Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Heated discussions still go on for an article released on TV two days ago where a minor incident occurred between a BTS security guard and a passenger wanting to board the sky train at Prompong Station. During the incident, it appears that the passenger was told he wasn’t allowed to carry balloons onto the train, which he apparently tried to ignore. This ensued into a scuffle where the passenger received a blow to the head by the security guard while the security guard was trying to defend himself and other members of the BTS staff. At present there is no evidence available (on TV) to support this part of the story. Video footage was taken by an individual at the station, which shows the alleged assaulted passenger ignoring security staff and trying to barge through to the train, himself seen committing physical assault on 3 separate occasions. Both sides are filing complaints. Since the incident, BTS have taken steps to pacify the situation by making a formal apology to the passenger; this to me is not an admission of guilt or wrong-doing by BTS, but a sensible action under the circumstances. It has also been stated by BTS that the security guard has been removed (not dismissed) from the station and that an investigation into the actions of all involved would ensue. The police have been forced to take action as the video was uploaded to U-Tube, and it is this that has sent this minor incident out of control. Great, read, ingest, ignore! Reading the posts here, we are now at a stage where the biggest topic of interest is what gas was used to fill the balloons, completely irrelevant to the story. Posters are also making a big issue that signs are not shown to enforce the rule by BTS about carrying balloons on the trains. Can anyone please tell me, anywhere in the world where these signs are displayed? How many people (honestly) know what rules apply as to what you can or cannot carry on public transport, and even if displayed how many people would take time to read them? I for one will raise my hand and admit that I haven’t a clue, and would in all likelihood never read any regulation. How many times have incidents like this occurred in Thailand on the public transport systems? Is it a daily/weekly/monthly occurrence? People, this is a minor incident, about balloons! A security guard trying to enforce a rule and a passenger knowing better and ignoring what is being told to him. Both sides wrong? Highly likely. Worth dragging out to this extent? I understand the banter in all these threads, it is why I like it, but when a subject bounces off in tangents to the original article………. Just my penny’s worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TinoThailand Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Blablabla It don't matter what was in the balloons and to make jokes. This is joker news anyway. Glad to see I was guesing right, he acted like a dumb cun_t. If a guard stop me i know it's for a reason, don't matter if I don't understand a word he said. It's not my country and not my train, I will wait and get to know what's the problem and take a cap with doughters balloons <deleted>.. This Farang make us look bad, c'mon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbamboo Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) I'm so proud to be a member of the TV community. It's a well known fact that us TV members are all so cool and placid that absolutely no force, seen or unseen, on earth or in heaven could possibly make any one of us lose our rag. We're all just brilliant! Really? I thought it was just me! As to the case, it would seem the Irishman lost his head and over reacted, a pretty stupid thing to do when you have a seven year old in tow. After that the whole thing then just... how can can one say it.......ballooned. Edited March 24, 2012 by bigbamboo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atyclb Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) And all the other idiots who can't stop complaining, moaning, seem to be so unhappy with so much in Thailand, especially with the Thais; go home, if its so much whatever . . . Just go away and let the rest of us who like the Thais the way they are, get on with enjoying this lovely place. I'm sick of seeing Argo situations, road rage and misunderstandings which are totally visitor created, by visitor who are suggesting the Thais need to change and do it their way. The thais have their own ways of doing stuff and it works for them. Agree with much of what you say. There are some of us and some "outside the box" Thai's that contemplate some of the issues also. Compassion and understanding tells me it is the education system that does not train the mind to think, but simply repeat and/or follow a script. I'm not complaining just citing some observations and corroborated analyses. "Cheating and corruption is the norm at all levels of society, and incompetency is the sum of our failings." Voranai Vanijaka , well respected University Professor and journalist http://www.thailandq...higher-learning Nazism in our brainwashed upbringing. http://studyinthaila...hed-upbringing/ Edited March 24, 2012 by atyclb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Snake Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) I am surprised that besides trespassing and assault, nobody has mentioned disorderly conduct as a charge that could easily be brought against this man. Does Thailand have disorderly conduct laws??? ok, stop laughing. I'm serious. Edited March 24, 2012 by Head Snake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Snake Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 If the BTS CCTV video is made available, and the security guard threw the first punch, I'll be on here saying how wrong I was to make the assumption I have. Won't happen for two reasons, firstly the CCTV video won't be released to the public, and secondly, I bet the guard didn't throw the first punch. This is what gets me: If the guy was acting beserk before the incident, shoving guards, kicking trash bins, etc., why doesn't BTS just release the video to prove that Mr. Behan was misbehaving? If the video shows this, then there is no benefit in them keeping it hidden. I have a suspicion (once again ONLY my speculation) that it's not being released because it MAY NOT SHOW WHAT THEY CLAIM IT SHOWS. If they just released the video, it would end alot of the wild speculation going on Maybe Mr. Behan deserved a thump on the head, maybe he didnt...I would really like to see the video before making a decision one way or the other. If it is not released (BTW Mr. Behan requested it be released on his television interview) it just might support what he's saying. Just my thoughts. Why tip your hat? Why show your cards? On a more pragmatic reason, bosses typically will not make a response until they have reviewed it with lawyers, PR, and such. Then the response will be measured and tempered to ensure BTS is squeaky clean. That's my view. I may be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DP25 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 If the BTS CCTV video is made available, and the security guard threw the first punch, I'll be on here saying how wrong I was to make the assumption I have. Won't happen for two reasons, firstly the CCTV video won't be released to the public, and secondly, I bet the guard didn't throw the first punch. This is what gets me: If the guy was acting beserk before the incident, shoving guards, kicking trash bins, etc., why doesn't BTS just release the video to prove that Mr. Behan was misbehaving? If the video shows this, then there is no benefit in them keeping it hidden. I have a suspicion (once again ONLY my speculation) that it's not being released because it MAY NOT SHOW WHAT THEY CLAIM IT SHOWS. If they just released the video, it would end alot of the wild speculation going on Maybe Mr. Behan deserved a thump on the head, maybe he didnt...I would really like to see the video before making a decision one way or the other. If it is not released (BTW Mr. Behan requested it be released on his television interview) it just might support what he's saying. Just my thoughts. Yup. The Irish guy has seen the video, and said that he wants it to be released. BTS isn't releasing it, most likely because it makes the them look bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxboy Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Another example of a Farang with a superiority complex in Thailand. It doesn't matter what the rules or laws are, or how ridiculous they may seem.. you are not exempt just because you perceive yourself to be more intelligent, more wealthy or of a higher social status. A week in jail would serve as a quick reminder what your social status is if you break the rules! What are you talking about? the victim of this assualt wasnt arrogantly thinking that he can break the rules, he was arguing about his daughters balloons, verbally, and then got violently assualted. everything after that was an instinctual reaction, which was remarkably restrained considering. so he wasn't "arrogantly thinking that he can break the rules" he was merely "arguing about his daughters balloons" and what was the nature of this argument? Was it perhaps that he wanted to carry them on the sky train when he had clearly been told they are prohibited? Are you quite sure he wasn't trying to break the rules? Or maybe these rules don't apply to Westerners? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAWP Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I have to say this got out of hand on both sides, but why is the guy throwing a fit over some balloons? He is throwing a fit over being bludgeoned in the head by a baton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wintermute Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I have to say this got out of hand on both sides, but why is the guy throwing a fit over some balloons? He is throwing a fit over being bludgeoned in the head by a baton. It wouldn't have happened if he didn't get all high and mighty and try to break clearly stated rules. Things would have been much worse for this guy if he did the same thing in the U.S. or in any international airport. Like I said, he's lucky he only got a love tap on the noggin with a metal detector. He could be facing stiff jail time and heavy fines if it were Singapore or something. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAWP Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 When a girl in their twenties got her arm cut off by a drunk cop it didn't generate as many replies as this. Guess it is because it was thai-only fight so no 'accept it or go home' posts could be posted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 When a girl in their twenties got her arm cut off by a drunk cop it didn't generate as many replies as this. Guess it is because it was thai-only fight so no 'accept it or go home' posts could be posted. Naah simple answer..... its because she wasnt carrying balloons... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swillowbee Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I have to say this got out of hand on both sides, but why is the guy throwing a fit over some balloons? He is throwing a fit over being bludgeoned in the head by a baton. It wouldn't have happened if he didn't get all high and mighty and try to break clearly stated rules. Things would have been much worse for this guy if he did the same thing in the U.S. or in any international airport. Like I said, he's lucky he only got a love tap on the noggin with a metal detector. He could be facing stiff jail time and heavy fines if it were Singapore or something. Wintermute ... are you kidding me?!... "clearly stated rules."!*?! ... puh-leaze! ... get a grip on reality! ... on REAL! ... there ARE no clearly stated rules! ... am I missing something on this point? ... maybe Wintermute will be kind enough to illuminate the forum about how he comes about this stunning claim ... please, Wintermute, show me that I am the idiot here, because there is an idiot in this exchange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregb Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 The rules are there to protect the rest of us from nuts with poisonous or explosive gasses. There are also rules there to protect us from nuts wielding metal detectors trying to bash peoples heads in... The only gas involved in all of this is the hot air people are spouting on TV... ronz28....is it time for your meds yet ? The rules are there to protect us? From sarin gas in children's balloon? Are you serious? Soutpeel is right. I'm sorry. This incident had nothing to do with protection and everything to do with on overbearing security guard on a power trip who thinks he is more important than he actually is. If anyone actually had sarin gas that they wanted to release on the BTS they would carry it in a backpack in a canister, not in a balloon which has a big possibility of bursting before it even gets into a train. No. The whole thing is ridiculous. If the BTS actually cared at all about security, then I might buy the garbage they are feeding us about this incident. But nobody with more than 2 neurons to rub together is going to believe that they care about balloons but don't even search the thousands of bags that go through their trains everyday, any one of which has infinitely more probability of injuring passengers. This is a stupid rule, and it is not surprising that nobody took it seriously. Heck, I wouldn't even believe a security guard if he started spouting that kind of nonsense at me. I don't accept they are justified in clubbing some poor guy simply because he didn't accept the word of some impolite Thai animal with the probable manners and intelligence of a goat. There are ways the guard could have handled the situation if he was in command of his faculties and had even a small amount of intelligence. He could have simply allowed the passenger to pass, and then obtained assistance from management. That would have been intelligent and respectful. But that obviously wasn't what he wanted to do. He felt superior and wanted to beat up this poor guy because he didn't respect his authority. Well, boohoo for him. The BTS has a responsibility to hire more mentally well adjusted staff, and to train them how to handle issues like this. As others have said, if this passenger truly was berserk, then release the security cam footage and put the problem to rest. The only reason not to is to avoid admitting obvious guilt. And that is what we have here. A joke of a company with a joke of a security guard beating a defenseless passenger when said passenger didn't believe a stupid rule that only one idiot out of a hundred even tried to make an issue of. BTS should pay big time for this. I don't know about anyone else, but I don't feel safer because a mentally unbalanced security guard at the BTS is beating people when they disrespect him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Stupid rule, or not, the Irishman violated it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reasonableman Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 He had traveled with his terrorising sarin-anthrax-ricin-acetylene-hydrogen-cocktail balloons earlier in the day without mishap, apparently. Correct me if I am wrong. "Meanwhile there appears to be some doubt as to whether balloons are banned completely on the BTS. Reports [whose? I have no idea] indicate that this is not a hard and fast rule and up to the discretion of each station, though its not hard to see there might be restrictions on balloon sellers." http://www.andrew-drummond.com/view-story.php?sid=529 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyserSoze01 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 But that is irrelevant. The BTS rules say NO BALLOONS. Why are posters ignoring that point? If a security guard says 'Don't take it on', he has an expectation that the instruction will be followed, and he has a right, under the law, to enforce the instruction. Why that rule is in place is not important because travelers are not permitted to take them on the BTS. END OF STORY. Have you ever seen a sign or other notification that states this to the general public? I know I haven't and I've been on the BTS hundreds of times. Couple this with the fact that Behan had already carried the balloons on the BTS earlier in the day and even you can see the confusion caused and the subsequent outcome. That is unless you are one of those who believe that every incident is either black or white, when in fact there are no absolutes in life. END OF STORY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyserSoze01 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I don't understand why so many people are spending precious time googling the chemistry of gases and swinging dicks to prove how knowledgeable they are on the weight of hydrogen compared to helium. What was in the balloon is hardly relevant. The guy was told by security that he couldnt bring it on. He ignored it. Case closed. All that is left to discuss are the fineries of how the two parties subsequently handled the breach of MTR regulations. We, in fact, don't know that Behan was told to give up the balloons. We don't know anything other than heresay about the entire case until the BTS CCTV videos are released. Which in my estimation will be released to the general public about the time that hell freezes over. The fact that BTS authorities publicly apologized to Behan and fired the security guards speaks volumes to me. When do you recall the last time that Thai authorities apologized for anything to anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) I don't understand why so many people are spending precious time googling the chemistry of gases and swinging dicks to prove how knowledgeable they are on the weight of hydrogen compared to helium. What was in the balloon is hardly relevant. The guy was told by security that he couldnt bring it on. He ignored it. Case closed. All that is left to discuss are the fineries of how the two parties subsequently handled the breach of MTR regulations. We, in fact, don't know that Behan was told to give up the balloons. He has admitted that he was told and that he understood that he was breaking a rule. He just feels that he should not have been whacked in the head for refusing to listen to the guards and to lose the balloons. Edited March 24, 2012 by Ulysses G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyserSoze01 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) .... Edited March 24, 2012 by KeyserSoze01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irwinfc Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 BTS, why apologize? the management should even laud the guard for doing his job. clearly, Behan didn't behave as he should have. he could've just gotten off the station and take a cab! done! but no! he had to pick a fight with a Thai wearing a uniform which is not always a bright idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 This thread continues here: Family of man in Skytrain scuffle threatened Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts