Family Of Man In Skytrain Scuffle Threatened

[animatic]

In no way do I condone the violence perpetuated against Mr. Behan by the G4S guards. It seems to be way over the top and they should be punished for it.

It is actually a training issue, as security guards in Thailand are not trained on how to properly react to a defiance of authority that is so common in the West but is pretty much non-existent here. The entire incident was so out of their experience, the guards and BTS staff was absolutely mystified at what to do. Watch the faces of the staff on video that has been released. They cannot believe what is happening and have no idea what to do.

But for me, the main issue of the whole incident is why Mr. Behan, when told he cannot take the balloons on the train, did not either discard the balloons or turn around and walk away.

Would Mr. Behan have acted out in a similar fashion at an airport security check point? Highly doubtful and the reasons why are the crux of the race issue that is being raised by some. Mr. Behan, when confronted with a lower class Thai male, decided he did not have to follow his instructions. That is the real race issue, not a Thai male using this as an excuse to beat on a Farang.

The entire incident lies at feet of Mr. Behan; he was the first person of all those involved who made the decision to escalate the episode to what was the final outcome. It always comes down to why did he not just walk away.

TH

True they were baffled,

but what they CHOOSE to do on the platform was street justice,

not securing the scene and quelling a disturbance.

They actively prolonged a disturbance and made it a national incident.

[p_brownstone]

Considering what Behan had been put through here and elsewhere I can totally understand why his friend has not come forward nor would I ask him to. He was also attacked according to the Burmese witness and he had done nothing wrong at all.

My goodness how quaint - a compassionate Reporter, usually they have no problem is asking awkward questions, perhaps you are over-sensitive for your chosen profession?

Also by the way, nowhere in your "report" on the testimony of the Burmese "eyewitness" does she say that the friend was also attacked - only that he was trying to protect Behan with his body. Was that something you edited out - compassion again perhaps? Or are we to expect yet another "exclusive" shortly?

You are losing credibility by the truckload.

Patrick

[TAWP]

Since it seem that those that in an unbalanced fashion bash other foreigners here often are the ones with the darkest secrets themselves I will sit back and remember this thread a few years down the line.

[TAWP]

Considering what Behan had been put through here and elsewhere I can totally understand why his friend has not come forward nor would I ask him to. He was also attacked according to the Burmese witness and he had done nothing wrong at all.

My goodness how quaint - a compassionate Reporter, usually they have no problem is asking awkward questions, perhaps you are over-sensitive for your chosen profession?

Also by the way, nowhere in your "report" on the testimony of the Burmese "eyewitness" does she say that the friend was also attacked - only that he was trying to protect Behan with his body. Was that something you edited out - compassion again perhaps? Or are we to expect yet another "exclusive" shortly?

You are losing credibility by the truckload.

Patrick

No, he isn't

His friend was attacked on the platform, when there was multiple guards on them.

Or you are denying this happened?

[thaihome]

...They actively prolonged a disturbance and made it a national incident.

How can you say the guards and BTS staff prolonged the disturbance?

Wasn't Mr. Behan's insistence on taking the balloons through the turnstiles and up the stairs what prolonged the disturbance? If he had merely handed them over at any time, the incident would have ended right then and there.

You are not even trying to be objective. Just engaging is a blind defense of some one that is clearly in the wrong. But again, let me say, the guards’ striking him is out of line. But ending it was clearly under Mr. Behan’s control and he chose not to do so.

TH

[bigbamboo]

Many have presumptions, few have the facts.

But pontificate wildly none the less.

Yep............ that's TV for you!

This story is just....well....amazing. I mean, who ever heard of a dispute between a 'tired and emotional' passenger and railway personnel before? Can't wait for the film with Angelina Jolie as the all action BTS special forces guard who takes no **** from anyone.

Edited March 27, 2012 by bigbamboo

[flyingsporran]

Considering what Behan had been put through here and elsewhere I can totally understand why his friend has not come forward nor would I ask him to. He was also attacked according to the Burmese witness and he had done nothing wrong at all.

My goodness how quaint - a compassionate Reporter, usually they have no problem is asking awkward questions, perhaps you are over-sensitive for your chosen profession?

Also by the way, nowhere in your "report" on the testimony of the Burmese "eyewitness" does she say that the friend was also attacked - only that he was trying to protect Behan with his body. Was that something you edited out - compassion again perhaps? Or are we to expect yet another "exclusive" shortly?

You are losing credibility by the truckload.

Patrick

I would read it again Patrick

[F4UCorsair]

Now the Burmese witness says the friend was 'attacked' also. That was, of course, before she left the country, or was it via an email report, or an imagined report? We ,may never know.

I wonder how long it will take for this to escalate to a sustained, brutal, vicious, 'pack attack' on the friend, and the friend was also bloody and bruised, semi coherent and crying for mercy? After all, on his website it was two attacks on Behan, but just back a little on this site, it was 3-4 attacks. I wonder why the 'attack' on the friend wasn't reported earlier? I wonder why the friend hasn't lodged a complaint with the police? Surely if he was 'attacked' by the BTS security staff, he would have done so, and no doubt the first place he would go, on the way back home from visiting the police, would be to visit Andrew Drummond so that the incident could be reported 'accurately', and 'comment' made.

I'm with you Patrick. This dude lacks credibility completely, and not only because he reported on the CCTV footage as if he had seen it, but in fact hadn't.

Thaihome, you are quite right. The escalation or termination of the incident was in the hands of one person, and he chose not to terminate it, in fact quite the opposite.

Edited March 27, 2012 by F4UCorsair

[flyingsporran]

Now the Burmese witness says the friend was 'attacked' also. That was, of course, before she left the country, or was it via an email report, or an imagined report? We ,may never know.

I wonder how long it will take for this to escalate to a sustained, brutal, vicious, 'pack attack' on the friend, and the friend was also bloody and bruised, semi coherent and crying for mercy? After all, on his website it was two attacks on Behan, but just back a little on this site, it was 3-4 attacks. I wonder why the 'attack' on the friend wasn't reported earlier? I wonder why the friend hasn't lodged a complaint with the police? Surely if he was 'attacked' by the BTS security staff, he would have done so, and no doubt the first place he would go, on the way back home from visiting the police, would be to visit Andrew Drummond so that the incident could be reported 'accurately', and 'comment' made.

I'm with you Patrick. This dude lacks credibility completely, and not only because he reported on the CCTV footage as if he had seen it, but in fact hadn't.

Thaihome, you are quite right. The escalation or termination of the incident was in the hands of one person, and he chose not to terminate it, in fact quite the opposite.

You are rather labouring a point. Behan chose the wrong course of action. Its been said 100 times. Even he admits it. The question is whether the attacks on him which were very brutal, were in any way justified. The answer can only be no. That comes from all the independent witnesses - and there is now a third, an American. The witnesses have already said that Behan was subject to pack attacks and that the friend was also injured.

The reason why these people are not writing to this website is plainly obvious.

Edited March 27, 2012 by flyingsporran

[mauGR1]

Now the Burmese witness says the friend was 'attacked' also. That was, of course, before she left the country, or was it via an email report, or an imagined report? We ,may never know.

I wonder how long it will take for this to escalate to a sustained, brutal, vicious, 'pack attack' on the friend, and the friend was also bloody and bruised, semi coherent and crying for mercy? After all, on his website it was two attacks on Behan, but just back a little on this site, it was 3-4 attacks. I wonder why the 'attack' on the friend wasn't reported earlier? I wonder why the friend hasn't lodged a complaint with the police? Surely if he was 'attacked' by the BTS security staff, he would have done so, and no doubt the first place he would go, on the way back home from visiting the police, would be to visit Andrew Drummond so that the incident could be reported 'accurately', and 'comment' made.

I'm with you Patrick. This dude lacks credibility completely, and not only because he reported on the CCTV footage as if he had seen it, but in fact hadn't.

Thaihome, you are quite right. The escalation or termination of the incident was in the hands of one person, and he chose not to terminate it, in fact quite the opposite.

I can agree that AD reportage may be a bit one-sided, but i would not be too harsh in judging his work.

After all he is putting his face and his name on it, and we know it's a risky business, isn't it ?

Time will tell.

[Nisa]

I do not in any way condone the violence against the Irish Guy BECAUSE this is Thailand. I also feel sorry for him that the path he chose to take at the BTS resulted in his being injured, threats and most of all for his daughter who watched all of this. However, after being raised in the US and the recent terrorist activity in Thailand, it is hard to feel to feel much more sorrow for the guy given he seems to have walked away from this a lot less battered than he might have elsewhere ...

This is Thailand and they have their own rules and socially acceptable forms of use of force by police and security but I am for one glad they were able to stop this guy from boarding the train on the platform. My personal belief is any force that is needed to prevent somebody from entering a public transport who has banned items (regardless of what they are), is refusing to comply with rules and simply has been told he cannot enter, is acceptable but this is not my country and I defer to what is appropriate here. However, none of this gives anyone the right to abuse anyone because they have been abused or insulted or simply don't like the behavior of somebody else. I suspect excessive force/violence was used against this guy and if this is the case then guards should be held accountable, just as this guy should be held accountable for his actions.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Nisa

[sparebox2]

^

Drummond has been flying close to the sun for a few years now, so let’s hope this is not the one that finally prompts the authorities to close him down.

Drummond should start writing something possitive about Thailand for a change.

Like . . . . Urh, I'll get back to you on this one.

[Curt1591]

Many years ago, I worked security at a topless bar in San Diego. In the 6 months working there, we refused entry and/or removed dozens of drunken patrons. Although we had to restrain someone, a time or two, never once did we did we have to beat anyone into submission.

Then again, they weren't balloon packing fathers. Many were only drunken bikers.

[F4UCorsair]

You are rather labouring a point. Behan chose the wrong course of action. Its been said 100 times. Even he admits it. The question is whether the attacks on him which were very brutal, were in any way justified. The answer can only be no. That comes from all the independent witnesses - and there is now a third, an American. The witnesses have already said that Behan was subject to pack attacks and that the friend was also injured.

The reason why these people are not writing to this website is plainly obvious.

The point I have been labouring is that you made misrepresentations, that your reporting is inflammatory, non objective, and little more than hearsay. You are not the 'investigative reporter' you claim to be. You reported that the CCTV footage contained certain things, but when questioned how you accessed the material you have chosen not to answer, numerous times. There can be no conclusion to draw other than you have not seen it, but chose to give readers the impression that you have.

These 'witnesses' have said Behan was subject to 'pack attacks' but we have only your word for that, and your word has been shown to be unreliable at best, and downright deceitful at worst. You put your neck in the noose; I am merely pointing out that your 'reporting' is not quality reporting.

[TheWalkingMan]

So now this has partially turned into a Andrew Drummond needs to up his journalistic skills topic. Seriously?

Sometimes I really believe that people come to Thailand their concept of proportion flies out the window.

Sure the guy should have let the balloons float away but to take a beating for it and then to have his family threatened? Next, posters come on here and begin to lay the blame on the witness who reported the beating(s) and the reporter who reported it? And people wonder why the witnesses are not commenting here on TV.

[chooka]

If I was this guy I would be packing up the family and all my goods and shackles and moving away. If he has seriously upset some thais he could end up throwing himself off the 7th floor of some building.

[p_brownstone]

Considering what Behan had been put through here and elsewhere I can totally understand why his friend has not come forward nor would I ask him to. He was also attacked according to the Burmese witness and he had done nothing wrong at all.

My goodness how quaint - a compassionate Reporter, usually they have no problem is asking awkward questions, perhaps you are over-sensitive for your chosen profession?

Also by the way, nowhere in your "report" on the testimony of the Burmese "eyewitness" does she say that the friend was also attacked - only that he was trying to protect Behan with his body. Was that something you edited out - compassion again perhaps? Or are we to expect yet another "exclusive" shortly?

You are losing credibility by the truckload.

Patrick

I would read it again Patrick

Maybe you should, after all you wrote it - no?

Patrick

[F1fanatic]

I'm incredibly impressed that the Thai woman who recorded this video on her phone AND the Burmese lady who was another witness, went to Andrew Drummond with their evidence!

Some of us expats know about his website (and often enjoy it), but Thais and Burmese??

He's obviously far more famous than we thought...

[F1fanatic]

So now this has partially turned into a Andrew Drummond needs to up his journalistic skills topic. Seriously?

Sometimes I really believe that people come to Thailand their concept of proportion flies out the window.

Sure the guy should have let the balloons float away but to take a beating for it and then to have his family threatened? Next, posters come on here and begin to lay the blame on the witness who reported the beating(s) and the reporter who reported it? And people wonder why the witnesses are not commenting here on TV.

No. I blame the person who posted the video on youtube for turning this molehill into a mountain and, worse, turning it into an issue that ended up with someone issuing threats against the family.

[taninthai]

I'm incredibly impressed that the Thai woman who recorded this video on her phone AND the Burmese lady who was another witness, went to Andrew Drummond with their evidence!

Some of us expats know about his website (and often enjoy it), but Thais and Burmese??

He's obviously far more famous than we thought...

This is exactly what i was thinking how would they even know about him

[p_brownstone]

Considering what Behan had been put through here and elsewhere I can totally understand why his friend has not come forward nor would I ask him to. He was also attacked according to the Burmese witness and he had done nothing wrong at all.

My goodness how quaint - a compassionate Reporter, usually they have no problem is asking awkward questions, perhaps you are over-sensitive for your chosen profession?

Also by the way, nowhere in your "report" on the testimony of the Burmese "eyewitness" does she say that the friend was also attacked - only that he was trying to protect Behan with his body. Was that something you edited out - compassion again perhaps? Or are we to expect yet another "exclusive" shortly?

You are losing credibility by the truckload.

Patrick

No, he isn't

His friend was attacked on the platform, when there was multiple guards on them.

Or you are denying this happened?

Whose "friend" are you referring to? The Farang seen in the Video desperately trying to restrain Behan?

And yes, I am denying anyone was attacked on the Platform until some Video or reliable eyewitness comes forward - once that does happen I will certainly accept the evidence - note evidence, not some hearsay report submitted to AD's blog for which, once given, the witness conveniently decamps to Burma. Further, and I repeat from my earlier Post, nowhere in the latest "revelation" on AD's site - from the Burmese "witness" - does she say one word about Behan's friend being assaulted too; that allegation comes only in a recent Post by AD / Flying Sporran when challenged as to why he never made any attempt to interview Behan's friend.

Finally AD's pathetic attempt to justify not tracing and interviewing this friend of Behan is also patently ridiculous.

"Considering what Behan had been put through here and elsewhere I can totally understand why his friend has not come forward nor would I ask him to"

So we are asked to accept the word of a Burmese witness - conveniently no longer available for interview - and at the same time understand that AD has such compassion and sensitivity to the feelings of another witness / potential interviewee that he decides not to make any attempt to get a statement?

Patrick

Edit : remove repeated information

Edited March 27, 2012 by p_brownstone

[chuang]

Many years ago, I worked security at a topless bar in San Diego. In the 6 months working there, we refused entry and/or removed dozens of drunken patrons. Although we had to restrain someone, a time or two, never once did we did we have to beat anyone into submission.

Then again, they weren't balloon packing fathers. Many were only drunken bikers.

Your patrons complied..but not this irishman....we still dont know who threw the first punch...""Stand Your Ground ""

[flyingsporran]

I'm incredibly impressed that the Thai woman who recorded this video on her phone AND the Burmese lady who was another witness, went to Andrew Drummond with their evidence!

Some of us expats know about his website (and often enjoy it), but Thais and Burmese??

He's obviously far more famous than we thought...

This is exactly what i was thinking how would they even know about him

I would say at least 20 per cent of information to my site comes from Thais. Despite comments here the site is very well trusted. Were I to be closed down deported etc my first contact would be the Ministry of Foreign Affairs ( who are sensible about such issues) unless its some nutty foreigner who is trying to do it. in which case little would happen. In 25 years in Thailand this case is 'piddle' compared with the some of the issues I have dealt with and got away with because at the top there is a sense of realism.

I am surprised nobody here has commented on the fact that despite Behan'a alleged awful behaviour, putting everybody at risk etc, by carrying balloons onto the station, and becoming angry, which Nisa says would warrant much sterner action in other countries, that Behan has not been charged with any offence. Some mistake surely.

No. No mistake. Everybody, who needs to know, knows what happened...except apparently internet warriors here and two Thai websites. The authorities have dealt with this sensibly and despite his feelings, I do not think it would serve much purpose for John Behan to pursue the matter through the courts.

Finally thanks to all the members who clicked on 'like'.

[Awk]

You reported that the CCTV footage contained certain things, but when questioned how you accessed the material you have chosen not to answer, numerous times. There can be no conclusion to draw other than you have not seen it, but chose to give readers the impression that you have.

On

http://www.andrew-dr...ory.php?sid=529 he (I assume) says

"I do not think now I even need to see the original CCTV videos."

While not phrased exactly as I would do it, it does answer your question I'd think.

Why you are incapable of finding this answer yourself I am not sure. Perhaps there are other things you also

do not know, but which it would be better to know before continuing slagging off other people?

These 'witnesses' have said Behan was subject to 'pack attacks' but we have only your word for that, and your word has been shown to be unreliable at best, and downright deceitful at worst. You put your neck in the noose; I am merely pointing out that your 'reporting' is not quality reporting.

Well, I hope you beg my, and perhaps some other peoples, forgiveness for putting slightly more trust in his words than some nameless Internet warriors who has so far only demonstrated his own lack of ability in finding a question that has not been answered "numerous times", yet the answer to which is, again, easily available.

[whybother]

It's interesting that Behan hasn't been charged with anything. That basically gives everyone approval to ignore and abuse station guards as they like.

[F1fanatic]

I'm incredibly impressed that the Thai woman who recorded this video on her phone AND the Burmese lady who was another witness, went to Andrew Drummond with their evidence!

Some of us expats know about his website (and often enjoy it), but Thais and Burmese??

He's obviously far more famous than we thought...

This is exactly what i was thinking how would they even know about him

I would say at least 20 per cent of information to my site comes from Thais. Despite comments here the site is very well trusted. Were I to be closed down deported etc my first contact would be the Ministry of Foreign Affairs ( who are sensible about such issues) unless its some nutty foreigner who is trying to do it. in which case little would happen. In 25 years in Thailand this case is 'piddle' compared with the some of the issues I have dealt with and got away with because at the top there is a sense of realism.

I am surprised nobody here has commented on the fact that despite Behan'a alleged awful behaviour, putting everybody at risk etc, by carrying balloons onto the station, and becoming angry, which Nisa says would warrant much sterner action in other countries, that Behan has not been charged with any offence. Some mistake surely.

No. No mistake. Everybody, who needs to know, knows what happened...except apparently internet warriors here and two Thai websites. The authorities have dealt with this sensibly and despite his feelings, I do not think it would serve much purpose for John Behan to pursue the matter through the courts.

Finally thanks to all the members who clicked on 'like'.

I agree that it would be ridiculous for Behan to pursue the matter through the courts.

I'm genuinely suprised that 20% of your information comes from Thais! As I said in an earlier post, you are obviously more famous than we thought!

The whole thing has been blown out of proportion since you posted the video on youtube. With the benefit of hindsight, do you not think it would have been better to just post it on your website? This would probably have avoided the threats to Behan and his family.

FWIW, I have nothing against your website and enjoy many of the articles - but this is ridiculously biased. None of us have seen the CCTV footage, so are in no position to blame anyone.

[F4UCorsair]

You reported that the CCTV footage contained certain things, but when questioned how you accessed the material you have chosen not to answer, numerous times. There can be no conclusion to draw other than you have not seen it, but chose to give readers the impression that you have.

On

http://www.andrew-dr...ory.php?sid=529 he (I assume) says

"I do not think now I even need to see the original CCTV videos."

While not phrased exactly as I would do it, it does answer your question I'd think.

Why you are incapable of finding this answer yourself I am not sure. Perhaps there are other things you also

do not know, but which it would be better to know before continuing slagging off other people?

These 'witnesses' have said Behan was subject to 'pack attacks' but we have only your word for that, and your word has been shown to be unreliable at best, and downright deceitful at worst. You put your neck in the noose; I am merely pointing out that your 'reporting' is not quality reporting.

Well, I hope you beg my, and perhaps some other peoples, forgiveness for putting slightly more trust in his words than some nameless Internet warriors who has so far only demonstrated his own lack of ability in finding a question that has not been answered "numerous times", yet the answer to which is, again, easily available.

The question was asked on this forum, and is yet to be answered on this forum. The only response required was a YES or NO, but he can't come up with it. That he is unable to give an affirmative response to whether he has seen the CCTV footage, yet claims to know what it contains, makes anything he says most unreliable.

[Nisa]

It's interesting that Behan hasn't been charged with anything. That basically gives everyone approval to ignore and abuse station guards as they like.

Kind of a silly argument too since nobody has been formally charged with anything including security. There has been charges filed by the BTS against the Irish man but he declined to file charges against any guard and both he and his wife have stated they don't want the guard to lose his job. Seems they are just going after the guard company and BTS for what appears to mainly be compensation since the wife complained of receiving none yet but she also complained on not receiving an apology too but I could swear it was reported the BTS apologized and this was another flag waiver for those wanting to put all the blame on one side.

[chrisinth]

It seems the idea to "reveal the brutality of BTS security personnel" by putting this video online thoroughly backfired. Now those who think that "farangs" in Thailand cannot behave decently have a nice little movie to prove it. And it is highly unlikely the public will see any security cam footage that might put the whole affair into another perspective.

Mr. Behan will have to go a long way to settle this affair. Wherever he may be teaching in the future, he can be sure at least one student has his one-man-show on his smartphone - "Teacher fighting for the "Right to Bear Balloons"...

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

Skytrain to Morchit even more-so.

[sparebox2]

It's interesting that Behan hasn't been charged with anything. That basically gives everyone approval to ignore and abuse station guards as they like.

Kind of a silly argument too since nobody has been formally charged with anything including security. There has been charges filed by the BTS against the Irish man but he declined to file charges against any guard and both he and his wife have stated they don't want the guard to lose his job. Seems they are just going after the guard company and BTS for what appears to mainly be compensation since the wife complained of receiving none yet but she also complained on not receiving an apology too but I could swear it was reported the BTS apologized and this was another flag waiver for those wanting to put all the blame on one side.

Since he is Irish, maybe he is in Thailand to improve his IQ. (said an Englishman)